[R1M4] 1st Generals of Grove Tournament - Salivas C. Otter vs. Spamton (0-0-0)

[ExSENNA]

Welcome to the Fourth Match of the First Round of the 1st Generals of Grove Tournament! (Bracket) (Event Leaderboard)

On the blue corner, we have Salivas C. Otter, submitted by @CCMBROTTERFN!
On the red corner, we have Spamton, submitted by @Eden_Warlock99!
Duel 4, let's go!

Salivas is 65 Tons. Spamton is 17.7 Tons. Salivas has a 3.6x AP Advantage.
Salivas has Class 25, Spamton has Unknown LS. Salivas has the LS Advantage.

Start of Journey Arc Salivas is used.
Anything above 8-A is restricted.
Speed is equalized.
Starting distance is 7 meters.

Salivas:
Spamton:
Incon:

 

[Eden_Warlock99]

I take it that Salivas' FTL "Attack and Reactions" is supposed to be his combat speed, right?
Having Attack Speed and Reactions over x333564 their Combat Speed would make one basically impossible to hit or avoid in speed equal.

 

[ExSENNA]

I take it that Salivas' FTL "Attack and Reactions" is supposed to be his combat speed, right?
Having Attack Speed and Reactions over x333564 their Combat Speed would make one basically impossible to hit or avoid in speed equal.

That would be equalized regardless for the tournament itself

 

[CCMBROTTERFN]

Okay, Salivas is going to destroy him in hand-to-hand, since all his physical stats are way higher. He is also way smarter and skilled, meaning in a hand to hand fight, Spamton is dead. When ranged abilities come into play, it’s a bit more interesting but I still think it goes to Salivas. While Spamton has Soul Manipulation, an ability that heavily restrains his healing factor and nullifies his immortality within his own canon, seeing as Salivas is 3.6 times more durable than Spamton is strong, it’s likely that he could still tank some moves, especially with his stamina. He also has the 8 Golden Orbs, which if all 8 come in contact with something, it gets erased, which would be an attack Spamton couldn’t resist. Don’t say his Acausality helps, just read how it works. It won’t. Plus, Salivas has Precognition and Enhanced Sense, making any Attack way easier for him to dodge. And with all his advantages, I vote Salivas.

 

[Eden_Warlock99]

It should be noted that Spamton is significantly more durable than his AP (Frisk at this point can harm Robot 98 in its Combat Form, which even in its base form, had defense value of 98. Yet, this same Frisk can't even scratch Spamton. To put it into perspective, Robot 98 is more durable in its Combat Form (Taking around 50 damage from Frisk's attacks while its Base Form takes around 90) and its 98 DEF puts it significantly beyond even the likes of Asgore and Toriel, the former of which is so superior to characters like Undyne to the point where she considers herself killing Frisk to be mercy compared to what Asgore could do. Do note that Undyne's AP is >Spamton's).

Plus, his AP disadvantage won't factor in too much either, considering the fact that the entire thing about Undertale SOUL manipulation negating durability would allow Spamton to kill Salivas in far less hits required than normal ones without magic.

I'll also say that hand-to-hand skill and the such, won't really matter in this fight. You can check Spamton's NA/T section, his attacks are basically just danmaku galore, dozens upon dozens of Mini Spamton clones, explosives, flying Spamton heads, etc. I'm not sure if Salivas really has experience against such attacks.

 

[Eden_Warlock99]

Oh, Spamton's posse is also listed in his Standard Equipment, so Ig he can use them.
Robot 98: With 40 ATK and 98 DEF in its base form, and only becoming stronger when it transforms into its XP(ipis) Form, Robot 98 is quite the formidable foe. It can stretch its arms to great lengths. It's willing to take hits for Spamton and usually combines its attacks with him.
Robot 100: Possesses 40 ATK and a DEF value of 100, while also being able to dodge attacks. It fights in a quiz-like format, much like the first Mettaton fight in Undertale. However, due to having the most advanced AI of the robots Undyne made, it usually defies Spamton.
Papybot: With 20 ATK and DEF, (The same as Papyrus') it's the weakest of Spamton's posse. It can still support Spamton by coordinating attacks together.

(For the record, 50 ATK is where 17.7 Tons originates from)

 

[SSB64]

Following.

 

[CCMBROTTERFN]

It should be noted that Spamton is significantly more durable than his AP (Frisk at this point can harm Robot 98 in its Combat Form, which even in its base form, had defense value of 98. Yet, this same Frisk can't even scratch Spamton. To put it into perspective, Robot 98 is more durable in its Combat Form (Taking around 50 damage from Frisk's attacks while its Base Form takes around 90) and its 98 DEF puts it significantly beyond even the likes of Asgore and Toriel, the former of which is so superior to characters like Undyne to the point where she considers herself killing Frisk to be mercy compared to what Asgore could do. Do note that Undyne's AP is >Spamton's).

Plus, his AP disadvantage won't factor in too much either, considering the fact that the entire thing about Undertale SOUL manipulation negating durability would allow Spamton to kill Salivas in far less hits required than normal ones without magic.

I'll also say that hand-to-hand skill and the such, won't really matter in this fight. You can check Spamton's NA/T section, his attacks are basically just danmaku galore, dozens upon dozens of Mini Spamton clones, explosives, flying Spamton heads, etc. I'm not sure if Salivas really has experience against such attacks.

Okay, these are all fair points. But Salivas still has an Intelligence advantage plus it’s really easy for him to dodge given his Precognition, Teleportation and Enhanced Senses, making it likely that Spamton alone can’t beat him. And there is one thing Spamton definitely can’t defend against, once again, I will mention his Existence Erasure.

Oh, Spamton's posse is also listed in his Standard Equipment, so Ig he can use them.
Robot 98: With 40 ATK and 98 DEF in its base form, and only becoming stronger when it transforms into its XP(ipis) Form, Robot 98 is quite the formidable foe. It can stretch its arms to great lengths. It's willing to take hits for Spamton and usually combines its attacks with him.
Robot 100: Possesses 40 ATK and a DEF value of 100, while also being able to dodge attacks. It fights in a quiz-like format, much like the first Mettaton fight in Undertale. However, due to having the most advanced AI of the robots Undyne made, it usually defies Spamton.
Papybot: With 20 ATK and DEF, (The same as Papyrus') it's the weakest of Spamton's posse. It can still support Spamton by coordinating attacks together.

(For the record, 50 ATK is where 17.7 Tons originates from)

This makes the fight a bit harder, but Salivas can still likely beat these others since he should still be physically and mentally superior. Plus, Salivas’s golden orbs can spread out. It gets rid of his main Wincon if he has to at the time, but it’s also likely he could just take them out one at a time with Existence Erasure since they’re robots and he doesn’t really care about robots.

 

[Eden_Warlock99]

Okay, these are all fair points. But Salivas still has an Intelligence advantage plus it’s really easy for him to dodge given his Precognition, Teleportation and Enhanced Senses, making it likely that Spamton alone can’t beat him.

Can you clarify the mechanics behind Salivas’s Teleportation? It isn’t really detailed in his profile, like does it have a cooldown, specific triggers, ya know?

I'll also say that Salivas’s Limited Precognition and Enhanced Senses probably won't offer much here. Spamton’s attacks aren't hard to dodge because they’re particularly fast or visually subtle but because of how much space they cover and how much stuff is constantly being thrown out. Even if Salivas can predict some of the attacks, the sheer number of them would make it extremely hard to evade every single one (Like look at this).

And there is one thing Spamton definitely can’t defend against, once again, I will mention his Existence Erasure.

This assumes a direct shot at Spamton. Spamton’s setup is designed to have his posse act as buffers for him.
Robot 98, specificially, will actively protect Spamton by jumping in the way of any attack aimed at him.
Robot 100 would also be particularly challenging for Salivas to pin down, as it’s agile even by monster standards, who are already pretty experienced at dodging danmaku-like attacks (Monsters express themselves with danmaku and their "attacks" are akin to greeting cards. This includes Woshua spiraling patterns of dozens of water-drop bullets or Vulkin firing dozens of bolts at a wide angle). It’s also wearing electrified merchandise, so any attempt to attack it at close range would leave him open to being electrocuted.

So even if Salivas erases Robot 98 or any other bot, each one should buy Spamton with the extra time necessary to potentially take Salivas down.

 

[CCMBROTTERFN]

Can you clarify the mechanics behind Salivas’s Teleportation? It isn’t really detailed in his profile, like does it have a cooldown, specific triggers, ya know?

Not really. Supposedly it’s an instant movement to any location he has ever seen. Like fast travel in a video game but actually canon. And I do mean ever seen. He has teleported in areas he himself has stated to have never been solely because he could see there. And it doesn’t seem to have a cool down. And if it is, it’s only really small.

I'll also say that Salivas’s Limited Precognition and Enhanced Senses probably won't offer much here. Spamton’s attacks aren't hard to dodge because they’re particularly fast or visually subtle but because of how much space they cover and how much stuff is constantly being thrown out. Even if Salivas can predict some of the attacks, the sheer number of them would make it extremely hard to evade every single one (Like look at this).

Not a problem. Unless they can cover a literal mountain sized area, he could actually (with later and earlier feats to back it up) jump thousands of feet into the sky. And since he can see grass sized objects and fire at this range, this give him a way to simply use his range to win.

This assumes a direct shot at Spamton. Spamton’s setup is designed to have his posse act as buffers for him.
Robot 98, specificially, will actively protect Spamton by jumping in the way of any attack aimed at him.
Robot 100 would also be particularly challenging for Salivas to pin down, as it’s agile even by monster standards, who are already pretty experienced at dodging danmaku-like attacks (Monsters express themselves with danmaku and their "attacks" are akin to greeting cards. This includes Woshua spiraling patterns of dozens of water-drop bullets or Vulkin firing dozens of bolts at a wide angle).

They might be a problem if it weren’t for one thing that really hurts their chances. The 8 Golden Orbs are insanely hot. They can literally turn most things they touch to gas or liquid within an instant. This isn’t on his page because it’s a Golden Orb power he can’t control, but it was mentioned on the (currently outdated) Golden Orbs page, which says this: Heat Manipulation (Instantaneously evaporated Avin’s Liquid, which is likely close to water.). They can also Divide into multiple smaller parts without losing power. This means they could have 8 orbs for each one. While they won’t erase anymore, the heat and power will remain the same.

It’s also wearing electrified merchandise, so any attempt to attack it at close range would leave him open to being electrocuted.

… is that supposed to stop him? He had his whole body frozen including the air in his lungs and blood in his veins and kept moving.

 

[Eden_Warlock99]

Not really. Supposedly it’s an instant movement to any location he has ever seen. Like fast travel in a video game but actually canon. And I do mean ever seen. He has teleported in areas he himself has stated to have never been solely because he could see there. And it doesn’t seem to have a cool down. And if it is, it’s only really small.

Guess should also ask if he ever uses it in combat? I don't think the fast travel teleportation in games is necessarily combat-applicable teleportation.

Not a problem. Unless they can cover a literal mountain sized area, he could actually (with later and earlier feats to back it up) jump thousands of feet into the sky. And since he can see grass sized objects and fire at this range, this give him a way to simply use his range to win.

I dunno, being airborne with seemingly no control over his movement as he falls would sorta make him a sitting duck for Spamton's attacks.
His low (In comparison to his combat speed) travel speed also means Salivas can’t rely on his travel speed to get away.
Plus, if his attacks are coming from hundreds of meters away, Spamton would have an easier time dodging and/or intercepting them.

They might be a problem if it weren’t for one thing that really hurts their chances. The 8 Golden Orbs are insanely hot. They can literally turn most things they touch to gas or liquid within an instant. This isn’t on his page because it’s a Golden Orb power he can’t control, but it was mentioned on the (currently outdated) Golden Orbs page, which says this: Heat Manipulation (Instantaneously evaporated Avin’s Liquid, which is likely close to water.). They can also Divide into multiple smaller parts without losing power. This means they could have 8 orbs for each one. While they won’t erase anymore, the heat and power will remain the same.

This doesn’t really pose a significant threat to Spamton and his bots, they all operate in Hotland, which can reach temperatures high enough to vaporize a styrofoam cup and the water inside it instantly. Robot 98 can even take Frisk's Solar Flare for an extended period of time.

… is that supposed to stop him? He had his whole body frozen including the air in his lungs and blood in his veins and kept moving.

It's still damage. All the damage will accumulate overtime.

 

[CCMBROTTERFN]

Guess should also ask if he ever uses it in combat? I don't think the fast travel teleportation in games is necessarily combat-applicable teleportation.

Yes.

I dunno, being airborne with seemingly no control over his movement as he falls would sorta make him a sitting duck for Spamton's attacks.
His low (In comparison to his combat speed) travel speed also means Salivas can’t rely on his travel speed to get away.
Plus, if his attacks are coming from hundreds of meters away, Spamton would have an easier time dodging and/or intercepting them.

Speed is equalized, meaning everything (Attacks, Movement and reactions) are all the same, so that’s not a factor. As for Spamton dodging them, try dodging literal rain. That’s the amount of small orbs salivas is able to make.a

I have no problems with the rest.

 

[Eden_Warlock99]

You think Spamton would be able to take the orbs hostage? His Super Sucky Machine might be able to do that?

 

[SSB64]

You think Spamton would be able to take the orbs hostage? His Super Sucky Machine might be able to do that?

Can the machine resist high temperatures though? I'd assume so, but it's best to make sure.

 

[Eden_Warlock99]

Can the machine resist high temperatures though? I'd assume so, but it's best to make sure.

Spamton uses it in Hotland, so most likely yeah.

 

[CCMBROTTERFN]

You think Spamton would be able to take the orbs hostage? His Super Sucky Machine might be able to do that?

Not really, no. Not only can they teleport to Salivas, but they are linked to his body and soul, so unless he is dead they wont stop trying to get back.

 

[Eden_Warlock99]

I suppose Spamton destroying them with his own danmaku isn't out of the picture? Assuming the divided orbs aren't as durable as the originals.

If it is, and Salivas in-character does abuse his range, I don't think Spamton can do much.

 

[CCMBROTTERFN]

I suppose Spamton destroying them with his own danmaku isn't out of the picture? Assuming the divided orbs aren't as durable as the originals.

If it is, and Salivas in-character does abuse his range, I don't think Spamton can do much.

The divided orbs haven’t shown any feats of durability since they mostly just slam into things, but based off most other things, yeah, they most likely stay just as durable.

 

[MintyBoi1]

Following

 

[SSB64]

The divided orbs haven’t shown any feats of durability since they mostly just slam into things, but based off most other things, yeah, they most likely stay just as durable.

I mean, if they slam into things and don't shatter, would they not have that level of Durability to survive slamming into it?

 

[CCMBROTTERFN]

I mean, if they slam into things and don't shatter, would they not have that level of Durability to survive slamming into it?

That makes sense, so yeah, I guess.

 

[MintyBoi1]

So Spamton can jump Salivas with dura neg Danmaku plus robots but Salivas is way stronger and has better mobility/skill and enhanced senses and his orbs to potentially erase Spamton. Hard to say, but I’m leaning Salivas since like mentioned he can leap high up to avoid attacks and abuse comparable Danmaku.

 

[Eden_Warlock99]

"High Ego" is listed as one of Salivas' weaknesses, so maybe Spamton could use his SI to talk him into getting in-range, or something of that sort.

 

[CCMBROTTERFN]

"High Ego" is listed as one of Salivas' weaknesses, so maybe Spamton could use his SI to talk him into getting in-range, or something of that sort.

Within canon, it’s been shown that it mostly just causes him to underestimate enemies, not fall to compliments. Plus, past the first part of FOG, his backstory, and he has since gotten more humble which is why it’s not listed for his weaknesses past there. And yes, that’s for the start of Journey arc, since that is actually after his main story by a long shot.

 

[ExSENNA]

ok who wins

 

[MintyBoi1]

Voting Salivas FRA

 

[CCMBROTTERFN]

ok who wins

Salivas fra

 

[Eden_Warlock99]

Salivas it is then. 10 bucks on Salivas winning this tourney