Satan VS Ultraman Neo Mebius

[Monarch_Laciel]

Battle for the strongest High 6-A

The Lord of Hell VS The Space Ranger

Base Mebius

Speed Unequalised

Takes place in Hell because Satan can't be anywhere else.

Ability restrictions? Absolutely none, seeing as this is meant to be for the strongest High 6-A

 

[Akreious]

I just realized I can make a buzz lightyear joke right now. Anyways, for those who say Mebius doesn't have a way to win; he does. Although it's via a BFR that he doesn't have control over.

Okay here's what I mean; Mebius can create a portal to the void. Now, a unique property of the Void in Neo Mebius is that it passively power nulls and EEs, plus there's going to be void entities trying to rip you apart. Mebius was sent here twice, in his Low 2-C state and 2-C state. During his first journey here, he got his powers completely nullified and only got out via help from The Hallowed Enchantress. The 2nd time when he was in 2-C, he was sent there by the Ethereal Hydra and the same result happened even though at that point, his whole being was at least 4D and possibly stronger. It's of note that due to his Omnilock, he could actually move around and at least attempt to escape unlike before where he couldn't move. He later got out, saved by the White Mebius.

So Mebius does indeed have a way to win. I'll give my thoughts more in-depth later but yeah.

Edit: I realized I mixed his stories together, just fixed it

 

[Drag-O-Drawgon]

I thought these two were going for speed equalized section of High 6-A.

 

[Monarch_Laciel]

A portal?

Does it suck them in or do they need to fall/walk in?

 

[Monarch_Laciel]

Also, what do you mean "he has no control over"

 

[Akreious]

The void will start eating at reality once the portal is open, so the sucky kind. Gimme a few minutes, I'll show you what I mean. His portals are kind of like a beam which can directly shoot at enemies to BFR only them

Edit: by no control, I mean that he has to make it count or else the void will "infest" reality and basically eat everything if the portal remains open for too long

 

[Monarch_Laciel]

Alright. Then one more question.

Can these beams hit non-corporeal conceptual beings that cannot be touched by anything not imbued by the collective consciousness of all sentient beings with an element of "fantasy", i.e. the abstract embodiment of a recessive concept that is not believed to exist in reality?

 

[Akreious]

So.... You're saying can it hit Abstracts....?


If that's what you're asking; it doesn't need to. Mebius can cause the beam to create the portal whenever he wants; such as firing it and opening the portal right on top of Satan. When the portal is opened, all of reality will be sucked into the void as it tries to infect reality and destroy it. So technically Satan wouldn't be "touched", and instead sucked into Nothing. The void operates kind of like "High concentration goes to low concentration", except the high concentration is void energy and the low concentration is forcibly shoved into the high concentration area.

Edit: And if you're wondering why Mebius only used this BFR twice, him opening it for 2 seconds (His perspective) easily sucked in 20% of the Earth's mass with huge reprucussions. He will only use it once he's blasted Satan a bunch of times to no avail

 

[Monarch_Laciel]

Thing is though, Satan isn't "reality".

 

[Akreious]

Explain? Because you don't need to be "Of reality" to get affected by the Void. The only way you cannot be affected at all is if you're naturally a void being; or else you'd get sucked into the void. If you're a "Thing", you're a target non-corporeal or not. The only reason why the Aetherion Lords (my 1-A abstracts) don't get affected by the Void is because they were created within the Void, so they can naturally exist there anyways. The Ascended (My species of High 1-Bs) yield enough power to come and go within the Void, but their power is vastly drained and would rather not do it on any day of the week. Any other being within my verse (With only a few exceptions) gets torn apart, power nulled or just stuck there for eternity.

 

[Monarch_Laciel]

Satan is a being of the Neverworld rather than the Everworld. Hence, he is a creature of fantasy rather than reality, and can only be affected by thing imbued with fantasy. You said "reality" gets sucked in, which he is not. From what you have explained though, he'd get affected anyway.

However, BFR won't work. Satan can't exist outside hell, and if he leaves it, Alaya puts him back where he should be. His entire motivation during his appearances is trying to find ways to leave it.

 

[Drag-O-Drawgon]

Doesn't Alaya count as outside help? (Can't do that here)

 

[Monarch_Laciel]

No. It's just like the Brothers Death for SCP-1440, or SCP-343 for 682, or Khorne for Kharn

 

[Akreious]

Just saying, pulling back Satan to the "real world" will cause Void Entities to "latch on" and try to take him back; and if Alaya goes full force and just doesn't allow Satan to go to the void, the Void Entities will sweep reality and basically cause World War Reality (Which occured only once in Ultraman Neo Mebius, being the reason why Mebius describes the verse he's in as unnatural)

If Alaya pulls Satan back to Hell, that's basically declaring war on the Void itself. Mebius only got out scott-free because utilized power from a Tier 0 in order to do it (Which the Void Entities know not to **** with)

And I'm gonna be frank, if Satan gets pulled back to reality (Or well, the battlefield) then it's going to be Neo Mebius and Satan vs Endless Void Entities rather than this battle itself.

 

[Monarch_Laciel]

I am 90% certain Alaya would casually overpower the Void Entities and push them back in without any problems.

 

[Akreious]

at least half of them are 1-A themselves Y'know; Zen'O and the 13 Original Kais from Dragon Ball Genesis being prime examples. These void entities are literal nothing; complete and utter opposite of anything that exists. The Aetherion Lords are creations of The Living Pantheon and as such possess immense power superior; with the Living Pantheon being a High 1-A who basically encompasses everything yet nothing.

Saying Alaya casually pushes them back would imply she has the strength to casually overpower an unfathomably huge amount of other 1-As.

I know this might seem like an "oh well uh, nope!" Comment but it's true; when we're this high in my verse's hierarchy then all of my verses are connected

 

[Monarch_Laciel]

Alaya is unfathomably superior to beings (Ultimate Archetype Nyarlathotep) who combines the powers of all the following: Beings (Azathoth) who transcend beings (Yog-Sothoth) who transcend beings (The Outer Gods) who are superior to beings (base Nyarlathotep) who transcend creatures (The Hunting Horrors) who already transcend infinite layers of Outerversal spaces and their concepts which are each indeterinably greater than the last, which exists above infinite dimensions (the Yog-Sothothium layer). So yeah. It kinda does have the power to casually overpower an unfathomably huge amount of other 1-As, who are all themselves ridiculously powerful.

And being "literal nothing" isn't a defense considering Alaya constantly pushes back and defends itself against the Void Incarnate trying to erase it.

Also Alaya isn't a she btw, it's an it.

 

[Akreious]

female name = It's a she in my book >;3

And.... Void Entities in my verse can't really be transcended. There's no "Transcending" with these 1-As; that's the difference between your Alaya transcending other 1-As. Since they're literal nothing; you can't transcend them period. You can overpower them, sure, but even the weakest of these 1-As are a threat to the Aetherion Lords who each hold a part of Creation in their hands similarly to how Alaya is basically the amalgamation of all sentient minds.

 

[Monarch_Laciel]

None of that says to me that Alaya can't just put Satan back where he should be and say lolno to the Void Entities trying to grab him.

1-A abstracts are less than fodder to Alaya, and it fights against the embodiment of absolute nothingness all the time. Literally all the time.

And it's not so much the amalgamation of sentient minds as the amalgamation of their High 1-A reality warping essence that acts in accordance with their beliefs. Yes, High 1-A essence.

 

[Akreious]

The Aetherion Lords aren't just 1-A Abstracts; the Aetherion Lords kick those being's asses all the time. The Aetherion Lords are basically Already extremely powerful 1-A Void entities that's been blessed by a straight High 1-A that's only weakness is there's a tier 0. And even with the backing of this High 1-A, they're still threatened by even the weakest of these Void entities if they're not careful.

And for the record, the Void has literal uncountable amounts of "This being is fodder to this being" due to the very nature of the Void. And I'm going to be honest, pretty much nothing on Alaya's abilities can affect these Void Entities. The only beings known to be able to affect the Void Entities is the High 1-A and tier 0; the Aetherion Lords can also affect them but only with Void Manipulation.

So I can't see how Alaya lolnopes Void Entities that even the weakest of which are a threat to 1-As that have powers backed up by a High 1-A.


And before you say it, it seems like our Voids operate very differently so comparing the two isn't accurate; at least as of right now.

 

[Monarch_Laciel]

What is High 1-A to one verse is fodder 1-A to another. If what you say is "the void entities are only known to be affected by High 1-A and Tier 0 characters", then I'm just going to ask you how powerful that High 1-A is.

Not that it matters. If Satan gets stuck and dies to the Void, Alaya just recreates him back in hell, and the fight continues.

 

[Akreious]

"then I'm just going to ask you how poewrful that High 1-A is" Oh you KNOW that's not possible given the nature of the High 1-A tier

Other than that; since speed here is unequal, Mebius has pretty much all the time in the world to figure out how to take out Satan.

And from that, I'm voting Inconclusive on 'ere. Sure, Satan has bountiful amounts of more Hax but he literally can't precieve Mebius who's very nature is to speed blitz. But Mebius is able to BFR, although Satan comes back. Even if Satan tries to outlive Mebius, Mebius is capable of reviving himself at least 10 times before he gets any semblance of mental fatigue from doing it.

Question, in his weaknesses it says that if revived through Alaya, he loses his powers that were not gained from humanity's belief in him. What are said powers?

 

[Monarch_Laciel]

It's entirely possible. It's just not often brought up because different verses. But as long as it isn't omnipotent, it has a measurable power. And a measurable power can be compared.

Satan outlives him 10 times then? And Mebius is going to get tired. And if he stands still for about 2 seconds, Satan mind haxes.

None. All the powers listed are powers from humanity's belief in Satan. It's only if he was to say, get an upgrade from someone else. If he was killed then, he would be restored without that upgrade.

 

[Akreious]

Ahmm, no. The Living Pantheon is basically as close to Omnipotent as one can be. Actually, it might as well be. In my verse, it can do all; be all and destroy all. It represents everything yet nothing. Going against it in a fight is the equivalent of fighting yourself, everything and non-things. If Baraghi didn't exist (Tier 0), the Living Pantheon would be tier 0.

About that standing still thing... see, he still operates at Massively Hypersonic speeds even when standing still. An example is when he stood still when under heavy fire from an Alien Fleet; even though he was standing still, their energy blasts was still as slow to him as he was running. So standing still isn't going to get Mebius killed here. And Monarch, you're assuming Mebius is just gonna live out 10 lives (Which is at least 72,000 years his perspective if he died RIGHT AT 7,200 years old) doing the same old thing and not attempting anything new. Possibly Supergenius intelligence, and a way for information probing via Telepathy and Clairvoyance? Not gonna use any of that?

Ah okay that's how it works.... But then I have another question. If Satan is killed and revived via Alaya, wouldn't Mebius technically win since Satan wouldn't retain any of his Memories or know to fight Mebius? That'd at least garner an inconclusive, since I doubt Satan would try to fight Mebius if Mebius just shrunk himself down to the subatomic level after he gets revived or something like that.

Edit: I just realized something; even with speed unequal... Redardant can't actually defeat Satan? At least not that I can see... And Redardant doesn't even have Longevity or Type 1 Immortality or at least resurrection in case he needs it.

 

[Drag-O-Drawgon]

1. Gonna say inconclusive for this due to Mebuius revival + the void vs Alaya argument. (If there are two of these, it's a glitch)

2. Redardant probably couldn't put Satan down with that mechanic he has, but he can still blitz the living hell out of Ultraman speed unequalized even though he has inconclusive (consistency with what I just said in 1) (possible win with BFR) against Satan. So we almost have a triangle here.

Just to simplify the "near" triangle, Mebius=Satan, Redardant > Mebius, Satan > Redardant

 

[Monarch_Laciel]

Damn it, my reply didn't go through. Ok

Ahmm, no. The Living Pantheon is basically as close to Omnipotent as one can be. Actually, it might as well be. In my verse, it can do all; be all and destroy all. It represents everything yet nothing. Going against it in a fight is the equivalent of fighting yourself, everything and non-things. If Baraghi didn't exist (Tier 0), the Living Pantheon would be tier 0.

Perhaps. But what in your verse constitutes "everything"? If it's less than another verse's...

About that standing still thing... see, he still operates at Massively Hypersonic speeds even when standing still. An example is when he stood still when under heavy fire from an Alien Fleet; even though he was standing still, their energy blasts was still as slow to him as he was running. So standing still isn't going to get Mebius killed here.

I don't think you understood what I meant. Sure Satan might be moving in slow motion from his perspective. But if he stands still for a single second from Satan's, he would get mind/soul haxxed.

And Monarch, you're assuming Mebius is just gonna live out 10 lives (Which is at least 72,000 years his perspective if he died RIGHT AT 7,200 years old) doing the same old thing and not attempting anything new. Possibly Supergenius intelligence, and a way for information probing via Telepathy and Clairvoyance? Not gonna use any of that?

He can use it as much as he wants, he still doesn't have a way to put Satan down.

Ah okay that's how it works.... But then I have another question. If Satan is killed and revived via Alaya, wouldn't Mebius technically win since Satan wouldn't retain any of his Memories or know to fight Mebius? That'd at least garner an inconclusive, since I doubt Satan would try to fight Mebius if Mebius just shrunk himself down to the subatomic level after he gets revived or something like that.

A) SBA says they need to kill each other. B) Satan hates everyone and would probably try to kill Mebius just for him being there. C) Shrinking himself down to subatomic would make Mebius unable to do anything to Satan, in which case he loses if he stays like that for an hour, or he would attract Satan's attention when he does try to attack.

Edit: I just realized something; even with speed unequal... Redardant can't actually defeat Satan? At least not that I can see... And Redardant doesn't even have Longevity or Type 1 Immortality or at least resurrection in case he needs it.

He probably can't

 

[Akreious]

"Perhaps. But what in your verse constitutes "everything"? If it's less than another verse's..."


Everything that's not the Void. Reality, Existence, Concepts, the Infinite Magniverse, Dimensions, Abstracts, Magic, Etc. So, basically, "Every" thing.


"I don't think you understood what I meant. Sure Satan might be moving in slow motion from his perspective. But if he stands still for a single second from Satan's, he would get mind/soul haxxed."


I don't think you understood what I meant either; Mebius won't slow down even if he stands still. Satan will literally be unable to precieve what Mebius is doing even if he just sat there infront of his face for awhile. The minimum difference between Supersonic and Mebius' AT LEAST mach 44 is 41.5 Machs. That is absolutely flipping huge.

Example: the vast majority of Mebius' fights later on happens in the span of less than a second to everyone else despite fighting for hours on end and even pausing for "Obligatory Mid-Battle Talk", but even with that he never slowed down to a level where mach speeders can precieve him.


"A) SBA says they need to kill each other. B) Satan hates everyone and would probably try to kill Mebius just for him being there. C) Shrinking himself down to subatomic would make Mebius unable to do anything to Satan, in which case he loses if he stays like that for an hour, or he would attract Satan's attention when he does try to attack."


A) "Victory Conditions: Killing the opponent, removing the opponent from the battlefield for at least one month (BFR), knocking the opponent out for at least one hour, permanently incapacitating the opponent by putting him in a state in which he can not harm the other fighter(s) anymore over one month, even if those don't actively defend against him." So, no. You don't have to kill the other opponent. B) Unless Satan has some sort of Extrasensory persepction or Cosmic Awareness, I am not sure if Satan can even see Mebius if he goes sub. And why would he lose? Satan wouldn't even know Mebius was there. And, by the way, Mebius would retain his speed. SubAtomic Mebius attacking Satan wouldn't draw his attention at all since he again, can't even precieve Mebius even in at his slowest speeds


"He probably can't" So..... 3 way inconclusive if this thread goes inconclusive?

 

[Monarch_Laciel]

My bad. SBA says they want to kill each other. Which is why he would keep fighting.

The only reason Mebius isn't getting soul haxed off the bat is his speed making him move faster than Satan can comprehend. But "being fast" doesn't make someone invisible if they are standing still. Hence, if Mebius stands still for about a second from Satan's perspective, Satan sees him and haxes. Also, Satan still probably outlives.

I don't really know about three way inconclusive.

Speed Equal: Satan stomps both of them at the same time.

Speed Unequal: Neither of them can put Satan down despite their insane speed advantage, Redardant blitzes Mebius, and Redardant eventually dies from old age. Leaving Satan the victor

 

[Akreious]

"The only reason Mebius isn't getting soul haxed off the bat is his speed making him move faster than Satan can comprehend. But "being fast" doesn't make someone invisible if they are standing still. Hence, if Mebius stands still for about a second from Satan's perspective, Satan sees him and haxes. Also, Satan still probably outlives."

See, that's not how it works in Neo Mebius. He stood absolutely still and casually talked to Empera mid-way through their battle but literally nobody else could even comperehend that they did so. They literally "Stood still" too fast for them to comprehend. Satan literally won't be able to see Mebius if he keeps operating at Massively Hypersonic speeds kind of like how Flashtime works in The CW's The Flash TV Show. Even when standing still, nobody can comprehend The Flash because he was moving way too fast.


And I'm not sure if Redardant blitzing Mebius is actually a way to victory. Redardant blitzes Mebius say, 8 times and he revives 8 times. Mebius says lolreactivepowerlevel and goes up to Redardant's speed and stomps. Actually, correction, Redardant can't bypass Regenerationn Mid-High. Might as well make a versus match with Redardant later :L


Edit: Mebius had one near-death experience and jumped from 2-C (Baraghi Base) to well into 2-B (Post-White Arc Base); being able to destroy a Magniverse which on its own is AT LEAST 3 Trillion Timelines. That's not even from dying.

So to me, it's actually looking like Redardant can't actually win against either of us. If Redardant blitzes Mebius, he will just keep coming back with Regen and eventually gain equal speed then stomp back. He actually doesn't need equal speed, just comparable enough to where Cosmic Awareness + Clairvoyance would allow him to lolbfr or actually just blast him with anything since Mebius is very high-end High 6-A.

 

[Drag-O-Drawgon]

"The only reason Mebius isn't getting soul haxed off the bat is his speed making him move faster than Satan can comprehend. But "being fast" doesn't make someone invisible if they are standing still. Hence, if Mebius stands still for about a second from Satan's perspective, Satan sees him and haxes. Also, Satan still probably outlives."

See, that's not how it works in Neo Mebius. He stood absolutely still and casually talked to Empera mid-way through their battle but literally nobody else could even comperehend that they did so. They literally "Stood still" too fast for them to comprehend. Satan literally won't be able to see Mebius if he keeps operating at Massively Hypersonic speeds kind of like how Flashtime works in The CW's The Flash TV Show. Even when standing still, nobody can comprehend The Flash because he was moving way too fast.


And I'm not sure if Redardant blitzing Mebius is actually a way to victory. Redardant blitzes Mebius say, 8 times and he revives 8 times. Mebius says lolreactivepowerlevel and goes up to Redardant's speed and stomps. Actually, correction, Redardant can't bypass Regenerationn Mid-High. Might as well make a versus match with Redardant later :L


Edit: Mebius had one near-death experience and jumped from 2-C (Baraghi Base) to well into 2-B (Post-White Arc Base); being able to destroy a Magniverse which on its own is AT LEAST 3 Trillion Timelines. That's not even from dying.

So to me, it's actually looking like Redardant can't actually win against either of us. If Redardant blitzes Mebius, he will just keep coming back with Regen and eventually gain equal speed then stomp back. He actually doesn't need equal speed, just comparable enough to where Cosmic Awareness + Clairvoyance would allow him to lolbfr or actually just blast him with anything since Mebius is very high-end High 6-A.

Please do not assume other's OCs to be baseline their tiers (Unless they just write (comparable to X) and there isn't a link with nothing else). Especially when they have a feat that's actually calculable straight from the page. (Grabs calculator, yeah he could be High 6-A to 5-C, so no, not baseline)

 

[Akreious]

I never said he was baseline. Please don't accuse me of things I never said. Mebius 1-shot a Zetton, sending it flying. This caused the sea to split like Moses brought the Jews, flew into the sky towards the moon, and smashed into it and almost shattering it like glass. I admit Mebius isn't just Possibly 5-C, He's Likely 5-C and well into it if we take the high end and the fact that the attack he used wasn't even considered one of his "Finishers".

 

[Drag-O-Drawgon]

I never said he was baseline. Please don't accuse me of things I never said. Mebius 1-shot a Zetton, sending it flying. This caused the sea to split like Moses brought the Jews, flew into the sky towards the moon, and smashed into it and almost shattering it like glass. I admit Mebius isn't just Possibly 5-C, He's Likely 5-C and well into it if we take the high end and the fact that the attack he used wasn't even considered one of his "Finishers".

I can tell by context you were assuming he was. And literally with the calc he would be around that very same level you just described. So no one shot there.

 

[Akreious]

You're using the word context a lot huh... anyways.... I'll stop this debate here since this is the wrong thread for it; but I'll just say this as you seem to be forgetting something. You're assuming Mebius will ONLY get speed upgrades everytime he regens and reactive power levels and gain no increase in power at all. I guarantee you that if Redardant tries to speed blitz Mebius a few times and he reactive power levels, he WILL gain the AP needed to 1-shot (especially if Redardant does it enough times to where Mebius is equal to Redardant in speed).

 

[Drag-O-Drawgon]

You're using the word context a lot huh... anyways.... I'll stop this debate here since this is the wrong thread for it; but I'll just say this as you seem to be forgetting something. You're assuming Mebius will ONLY get speed upgrades everytime he regens and reactive power levels and gain no increase in power at all. I guarantee you that if Redardant tries to speed blitz Mebius a few times and he reactive power levels, he WILL gain the AP needed to 1-shot (especially if Redardant does it enough times to where Mebius is equal to Redardant in speed).

Last message in this thread, when it comes to strongest in whatever tier, you can't stat amp (or reactive power level or whatever) above it (read the OP on the wiki's strongest), when it goes above, it's no longer within this. I really don't care too much if Redardant loses, I just care that you don't completely ignore rules like that.

 

[Akreious]

I'm not. Even if he's restricted to High 6-A; he'd still reactive power level to the very top one can go.