Darth Vader's Soul Calibur scaling

[BigSmoke4269]

so basically darth vader's profile scales him to algol and i'm here to argue about why that shouldn't be the case

 

[XSOULOFCINDERX]

so basically darth vader's profile scales him to algol and i'm here to argue about why that shouldn't be the case

Why is this such an issue? Nothing Contradicts Vader being able to beat Algol.

 

[HeadlessKramerGeoff777]

In a non-canon ending

 

[SamanPatou]

Vader himself isn't canon to Soul Calibur to begin with, and the only totally legitimate thing he can scale from is his own ending, which isn't canon as a pure consequence.
The other characters don't scale to their own ending because they already exist in the main canon of the story, while Vader exists only in his own alternate story.

And in terms of powers and differences, he's different enough from the original and is totally a legitimate character in the game.

 

[XSOULOFCINDERX]

It's like what SamanPatou said in the other thread.

"That's because the other characters exist within the SC main canon, where they didn't beat Algol, while Vader exists only in his alternate story."

 

[KieranH10]

If Vader is his own canon with his own story that doesn't contradict anything from the main story, I see nothing wrong with his profile.

 

[SamanPatou]

Also non-canon characters are allowed as long as they aren't used to scale the canon characters, Vader is in his own bubble, and it's not even an outlier, since there's no reason to believe he can't beat Algol.

 

[BigSmoke4269]

Yoda and the Apprentice share that bubble with Darth Vader, and their endings contradict Vader's ending.

 

[XSOULOFCINDERX]

Yoda and the Apprentice share that bubble with Darth Vader, and their endings contradict Vader's ending.

Not really?

 

[XSOULOFCINDERX]

The Apprentice doesn't contradict it at all since that's just Vader sending him to do what he was gonna do himself.

 

[SamanPatou]

No, they just are in their own bubble, since they all contradict each other and there isn't an established canon for those characters.
They are all non-canon characters with a non-canon story, that just interact with each other, always in their own story.
It's like saying that canon Algon not meeting Vader contradicts a non-canon ending. The distinction between canon and not-canon exists for this reason.

 

[XSOULOFCINDERX]

Yoda's Story only contradicts in the way of "The literal level just before Algol, Yoda and Vader have to fight each other after beating Nightmare and Siegfried" so that just depends on who wins that matchup.

 

[BigSmoke4269]

But they interacted with each other. Iirc, the reason Yoda went to find the swords in the first place is because he sensed that Vader was headed for them.

 

[XSOULOFCINDERX]

Yoda's Story only contradicts in the way of "The literal level just before Algol, Yoda and Vader have to fight each other after beating Nightmare and Siegfried" so that just depends on who wins that matchup.

It's the same for Vader's Second to Last Level. He fights Yoda after Nightmare and Siegfried.

 

[SamanPatou]

Yes, but there isn't an actual "Star Wars Soul Calibur canon" to follow, each character is canon to his own story, regardless of who that character meets.

 

[BigSmoke4269]

I still don't see how the Star Wars characters scale and the SCIV characters don't.

 

[SamanPatou]

Because the other characters exist in the real plot, that goes differently.

You can see every non-canon ending of every fighting game as an alternate universe, we just don't make a key/profile for every one of them, just fot the canon versions, otherwise it would be a shitshow, especially with characters that appeared in many games.

Star Wars character just don't have a version in the main story, they exist only in their own alternate canon.

 

[XSOULOFCINDERX]

I still don't see how the Star Wars characters scale and the SCIV characters don't.

Because nothing that happens contradict them being able to beat Algol, unlike with the rest of the SC4 Cast. The only one who does end up fighting Algol Canonically is Mitsurugi who, would you look at that, Darth Vader also fights in the Opening Cinematic of the Playstation Version of the Game.

 

[BigSmoke4269]

Mitsurugi doesn't scale either, though, he's still like 7-B

Also the opening cinematic isn't the most reliable source for scaling and feats

 

[BigSmoke4269]

Wait he's like 6-A

ah well my point still stands

 

[XSOULOFCINDERX]

First of all, Mitsurugi is High 6-A Currently and he did fight Algol, so it happened regardless.

Second of all, it's his only other known for a fact feat aside from busting up Algol in his Ending.

 

[XSOULOFCINDERX]

So he either scales to Algol or scales to the guy who fought Algol. Take your pick.

 

[SamanPatou]

That's another thing on which I can't speak because I don't remember anything of SC4's plot, but it is irrelevant to the current question.

Most characters exist in the main story, while the Star Wars ones don't.
And every one also has his "alternate universe" in which they defeat Algol, we just can't give keys for every non-canon ending to each character, because it would end up clogging the profiles and creating a lot of confusion, aside of it being totally pointless.

On the other hand, Star Wars characters exist only in their bubble, there isn't a version of them in the canon story, so we pick them up for how they are inside their story.
You can see it as a privilege dictated by the need of not polluting canon characters' profile with useless keys.

 

[XSOULOFCINDERX]

Exactly.

 

[BigSmoke4269]

This really doesn't feel like it should be a profile in the first place

 

[XSOULOFCINDERX]

The biggest problem is that Soul Calibur 4 doesn't have a Canon ending within itself. We just see that SC5 leads to two of them sort of happening, that being Siegfried beats Nightmare but doesn't turn the world to Crystals like his SC4 Ending and Mitsurugi fought Algol, but was interrupted due to Nightmare dying and Algol getting pulled back into Astral Chaos.

 

[SamanPatou]

This really doesn't feel like it should be a profile in the first place

I don't see why, there are tons of non-canon profiles, there is even a category for them.
This Vader is different enough from his Star Wars counterpart, and the canon Soul Calibur characters don't scale to him, it is a totally legitimate and harmless profile.

 

[XSOULOFCINDERX]

I don't see why, there are tons of non-canon profiles, there is even a category for them.
This Vader is enough different from his Star Wars counterpart, and the canon Soul Calibur characters don't scale to him, it is a totally legitimate and harmless profile.

^^^^

 

[HeadlessKramerGeoff777]

I don't see why, there are tons of non-canon profiles, there is even a category for them.
This Vader is different enough from his Star Wars counterpart, and the canon Soul Calibur characters don't scale to him, it is a totally legitimate and harmless profile.

Yeah it’s harmless but it breaks the rules even if the rules are dumb

 

[KieranH10]

I completely agree with Saman on this one, the profile does not contradict or ruin anything else shown in the verse, he follows his own canon and therefor does not affect the rest of the verse, so the profile is completely harmless.

 

[SamanPatou]

Yeah it’s harmless but it breaks the rules even if the rules are dumb

Well, many of other crossover characters aren't canon but have profiles because they are different enough and aren't used to scale anyone else. Also, the same rules are currently being discussed by staff members to solve this issue.

 

[Antvasima]

I think that the profile page can remain for the moment. We are talking about our rules in private right now.