Set theory in scaling

[Dfg05]

Hey, I’ve read the FAQ and I found the point I’m gonna talk about to be pretty explicit, but some guy is telling me I misunderstood it.

His point was that a certain theory scales to boundless because it’s above Reinhardt cardinals, which are above strongly Mahlo cardinals. If we refer to the FAQ, that’s not a valid scale as this is stated:

« Firstly, it should be highlighted that asking about the tier of a cardinal number is effectively a meaningless question when the quantity which it is denoting is not specified in the question as well, and makes as much sense as asking "What tier is the number 8? […] Do note, however, that these infinities must specifically refer to elements that physically exist within a verse's cosmology. Them existing as in-universe mathematical concepts is not sufficient for anything to scale to them, unless there is a direct comparision that allows scaling to be made. »

My interpretation of it is that a number existing in a verse doesn’t scale anywhere unless it counts a number of objects (such as dimensions for example). The guy told me it doesn’t work like that and gave me as a counter God (Unsong)’s page that uses set theory as a way to get to high 1A:

« Represents the "Absolute Infinite" conceptualized by Georg Cantor that stands beyond any conceivable quantity, unreachable by the unending hierarchy of infinities discovered by him while transcending the very concept of "infinity," with all hierarchies ending in God by neccessity, as He is above all and will always be) »

Considering what was said in the FAQ, representing absolute infinity shouldn’t scale anywhere, so is he right and I am actually misunderstanding what’s written in the FAQ, or is he wrong and there’s other factors that justify God’s scale?

Second question

Imagine that a certain theory (from the real world, so not a fictional theory), lets call it X-theory, is estimated to be boundless by transcending a massive cardinal, let’s say a Reinhardt cardinal that actually represents an amount of dimensions. Now, a realm in a fictional verse is stated to work similarly to X-theory, would the statement be valid for a boundless scale if lets say, the verse has only showed high hyperversal feats ?

 

[Achille]

Hey, I’ve read the FAQ and I found the point I’m gonna talk about to be pretty explicit, but some guy is telling me I misunderstood it.

His point was that a certain theory scales to boundless because it’s above Reinhardt cardinals, which are above strongly Mahlo cardinals. If we refer to the FAQ, that’s not a valid scale as this is stated:

« Firstly, it should be highlighted that asking about the tier of a cardinal number is effectively a meaningless question when the quantity which it is denoting is not specified in the question as well, and makes as much sense as asking "What tier is the number 8? […] Do note, however, that these infinities must specifically refer to elements that physically exist within a verse's cosmology. Them existing as in-universe mathematical concepts is not sufficient for anything to scale to them, unless there is a direct comparision that allows scaling to be made. »

My interpretation of it is that a number existing in a verse doesn’t scale anywhere unless it counts a number of objects (such as dimensions for example). The guy told me it doesn’t work like that and gave me as a counter God (Unsong)’s page that uses set theory as a way to get to high 1A:

« Represents the "Absolute Infinite" conceptualized by Georg Cantor that stands beyond any conceivable quantity, unreachable by the unending hierarchy of infinities discovered by him while transcending the very concept of "infinity," with all hierarchies ending in God by neccessity, as He is above all and will always be) »

Considering what was said in the FAQ, representing absolute infinity shouldn’t scale anywhere, so is he right and I am actually misunderstanding what’s written in the FAQ, or is he wrong and there’s other factors that justify God’s scale?

Second question

Imagine that a certain theory (from the real world, so not a fictional theory), lets call it X-theory, is estimated to be boundless by transcending a massive cardinal, let’s say a Reinhardt cardinal that actually represents an amount of dimensions. Now, a realm in a fictional verse is stated to work similarly to X-theory, would the statement be valid for a boundless scale if lets say, the verse has only showed high hyperversal feats ?

I don't understand question 1, can you explain a little more?

2- If there is no reason to think that this will be an exaggeration or an outlier, you can do 0.

 

[Dfg05]

I don't understand question 1, can you explain a little more?

being above a number doesn’t scale anywhere unless it’s a number of objects (like dimensions) right?

2- If there is no reason to think that this will be an exaggeration or an outlier, you can do 0.

if the cosmology is not even close to what the statement implies, it’s considered an outlier then?

 

[Achille]

being above a number doesn’t scale anywhere unless it’s a number of objects (like dimensions) right?

Yes. Attribute is required, for example if a character exceeds ℵ0 it will not receive any rank. Because the quantity is unknown. If it destroys ℵ0 universes, it becomes 2-A.
If it destroys ℵ0 dimensions, it becomes High 1-B. But if it exceeds ℵ0, it won't get a rank because there is no attribute.

if the cosmology is not even close to what the statement implies, it’s considered an outlier then?

You can't usually scale to a tier. But with very strong context and evidence, and if it's handled consistently, you shouldn't have much trouble scaling.

 

[Dfg05]

Yes. Attribute is required, for example if a character exceeds ℵ0 it will not receive any rank. Because the quantity is unknown. If it destroys ℵ0 universes, it becomes 2-A.
If it destroys ℵ0 dimensions, it becomes High 1-B. But if it exceeds ℵ0, it won't get a rank because there is no attribute.



You can't usually scale to a tier. But with very strong context and evidence, and if it's handled consistently, you shouldn't have much trouble scaling.

Aight thanks a lot man
But last question, why is god unsong considered high outer for being above absolute infinity? Shouldn’t that not scale anywhere?

 

[Achille]

Aight thanks a lot man
But last question, why is god unsong considered high outer for being above absolute infinity? Shouldn’t that not scale anywhere?

Can you discard the CRT connection, which is considered High 1-A? Because I don't have the character you're talking about, my interpretation may be wrong.

 

[Dfg05]

Can you discard the CRT connection, which is considered High 1-A? Because I don't have the character you're talking about, my interpretation may be wrong.

Well it doesn’t really matter who the character is, here’s the thing I mentioned:
« Attack Potency: High Outerverse level (God is the ineffable and incomprehensible principle which orders and sustains all of creation as its simplest and most fundamental ontological ground, completely unbound by the basic principles and dichotomies inherent to the physical universe while encompassing all of them as an entity of pure wholeness possessing all characteristics and attributes, and embodying the property of "existence" itself. Represents the "Absolute Infinite" conceptualized by Georg Cantor that stands beyond any conceivable quantity, unreachable by the unending hierarchy of infinities discovered by him while transcending the very concept of "infinity," with all hierarchies ending in God by neccessity, as He is above all and will always be) »
Representing the absolute infinite here shouldn’t scale anywhere, so I don’t get why it’s high outer. Maybe there’s some context I don’t know of

 

[Another_Council]

Well it doesn’t really matter who the character is, here’s the thing I mentioned:
« Attack Potency: High Outerverse level (God is the ineffable and incomprehensible principle which orders and sustains all of creation as its simplest and most fundamental ontological ground, completely unbound by the basic principles and dichotomies inherent to the physical universe while encompassing all of them as an entity of pure wholeness possessing all characteristics and attributes, and embodying the property of "existence" itself. Represents the "Absolute Infinite" conceptualized by Georg Cantor that stands beyond any conceivable quantity, unreachable by the unending hierarchy of infinities discovered by him while transcending the very concept of "infinity," with all hierarchies ending in God by neccessity, as He is above all and will always be) »
Representing the absolute infinite here shouldn’t scale anywhere, so I don’t get why it’s high outer. Maybe there’s some context I don’t know of

IIRC there’s a chapter in Unsong where it explains Georg’s work and how the Absolute Infinite comes into play.

Here’s the thread in question

 

[XXKINGXX69]

Well it doesn’t really matter who the character is, here’s the thing I mentioned:
« Attack Potency: High Outerverse level (God is the ineffable and incomprehensible principle which orders and sustains all of creation as its simplest and most fundamental ontological ground, completely unbound by the basic principles and dichotomies inherent to the physical universe while encompassing all of them as an entity of pure wholeness possessing all characteristics and attributes, and embodying the property of "existence" itself. Represents the "Absolute Infinite" conceptualized by Georg Cantor that stands beyond any conceivable quantity, unreachable by the unending hierarchy of infinities discovered by him while transcending the very concept of "infinity," with all hierarchies ending in God by neccessity, as He is above all and will always be) »
Representing the absolute infinite here shouldn’t scale anywhere, so I don’t get why it’s high outer. Maybe there’s some context I don’t know of

According to cantor, absolute infinity is omnipotence, which can't be a thing in fiction. So this would be unquantifiable

 

[Dfg05]

IIRC there’s a chapter in Unsong where it explains Georg’s work and how the Absolute Infinite comes into play.

Here’s the thread in question

Well one of the mods has the same question as me, and doesn’t really seem to agree in the end.
But anyway not the point of the thread, all my questions were answered so thanks