The Revenant Marvel Comics Discussion Thread

[Tahoy49574]

Would Super Skrull's statement of destroying stars finally be usable if you go with that ?

 

[ShiftCtrlAltDeleteTabFn]

I appreciate a good pun.

 

[Antvasima]

Honestly I don't know. Like there definitely is a significant difference in power between the likes of The Thing and of Silver Surfer, and of Iron Man and Blue Marvel, but I don't know how big it is. Like Super Skrull can fight Silver Surfer, but Super Skrull is also shown to be on Thing's level. Iron Man has defeated characters like Terrax and Ulik.

At the very least, I think that the cosmic characters should all be merged into the same tier. Silver Surfer, Gladiator, Quasar, Nova, Blue Marvel, Hyperion, etc. Tbh though I'm a bit iffy on 3-C now. A solid chunk of the 3-C feats we have are from Thor or Hercules, who should not be scaled to since they are gods. Silver Surfer does have some good 3-C feats, but I'm wondering if the 4-B range is more consistent? Idk.

I think you might be right about earthbound characters being on a lower level that the cosmic heavy hitters actually, looking again at some of my notes.

Where do you think this leaves earth-based "teambusters" like Count Nefaria and Graviton? Both are sometimes implied in their old stories to be stronger than peak and Thor and Hulk, which is a problem as peak Thor and Hulk are both 1-A. I have to say, Thor is posing quite the problem because he has a ton of Tier 1 feats, but is basically the only one to have those feats.

Maybe we could end up with something like:

Earth High Tiers: 5-B (I think these characters being Planet level at least is extremely consistent)
Herald Tiers: 3-C (or maybe 4-B if we downgrade)
God Tiers: 1-A

I think that your first option seems like a more consistent and reasonable system than what we use currently, although 1-A still seems ridiculously high to me.

 

[GeneralSol16]

I think the best way to scale these characters is to see if the story itself treates them. For example, was Thor actually perceived as 1-A by that specific writer? We know comics are the most inconsistent characters ever, but if we try to see detail by detail everything that is being used to scale, it could lead to levels way more consistent and reals than current ones, even if that makes the job a little bit harder. And we shouldn't really try to put an interpretation over another one just because, if a story refers to one aspect of the cosmology as, idk, Tier 2, we shouldn't scale it to Tier 1 just because in another comic, by another writer, and being 15 years apart from each other, says it's 1-C.

 

[ObberGobb]

I think that your first option seems like a more consistent and reasonable system than what we use currently, although 1-A still seems ridiculously high to me.

1-A does seem high. The problem is that Thor does consistently scale to the entirety of Yggdrasil, which we accept as scaling to all of Earth 616, which we have as 1-A. I don't really know what to do about that.

 

[GeneralSol16]

1-A does seem high. The problem is that Thor does consistently scale to the entirety of Yggdrasil, which we accept as scaling to all of Earth 616, which we have as 1-A. I don't really know what to do about that.

So, Thor has Uni level feats but due to the cosmology it gets to Tier 1-A? Lol.

 

[Excellence616]

So, Thor has Uni level feats but due to the cosmology it gets to Tier 1-A? Lol.

I think the best way to scale these characters is to see if the story itself treates them. For example, was Thor actually perceived as 1-A by that specific writer? We know comics are the most inconsistent characters ever, but if we try to see detail by detail everything that is being used to scale, it could lead to levels way more consistent and reals than current ones, even if that makes the job a little bit harder. And we shouldn't really try to put an interpretation over another one just because, if a story refers to one aspect of the cosmology as, idk, Tier 2, we shouldn't scale it to Tier 1 just because in another comic, by another writer, and being 15 years apart from each other, says it's 1-C.

Come man, Marvel and Dc works under a composite cosmology, every writer ideas if there is a connection.

If we really wanna use your idea, we will have every character with different key because different writer has different ideas about the character power level or verse cosmology.

 

[ObberGobb]

So, Thor has Uni level feats but due to the cosmology it gets to Tier 1-A? Lol.

Well, the feats are bare minimum 2-A since Yggdrasil has infinite universes in it.

 

[GeneralSol16]

Come man, Marvel and Dc works under a composite cosmology, every writer ideas if there is a connection.

Not really. Every writer has his own way to interpretate something, doesn't matter if they're under an "Era", every writer has his way to see the Verse.

If we really wanna use your idea, we will have every character with different key because different writer has different ideas about the character power level or verse cosmology.

No. We would just scale every feat the way it was portrayed in that series, instead of cross scaling everything, and in the same way as today, we would see what's the most consistent level.

For example, if Thor or Superman punch someone or something, we need to see how that writer handled that specific scenario,

 

[ObberGobb]

Is a feat affecting a 1-A structure necessarily 1-A? Like we know Thor affected all the universes in Yggdrasil, but did he necessarily do it in a way that was beyond dimensional?

 

[Da3ggman]

Inconsistency this, outlier that, when is the wiki going to realize that Thor is just that guy?

 

[Antvasima]

Thor is awesome when written well, and I can easily see him as 2-A or even Low 1-C, but 1-A is ridiculously high for any Marvel superhero in general. It isn't about Thor.

 

[Antvasima]

Btw: Saman found a pretty disturbing old cold war era "nuke the commies back to the stone age"-style quote from Reed Richards in a self-deleted post above, but it was uploaded via Discord, and I vaguely recall other genocidal quotes about aliens by Frankie Raye and The Thing during John Byrne's Fantastic Four run. I will see if I can find them.

Society usually wasn't "better in the old days".

 

[Eseseso]

Btw: Saman found a pretty disturbing old cold war era "nuke the commies back to the stone age"-style quote from Reed Richards in a self-deleted post above, but it was uploaded via Discord, and I vaguely recall other genocidal quotes about aliens by Frankie Raye and The Thing during John Byrne's Fantastic Four run. I will see if I can find them.

Society usually wasn't "better in the old days".

Pretty sure any minority or other disadvantaged demographic could tell you the same thing.

The way they treated Invisible Woman in early comics was horrifically sexist, for example

 

[Excellence616]

Thor is awesome when written well, and I can easily see him as 2-A or even Low 1-C, but 1-A is ridiculously high for any Marvel superhero in general. It isn't about Thor.

Nope Ant, 1-A isn't high for Thor. Bro is connected to an Elder God and the Phoenix Force and can tap into those powers.

 

[Antvasima]

Btw: Saman found a pretty disturbing old cold war era "nuke the commies back to the stone age"-style quote from Reed Richards in a self-deleted post above, but it was uploaded via Discord, and I vaguely recall other genocidal quotes about aliens by Frankie Raye and The Thing during John Byrne's Fantastic Four run. I will see if I can find them.

Society usually wasn't "better in the old days".

I found it.

VS Battles Wiki

The VS Battles Wiki is the world's most comprehensive and popular index of statistics and powers for characters and items from all of popular fiction.

vsbattles.fandom.com

"Fun" facts: After the 9/11 event John Byrne made seemingly genocidal Zionist statements about Muslims, and he wrote the "Trial of Galactus" storyline in which the Skrull throneworld was eaten by Galactus, and very contrived reasons were invented to justify social-Darwinist serial genocide, and he also created the spree-killing African-American Bloodsport character as an apparent counterpoint to Nuke (who in turn was a counterpoint to Rambo) in apparent defence of the Vietnam War. Nice guy...

 

[Progrev228]

Nope Ant, 1-A isn't high for Thor. Bro is connected to an Elder God and the Phoenix Force and can tap into those powers

Every character in Marvel should be high 1-A because souls should scale to TOAA/creator and story hierarchies in mind.

 

[ObberGobb]

Thor is awesome when written well, and I can easily see him as 2-A or even Low 1-C, but 1-A is ridiculously high for any Marvel superhero in general. It isn't about Thor.

Eh, I don't know. I feel like it works for the absolute most powerful, like Thor, Doctor Strange, Scarlet Witch, etc. But maybe Low 1-A would be better? There was that Captain America shield CRT a while ago where people discussed downgrading to that level, but nothing came of it. Frankly I don't actually understand the tiering system beyond High 1-B, I just know Marvel.

 

[Jimmy.robinson.5099]

Inconsistency this, outlier that, when is the wiki going to realize that Thor is just that guy?

I feel that at the rate we're going, we can just say that about a bunch of characters...

 

[Da3ggman]

Thor is awesome when written well, and I can easily see him as 2-A or even Low 1-C, but 1-A is ridiculously high for any Marvel superhero in general. It isn't about Thor.

For most characters, I'd agree that 1-A is way to high; but for Thor in particular, he's pretty unanimously treated as above almost everyone is the verse, especially "superheroes". After all, being a superhero is his day job - in reality, he is a god.

Also he has a shit ton of 1-A stuff, probably the most in sheer quantity for Non-Abstract entities, maybe only being tied with Hulk after his current run and arc is finished.

 

[Antvasima]

Well, I just think that 1-A is ridiculously high for all Marvel superheroes.

 

[Eseseso]

Well, I just think that 1-A is ridiculously high for all Marvel superheroes.

What about Doctor Strange at his peak? Dude has almost as many 1-A showings as peak Thor.

 

[Antvasima]

I think that the Marvel Comics writers just consider universal (Earth 616, etc.) feats by Thor, Doctor Strange, and other characters, to be Low 2-C in scale, not to exceed the absolute peak of absolute mathematical infinity (Low 1-A), so our stacking of all different versions of individual writer cosmologies on top of each other has likely severely messed up our scaling.

 

[Da3ggman]

I think that the Marvel Comics writers just consider universal (Earth 616, etc.) feats by Thor, Doctor Strange, and other characters, to be Low 2-C in scale, not to exceed the absolute peak of absolute mathematical infinity (Low 1-A), so our stacking of all different versions of individual writer cosmologies on top of each other has likely severely messed up our scaling.

How many times has Thor done shit to Yggdrasil across multiple authors and runs? I can guarantee you, it’s a lot. I can further guarantee you that almost all those said authors know that Yggdrasil is supposed to represent the entire multiverse, as that’s like, a baseline thing to know. Sure, they might not know exactly where that ends up scaling, but they do know that it’s supposed to be a big ****-off power feat. If we were to go off what exactly the author thinks, shit would get chaotic real fast.

Point is, most authors don’t arbitrarily think is “tiers” or “number of universes”, mostly scale; same reason why an author might only consider a character a “town buster” based on blowing up a town, when we calc them to be mountain level or something because of the KE of the pieces or something. Oftentimes, Thor is shown to be a powerhouse comparable in scale to all of the normal stuff in creation at the height of his strength. As I said previously, he’s just that guy.

Btw, this is not me endorsing everyone and they’re grandmother scaling to 1-A, as I think almost no regular flagship hero should scale that high. I’d personally place most “heralds” comfortably around Solar System to Galaxy, Universal at best. But for some characters, like Thor, Hulk, Strange, etc. they tend to go beyond that and should be rated as such at their peaks.

Just my two cents, at least.

 

[Antvasima]

Well, I disagree, but you are entitled to your opinion.

 

[SamanPatou]

Btw: Saman found a pretty disturbing old cold war era "nuke the commies back to the stone age"-style quote from Reed Richards in a self-deleted post above, but it was uploaded via Discord, and I vaguely recall other genocidal quotes about aliens by Frankie Raye and The Thing during John Byrne's Fantastic Four run. I will see if I can find them.

Society usually wasn't "better in the old days".

Yeah, I want to joke on that and Reed sounding more like a villain than Doom himself back then, but the images didn't load, so I gave up.

 

[GeneralSol16]

I can guarantee you, it’s a lot. I can further guarantee you that almost all those said authors know that Yggdrasil is supposed to represent the entire multiverse, as that’s like, a baseline thing to know. Sure, they might not know exactly where that ends up scaling, but they do know that it’s supposed to be a big ****-off power feat. If we were to go off what exactly the author thinks, shit would get chaotic real fast.

I don't think so.

The common knowledge of the World Tree is that it holds the nine realms, that's what most authors and people know about it, assuming that writers think that it holds the Multiverse as a whole it's a stretch, the best way to scale it would be investigating every writer interpretation of the cosmology before anything.

 

[Maverick_Zero_X]

 

[ObberGobb]

It should be Scarlet Witch. Out of everyone shown here, she's the only one that I think would actually deserve it. Like she is one of the only people on Earth with comparable magical prowess to Strange.

How long do you think the change will last before Doctor Strange is Sorcerer Supreme again?

 

[Suigetsuhyugs]

It should be Scarlet Witch. Out of everyone shown here, she's the only one that I think would actually deserve it. Like she is one of the only people on Earth with comparable magical prowess to Strange.

How long do you think the change will last before Doctor Strange is Sorcerer Supreme again?

From what I saw from Wanda, her magic is basically say and it happens no study no need to understand the basics of magic and whatnot, don't think she should be doctor supreme, also her magic is already powerful as it is. Might as well give it to Clea again or maybe doc Vodoo

 

[ObberGobb]

From what I saw from Wanda, her magic is basically say and it happens no study no need to understand the basics of magic and whatnot, don't think she should be doctor supreme, also her magic is already powerful as it is. Might as well give it to Clea again or maybe doc Vodoo

Clea is probably the most logical, she is both Doctor Strange's wife and student AND has Sorcerer Supreme experience herself so is a natural successor. Doctor Voodoo would be very cool though.

 

[Eseseso]

It should be Scarlet Witch. Out of everyone shown here, she's the only one that I think would actually deserve it. Like she is one of the only people on Earth with comparable magical prowess to Strange.

How long do you think the change will last before Doctor Strange is Sorcerer Supreme again?

Clea: Am I a joke to you?

 

[Entity]

How long do you think will last the Infernal Hulk event?

 

[Re5yh]

Ok, here is my draft of the next Marvel Character, and this will be: Bast

Re5yh/Bast (Marvel Comics)

vsbattles.fandom.com

 

[Eseseso]

Ok, here is my draft of the next Marvel Character, and this will be: Bast

Re5yh/Bast (Marvel Comics)

vsbattles.fandom.com

Nice, try checking out the issue where Bast meet with Doom, it states some stuff for NEP

 

[Re5yh]

Nice, try checking out the issue where Bast meet with Doom, it states some stuff for NEP

What issue?

 

[FentyBeauty]

i think its doomwar #3

 

[Re5yh]

Does any one of you guys know what comic does this image comes from?

VS Battles Wiki

The VS Battles Wiki is the world's most comprehensive and popular index of statistics and powers for characters and items from all of popular fiction.

vsbattles.fandom.com

 

[FentyBeauty]

fantastic four vol. 3 (the 1998 one) n its the 608th issue

 

[Re5yh]

fantastic four vol. 3 (the 1998 one) n its the 608th issue

I tried to find it, but there were no results on Read-Comics-Online