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Sasuke's TSO resistance doesn't make sense
- Thread starter GTsek
- Start date
- 10,995
- 16,265
I think you're referring to All-killing Ash Bone which is what disintegrated Obito and not TSO
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That wasn't the erasure turn to dust one, since the first 3 kage regenned from it, same reason why he can regen from it
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Well, that can be chalked up to his Juubito Key lacking said resistance due to losing control, whereas his Six Paths Sage Obito can freely touch his TSO.
And looking at previous chapters it seems his Juubito Key never touched his TSO he only ever used it through the holes in his hands.
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Yeah, it seems the only time he touched his TSO was when he became his final key or Six Paths Sage Obito Key, before that the TSO never made any physical contact with his body.
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- Thread starter
- #7
My point here is the following: It is mentioned in Sasuke's profile an alleged resistance to the effects of TSO, and this justification mentions that users of Six Paths Chakra have such resistance, and this is a mistake because Obito had this power and was affected.
I believe this is due to the fact that he steps on Naruto's TSO, but as mentioned in the Databook, the effects of TSO are not passive, TSO is a sphere of dense chakra, which contains the 5 natural elements and Yin-Yang, and its shape and size can be manipulated at will by the user, and it is also mentioned that when manipulating the elements present in them, various effects are created. Literally means that all effects depend on the user to create, it is not something passive:
www.narutoforums.org
As I already showed, Obito who has this power is affected, and in this scene we can see him protecting himself from an attack by the TSO:
https://***********.com/read-online/Naruto-chapter-641-page-2.html
https://***********.com/read-online/Naruto-chapter-641-page-3.html
Besides that when he goes to attack with the TSO, he does not touch them directly, but uses it through a hole in his hands:
https://***********.com/read-online/Naruto-chapter-642-page-8.html https://***********.com/read-online/Naruto-chapter-645-page-9.html https://***********.com/read-online/Naruto-chapter-648-page-12.html https://***********.com/read-online/Naruto-chapter-650-page-9.html https://***********.com/read-online/Naruto-chapter-638-page-24.html https://***********.com/read-online/Naruto-chapter-639-page-2.html
When not attacking, he touch normally:
Resume:
-The effects of TSO are not passive, they need to be created by the user.
-A Six Paths Chakra user can be affected, which makes the current justification invalid
-A proof that the effects are passive is that Obito only touches the TSO when he is not attacking
-Touching the TSO does not mean that it is immune to the effects, as Obito touches a few times and is still affected
-Sasuke stepping on the TSO does not mean he is immune to the effects, as they depend on Naruto and he obviously did not create any effect while Sasuke was on the TSO
I believe this is due to the fact that he steps on Naruto's TSO, but as mentioned in the Databook, the effects of TSO are not passive, TSO is a sphere of dense chakra, which contains the 5 natural elements and Yin-Yang, and its shape and size can be manipulated at will by the user, and it is also mentioned that when manipulating the elements present in them, various effects are created. Literally means that all effects depend on the user to create, it is not something passive:
Databook IV Collection Thread
Insect Jamming One of the Hiden Jutsu handed down in the Aburame Clan. A vast number of insects are released into the air, which misleads/bewilders chakra sensing. This prevents the enemy from reading one's allies intelligence, Having trouble making out the last Kanji and Hiragana due to...
www.narutoforums.org
As I already showed, Obito who has this power is affected, and in this scene we can see him protecting himself from an attack by the TSO:
https://***********.com/read-online/Naruto-chapter-641-page-2.html
https://***********.com/read-online/Naruto-chapter-641-page-3.html
https://***********.com/read-online/Naruto-chapter-641-page-7.html
Besides that when he goes to attack with the TSO, he does not touch them directly, but uses it through a hole in his hands:
https://***********.com/read-online/Naruto-chapter-642-page-8.html https://***********.com/read-online/Naruto-chapter-645-page-9.html https://***********.com/read-online/Naruto-chapter-648-page-12.html https://***********.com/read-online/Naruto-chapter-650-page-9.html https://***********.com/read-online/Naruto-chapter-638-page-24.html https://***********.com/read-online/Naruto-chapter-639-page-2.html
When not attacking, he touch normally:
https://***********.com/read-online/Naruto-chapter-642-page-2.html
https://***********.com/read-online/Naruto-chapter-642-page-3.html
Resume:
-The effects of TSO are not passive, they need to be created by the user.
-A Six Paths Chakra user can be affected, which makes the current justification invalid
-A proof that the effects are passive is that Obito only touches the TSO when he is not attacking
-Touching the TSO does not mean that it is immune to the effects, as Obito touches a few times and is still affected
-Sasuke stepping on the TSO does not mean he is immune to the effects, as they depend on Naruto and he obviously did not create any effect while Sasuke was on the TSO
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TSOs have combat applicable:
Matter Manipulation
Existence Erasure
Power Nullification
Six Paths Chakra Users have resistance to them on their profile, but if your CRT were accepted it would only remove their Resistance to Matter Manipulation and maybe EE, and leave Resistance to Power Nullification.
But BSM Naruto and EMS Sasuke (Curse Seal Susanoo) were unaffected by Obito's TSOs in their fight, Base Naruto (Six Paths Chakra) was able to kick away Madara's TSO that was meant to kill Guy, Madara cut off Minato's arm using a TSO staff, Obito erased part of Minato's kunai using a TSO staff, Madara got kicked through a TSO cocoon by Guy that needed to be Kamui'd first.
Matter Manipulation
Existence Erasure
Power Nullification
Six Paths Chakra Users have resistance to them on their profile, but if your CRT were accepted it would only remove their Resistance to Matter Manipulation and maybe EE, and leave Resistance to Power Nullification.
But BSM Naruto and EMS Sasuke (Curse Seal Susanoo) were unaffected by Obito's TSOs in their fight, Base Naruto (Six Paths Chakra) was able to kick away Madara's TSO that was meant to kill Guy, Madara cut off Minato's arm using a TSO staff, Obito erased part of Minato's kunai using a TSO staff, Madara got kicked through a TSO cocoon by Guy that needed to be Kamui'd first.
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- Thread starter
- #9
About Sasuke and Naruto versus Obito, the two had senjutsu, which somehow negates the TSO's Yin-Yang effect.
Naruto when he punches Madara's TSO when he presses him on Shinju, he has the chakra concentrated on his fist, he may have used the wise chakra to counteract the effect of Yin-Yang, and he may have done the same thing when kicking. There is also the possibility that Madara didn’t use any effect on the TSO during the trip to the Guy, but would apply it upon reaching the Guy. Madara himself may have concentrated wise chakra in the body when he was pressed against the TSO, or he may have simply removed the effect when Kakashi made a hole in the TSO, or he may not even have applied any effect to the TSO that was covering him, but applied only those he launched on Guy.
There are several possibilities and discussing what may or may not have happened in confused cases is really complicated, but we have evidence that having the Six Path Chakra does not mean immunity, but in the case of Senjutsu we have confirmation that it cancels the effects of Yin-Yang, so in all cases where the TSO had no effect on anyone, it may have been because Senjutsu canceled the effect or because no effect was currently active. Sasuke's case matches the second case, he doesn't have Senjutsu and his orb scene is very explicit that Naruto allows.
Naruto when he punches Madara's TSO when he presses him on Shinju, he has the chakra concentrated on his fist, he may have used the wise chakra to counteract the effect of Yin-Yang, and he may have done the same thing when kicking. There is also the possibility that Madara didn’t use any effect on the TSO during the trip to the Guy, but would apply it upon reaching the Guy. Madara himself may have concentrated wise chakra in the body when he was pressed against the TSO, or he may have simply removed the effect when Kakashi made a hole in the TSO, or he may not even have applied any effect to the TSO that was covering him, but applied only those he launched on Guy.
There are several possibilities and discussing what may or may not have happened in confused cases is really complicated, but we have evidence that having the Six Path Chakra does not mean immunity, but in the case of Senjutsu we have confirmation that it cancels the effects of Yin-Yang, so in all cases where the TSO had no effect on anyone, it may have been because Senjutsu canceled the effect or because no effect was currently active. Sasuke's case matches the second case, he doesn't have Senjutsu and his orb scene is very explicit that Naruto allows.
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Well, Obito wasn't in full control of his powers, he exploded it and got hurt.
TSB also carries AP, just because you are resistant doesn't mean you are immune to it, they can hit each other with TSB and leave bruises.
Sasuke's resistances are fine.
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Pre-Control Juubito being used as justification for this downgrade is just wrong. Not only did he have no control over his abilities at the time, but he also never actually touched them until he lost control and the TSO vaporized half of his body.
It should also be noted that Pre-Control Juubito's TSO lacked Yin-Yang Release, which is responsible for the Power Nullification and EE aspects, as well as other applications. At the time, all the TSOs could do was destroy things on a molecular level and shapeshift, which is why the Edo Hokage could regenerate, while Minato later on couldn't (which, again, was attributed to him now applying Yin-Yang Release on the TSOs).
Finally, the whole argument about the effects not being passive is nonsense for the simple fact that this was never ever implied, quite the opposite actually. There's more than enough evidence to prove they're always active and potent, while there's absolutely nothing to remotely prove the contrary.
There have been numerous instances where the characters clearly state that just touching the TSB in rod, sphere, or any other form (that isn't transmutated) is enough to completely erase you. We even see the characters continuously warn against this, and actively try to either avoid or work around making contact with them at any cost.
This is all consistent with Madara being shocked at Naruto's ability to physically touch a TSO, which as we all know is attributed to his Six Paths chakra. Since Sasuke also has Six Paths chakra, he keeps his resistance. It's that simple. This thread should be closed.
It should also be noted that Pre-Control Juubito's TSO lacked Yin-Yang Release, which is responsible for the Power Nullification and EE aspects, as well as other applications. At the time, all the TSOs could do was destroy things on a molecular level and shapeshift, which is why the Edo Hokage could regenerate, while Minato later on couldn't (which, again, was attributed to him now applying Yin-Yang Release on the TSOs).
Finally, the whole argument about the effects not being passive is nonsense for the simple fact that this was never ever implied, quite the opposite actually. There's more than enough evidence to prove they're always active and potent, while there's absolutely nothing to remotely prove the contrary.
There have been numerous instances where the characters clearly state that just touching the TSB in rod, sphere, or any other form (that isn't transmutated) is enough to completely erase you. We even see the characters continuously warn against this, and actively try to either avoid or work around making contact with them at any cost.
This is all consistent with Madara being shocked at Naruto's ability to physically touch a TSO, which as we all know is attributed to his Six Paths chakra. Since Sasuke also has Six Paths chakra, he keeps his resistance. It's that simple. This thread should be closed.
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