Super Mario: Removing some MFTL+ feats

[Dust_Collector]

Don't worry this isn't a CRT to straight up downgrade the verse from Massively FTL+, I mean that might still happen I dunno I ain't got the gift of Apollo, but I just wanted to remove some feats that I feel like don't back up the current ratings:

• Capable of dodging attacks from a Grand Star-powered Bowser, who can tag Starship Mario with his meteors

So I had the japanese version of this scene translated here and it says: That spaceship is in this miserable state. A meteor was thrown at the ship by the Kaibutsu, the ship was broken, and the companions were scattered. The big concern here being that it's never stated or implied Bowser pelted the ship with meteors while it was moving at it's top speed, it could've been flying at a more leisurely speed, could've just been stationary.

• and flew to the center of the universe in a short time

So the claim here is that Bowser can fly to the centre of the universe in a short time, but no matter where I looked I couldn't find anything that backs up Bowser doing this. I best guess is it's referring to him flying away during the games opening, but he flies into a giant portal above Peach's castle not directly into space and then to the centre of the universe.

• Capable of reacting to Bowser and Bowser Jr riding the Koopa Clown Car, which flew towards the sun and from their home planet to a nearby galaxy in a short period of time.

So first feat is fine and legit, granted it ain't MFTL+, but it's the second one I take issue with. The wording doesn't even match up with the scene it links to, it shows a galaxy and then Bowser and Jr. in their clown cars flying across space. I checked and at no point do we get any kind of cutscene or statement with the Koopa Clown car flying to a nearby galaxy in a short period of time, like yeah Bowser does sometimes show up on the planet before going back to his space station but even just using the magic he displays in this game he's got portals and shit, would recommend removing this from the speed justification as well.

• Can keep up with the Millennium Star, which is this fast

So the Millennium Star didn't actually fly that fast, it fell due to being a newborn (No idea how that happened, Mario's planet's got some insane gravity I guess), and nobody reacted to it's fall. We dunno if he can fly as fast as he fell, or if he can accelerate to that level of speed in a fight, but I dunno how our standards on this work exactly so I'm open to keeping this one maybe?

Yeah that's about it. Travel speed downgrade coming soon™, planning on subsonic+-ish for that but for now just wanted to air out concerns for the above feats. I did this on my phone since laptop is busted atm but hopefully should be formatted ok. If these are removed than their 73 Quadrillion c rating would go down to 820 Trillion c from this calc.

 

[Kurokitomo]

@Speedblitzer50

 

[Speedblitzer50]

Capable of reacting to Bowser and Bowser Jr riding the Koopa Clown Car, which flew towards the sun and from their home planet to a nearby galaxy in a short period of time.
So first feat is fine and legit, granted it ain't MFTL+, but it's the second one I take issue with. The wording doesn't even match up with the scene it links to, it shows a galaxy and then Bowser and Jr. in their clown cars flying across space. I checked and at no point do we get any kind of cutscene or statement with the Koopa Clown car flying to a nearby galaxy in a short period of time, like yeah Bowser does sometimes show up on the planet before going back to his space station but even just using the magic he displays in this game he's got portals and shit, would recommend removing this from the speed justification as well.

I don't have much to say, the wording of the profile about that is bad but it should be noted that the the mini-stars travel at great speed for the space and the clown car can move at comparable speed to them and Bowser reacts to them, so that clip can still be used as a feat but just need rewording.

About the Travel speed stuff I don't sure about that because Mario iconic combat style is running and stomping others before they can react and the ones Mario stomps almost always have MFTL+ C/R speed like fodder enemies or various bosses, also Mario fireballs can tag Bowser who have MFTL+ C/R speed and Mario can run at comparable speed to his fireballs, he can also run at comparable speed to the clown car who did the feat of moving at comparable speeds to the mini-stars so Mario having MFTL+ travel speed is almost a thing to not say is totally a thing, I know this thread is not about travel speed but since OP mentions it I just wanted to say this. I agree that the other stuff should be removed.

 

[DarkDragonMedeus]

So the claim here is that Bowser can fly to the centre of the universe in a short time, but no matter where I looked I couldn't find anything that backs up Bowser doing this. I best guess is it's referring to him flying away during the games opening, but he flies into a giant portal above Peach's castle not directly into space and then to the centre of the universe.

Feat happened in the first Galaxy game, it seems like the link you used was for Galaxy 2. Galaxy Reactor is stated to be located in "The Center of the Universe."

Don't really have much to say on the rest and agree with removing the bad examples, but I should note there actually is plenty of evidence for Universe's size being infinite which would either turn the "Edge of the Universe" or "Center of the Universe" into Infinite speed feats.

 

[Dust_Collector]

Feat happened in the first Galaxy game, it seems like the link you used was for Galaxy 2. Galaxy Reactor is stated to be located in "The Center of the Universe."

Don't really have much to say on the rest and agree with removing the bad examples, but I should note there actually is plenty of evidence for Universe's size being infinite which would either turn the "Edge of the Universe" or "Center of the Universe" into Infinite speed feats.

When does he travel to centre of the universe with his own speed in thr first game? When he gets clapped in his boss fights he teleports away instead of flying, and at the start of the game he's using ships and iirc nobody reacts to the ships top speed.

 

[Uradial50]

When does he travel to centre of the universe with his own speed in thr first game? When he gets clapped in his boss fights he teleports away instead of flying, and at the start of the game he's using ships and iirc nobody reacts to the ships top speed.

I mean he is technically piloting the ship, which he has to require him reacting to it.

 

[Dust_Collector]

But the issue with that is would he be flying it in a path that would require him to react to incoming obstacles in the way of the ship instead of just flying relatively straight to the centre of the universe without needing to react to and pilot the ship to dodge asteroids or planets? Space can be mad empty.

Also I didn't realise this since I mixed up the results for some of the calcs, but the 73 quadrillion c rating comes from the Millennium Star feat so they'd be bumped down to 820 trillion c from the launch star calc.

 

[Uradial50]

But the issue with that is would he be flying it in a path that would require him to react to incoming obstacles in the way of the ship instead of just flying relatively straight to the centre of the universe without needing to react to and pilot the ship to dodge asteroids or planets? Space can be mad empty.

I mean he was able to stop when he was flying, so that would still require reaction speed

 

[Mommyleona]

I mean he was able to stop when he was flying, so that would still require reaction speed

No it wouldnt, thats like saying people flying supersonic jets scale to that speed in reactions

 

[SuperMarioGamers3]

So the Millennium Star didn't actually fly that fast, it fell due to being a newborn (No idea how that happened, Mario's planet's got some insane gravity I guess), and nobody reacted to it's fall. We dunno if he can fly as fast as he fell, or if he can accelerate to that level of speed in a fight, but I dunno how our standards on this work exactly so I'm open to keeping this one maybe?

Due to this, it's a bit more reasonable to say that the Milleimum Star "fell" by just flying to Mario's Planet. Or, otherwise, it was traveling, and then went off course and crash landed into Mario's planet. Both make a bit more sense than Mario's planet having this insane amount of gravity to just pull things into it.

The big concern here being that it's never stated or implied Bowser pelted the ship with meteors while it was moving at it's top speed, it could've been flying at a more leisurely speed, could've just been stationary.

I think we could make the assumption based on how Bowser was able to capture the and take down the Comet Observatory in that game. As the Galaxy Generator is absorbing the Comet Observatory, it's in the form it looks like when it's generally traveling. It's not 100% definitive, but it does establish a pattern that makes it more likely than not.

but he flies into a giant portal above Peach's castle not directly into space and then to the centre of the universe.

I'm curious if any outside material discusses if this is actually a portal or not, since it could be just the dark aura that's a part of Bowser's presence.

 

[Mephistus]

Due to this, it's a bit more reasonable to say that the Milleimum Star "fell" by just flying to Mario's Planet. Or, otherwise, it was traveling, and then went off course and crash landed into Mario's planet. Both make a bit more sense than Mario's planet having this insane amount of gravity to just pull things into it.

I think we could make the assumption based on how Bowser was able to capture the and take down the Comet Observatory in that game. As the Galaxy Generator is absorbing the Comet Observatory, it's in the form it looks like when it's generally traveling. It's not 100% definitive, but it does establish a pattern that makes it more likely than not.

I'm curious if any outside material discusses if this is actually a portal or not, since it could be just the dark aura that's a part of Bowser's presence.

Everything is constantly "falling in space" in technical terms. But yeah, propulsion there is entirely up to the magic star, esp with that lil wobble
. Even if uncontrollable, it still shouldn't be something that they should count in their arsenal.

The comet observatory being stranded around the lunar orbit of mario's planet doesn't make much sense for it to fly full tilt MFTL+/top speeds across the skies if Rosa is actually visiting the planet for the duration of that night of it raining down star bits (of the star festival); coasting speed for her intent there is pretty easy to account. When its explained in narration "a strange force latched onto the comet and pulled away the power/grand stars" wouldn't indicate much physical reaction needed on bowsers part if he's uses some sort of magic anyhow.

I think the airships coming out of similar purple portals in the second galaxy game kinda indicate that method of transportation too, along with the way that you see stars and stuff behind the portal he goes into, would not use this anyway due to how he just disappears in a puff of dark purply smoke in the first galaxy game. Burden of proof would be moreso on why he's not using the teleport abilities there rather than flight.