[Toaru] Aureolus Izzard vs Othinus

[Churronzon]

• Izzard has info that he's going against a Magic God capable of phase manipulation and Othinus is aware of what Izzard's Ars Magna is.
• Othinus is at her strongest
• Izzard has 5 seconds of prep time to put his acupuncture needle on his neck.
• Starting distance: 10 meters
• Speed equalized.
• SBA everything else

Profiles: Izzard | Othinus

 

[Iiliminal]

Wtf…

 

[Doggo]

incon? Othinus funnily enough doesn't resist his hax

 

[Enter_Bluey]

She doesn't need to. Everything he do will just fail due to probability. Like she can literally just blow him up by standing still and he will die. Bro literally gets destroyed by her aura of fear

 

[Churronzon]

The probability manipulation isn't so convenient to prevent Magic Gods from being killed by a golden retriever conveying Aleister's willpower. I would love to be proven wrong though.

Him being scared as shit from seeing a Magic God is a good point though. That's why I had given him the prior info and prep time.

Are you saying that in order to make it fairer, I should give Izzard enough prep time for him to overcome his fear? Should I bloodlust them?

 

[Enter_Bluey]

If you mean high priest, he was killed while weakened already. They don't have this in that key. If we are talking about a magic god at full power...aleister completely lost. Everything they do will be successful. If they really did have that probability at that time the arc probably would have just ended. Their power is basically split apart.

Bloodlust will just make it worse as Othinus will just do something that will garunteed hit, and he can't do anything about it. But if this is full power anyway, she'll do that anyway if she knows about him. Then there is also gungir which is basically human can't defeat me and takes precedence over what he'll do. I'm also unsure how he'll handle a magic god even with his prep time mentally? She can just do everything he does, but better, and without even saying anything while limited to his voice. Maybe it will be easier if she didn't know about him? Even then, I don't see how he doesn't just die.

Here's how I see it

Fight starts:

Ollerus tries something

-

He's already dead from an explosion that will instantly kill him. And she will be successful

 

[Aseka]

The probability manipulation isn't so convenient to prevent Magic Gods from being killed by a golden retriever conveying Aleister's willpower. I would love to be proven wrong though.

Nerfed High Priest doesn't have probability manipulation.

 

[Churronzon]

I meant Zombie.

“That’s that golden retriever’s...A.A.A. was it called?”

“Oh? The thing that killed High Priest and Zombie?”

[...]

That secret of Academy City had completely killed two Magic Gods without World
Rejecter. Since Kamijou Touma’s hand had not killed or eliminated Magic God Othinus,
it was a true exception on the level of Kamisato himself.

[...]

Either way, this changed who was in control. Kihara Noukan was still extraordinary for
heading out to the scene, accurately avoiding the downpour of fireworks-like blasts from
a bullet hell game, and fighting the boss all the while, but it was someone else who had
been supplying him his firepower from behind the scenes. In a way, one could say it was
that person who had killed High Priest and Zombie.

• Shinyaku Toaru Majutsu no Index Volume 17 Between the Lines 3

Nerfed High Priest doesn't have probability manipulation.

Zombie does

It's also stated in the A.A.A's profile.

• It's hinted this power allows the suit to kill immortals and other powerful beings, as Noukan used it to kill Zombie and he also stated it was designed to be used on beings like Aiwass, Fräulein Kreutune and Ladylee Tangleroad.

 

[Churronzon]

She can just do everything he does, but better, and without even saying anything while limited to his voice. Maybe it will be easier if she didn't know about him? Even then, I don't see how he doesn't just die.

If they both act at the same time, it's inconclusive since Othinus doesn't have resistance to reality warping on her profile.

 

[Aseka]

I meant Zombie.

She was killed meaning Aleister also nerfed her, or AAA can bypass that passive probability manip somehow.

 

[Churronzon]

She killed meaning Aleister also nerfed her, or AAA can bypass that passive probability manip somehow.

The former isn't stated to be true in Zombie's profile(as Zombie was never hit with Aleister's nerf spell), and the latter would need to be added to the A.A.A's abilities if it's true.

Aleister had to kill Zombie in order to hijack the spell. Not the other way around.

“No,” denied the High Priest. “That is still impossible. The very foundation of your
assertion is wrong. You claim to have prepared something powerful enough to defeat
Magic Gods like us and you claim to have used this opportunity to inject it inside of us,
but that would require swapping out Zombie’s spell. Whether you had a spell or not, you
would need to defeat Zombie, a Magic God, to replace her spell! That’s no different from
locking the key inside the vault. Your initial argument doesn’t hold up!!”

“True.”

[...]

A human silhouette was nailed to the cross by countless tungsten steel spikes and it was
tightly bound by barbed wire.

“Zom...bie?” muttered the High Priest when he saw the girl whose entire body was covered
in stitches.

• Shinyaku Toaru Majutsu no Index Volume 12 Epilogue

 

[Aseka]

Then somehow AAA can bypass that probability manip

 

[Enter_Bluey]

Right, because zombie would likely also need to be nerfed to even be in the world lol. So she was likely killed while nerfed. Otherwise it would also be stated aleister killed a FP magic god..as that would be an incredibly big thing. But he never killed a FP one and lost. So highly doubt it bypasses passive probability. The magic gods wanted to explore the world, it is more evident she also used the spell if anything.

Also even they act at the same time. Othinus requires no actions, and will be successful. Along with the passive probability his chances are not that high. This is also ignoring the fact her extensive knowledge + better abilities + more powerful abilities will take prescedence and allow her to "lol no" anything he does.

Defend herself ? It will work 100%

Manipulate causality to make him never attack anyway? It will work

It's literally like she is dealing with a a way lesser version of herself.

What also stops her from just relaying fate for this to not happen?

She will unilaterally be successful in this fight. Her knowledge is way more expansive, meanwhile he will not know how to deal with a magic god. Knowing how they can manipulate phases won't let him know how to deal with them.

 

[Churronzon]

Right, because zombie would likely also need to be nerfed to even be in the world lol. So she was likely killed while nerfed.

She was killed while nerfed once, but not twice nerfed by Aleister, yes. They still have their probability manipulation listed in their Zombie nerf key, which Kihara Noukan killed.

Aleister would need Aiwass to kill a full power Magic God.

 

[Churronzon]

Also even they act at the same time. Othinus requires no actions, and will be successful.

She might need to throw or twirl her lance, IIRC. Regardless, with speed equal, I don't think it isn't enough of a time disparity to change it from an inconclusive.

It's literally like she is dealing with a a way lesser version of herself.

And yet, she doesn't resist it. Not my opinion btw. Just what the profile states.

What also stops her from just relaying fate for this to not happen?

Performing win conditions at the same time.

 

[Enter_Bluey]

Why exactly would she use her lance as an attack to deal with him? She did that as a last attack against touma after fighting him countless times and going through mental fatigue.

This is also taking into consideration aleister who already fought against a magic god previously...has actual experience with them, and very likely has a way to deal with their probability in someway. He has at least shown the feats which make it plausible. If zombie was weakend the first time, this also makes it worse for them. Izzard has shown literally nothing to counter their stuff.

For example what is his win condition. Also, even with speed equal, that doesn't mean speaking = instantly activating her hax. All Othinus has to do, esp when already knowing about Ars is overpowering. That is a serious weakness here. They both know each other, she knows what his ability is, and the "'win condition" this point comes down to her extensive knowledge. She can just make his abilities completely useless with 100% success.

 

[Churronzon]

Why exactly would she use her lance as an attack to deal with him? She did that as a last attack against touma after fighting him countless times and going through mental fatigue.

I wasn't saying using the lance physically if that's what you interpreted. I was saying that I recall she needs to twirl her lance to manipulate phases, but I'd have to recheck.

This is also taking into consideration aleister who already fought against a magic god previously...has actual experience with them, and very likely has a way to deal with their probability in someway.

Great, then it should be added to the A.A.A's profile. Convince everyone else in a CRT. If it's not in the profile, it can't be used in this thread.

Izzard has shown literally nothing to counter their stuff.

Magic Gods have nothing in their profiles that would let them resist Ars Magna aside from acting first.

She can just make his abilities completely useless with 100% success.

And he can make her die or sleep with reality warping, preventing her from taking any further actions. With prior info given, he could take a more definitive approach and possibly just erase her from existence, although it's not needed.

 

[Enter_Bluey]

The point is that she also knows about ars, and can just do whatever with her knowledge to mess with him. Just like he knows of their phase Manipulation, he wouldn't know everything else really. I'm not even sure his imagination will allow him to concretely come up with something to counter a magic god? Well assuming it did, he would still get trumped out.

Her abilities actually control natural laws, while his are kinda "fake" in that regard. She can just mess with his mind off rip, make him not attack. Or attack with something that will be instant, by splitting space open, all while be garunteed for her to win. I also don't think attacks that work like this would be equalized in speed.

As for her twirling the lance to manipulate phases, I don't remember it being the case? Even if it did though she has several abilities that wouldnt require it.

It's like, the fight is based on win conditions and their knowledge. While Izzard needs a way to figure out how to take down Othinus, Othinus has numerous conditions to just deal with his ability thanks to her Manipulation being more powerful.

And the proof is in the literal feats Aleister performed, by contesting with a magic God.

I can input more when I wake up. But it's 6 am, and I need to sleep for now

 

[Churronzon]

Even if it did though she has several abilities that wouldnt require it.

So true actually. Othinus with billions of thought-based explosions wins before he can speak.

 

[Doggo]

She was killed while nerfed once, but not twice nerfed by Aleister, yes. They still have their probability manipulation listed in their Zombie nerf key, which Kihara Noukan killed.

Aleister would need Aiwass to kill a full power Magic God.

eh the fact noukan knew and killed her kinda proves she was nerfed twice by aleister otherwise how will the dog even know her location and identity

 

[Churronzon]

eh the fact noukan knew and killed her kinda proves she was nerfed twice by aleister otherwise how will the dog even know her location and identity

How is knowing who Zombie is proof that she was nerfed twice? The A.A.A is capable of killing Magic Gods that are nerfed once. High Priest and Aleister also confirm this.

Why would Zombie being nerfed only once prevent Noukan and Aleister from finding their location?

 

[Enter_Bluey]

Tbh, I guess aleister gathering info on them by fighting the magic gods also helped in the method to kill her. A.A.A killing zombie is pretty impressive even if it's with the spell.

From what ik their probability prevents them from inducing a loss, and control probability to where it benefits them anyway to be successful. So it's treated as passive, but I'm not sure how that affects the A.A.A. I guess it's a buff for it, or something. Ill probably ask in the discussion thread.

Also now thinking about it, even if it's not treated as passively preventing her from being killed, Othinus can also just consciously reduce the possibility of his attack working through probability, in other words making him fail all together.

So along with the thought based stuff, probability still would mess izzard pretty hard.

 

[Doggo]

incon

 

[Enter_Bluey]

Don't think so

 

[Churronzon]

I take it that's a vote for Othinus, Bluey?

 

[AlipheeseXIV]

Bruh....this is a stomp Ars Magna is essentially a magic god nerfed by infinity x infinity (since magic gods already infinitely nerf themselves) but uh....yeah no this isn't really all that interesting at all especially since Izzard would have to imagine himself killing a magic god which.....if you haven't seen S1 of Index or read the LN or something the dude can barely imagine a blood sucking vampire so.....

 

[Enter_Bluey]

I take it that's a vote for Othinus, Bluey?

Yeah

 

[AlipheeseXIV]

I mean tbf Ars Magna is really busted like really really busted against majority of the Toaru cast and even other verse's Izzard with prep is a dangerous man. It's even scarier that in V1 of Toaru Index out right confirms that even a child could learn magic and use Ars Magna which....if you think about it is absolutely ridiculous but at the end of the day it's just a cheap copy of what a magic god is capable of.