Thanos vs Alien X

[SuperKamiNappa]

Thanos has the infinity gauntlet, Low 2-C version
Bloodlusted

Speed Equalized

Who wins and why?

 

[Yomi_Schwarz]

i'd say thanos cause he has more expirience and more hax while alien x barely masters his own P and A

 

[Cropfist]

Thanos. More hax.

 

[TheGlovesMan]

Alien X wins this. That thing with Alien X's personalities needing to come to an agreement before the Celestialsapien can do anything is pretty much removed. In Universe v. Tennyson, Ben managed to convince them to give him full control over Alien X. In the episode that aired right after, Weapon XI Part 1, they showed Ben's full control over Alien X. Derrick J. Wyatt even confirmed that Although Ben still needs to ask Bellicus and Serena for control, he's better at it now and they don't think they need to constantly show Ben convincing them for control when he's just going to get it anyway.

Alien X tanked the destruction of the entire universe and everything in it without a single scratch. Alien X's thoughts can become reality. It was even confirmed that if Alien X was to think of destroying the Multiverse or Cosmos six times, he would be able to. So Alien X wins this.

 

[Observer_of_the_7th]

Alien X erases thanos from existence with a single thought, sounds absurd that people would choose thanos.

 

[TheMightyRegulator]

The "destroys the multiverse with six thoughts" thing was disregarded as a mocking reply.

Or at least, it didn't seem to be a very serious statement about the power of the character.

Since multiple universe level+ entities couldn't erase Thanos it would be absurd to think Alien X can do so with a single thought.

 

[TheGlovesMan]

The "destroys the multiverse with six thoughts" thing was disregarded as a mocking reply.
Or at least, it didn't seem to be a very serious statement about the power of the character.

Since multiple universe level+ entities couldn't erase Thanos it would be absurd to think Alien X can do so with a single thought.

I wasn't mocking Thanos. I was being serious. I mean these universe level+ entities probably aren't omnipotent like Alien X.

Plus, as long as Alien X thinks of something it can become reality. So if Alien X can create an entire universe with a single thought, I feel confident that Alien X can erase one being if he wants to.

 

[TheMightyRegulator]

I was not accusing you of mocking Thanos. I was saying the official statement was not meant to be a serious description of his powers.

Omnipotence doesn't exist and you need feats to make assumptions like that especially considering Thanos has defeated multiple entities of the level of that Universe effortlessly which is a superior feat to just easily creating one. Reality Warping on a Universal scale is not impressive for tier 2 and above.

 

[TheGlovesMan]

I was not accusing you of mocking Thanos. I was saying the official statement was not meant to be a serious description of his powers.
Omnipotence doesn't exist and you need feats to make assumptions like that especially considering Thanos has defeated multiple entities of the level of that Universe effortlessly which is a superior feat to just easily creating one. Reality Warping on a Universal scale is not impressive for tier 2 and above.

When Derrick J. Wyatt stated Alien X's capability of destroying a multiverse or the entire multiverse, he was being completely serious.

And omnipotence does exist, you just choose not to believe it. (No disrespect btw)

And Alien X/Celestialsapiens have multiple feats along with actual evidence in the show that prove as long as they agree to something, it becomes reality.

-Professor Paradox, a man who has travelled through all of space and time, has stated that Celestialsapiens are omnipotent. (He indirectly said this when he was referring to what Ultimate Aggregor would be if he absorbed the power of the baby Celestialsapien.)

-Bellicus and Serena have stated their ability to accomplish anything many times. Especially Serena, after the destruction of the universe, she said "Alien X can do many things. We just have to agree on it."

-Azmuth, the greatest mind in the universe, has stated that Alien X can do anything. One of the definitions of omnipotence is "capable of doing anything."

-Professor Paradox also stated that The Forge of Creation(the place where Celestialsapiens are born) is the place where thoughts become reality.


Feats that support this include all the times Bellicus and Serena or any Celestialsapien actually did agree upon a task. Because when they did so, they always accomplished their goal:

1. In Alien X's first appearance, Ben simply wanted to stop the flood that had occured and he did so with the wave of a hand.

2. In an alternate timeline, Alien X stopped Vilgax from sending Ben to the Null Void. Instead, they sent Vilgax, Psyphon, and his entire ship to the Null Void.

3. In the show, they proved that Celestialsapiens were the reason for the art design, pretty much they changed how reality appeared to others.

4. Although, they reluctantly agreed to do this, Ben actually got Alien X to recreate the entire universe and everything in it after it was destroyed.

5. When Bellicus and Serena agreed on giving Ben full control over Alien X, he gained control and defeated another Celestialsapien

6. When they agreed on giving him full control in a later episode, with simple hand gestures and thoughts, Alien X was easily pummeling a slightly big group of enemies, without taking a single step.

 

[TheGlovesMan]

Also, about your comment about omnipotence not existing, I see where you're coming from since in order for a being to actually prove they are omnipotent, they would have to actually do everything, which is impossible so we are left with no choice but to listen to the show and authors.

But if Alien X has done every task that he actually wanted to do, it can strongly support that he is omnipotent.

 

[WeeklyBattles]

Okay, im just going to tell you right now that the fact that an ENTIRE RACE is described as being 'omnipotent' proves that theyre not...That goes against the very definition of the word omnipotent.

These characters are the closest thing to being 'omnipotent'. Alien X and the Celestialsapiens are NOWHERE near as powerful.

 

[WeeklyBattles]

And no, listening to the show and authors is the worst thing to do when concerning the term omnipotence. It is often used as a highly exaggerated description to say a character is very powerful but does not actually accurately describe how powerful they actually are.

Alien X's best feats are Universe level+ at best

 

[TheGlovesMan]

Okay, im just going to tell you right now that the fact that an ENTIRE RACE is described as being 'omnipotent' proves that theyre not...That goes against the very definition of the word omnipotent.
These characters are the closest thing to being 'omnipotent'. Alien X and the Celestialsapiens are NOWHERE near as powerful.

Ugh, I hate getting into the argument about what defines omnipotence and what doesn't.

Omnipotence derives from the Latin term "Omni potent" which means All Power. Which can also mean all powerful, capable of doing anything, unlimited powers, and etc.

Just because there's more than one, doesn't mean they can't all be capable of doing anything. Being more than one goes against the definition on a monotheissic perspective, but against the actual definition.

Celestialsapiens are just as powerful as them considering that they've been confirmed to be able to affect the Cosmos, some also call it the Omniverse.

 

[WeeklyBattles]

There can not be more than one "Omnipotent" being in any given verse, let alone an entire race. It is very clearly hyperbole especially considering, like i said before, Alien X's best feats are Universe level+ at best.

 

[Celestial_Pegasus]

You can't have a race of omnipotent people, it's either you're omnipotent or not, omnipotence is an incredibly hard thing to prove, usually you have to have characters who are first beyond all dimensional scale and conceptualizations and being above literally everything, existence and nonexistence, possibility, causality etc, unless all of that is proven then you can't just say a character is omnipotent just cause they are said to be, you need feats to back it up, alien x only has feats of being universe+, which is hilariously below being omnipotent, just because a character hasn't shown any limits doesn't mean they don't have any, that's a no limits fallacy.

 

[TheGlovesMan]

First of all, the idea that there can only be one being with limitless power belongs to monotheissic views. Omnipotent basically means that you're capable of doing anything which Celestialsapiens are meaning that they follow the definition and that they are omnipotent.

It is very difficult to prove that characters are omnipotent and we just have to assume they are based off of the fiction they belong to or author's words since it is impossible for them to do everything.

Just because The-One-Above-All hasn't shown the feat of accomplishing everything does not mean he isn't omnipotent. Same with Alien X. Words of God are just as viable as feats.

 

[WeeklyBattles]

Problem with that logic is Alien X has both displayed limits and has no feats whatsoever that would put him above Universe level+, and claiming that he do anything without proper feats to back it up is a HUGE, baseless assumption.

WoG is NOT reliable concerning omnipotence, in fact is is one of the most if not THE most unreliable thing, especially with no feats backing up said claims.

TOAA actually has feats that place him as a Tier 0, Alien X does not, not even close.

 

[TheGlovesMan]

Problem with that logic is Alien X has both displayed limits and has no feats whatsoever that would put him above Universe level+, and claiming that he do anything without proper feats to back it up is a HUGE, baseless assumption.
WoG is NOT reliable concerning omnipotence, in fact is is one of the most if not THE most unreliable thing, especially with no feats backing up said claims.

TOAA actually has feats that place him as a Tier 0, Alien X does not, not even close.

The "limits" that Alien X have shown aren't anything that limits his ability from doing anything. His two main weaknesses are his multiple personalities and his vulnerability to another Celestialsapien.

I don't think the personalities make him not omnipotent since if they're decisive, they can accomplish any feat which makes them omnipotent. And being vulnerable to a being who has limitless power isn't anything that sounds like a big weakness either. Yes, you are right. By feats, Alien X is around universal at best. But WoG are just as good as feats, if not, WoG>feats.

Sometimes, I let it slide when WoG completely contradict the canon, but these WoG are completely reliable since they go with what is canon.

Saying WoG is not reliable is like saying "Because I don't agree with this fact then it is not true" It does not work. And it's reliable since I've listed feats of Alien X being able to accomplish anything as long as his personalities agree on it. The show even proves that a Celestialsapien's main ability is his ability to do anything that the personalities agree upon doing.

With shown feats, Alien X is Universal+, but with his full potential, considering the abilities that the creators have given him as well, he would be tier 0 since he can destroy the Cosmos.

 

[Ryukama]

His two main weaknesses are his multiple personalities and his vulnerability to another Celestialsapien.

I do not believe you know what omnipotence means. If he were truly "omnipotent" (such a thing being impossible to prove and self contradictory but I digress) then he would not have any weaknesses at all. No matter how minor. If there is another entity who is capable of harming him and if there is something that restrains his ability, then he is not omnipotent.

 

[Observer_of_the_7th]

Like Dontae123000 said,

It's not wise to bring the general concept of omnipotence into debate when these two realites clearly differ.

For one instance, if marvel comics says " TOAA is the the top, he is the cause of all" but ben 10 franchise says that celestial sapiens are individually omnipotents but are necessary restricted to "that" extent because they must follow the multiversal preservation act.

Doesnt this not make alien X at least nigh-omnipotent?

 

[Celestial_Pegasus]

Neither of these characters are omnipotent, or nigh omnipotent, serious drop this argument i am getting a little bit irritated here. They only have feats of being around low 2-C, statements of being omnipotent are completely meaningless unless characters have shown feats to support it.

 

[ProfessorKukui4Life]

Along with the reasons above, if Alien X is not anywhere remotely near 1-C or even 2-A, you can forget about him being Tier 0 omnipotent completely. So this needs to be dropped, now.

@Celestial Pegasus

Should a note about this be placed on Alien X's page, noting not to try and upgrade him to "omnipotent" status for multiple contradicting reasons such as those listed above?

 

[Huesito88]

Yep drop the subject guys. Neither these guys are omnipotent let alone nigh omnipotent let alone multiversal+.

 

[Celestial_Pegasus]

We probably should have a note, but with weaknesses like this "Alien X can also have the powers absorbed by Osmosians, and needs to follow the Multiverse Preservation Act, or other members of its species will punish it. Alien X's Life-force might be absorbed by Anur Vladias."

I don't see how someone can claim he is omnipotent, i guess those people like osmosians and anur vladias are also omnipotent or omnipotent+ ┬»\_(Òâä)_/┬»

 

[The_Everlasting]

@Celestial

The note feels silly considering how this wiki treats omnipotence.

I'm also rather dubious on including the weaknesses, since they're only in-verse mechanics (Plus Osmosians can only absorb the power of baby Celestialsapiens, not full grown ones like Alien X). It's like saying that "Character A can be harmed by these special bullets made by Character B from the same verse". It's ultimately redundant.

 

[Celestial_Pegasus]

Whatever the case this argument should be dropped, to stop derailing this thread, so this match can go on.

 

[Observer_of_the_7th]

We probably should have a note, but with weaknesses like this "Alien X can also have the powers absorbed by Osmosians, and needs to follow the Multiverse Preservation Act, or other members of its species will punish it. Alien X's Life-force might be absorbed by Anur Vladias."
I don't see how someone can claim he is omnipotent, i guess those people like osmosians and anur vladias are also omnipotent or omnipotent+ ┬»\_(Òâä)_/┬»

You do realize that the multiverse preservation act has no affect when you do a cross-over fight? It's called neutral ground, in which case it's belongs to no-one so alien X can fully enjoy himself with his imagination.

 

[LordGriffin1000]

Didn't Ben 10'000 turn into Alien X fused with another alien (I think it was Atomic something) and tried to stop a bomb that destroy all other timelines except for the one they where in and he got erased as soon as he touched it.

 

[Ryukama]

You do realize that the multiverse presveration arc has no affect when you do a cross-over fight? It's called neutral ground, in which case it's belongs to no-one so alien X can fully enjoy himself with his imagination.

I don't think Celestial's point was The Multiversal Preservation Act prevents Alien X from winning this fight rather its existence proves he can't be "omnipotent."

 

[LordGriffin1000]

I might go with Thanos on this does Alien x have any resistance to soul manipulation

 

[Observer_of_the_7th]

I might go with Thanos on this does Alien x have any resistance to soul manipulation

Soul manipulation? Since when are souls revelant to undefinable creatures like celestial sapiens.

 

[Observer_of_the_7th]

Didn't Ben 10'000 turn into Alien X fused with another alien (I think it was Atomic something) and tried to stop a bomb that destroy all other timelines except for the one they where in and he got erased as soon as he touched it.

Atomic X is not relevant either, he is mix of celestial sapien + ? and that makes him weaker than a true celestial sapien.

 

[LordGriffin1000]

Doesn't Ben have a soul, do you have any proof that Celestial sapiens don't have souls and just because he fused with another alien doesn't make him weaker unless you have proof. Its not the same as heatblast fused with ripjaw. Why in the world would Ben 10,000 fuse Alien x with another alien knowing it would make him weaker

 

[TheGlovesMan]

I'm still going to classify Alien X as omnipotent but whatever.

@The Everlasting, Osmosians can absorb the power of any Celestialsapien. The reason why Ultimate Aggregor wanted to absorb the Baby Celestialsapien's power was because it didn't develop it's multiple personalities yet; however, it wasn't mature enough to use its power. So if he absorbed it, he would get its power without the multiple personalities.

I'm pretty sure the Soul gem would not affect Alien X. If it did, he could simply wish for it not to affect him and GG.

 

[TheGlovesMan]

Doesn't Ben have a soul, do you have any proof that Celestial sapiens don't have souls and just because he fused with another alien doesn't make him weaker unless you have proof. Its not the same as heatblast fused with ripjaw. Why in the world would Ben 10,000 fuse Alien x with another alien knowing it would make him weaker

Atomic-X has been confirmed to be weaker than Alien X. I can't find the link rn but in the series, they make it clear that Alien X doesn't really have limits in term of power. Wyatt did say that "Atomic-X has limits. They're just very high up."

This should be common sense(no disrespect lol) but when Atomic-X was erased by a Chronosapien Time Bomb and how Maltruant was actually a challenge for him, I knew he was weaker.

I feel 100% confident when I say that Alien X would be unaffected by the Chronosapien Time Bomb, and he's pretty much immortal so time attacks shouldn't affect him either.

To answer your question, it makes a lot of sense that Ben doesn't transform into Alien X and goes for the weaker form, Atomic-X.

I mean, there are only a few scenarios where Ben would need to transform into an omnipotent being. Atomic-X is also better for quick access since Ben probably doesn't have to deal with the multiple personalities when he transforms.

 

[LordGriffin1000]

That time bomb destroyed multiple timelines/universes Alien x only survived the destruction of one. I say again why in the world would Ben 10,000 fuse Alien x with another alien knowing it would make him weaker

Still see no solid reason to how Alien x wins this

 

[ProfessorKukui4Life]

I'm still going to classify Alien X as omnipotent but whatever.

No, your not.

As long as you participate on this wiki you must obide by what we believe is to be accurate and us thinking for a second that he's omnipotent is certainly not accurate. At all.

 

[Observer_of_the_7th]

You do realize that the multiverse presveration arc has no affect when you do a cross-over fight? It's called neutral ground, in which case it's belongs to no-one so alien X can fully enjoy himself with his imagination.

I don't think Celestial's point was The Multiversal Preservation Act prevents Alien X from winning this fight rather its existence proves he can't be "omnipotent."

Then why or why does his page contain such a "weakness", it's highly inconsistent and meaningless you know.

 

[Observer_of_the_7th]

That time bomb destroyed multiple timelines/universes Alien x only survived the destruction of one. I say again why in the world would Ben 10,000 fuse Alien x with another alien knowing it would make him weaker
Still see no solid reason to how Alien x wins this

Most likley because he just wanted to, ben 10,000 was never fully explained and it could just be that he neglects alien X entirely. I mean he has at least 10.000 aliens and if he has full control over his device then it's just a plot-hole that was never explained. "Plot didnt allow him to" is the conclusion. Alien X was standing there, not even bothering to defend himself to the armageddon, and it appeared that the attack was non-effective. Alien X has already been confirmed to do anything, by the greatest mind in the universe. "Eating Time-lines, destroying time lines, surviving a armageddon on multiversal scale" is just another day inside his mind. I repeat that alien X thoughts can become real.

 

[Ryukama]

@Observer because weaknesses don't purely have to be ones that are relevant for one type of hypothetical match up.