Rule Violation Reports (New forum)

[Dark_Soul20189]

Can someone please tell @Azertyhuuh to remove Reiner's vote here? We have tried to tell him to remove it, but he refuses to listen to anyone that go against him that isn't staff.

(Reiner is no longer a staff so his vote dosen't count, and needs to be removed)

 

[KLOL506]

IIRC if a staff voted before retirement then their vote counts, but IDK if it was put up into rule.

 

[TWILIGHT-OP]

Can someone please tell @Azertyhuuh to remove Reiner's vote here? We have tried to tell him to remove it, but he refuses to listen to anyone that go against him that isn't staff.

(Reiner is no longer a staff so his vote dosen't count, and needs to be removed)

@Azertyhuuh you should remove Reiner from the vote list. I asked him off site.

No more clogging this thread anymore.

 

[Hecky2222]

Might be off-topic, but since we are discussing about votes generally, I think actually HR or Admins need to clarify if retired staff vote counts, cuz i see ongoing threads have Reiner vote too, so idk if we count retired staff or not

Ben 10: “OK, so you’re saying the sword needs someone worthy.” - Ascalon re-interpretation

How powerful is Ascalon? When wielded by Sir George in the past, he had a brutal battle against the Dagon that ended with him cutting out the creature’s heart and sealing him away, as he was unable to properly kill him. According to Azmuth, Dagon underestimated George in their first fight, and...

vsbattles.com

Honkai Impact 3rd - Infinite Speed Arguments (v2)

This CRT will go over several infinite speed arguments for Hi3, all that's required is for one to pass. I'll list these in order from weakest to strongest. Arguments will be separated by horizontal lines. Firstly, the Theatre is accepted as infinite. Under this CRT it's accepted the Herrscher...

vsbattles.com

I don't mind if we count retired staff vote, but it just needs some clarification to not confuse users in future.

 

[Azertyhuuh]

@Azertyhuuh You need to be more respectful of other people. The frequency at which you dismiss people outright and imply they're beneath you or don't know anything is not acceptable.

@Ruler_Star_Kuma Two wrongs don't make a right. We can all tell Azerty was being passive-aggressive, but that doesn't give you a free pass to be active-aggressive. Next time just go straight to reporting them rather than stirring up more drama in the thread.

Well, I understand your point, but I am not acting this way because I want to. I end up being attacked by a group of people at once with incorrect arguments, and they flood the thread. How would you react if you were the only one debating while more than 10 people opposed you at the same time, supporting each other to defend mistakes and inaccurate information? They even support each other over objectively false claims.

Astral came and reopened topics that had already been discussed in a previous thread and were already accepted. That discussion itself reached 16 pages, yet he was not even aware of it. He came into my thread and started debating points that had already been accepted, which turned the thread into chaos. The problem is that the members supporting him are backing him up normally without even checking the prior discussion.

When I came into his thread before and mentioned something that had already been accepted, he himself told me not to discuss already accepted matters and said that I was derailing the thread.

@FinePoint You personally may remember that in a Tensura discussion, you warned someone against reopening already accepted topics because it was disrupting and derailing the discussion, and you told them to make separate threads for things that had already been accepted.

Now imagine being alone against more than 10 opposing people who support each other, spread inaccurate information, and attack points that were already accepted, while not even knowing what was accepted, what exists already, or the reasons behind those conclusions. I explained it to him, another staff member explained it to him, and another supporter explained it to him as well, yet after all of that, he still said that “incorrect things can be debated here normally,” meaning he still wanted to reopen already accepted topics and flood the thread, even though the original accepted discussion already lasted 16 pages.

I am not saying my behavior is perfect, but when you are put in situations like this, things become extremely difficult if you do not defend yourself strongly enough.

 

[DarkDragonMedeus]

Normally we don't need to remove votes from retired staff if the vote happened before their retirement. But given Twilight OP's DMs with Reiner, Reiner has requested to have vote removed and we should honor that.

 

[Azertyhuuh]

Normally we don't need to remove votes from retired staff if the vote happened before their retirement. But given Twilight OP's DMs with Reiner, Reiner has requested to have vote removed and we should honor that.

@Azertyhuuh you should remove Reiner from the vote list. I asked him off site.

No more clogging this thread anymore.

I deleted it.

 

[FinePoint]

How would you react if you were the only one debating while more than 10 people opposed you at the same time, supporting each other to defend mistakes and inaccurate information? They even support each other over objectively false claims.

I would present my argument as clearly as possible, including why I think the opposition is categorically incorrect, then trust that the staff would see past the noise and land on a position that was at least logical.

If I thought everyone else was acting in bad faith or spamming, I would report them.
If I determined that even the staff present were being completely irrational, then I would appeal to different staff.
If I determined that there was not a single staff member capable of seeing reason and in a position to help, then frankly I would just stop using the website.

I can tell you that at the very least I wouldn't start insulting everyone. It would not benefit my position in any way, it would only give them reason to dismiss me and make it about that.

 

[Azertyhuuh]

I am here to report @Ruler_Star_Kuma because he is trying to create problems in the thread I just opened, and it does not seem like he entered the discussion in good faith, but rather out of hostility alone.

I specifically requested in the thread that people stay on topic and avoid discussing matters that were already approved previously in the thread. He did not like that and started arguing that I have no right to say this.

Discussing matters that were already approved inside a thread dedicated to another argument derails the discussion and makes the thread extremely chaotic. At this rate, the thread could easily extend to 30 pages or more. Each thread is meant to focus on a specific argument, which is why I open separate threads for separate arguments, so that it becomes easier to discuss future points based on previously accepted conclusions. Discussing everything at once is impossible. It is exhausting both for the staff and for me, and no staff member would realistically want to read a massive disorganized thread like that.

Every thread has its own arguments. Some already reach 4 or 5 pages because of a single argument, sometimes even more. There are threads that reach 16 pages. That is exactly why I requested that previously accepted matters not be reopened. Reopening already accepted issues inside another thread, even if somewhat related, floods the discussion with unrelated debates. That would effectively reopen every previous thread I worked on inside one thread, turning it into a chaotic mess extending to 20 pages or more.

I intentionally open multiple threads and discuss arguments one by one in order to support future arguments with points that were already discussed previously. However, coming into a thread and attacking arguments that were already accepted in other discussions, derailing the thread and turning it into chaos, is unacceptable.

When I personally tried to discuss an already accepted argument in a Tensura thread before, I was collectively criticized and told that the matter had already been accepted and could not be debated again within that thread, and that I should open a separate thread for it instead. Even the staff themselves ask for this approach.

This is the thread.

 

[Mr._East_Statement]

I am here to report @Ruler_Star_Kuma because he is trying to create problems in the thread I just opened, and it does not seem like he entered the discussion in good faith, but rather out of hostility alone.

I specifically requested in the thread that people stay on topic and avoid discussing matters that were already approved previously in the thread. He did not like that and started arguing that I have no right to say this.

Discussing matters that were already approved inside a thread dedicated to another argument derails the discussion and makes the thread extremely chaotic. At this rate, the thread could easily extend to 30 pages or more. Each thread is meant to focus on a specific argument, which is why I open separate threads for separate arguments, so that it becomes easier to discuss future points based on previously accepted conclusions. Discussing everything at once is impossible. It is exhausting both for the staff and for me, and no staff member would realistically want to read a massive disorganized thread like that.

Every thread has its own arguments. Some already reach 4 or 5 pages because of a single argument, sometimes even more. There are threads that reach 16 pages. That is exactly why I requested that previously accepted matters not be reopened. Reopening already accepted issues inside another thread, even if somewhat related, floods the discussion with unrelated debates. That would effectively reopen every previous thread I worked on inside one thread, turning it into a chaotic mess extending to 20 pages or more.

I intentionally open multiple threads and discuss arguments one by one in order to support future arguments with points that were already discussed previously. However, coming into a thread and attacking arguments that were already accepted in other discussions, derailing the thread and turning it into chaos, is unacceptable.

When I personally tried to discuss an already accepted argument in a Tensura thread before, I was collectively criticized and told that the matter had already been accepted and could not be debated again within that thread, and that I should open a separate thread for it instead. Even the staff themselves ask for this approach.

This is the thread.

Sorry but this is wholly disingenuous.

Kuma said I quote

Okay.. time to deal with crts appropriately this time, but first things first before I talk about ANYTHING in this proposal— this is not an appropriate thread rule at all. Taking note of 'derailing' is fine but talking about prohibiting previously approved stuff.. specially if they end up genuinely relating to the conversation at hand.. just no? This is a forum. Also, you'd be making false reports in that case, which are just not good.

That's all he said, he did not insult or mock, all he said was that taking the permission for talking about a context that corresponds to another is not of good faith. Which you answered passive aggressive as always.

Mods are not 24/7 free either to waste their time on these reports. Finepoint told you to report people who are derailing the thread yes but he did not mean you should report anyone left and right because they disagree with the scale, you cannot limited the discussion when it literally is interconnected with another "already accepted" content.

 

[FinePoint]

This doesn't feel very severe in either direction, but I will leave a comment on the thread.

 

[Azertyhuuh]

It seems this topic will get out of control because the upgrade combines very large amounts of abilities, so this thread will become controversial and may reach 15 pages. Therefore, I am asking one of the staff members here to move this topic to the staff section, as this is the only thread I requested to be moved since it is large and requires serious discussion.

 

[Hecky2222]

This doesn't feel very severe in either direction, but I will leave a comment on the thread.

Not reporting or whatever but I think you should explain OP something like that

Please stay on topic. It is also prohibited to derail the discussion or debate matters that have already been approved in the thread. Anyone attempting to discuss previously approved points will be reported. Please remain on topic; any off-topic comments will also be reported.

is already red flag. There is no rule violation for it yet it showing complete combative mood of OP. I am actually surprised why only @Ruler_Star_Kuma gets warning when starting premise from OP actually something surprising.

 

[FinePoint]

is already red flag. There is no rule violation for it yet it showing complete combative mood of OP. I am actually surprised why only @Ruler_Star_Kuma gets warning when starting premise from OP actually something surprising.

Is it a red flag? Is it completely combative? They're just asking people to stay on-topic, and saying they'll report people that don't, which is genuinely what we suggest they do if it'll otherwise just cause a fight.

Azer has been rude in the past, but it feels like since they got in trouble the first time people have been really reaching over some incredibly minor stuff.
Are they speaking in the most polite manner possible? No, but we only ask that people are civil, not that they constantly walk on eggshells.

@Azertyhuuh That said, you don't need to keep reminding people. As for your request, I think we should wait a bit and see if anything happens.

 

[Antvasima]

Yes, and also please be careful to only report genuine rule-violations, so our RVR thread does not constantly get spammed by irrelevant arguments.

 

[Dark_Soul20189]

Is it a red flag? Is it completely combative? They're just asking people to stay on-topic, and saying they'll report people that don't, which is genuinely what we suggest they do if it'll otherwise just cause a fight.

Azer has been rude in the past, but it feels like since they got in trouble the first time people have been really reaching over some incredibly minor stuff.
Are they speaking in the most polite manner possible? No, but we only ask that people are civil, not that they constantly walk on eggshells.

@Azertyhuuh That said, you don't need to keep reminding people. As for your request, I think we should wait a bit and see if anything happens.

I think we are forgetting this part....

I would like to mention Azerty always goes into a thread with an unchangeable mindset of "I'm right you're wrong and this is not up to debate". This type of behavior is incredibly aggravating and is textbook in bad faith. There should be a willingness to discussion rather than admitting to being in bad faith for every argument you make. I think he has gotten way too much lenience but thats just me.

So yes, it's combat since he goes into it believing he is correct, and any other arguments are "irrelevant".

 

[FinePoint]

So yes, it's combat since he goes into it believing he is correct, and any other arguments are "irrelevant".

Everyone goes into a debate believing they're correct. Refusing to listen to or discrediting the other side is different, and something they were already warned for in a separate incident.

I don't see this as a continuation of that.