Shana

[DontTalk]

I made this thread as a follow up from what I started on this talk page, since talk pages are bad to have discussions on.

To quote from the page:

Can someone give reasoning for the Island level AP and the durability stats? After that the stub tag could also be removed from the page. DontTalk (talk) 20:53, February 25, 2016 (UTC) Technically, on her own, Shana's AP would be lower, probably around Large City/Mountain, as she was able to beat 2 characters of her series with that level of durability. However, the Island Level AP is due to Shana's ultimate magic, Tenpa Josai, in which she summons her contractor in the form of a very powerful gigantic flame titan, which I placed at Probably Multi-Continent Level. But what I'm not sure about, is whether the AP reflects the maximum damage she can produce, or something more like a mean score... As for the durability stats, Base/Human Shana (Key 1) can survive Small Building Level hits, since magic is always flowing in her, making her resistant. For Flame Haze Shana (Key 2), they are lower than her AP/Tier because Shana can't tank hits as strong as the ones she deals. GoldenScorpions (talk) 14:29, February 26, 2016 (UTC)

Now first attack potency usually is the maximum damage a character can cause. Even though it makes the profiles a lot more accurate if special techniques that are far more powerful then what can be done otherwise are noted seperately. So because of that I would suggest to list both.

Now a few more questions:

To Large City/Mountain level: Given that shana is the only character currently listed on the wiki for the franchise I of course also don't know the feats that put the mentioned characters there. So I would like to ask which characters are meant and which feat put them on that level.

To Multi-Continent level: What is it that puts this technique to multi-continent level?

Durability: Here as well I would want to see what makes this attacks small building level / City block level.

So, in other words, we need quotes/videos/scans of the feats in question to make sure that everything is correct.

 

[AidenBrooks999]

And who deleted Yuuji's profile?

 

[GoldenScorpions]

I will think about all that later. I will also try to make pages for other characters of Shakugan no Shana in the future, so that it's easier to compare.

Just, for the Multi-Continent Level attack, Shana releases her contractor Alastor from his vessel so that he can unleash his full power. Alastor is considered by all the other characters as one of the strongest beings in the world, called a Crimson God. His power was only seen twice, one time in the Light Novel and another in the anime. When he was summoned in the LN, he annihilated an entire army of supernatural creatures almost immediately, while also destroying vast areas of land. In the anime, he destroyed the entire enemy base of the size of a Large City that had special strong magic barriers on it. His destruction didn't go beyond however, because it was a flying city. Alastor uses his power only twice, and it's never fully shown, so it has to be based off of the little we saw and the information we get from other characters.

 

[GoldenScorpions]

Changed a few things. Also used your first advice.

 

[DontTalk]

Hmm... ok, in that case I will just leave the profile as is until you have created profiles for the powerscaling necessary.


That aside I have restored Yuji's profile. That one needs its reasoning explained as well (might also clean up, don't know)

 

[Zhaoshuais]

The problem is that most characters can not resist time stop, so it's difficult to find a suitable opponent for Shana,as time stop resist is always considered as a high tier attribute.

In fact,it needs extremly high tier to resist Shana's abilities.

I suggest to discuss Kamijou Touma VS Shana,as Touma can resist time stop,this would be a good battle.(But although this would be a long battle,it seems Touma would win at last,as he has proved that he is capable to fight against a god.)

 

[Ciruno_Fortes_(COB)]

Hmm, would Esdeath vs Shana be a good fight?

 

[Alakabamm]

Ehh, you still sort of need calcs to prove those things

 

[Lina_Shields]

If calcs were to be done for this series, should we go with what was shown from the anime, or should we use the novel?

Using the anime would give us a better understanding of what had happened during said feat however.

 

[DontTalk]

The lightnovel and the manga are the primary and secondary canon here. If possible their descrpitions should be used.

Anime may work if not derivating from the plot or contradicting the feat in question though. So for anything happening in the manga (68 chapters translated I think) anime probably won't find use.

 

[Lina_Shields]

In regards to Shana, what is her speed? The profile says her speed is supersonic, but she could be faster than that.

Will read the manga if I have the time however; if you know anyone that is interested in Shakugan no Shana/has read the novels, can you get them to share any notable feats that could be calculated?

 

[AidenBrooks999]

Wow, it has a manga version http://www.*********.co/manga/shakugan_no_shana/

 

[AidenBrooks999]

Wow, it has a manga version http://www.*********.co/manga/shakugan_no_shana/

Two mangas? http://www.*********.co/manga/shakugan_no_shana_x_eternal_song/

 

[DontTalk]

Well, GoldenScorpions seemed to have read the novel, but he disappeared it seems. So I really don't know anyone else having read the novels and they are also not as easily accesesable as some others, so for now manga + anime is our best shot for rankings I guess.

 

[GoldenScorpions]

Sorry for being inactive for so long; I had business to take care of irl.

Unfortunately, I haven't read the Shana novels. Only people who can read japanese can do that, and I can't. The official translation was dropped after just 2 Volumes, and the fan-translations has been stopped for a long time. So all the stats are based of the anime. Also, the manga is NOT reliable. It only adapts the first 2 arcs of the 1st season only. The anime has 3 seasons with 10+ arcs. As for the Eternal Song manga, I haven't read it, but from what I know and little I've seen, the focus isn't even Shana herself, but the Flame Hazes who foughts hundreds of years prior to the events of the series, during the 1st War.

So unless someone who can read Japanese and has read the novels arrives, we can only base off the stats from the anime. Believe me, if I could read the novels, I'd have done it years ago.

 

[GoldenScorpions]

In regards to Shana, what is her speed? The profile says her speed is supersonic, but she could be faster than that.

The thing is that I have always had trouble determining the speed of characters, whether it's combat, reaction or movement speed. I'm more of an anime than a manga person, so when a character runs, they usually make the "camera" follow him/her in a way that the traits are clear, so it's hard to say their actual movement speed (or other types of speed for that matter). As for combat/reaction speed, I think Supersonic is rather accurate. If you can think of examples where it could be higher, please tell so.

 

[Lina_Shields]

@GS: I believe scaling from the anime is the best decision, if the manga isn't finished and the novels are not translated.

This assumes that the anime is canon.

 

[AidenBrooks999]

The manga seems finished


Or at least that whats wikipedia says

 

[DontTalk]

Hmm...

Well, Volume 7, 8, 16, 22 and great part of 0 seem to be fan-translated.

But I can see that it is hard to you use those as sources if there are such large gaps.

Well, using anime is fine here, as long as not contradicted by the manga would be what I aim for now. If someone should later on have read the novel and say that it contradicts parts of the anime that has to be taken care of then.

 

[GoldenScorpions]

The manga seems finished

The manga is finished, but only adapted 2 arcs out of the 10+ existing arcs. So, it can't really be used as reference.