Some minor Hyuga Clan revision

[Tdjwo]

What's up y'all? This crt doesn't contain any complicated stuff so it should be easy to understand.

Hyuga Clan weakness removal

The supposed "weakness" justification given to the Hyuga clan members on our profile should be removed

Weaknesses: Their fighting style is primarily limited to taijutsu. There is a small blind spot near the back of their neck, which their vision can not cover

The first sentence is not necessarily a weakness. The Hyuga clan might be limited to "gentle fist taijutsu," but they are still able to use ranged attacks such as air palm and wall palm which are very effective ranged taijutsu attacks. Moreover, the Gentle Fist already nullifies chakra-based attacks, which is why chakra-based substances are useless against the Gentle fist. This is proven to be the case as shown in the Itachi Shinden novel where a distant Hyuga relative used gentle fist taijutsu to split Shisui's great fireball jutsu. Also shown here when Neji uses his Gentle fist to nullify Kisame's water prison jutsu

For the second sentence regarding blindspots, the Hyuga clan already devised a method of bypassing this weakness. All they have to do is send in chakra to their blindspot to sense any incoming attacks.

HINATA HYUGA

Hinata should be rated "Gifted" in intelligence. She and Sakura were the only ones who didn't need to cheat in the chunin exams written test to be confident on their marks(We not gonna talk about Naruto). During the test, everyone who cheated were shown displaying their abilities and "cheating skills." Even TenTen got enough screentime for us to see her S-tier cheat skills. Even Neji who is currently rated as "gifted in general" cheated in the chunin exams. So yeah, for Hinata to be intelligent enough that she didn't have to cheat and seemed confident enough to let Naruto copy off her work should make her "gifted" as well in books-smart.

Genius in combat: Hinata towards the end of the war arc should be rated as "Genius" in combat. Being the only Hyuga member ever to simultaneously use two high-level gentle fist jutsus which require extremely perfect chakra control puts her on the same level/above the likes of Neji who is also "Genius" in combat without performing such a feat.

Range: Hinata's Byakugan range in Shippuden should be upgraded to 10KM while her Byakugan range in The Last should be upgraded to 20KM.

Aura: Hinata should have Aura as shown in the Last.

Resistance to absorption: Hinata is immune to the Tenseigan's chakra absorption.

Agree: @LordGriffin1000

Neutral: @LordGriffin1000 (Hyuga blindspot although, leaning towards agreeing).

Disagree:

 

[Ped2018]

Tdjwo thread? Disagree

 

[Tdjwo]

Tdjwo thread? Disagree

 

[Stryker861]

Seems fine for the most part

 

[Deceived3596]

I'll check out the thread later.

 

[Suigetsuhyugs]

Everything seems fine but the aura is already on the chakra page doesnt need to be on the character does it?

 

[MadaraZKX]

Everything seems fine but the aura is already on the chakra page doesnt need to be on the character does it?

The "aura" on the chakra page refers to their internal aura (chakra) which can only be detected by sensor ninjas. Now about the ninja who can make it visible, it's a different thing.

 

[Tdjwo]

Bump

 

[DavidTPPM]

I don't see anything wrong here. Although this

"For the second sentence regarding blindspots, the Hyuga clan already devised a method of bypassing this weakness. All they have to do is send in chakra to their blindspot to sense any incoming attacks."

Should only apply to people who have canonically mastered gentle fist + Neji, not necessarily every hyuga

 

[Tdjwo]

I don't see anything wrong here. Although this

"For the second sentence regarding blindspots, the Hyuga clan already devised a method of bypassing this weakness. All they have to do is send in chakra to their blindspot to sense any incoming attacks."

Should only apply to people who have canonically mastered gentle fist + Neji, not necessarily every hyuga

We only have 3 Hyuga profiles anyways and all three should be able to use it.

 

[karzen]

looks good, agree

 

[AnimesFreak2]

seems fine to me

 

[BestMGQScalerEver]

FRB

 

[Tdjwo]

FRB

Agree FRB? Nice, nice.

 

[Tdjwo]

Bump

 

[LordGriffin1000]

I agree with the OP on the first part of the weakness but for the second, regardless of if the can bypass the weakness, it's still a default weakness that needs something to be done in order to bypass it so it should remain, however it needs to be pointed out in the weakness section that they can bypass in by insert method here. Everything else looks fine but you should get a scan that shows she's immune to the absorption affect.

 

[Tdjwo]

I agree with the OP on the first part of the weakness but for the second, regardless of if the can bypass the weakness, it's still a default weakness that needs something to be done in order to bypass it so it should remain, however it needs to be pointed out in the weakness section that they can bypass in by insert method here.

I understand your view however, if a supposed "weakness" already has a solution, then it's no longer a weakness. For example, daredevil is blind but he makes up for that weakness with heightened senses which helps him even better than a regular eyeball would have. But like I said, I fully understand where you're coming from and I'm willing to adhere to your view if I'm not convincing enough.

Everything else looks fine but you should get a scan that shows she's immune to the absorption affect.

Yes, I will.

 

[LordGriffin1000]

I understand your view however, if a supposed "weakness" already has a solution, then it's no longer a weakness. For example, daredevil is blind but he makes up for that weakness with heightened senses which helps him even better than a regular eyeball would have. But like I said, I fully understand where you're coming from and I'm willing to adhere to your view if I'm not convincing enough.

Fair point, if more people agree with the removal I won't argue.

 

[Tdjwo]

Bump.

 

[Tdjwo]

Bump

 

[Mamaroza]

Looks good

 

[Monkey_Dunno]

The first sentence is not necessarily a weakness.

Well, all in all. This is enough for me to agree. Being primarily into melee on itself isn’t a weaknesses per se, regardless if truth or not.

For the second sentence regarding blindspots, the Hyuga clan already devised a method of bypassing this weakness. All they have to do is send in chakra to their blindspot to sense any incoming attacks.

I don’t believe this stops the weakness from existing, as it is a deliberate countermeasure. But I believe the ability to make up for this weakness should be noted.

Hinata should be rated "Gifted" in intelligence.

I don't like taking the Chūnin Exams first test as a proof as the test, as far as I’m aware, was never actually graded. Hinata (and Sakura) only believed they got the right answers. However, I guess is still noteworthy.

Genius in combat: Hinata towards the end of the war arc should be rated as "Genius" in combat. Being the only Hyuga member ever to simultaneously use two high-level gentle fist jutsus which require extremely perfect chakra control puts her on the same level/above the likes of Neji who is also "Genius" in combat without performing such a feat.

Don’t know if that puts her at Neji's level, but I’m fine with the justification. Should also note that in the Last she used the Twin Lion Fist upgraded version without the need of the Byakugan even after receiving Hamura's chakra boost; which shows that her chakra control is quite impressive.

Range: Hinata's Byakugan range in Shippuden should be upgraded to 10KM while her Byakugan range in The Last should be upgraded to 20KM.

Aura: Hinata should have Aura as shown in the Last.

Resistance to absorption: Hinata is immune to the Tenseigan's chakra absorption.

I’m fine with this.

 

[DavidTPPM]

I don't think Hinata has Neji levels of skill in the war and her BIQ is verbatim stated to be below Nejis in the novels. But she should be a combat genius solely due to mastering the gentle fist which is the strongest taijutsu style of Konoha, and due to showing literally perfect chakra control (there's probably more reasons but I'm too lazy to think about them)

 

[Tdjwo]

I don't think Hinata has Neji levels of skill in the war and her BIQ is verbatim stated to be below Nejis in the novels. But she should be a combat genius solely due to mastering the gentle fist which is the strongest taijutsu style of Konoha, and due to showing literally perfect chakra control (there's probably more reasons but I'm too lazy to think about them)

There was nowhere in any novels was it ever stated she had lower battle iq than Neji. Secondly, this is Hinata after Neji's death. She explicitly showed better combat iq than Neji when he was alive. Mixing two extremely advanced techniques together after immediately mastering one of the techniques is something only a genius can do.

I'm with you in the rest.

 

[DavidTPPM]

There was nowhere in any novels was it ever stated she had lower battle iq than Neji.

Neji is stated to be the greatest genius of all hyugas in the Sasuke Shinden novel (or was it Naruto retsuden? Maybe both) so he should be still considered superior to her and everyone else in the clan.

She explicitly showed better combat iq than Neji when he was alive. Mixing two extremely advanced techniques together after immediately mastering one of the techniques is something only a genius can do

Neji mastered 2 highly advanced Hiden technique (rotation and 64 palms) at like 12 by seeing someone else use it. That's genuinely just far better than Hinata combining TLF and 64 palms.

Don't get me wrong here, Hinata combining them shows a ridiculous level of precision and chakra control. She can not just maintain a jutsu that requires perfect chakra control up, but also use an extremely precise technique where you need to hit needle sized points on a moving target with a specific amount of chakra. That's like top 5 best chakra control feats in the verse.

But that's not battle IQ. From a BIQ standpoint it's like putting on a knuckleduster and using your boxing skills with it. Neji saw an extremely advanced attack probably like once, and could completely break it down and replicate it. Twice. Him finessing Kidomaru throughout the fight is also a pretty good BIQ feat which Hinata doesn't really have so there's that

 

[Tdjwo]

Neji is stated to be the greatest genius of all hyugas in the Sasuke Shinden novel (or was it Naruto retsuden? Maybe both) so he should be still considered superior to her and everyone else in the clan.

You have to drop the scan for such a statement as I can't find it anywhere. I read all the shinden novels, and I don't remember anything close to that ever being said. The most I can remember about Neji is that Hinata kept his journals. That's all. Moreover, claiming he's superior to everyone based on such a statement sound preposterous to say the least considering Hiashi and Hinata simply have better feats than Neji.

Neji mastered 2 highly advanced Hiden technique (rotation and 64 palms) at like 12 by seeing someone else use it. That's genuinely just far better than Hinata combining TLF and 64 palms.

The rotation is not considered high level. Actually, the only techniques that were straight-up called "high-level" were the 64 palms and Twin Lion Fist. Hinata mastered both techniques together and used them simultaneously. It's indeed a feat beyond Neji's shown capabilities. TLF uses absolute perfect control which requires optimum focus while 64 palms requires very precise accuracy and focus. Hinata was perfectly able to combine both difficult techniques together without making any mistake despite the fact that she had just barely mastered 64 palms. That's extreme high combat IQ.

Don't get me wrong here, Hinata combining them shows a ridiculous level of precision and chakra control. She can not just maintain a jutsu that requires perfect chakra control up, but also use an extremely precise technique where you need to hit needle sized points on a moving target with a specific amount of chakra. That's like top 5 best chakra control feats in the verse.

But that's not battle IQ. From a BIQ standpoint it's like putting on a knuckleduster and using your boxing skills with it. Neji saw an extremely advanced attack probably like once, and could completely break it down and replicate it. Twice. Him finessing Kidomaru throughout the fight is also a pretty good BIQ feat which Hinata doesn't really have so there's that

Both Neji and Hinata's scenarios are considered battle IQ's. I don't see anything here disproving that.

 

[Tdjwo]

Fair point, if more people agree with the removal I won't argue.

Do you mind helping me tag more staff members? Would really appreciate the help.

 

[Suigetsuhyugs]

Just a quick thing here in addition to what was already said.

Neji is stated to be the greatest genius of all hyugas in the Sasuke Shinden novel (or was it Naruto retsuden? Maybe both) so he should be still considered superior to her and everyone else in the clan.

That's impossible "is" implies Neji is still alive which he clearly is not, at best it could be a statement saying Neji "was" the greatest genius of all times. Obviously talking in the past tense doesnt apply to after his death.

Neji mastered 2 highly advanced Hiden technique (rotation and 64 palms) at like 12 by seeing someone else use it. That's genuinely just far better than Hinata combining TLF and 64 palms.

And Hinata learn TLF without seeing anyone since as far as we now she was the only user alive. I think learn an "extinct" technique tops learning a jutsu by watching it.

 

[DavidTPPM]

You have to drop the scan for such a statement as I can't find it anywhere. I read all the shinden novels, and I don't remember anything close to that ever being said.

Sure. Here

The rotation is not considered high level.

The rotation is considered leagues above a jonin level technique On par with Gaaras bijuu technique and yet Neji managed to Come up with it by himself since he was never taught the technique. It's also considering "high grade". It most DEFINITELY is high level lol.

Hinata mastered both techniques together and used them simultaneously. It's indeed a feat beyond Neji's shown capabilities. TLF uses absolute perfect control which requires optimum focus while 64 palms requires very precise accuracy and focus. Hinata was perfectly able to combine both difficult techniques together without making any mistake despite the fact that she had just barely mastered 64 palms. That's extreme high combat IQ.

I've already explained why combining them isn't an intelligence feat but a skill/precision feat. You can't genuinely look at Hinata go "hmm it would be a good idea to use my punchy gloves alongside my skills" and say that's anything above average in terms of intelligence.

Both Neji and Hinata's scenarios are considered battle IQ's. I don't see anything here disproving that.

Bro Hinata literally just combined her punching gloves™ with her punching techniques while Neji completely deconstructed and recreated two above jonin level jutsus as lil kid. Hinatas case is like giving a monkey a rock and praising it for punching things with said rock, while Nejis is like watching a 12 year old completely master Brazilian jiujitsu after seeing someone use it once.

 

[DavidTPPM]

That's impossible "is" implies Neji is still alive which he clearly is not, at best it could be a statement saying Neji "was" the greatest genius of all times. Obviously talking in the past tense doesnt apply to after his death.

The statement says

"She imagined the movements of Hyuga
Neji, the greatest genius since the start of the Hyuga clan."

Obviously I don't remember a random line from a novel I've read years ago verbatim

And Hinata learn TLF without seeing anyone since as far as we now she was the only user alive. I think learn an "extinct" technique tops learning a jutsu by watching it.

Appeal to ignorance. The databook states the technique is "taught to the main family" which already implies it was taught. But even besides that, Hinata could have still learned it from something like scrolls or books. Just because we don't know the exact details doesn't mean we can just say "oh yeah Hinata revived a dead technique nobody in the clan knew".

Also Neji wasn't "watching it" lmao. The whole point of him mastering it was that he wasn't taught the technique and he figured it out himself. He didn't have Hiashi spamming rotation in front of him every day to copy it or something. Realistically speaking, there is no way for Neji to have actually seen the technique be performed at all since it was a time of peace and only Hiashi knew it (besides maybe old dying Hyugas). So yeah, Neji completely deconstructing and recreating at least 2 high level techniques after seeing them at best a handful of times >>> whatever Hinata did in shippuden

 

[Stillwinston]

On the topic of the first part of the chunin exam iirc they never bothered legit grading them right? It was more just a test of character and the guy that ran it even checked naruto's page and saw he sucked at it from what I remembered, maybe we could get a possible supporting feat there?

 

[Suigetsuhyugs]

The statement says

"She imagined the movements of Hyuga
Neji, the greatest genius since the start of the Hyuga clan."

Obviously I don't remember a random line from a novel I've read years ago verbatim

That surely is exaggerating, Hyuga clan started with Hamura and I'm pretty sure Neji doesn't have nothing on Hamura, and Hinata even knows about his existence.

Appeal to ignorance. The databook states the technique is "taught to the main family" which already implies it was taught. But even besides that, Hinata could have still learned it from something like scrolls or books. Just because we don't know the exact details doesn't mean we can just say "oh yeah Hinata revived a dead technique nobody in the clan knew".

So? First Hiashi was the one who basically "banned" Hinata from the main family, we know Neji was helping her during the timeskip not Hiashi. And even if Hiashi read the scrolls to teach Hinata as far as we know she is the only alive who knows it.

Also Neji wasn't "watching it" lmao. The whole point of him mastering it was that he wasn't taught the technique and he figured it out himself. He didn't have Hiashi spamming rotation in front of him every day to copy it or something. Realistically speaking, there is no way for Neji to have actually seen the technique be performed at all since it was a time of peace and only Hiashi knew it (besides maybe old dying Hyugas). So yeah, Neji completely deconstructing and recreating at least 2 high level techniques after seeing them at best a handful of times >>> whatever Hinata did in shippuden

Really? A technique that no one managed to learn it which is also only taught to the main family can have scrolls to teach a person but one of the main techniques used by the hyugas wouldn't have that?
And a lot of what you said is just your head cannon. Funny how you mention time of peace, you remember that in Boruto Hanabi used rotation on Boruto during a training right? It doesn't need a war to see these techniques.
If Neji is that much genius show me Neji using the TLF after all not only did he helped Hinata learn it as he saw her use multiple times so that would be much easier than learning rotation right? And by the way let's remember that Hinata created a new variation of the TLF in the last so creating a new technique tops learning 2 techniques by watching them.

 

[Suigetsuhyugs]

On the topic of the first part of the chunin exam iirc they never bothered legit grading them right? It was more just a test of character and the guy that ran it even checked naruto's page and saw he sucked at it from what I remembered, maybe we could get a possible supporting feat there?

I think they did get scored, didn't he said that Naruto passed the test with a 0? And the anime version at least shows a scene with circles in read on the tests

 

[Monkey_Dunno]

I’m neutral about the whole Neji vs Hinata debate (IMO Hinata's Byakugan and Chakra control skills are superior to Neji's whereas Neji’s physical aptitude and discipline is superior to Hinata's), but

Realistically speaking, there is no way for Neji to have actually seen the technique be performed at all since it was a time of peace and only Hiashi knew it (besides maybe old dying Hyugas).

I don’t believe this to be true. This comment (top left panel) doesn’t makes much sense if there was only one or two Hyūgas around that could use the Rotation

 

[DavidTPPM]

That surely is exaggerating, Hyuga clan started with Hamura and I'm pretty sure Neji doesn't have nothing on Hamura, and Hinata even knows about his existence.

Hamura is not a hyuga lol. He lived on the moon with the moon Otsutsiki clan and kept his "Otsutsiki" surname.

So? First Hiashi was the one who basically "banned" Hinata from the main family, we know Neji was helping her during the timeskip not Hiashi. And even if Hiashi read the scrolls to teach Hinata as far as we know she is the only alive who knows it.

First of all, he didn't ban her. He gave up on her. She would still have access to anything any other main family member would. Second of all, Hiashi has shown no resentment towards Hinata after part 1. We actually have this statement

Which implies Hiashi is indeed taking care of Hinata again. Again, even further reinforced by this statement

Which shows Hiashi not only still considers Hinata his daughter (so she's not "kicked out of the main family") and that he's aware of their relationship.
And as I've said, Hinata having scrolls or books to learn from makes this not a BIQ feat but a skill/talent feat.

Really? A technique that no one managed to learn it which is also only taught to the main family can have scrolls to teach a person but one of the main techniques used by the hyugas wouldn't have that?

My g both Rotation and 64 palms are literally a head clan exclusive move. Whether there are scrolls about it or not does not matter, Neji wouldn't have access to them. But unlike TLF, the databook verbatim states kaiten is spread through ORAL TRADITION so it would most likely not have text written on it.

And a lot of what you said is just your head cannon. Funny how you mention time of peace, you remember that in Boruto Hanabi used rotation on Boruto during a training right? It doesn't need a war to see these techniques.

No it's not. There being no active war makes it so there's no logical circumstance where Neji could actively watch people use rotation. The Hanabi example is goofy af because that's a HEAD CLAN member training another HEAD CLAN MEMBER. Neji wouldn't be trained by the head clan to see it. And again, the databook says he came up with it so it seems like he straight up just reinvented it by himself. Which would straight up be on par with Minato creating the rasengan in terms of talent and intelligence.

If Neji is that much genius show me Neji using the TLF after all not only did he helped Hinata learn it as he saw her use multiple times so that would be much easier than learning rotation right?

Oh my god . Okay so
1. We don't know if Neji has actually ever seen Hinata use it or if Neji was interested in learning TLF.
2. That would, literally, be a thing of chakra control skill and not BIQ. I've went over this like 3x already and you keep repeating the same thing over and over again without actually addressing my arguments.
3. Just one more time so the people in the back can hear it. Learning a technique when you straight up have the manual for it (or a teacher) = skill. Breaking down and reinventing techniques you have only heard of or at best seen a handful of times = intelligence.

And by the way let's remember that Hinata created a new variation of the TLF in the last so creating a new technique tops learning 2 techniques by watching them.

No it doesn't what are you talking about? Ah yes, Jiraya creating the "shuriken whatever jutsu" is so superior to kid Neji reinventing a high class hiden above jonin level jutsu by himself.
I guess in that case prepubescent Naruto inventing the sexy jutsu means he's as smart or smarter than adult Hinata.

 

[DavidTPPM]

(IMO Hinata's Byakugan and Chakra control skills are superior to Neji's whereas Neji’s physical aptitude and discipline is superior to Hinata's)

Adult Hinata has far better CC, more experience, more skill, etc. But Neji is still smarter.

I don’t believe this to be true. This comment (top left panel) doesn’t makes much sense if there was only one or two Hyūgas around that could use the Rotation

I mean, it would tho. Just from the main branch there could be several people knowing it. Imagine they went to war in blank period. You would have Hinata, Hanabi, Hiashi, Hiashis potential wife, and maybe even his grandparents knowing the Rotation.

And either way, even just a single OP hyuga could be more than troublesome enough. Remember when a half hyuga schooled 2 of the 3 strongest living Uchihas at once in the Itachi novel? I'm pretty sure a single person like that with bijuu tier omnidirectional defense would be quite troublesome.

 

[DavidTPPM]

Anyway (sorry for the spam), the TLF thing is still worth discussion.

I think Hinata mastering 64 palms and combining them with TLF right after that should be enough to give her accelerated development.

 

[Stillwinston]

I think they did get scored, didn't he said that Naruto passed the test with a 0? And the anime version at least shows a scene with circles in read on the tests

Looking it over the entire test thing would feel superfluous even then though, what really mattered in that instance was being willing to brave the unknown. I don't think we got any mention of Hinata being a genius in book smarts like Sakura and her showing Naruto was due to simping, could settle for a possible but idk

 

[Monkey_Dunno]

But Neji is still smarter.

I agree when it boils down to technique.

And either way, even just a single OP hyuga could be more than troublesome enough. Remember when a half hyuga schooled 2 of the 3 strongest living Uchihas at once in the Itachi novel? I'm pretty sure a single person like that with bijuu tier omnidirectional defense would be quite troublesome.

Fair enough, however,

I mean, it would tho. Just from the main branch there could be several people knowing it. Imagine they went to war in blank period. You would have Hinata, Hanabi, Hiashi, Hiashis potential wife, and maybe even his grandparents knowing the Rotation.

Hiashi's direct family are not the only members of the Main Branch. Kō, Hinata's bodyguard, is also part of the main family, which means that there’s more than a single family that’s part of the main branch; Hiashi's one is seems to be special because he’s the one supposed to give a heir to the clan. Which suggests that there’s indeed a high possibility of multiple users of the Kaiten around that engage in fight on a regular basis.

 

[DavidTPPM]

Hiashi's direct family are not the only members of the Main Branch. Kō, Hinata's bodyguard, is also part of the main family, which means that there’s more than a single family that’s part of the main branch; Hiashi's one is seems to be special because he’s the one supposed to give a heir to the clan. Which suggests that there’s indeed a high possibility of multiple users of the Kaiten around that engage in fight on a regular basis.

True. But that doesn't really change my point. Neji would still have no reason to be near any adult hyugas from the main family during missions to see kaiten. Neji might have accidentally seen it a handful of times (unlikely as is, it's not impossible) but it still wouldn't mean he's seen it that many times.

As far as I remember we haven't seen any teams with 2 members of the same clan, and team Guy is already very taijutsu heavy so it's even more unlikely they would cooperate with another hyuga, especially a main family one as Kurenai had to go ask for permission to take Hinata on missions to begin with.