Sasuke Uchiha (Naruto) vs Reid Astrea (Re:Zero)

[Croissant_13]

Sasuke's and Reid's profiles.
Part 2 and last key for Sasuke.
Equal speed.
Starting distance is 100 meters.

 

[Fezzih_007]

Genjutsu GG.

 

[SatellaTheWoE]

Reid slashes once gg i guess?
You should make this match with reinhard sinxe he has resistance

 

[Fezzih_007]

Reid slashes once gg i guess?

Not really, since he would need to get in range, before Sasuke put him in a Genjutsu, which is very unlike to happen.

And using Reinhard would't exactly work, since he have EE, that Sasuke can't escape. Well, his Genjutsu might help trought, since It have more potency.

 

[SatellaTheWoE]

Not really, since he would need to get in range, before Sasuke put him in a Genjutsu, which is very unlike to happen.

And using Reinhard would't exactly work, since he have EE, that Sasuke can't escape. Well, his Genjutsu might help trought, since It have more potency.

You could use his high 6A key then, also i dont think genjutsu layers have been accepted yet

 

[Rutæhh]

is sasukes first move genjutsu? I know he uses it in IC but i would have thought he would use h2h combat first

 

[SatellaTheWoE]

is sasukes first move genjutsu? I know he uses it in IC but i would have thought he would use h2h combat first

Its one of his starting moves yeah, i mean why wouldn't he just use his eyes to defeat his enemies if he can instead of taking the effort to actually fight

 

[Fezzih_007]

is sasukes first move genjutsu? I know he uses it in IC but i would have thought he would use h2h combat first

That's a good question, for what i remenber not really?
Well, he fight most people who can get out of Genjutsu pretty easily, so that may be the reason. But not sure.

 

[DavidTPPM]

also i dont think genjutsu layers have been accepted yet

They're on the Naruto Verse page so I assume they were.
And yeah what stops Sasuke from just precog dodging everything and Genjutsu one shotting?

 

[SatellaTheWoE]

They're on the Naruto Verse page so I assume they were.
And yeah what stops Sasuke from just precog dodging everything and Genjutsu one shotting?

Well if we are going on skill alone and ignoring the Genjutsu aspect then Reid skillstomps, his own AP is massively upscaling from a character who just needs to look ar you to know exactly how to strike you to kill you in one hit to the point where even an eternity of training for them wouldn't get them to his level. He is also skilled enough to skillstomp Ram who can read you better rhan if she was reading your mind and knows what you will do before you yourself do
If it was JUST based on h2h then Reid negative diffs Sasugay

 

[DavidTPPM]

Well if we are going on skill alone and ignoring the Genjutsu aspect then Reid skillstomps, his own AP is massively upscaling from a character who just needs to look ar you to know exactly how to strike you to kill you in one hit to the point where even an eternity of training for them wouldn't get them to his level. He is also skilled enough to skillstomp Ram who can read you better rhan if she was reading your mind and knows what you will do before you yourself do
If it was JUST based on h2h then Reid negative diffs Sasugay

Yeah p2 Sasuke isn't really all that skilled. Well he is very skilled but not "eternity of training wouldn't get you to this level" skilled.

That being said he does have pretty OP precog which is a decent counter for raw skill. At least to some level. Especially combined with Sasuke spamming other hax and teleportation

 

[LordGinSama]

Reid skill stomps to the point where it isn't even funny.

He got slapped around by Killer B who's significantly less skilled than characters like Reid so the Sharingan Prediction ain't helping him much, if at all.

 

[LordGinSama]

Yeah p2 Sasuke isn't really all that skilled. Well he is very skilled but not "eternity of training wouldn't get you to this level" skilled.

That being said he does have pretty OP precog which is a decent counter for raw skill. At least to some level. Especially combined with Sasuke spamming other hax and teleportation

Sasuke doesnt have Precognition. He has Analytical Prediction which isn't even very notable.

 

[SatellaTheWoE]

Yeah p2 Sasuke isn't really all that skilled. Well he is very skilled but not "eternity of training wouldn't get you to this level" skilled.

That being said he does have pretty OP precog which is a decent counter for raw skill. At least to some level. Especially combined with Sasuke spamming other hax and teleportation

Right so Ram is actually multiple lifetimes to an eternity of training behind Theresia so in theory Theresia should also be able to counter Ram.... and yeah she is also an eternity behind.
Ley Batenkaitos can also teleport and even Emilia who was physically weaker than him at that time could counter him. Where is Emilia in the skill chain you ask? Low mid tier fodder
Reid can also just make up new fighting styles that are perfect for countering everything skill based in Sasuke's arsenal
So yeah, Sasuke doesnt have much on Reid at all

 

[LordGinSama]

Tbh Reid can probably just cut the concept of Chakra, given his CM manipulation. Both Types 2 and 3 would be more than sufficient enough to make Chakra go bye bye so no Genjutsu.

 

[DavidTPPM]

He got slapped around by Killer B who's significantly less skilled than characters like Reid so the Sharingan Prediction ain't helping him much, if at all.

That's
1. Pre-war Sasuke.
And
2. Bees fighting style was a direct counter to Sasukes precog.

Reid can also just make up new fighting styles that are perfect for countering everything skill based in Sasuke's arsenal
So yeah, Sasuke doesnt have much on Reid at all

Sauce still has genjutsu and other hax. Hitting him with them will probably be difficult by itself but if he genjutsu manips him and then attacks he should get the W.

Tbh Reid can probably just cut the concept of Chakra, given his CM manipulation. Both Types 2 and 3 would be more than sufficient enough to make Chakra go bye bye so no Genjutsu.

Would he start by cutting the concept of chakra? Would he even know about it to cut it? Why would he cut it faster than Sasuke can use a genjutsu which is thought based.

 

[SatellaTheWoE]

Actually now that i think of it, due to how absurd reid is he might actually just cut the Genjutsu itself

That's
1. Pre-war Sasuke.
And
2. Bees fighting style was a direct counter to Sasukes precog.

Theresia will just see faults, mistakes and openings in Bees style and Reid will make an even better version of it

Sauce still has genjutsu and other hax. Hitting him with them will probably be difficult by itself but if he genjutsu manips him and then attacks he should get the W.

Would he start by cutting the concept of chakra? Would he even know about it to cut it? Why would he cut it faster than Sasuke can use a genjutsu which is thought based.

I mean it all depends on if Sasuke uses genjutsu as an opening move, and yeah due to verse equlaization mana = chakra and he can easily sense rhat. Heck he can even sense Cor Leonis which is a much more abstract ability than jutsu

Yeah yk what, there is a good chance that reid will just slice the genjustu aparr after sensing it

 

[DavidTPPM]

Actually now that i think of it, due to how absurd reid is he might actually just cut the Genjutsu itself
Yeah yk what, there is a good chance that reid will just slice the genjustu aparr after sensing it

How would he do that faster than the genjutsu immobilizes him with speed =? Even an MS genjutsu could completely immobilize v1 Bee mid lariat despite Bee already being >~Sasuke in base. Visual genjutsu is usually displayed as instantaneous compared to the users own speed. The Tsukuyomi databook even notes

Even a body made of iron or the speed of light are powerless before this jutsu, which is the reason why it is feared as the most powerful.

And MS genjutsu was described to make you fall under its effects "instantly" in the Itachi novel.

 

[SatellaTheWoE]

How would he do that faster than the genjutsu immobilizes him with speed =? Even an MS genjutsu could completely immobilize v1 Bee mid lariat despite Bee already being >~Sasuke in base. Visual genjutsu is usually displayed as instantaneous compared to the users own speed. The Tsukuyomi databook even notes

And MS genjutsu was described to make you fall under its effects "instantly" in the Itachi novel.

He doesn't need to be faster
1. He is superior to Reinhard who could dodge stuff even in his sleep so even if he gets stuck in a genjutsu for a while, he would just keep dodging for a while
2. He can sense that he is in a genjutsu and cut the concept of chakra/genjutsu itself to remove it, probably instantly too

This is also worth adding that Murasame, one of Cecilus's sword can target the "core" of anything be it a curse(-cut the core of the curse of the king of thorns nullifying its effect), a concept (it permanently cut the concept of its smell bevause groovy tried to dismantle it) etc. And while there hasn't been any type of confirmation yet I am fairly certain Reid could pull off the same stuff. I mean he has cut Cor Leonis which..doesn't even exist, cut dimensions, Space-time, concept, black holes etc.
Oh and he can cut magic as well, which would include Ram's illusion creation which is also basically genjutsu

 

[Zabazab]

This is also worth adding that Murasame, one of Cecilus's sword can target the "core" of anything be it a curse

This isn't even properly translated yet

But yes Reid can generally cut down Jutsu.

 

[DavidTPPM]

He doesn't need to be faster

He kinda does...

1. He is superior to Reinhard who could dodge stuff even in his sleep so even if he gets stuck in a genjutsu for a while, he would just keep dodging for a while

That's not how that works tho. Dodging stuff in your sleep wouldn't give you layered mind manip resistance. If he gets hit by genjustu it's Joever.

2. He can sense that he is in a genjutsu and cut the concept of chakra/genjutsu itself to remove it, probably instantly too

Again not how that works. Genjutsu isn't just some minor immobilization… How would he cut anything while he's mind controlled?

Oh and he can cut magic as well, which would include Ram's illusion creation which is also basically genjutsu

That doesn't give him mind manip resistance he would need to even like, think after he gets hit with genjutsu.


I accidentally sent this message before finishing it, gimme a second

 

[SatellaTheWoE]

I am gonna kms, everything i wrote disappeared after a page reset

He kinda does...
That's not how that works tho. Dodging stuff in your sleep wouldn't give you layered mind manip resistance. If he gets hit by genjustu it's Joever.

Well, it would be over for someone who isn't Reid Astrea yeah
Thing is, even mid tier RZ characters can shake off, cancel out or fight regardless of being hit by shamak which cuts off all of your senses and higher levels can even make your mind float in a void via sheer skill alone
Heck, Elsa who has a WEAKNESS to magic can target your vitals while all of her senses have been cut off and her mind was floating in a void
so, lets say he gets stuck in a genjutsu and Sasuke comes upto him to finish him off. Well, not only could Reid dodge his attacks but he could also fight back

Again not how that works. Genjutsu isn't just some minor immobilization… How would he cut anything while he's mind controlled?

1. He would sense he is in a genjustu, and cut it from the inside similar to how Julius did (he would do it better). He could also just cut off the justsu, the chakra or the concept of jutsu entirely
2. He has instinctive action, and can fight while his mind isnt present

That doesn't give him mind manip resistance he would need to even like, think after he gets hit with genjutsu.

Shamak basically removes your mind from the battle and even mid tiers can fight regardless of that.

I accidentally sent this message before finishing it, gimme a second

My page reset made my previous arguement, which was better, dissappear and now idk what it was anymore

 

[DavidTPPM]

I am gonna kms, everything i wrote disappeared after a page reset

Damn, I feel you. Hate when that happens .

Well, it would be over for someone who isn't Reid Astrea yeah
Thing is, even mid tier RZ characters can shake off, cancel out or fight regardless of being hit by shamak which cuts off all of your senses and higher levels can even make your mind float in a void via sheer skill alone
Heck, Elsa who has a WEAKNESS to magic can target your vitals while all of her senses have been cut off and her mind was floating in a void
so, lets say he gets stuck in a genjutsu and Sasuke comes upto him to finish him off. Well, not only could Reid dodge his attacks but he could also fight back

But Sasuke doesn't just cut off your senses or whatever. He controls your mind and actions. Your senses being cut off doesn't actually remove your ability to move or control your thoughts and movements. It only limits your sensory input. In order to resist genjutsu he would need layered mind manip resistance.

1. He would sense he is in a genjustu, and cut it from the inside similar to how Julius did (he would do it better). He could also just cut off the justsu, the chakra or the concept of jutsu entirely

He wouldn't because Sasuke controls his mind and body. What you're saying should require him to resist Sasukes mind manip and paralysis which are layered af.

2. He has instinctive action, and can fight while his mind isnt present

Shamak basically removes your mind from the battle and even mid tiers can fight regardless of that.

IA doesn't negate layered mind manip, paralysis, and illusions. Like maybe if Sasuke only controlled his conscious mind, his subconscious instincts could help him out. But Sasuke controls his mind as well as his body and perception.

And there's a difference between fighting without your mind (although I would like a more in depth explanation on how that works in RZ) and fighting with your mind controlled.
Fighting without arms would be significantly easier than fighting with your arms fully controlled by the opponent (goofy comparison but you get my point lol).

 

[SatellaTheWoE]

But Sasuke doesn't just cut off your senses or whatever. He controls your mind and actions. Your senses being cut off doesn't actually remove your ability to move or control your thoughts and movements. It only limits your sensory input. In order to resist genjutsu he would need layered mind manip resistance.

He wouldn't because Sasuke controls his mind and body. What you're saying should require him to resist Sasukes mind manip and paralysis which are layered af.

IA doesn't negate layered mind manip, paralysis, and illusions. Like maybe if Sasuke only controlled his conscious mind, his subconscious instincts could help him out. But Sasuke controls his mind as well as his body and perception.

And there's a difference between fighting without your mind (although I would like a more in depth explanation on how that works in RZ) and fighting with your mind controlled.

Bro just use Reinhard ffs

Fighting without arms would be significantly easier than fighting with your arms fully controlled by the opponent (goofy comparison but you get my point lol).

Nah Reid is built diff, he would solo his arms and then solo his opponent fra🗣

 

[Fezzih_007]

Bro just use Reinhard

Is a stomp for Reinharder trought.

Maybe hmmmmmm.
Well, It could work actually. But you know, the OP is not here, so i don't think he gonna change the opponents.

 

[TheHeavenlySword]

But Sasuke doesn't just cut off your senses or whatever. He controls your mind and actions. Your senses being cut off doesn't actually remove your ability to move or control your thoughts and movements. It only limits your sensory input. In order to resist genjutsu he would need layered mind manip resistance.

Reid technically resist layered mind manipulation

when Reid first spawned in the 2nd Floor Electra, the trial tried to force him to go on easy mode to teach the Challengers the power of friendship and teamwork, so he just hacked the system because f##k the power of friendship

The Stick Swinger:「Well, there is some sense to what that runt is sayin’. I also seem to recall it at first bein’ that you can take on as many people as you like so long as you try ‘n get past me. ――Though followin’ the rules is kinda borin’ so I had to drag myself awake.」

Subaru:「When you say you had to drag yourself awake….. You mean that stuff at the beginning was you hacking the system!?」

the trial is based on Od Laguna the Soul of the World so it would be superior to any other mind manipulation

 

[DavidTPPM]

Reid technically resist layered mind manipulation

How many layers?

 

[SatellaTheWoE]

Reid technically resist layered mind manipulation

when Reid first spawned in the 2nd Floor Electra, the trial tried to force him to go on easy mode to teach the Challengers the power of friendship and teamwork, so he just hacked the system because f##k the power of friendship


the trial is based on Od Laguna the Soul of the World so it would be superior to any other mind manipulation

I ******* called it!!!


I dont know if its layered or not but this should be superior to Reinhard's mind manipulation, Sirius's mind manipulation and the blessing of uh empathy was it? The one that Lilianna has. Anyways those haxes can target the mind and soul of the people its used on and Reinhard's mind manipulation is busted. He doesn't even need to know who they are, what they look like or their location. Just him being aware of you is all he needs to mind manipulate you

 

[Fezzih_007]

Reid technically resist layered mind manipulation

when Reid first spawned in the 2nd Floor Electra, the trial tried to force him to go on easy mode to teach the Challengers the power of friendship and teamwork, so he just hacked the system because f##k the power of friendship


the trial is based on Od Laguna the Soul of the World so it would be superior to any other mind manipulation

How exactly is this mind Manipulation?

And why is this layered? I pretty sure you need more evidence than saying "because is superior", like the mind Manipulation actually bypass resistance or having a statement that It is superior.

And also, you need to trapass the layers thread thing to check out If It counts.

 

[TheHeavenlySword]

How exactly is this mind Manipulation?

he kept repeating the same sentence again and again, how is that not mind manipulation

And why is this layered? I pretty sure you need more evidence than saying "because is superior", like the mind Manipulation actually bypass resistance or having a statement that It is superior.

yeah I'm not sure about it being layered, I thought that there is already layered mind Hax in re zero based on magic

 

[Zabazab]

How exactly is this mind Manipulation?

Reid was physically summoned from his memories within the Book of the Dead in order to act as the Examinor of Electra's Trial, but he was too Him for the Pleiades Watchtower and broke out of the state it put him in. He's still limited to obey the rules though (until reaching resurrection within a flesh body), but he does regain his personality & freedom to act as he pleases.

It does seem to be an overlooked feat, can probably be tossed into the Volume 22 additions.

 

[Fezzih_007]

yeah I'm not sure about it being layered, I thought that there is already layered mind Hax in re zero based on magic

After thinking about, I can think for a argument about being layered.
Maybe. I have to try It.