Quick Ben 10 crt

[Uzukeas]

Bloxx should get construction.
Heatblast at 10 years old should be 7-A due to fighting and beating Kevin in his armoured form. Here, He was armoured and had spiked balls for hands so he was obviously trying to hurt Ben.

Agree:3(BoyinLuv2002, Emerald,Splixson2)
Disagree:1(MaverickZero disagrees with Heatblast scaling up to 7-A)

 

[Khanhba01]

Agree

 

[Uzukeas]

Bump,

 

[Spilxson2]

Agree. Brought up the Heatblast thing in the general discussion thread earlier. Don't know if that'd make OS Vilgax and everyone else who scales to Heatblast and Vilgax 7-A though. But I agree with Bloxx having construction. Heatblast I'm somewhat iffy on

 

[Emerald]

I agree with everything
However wouldn't this bump all OS characters to 7-A as well?

 

[Spilxson2]

I agree with everything
However wouldn't this bump all OS characters to 7-A as well?

Probably. Honestly I'm just confused as to how human form UAF/OV Ben can one shot OS Vilgax according to their profiles

 

[Uzukeas]

I agree with everything
However wouldn't this bump all OS characters to 7-A as well?

All OS characters which scale to heatblast.

Example, Diamondhead, Four Arms, Eye Guy(possibly) and such.

Counted by the way.

 

[Uzukeas]

bump

 

[Uzukeas]

Bump

 

[Uzukeas]

Bump

 

[omegabronic]

agree with bloxx, but 10 year old aliens scaling to Older aliens is a no go, ben notes that as he gets older his aliens get stronger to young ben, specially true when you consider that while diamond head scales to four arms in OS, the scaling later on makes it clear that aliens on the level of 4 arms completely stomp aliens on the level of diamond head, and this 1 7-A outlier against all of the consistent low 7-C feats is not only wrong by a lore stand point, but it creates circular scaling

 

[omegabronic]

Bump

you can only bump 1 per 12 hours, don't spam it

 

[Emerald]

just downscale the 10 year olds to baseline 7-B+

 

[Spilxson2]

you can only bump 1 per 12 hours, don't spam it

12? Someone told me it was only 6. I'll keep that in mind I guess

 

[Uzukeas]

agree with bloxx, but 10 year old aliens scaling to Older aliens is a no go, ben notes that as he gets older his aliens get stronger to young ben, specially true when you consider that while diamond head scales to four arms in OS, the scaling later on makes it clear that aliens on the level of 4 arms completely stomp aliens on the level of diamond head, and this 1 7-A outlier against all of the consistent low 7-C feats is not only wrong by a lore stand point, but it creates circular scaling

May you explain how this is an outlier?
We literally see Gwen 10 aliens fight on par with older aliens. This should be consistent considering Ben and Gwen are the same age and have the same aliens.
This really shouldn’t be an outlier considering everything which happens in the series.

So in my opinion
Heatblast should be 7-A since he beats Kevin who is 7-A.
Younger aliens from Gwen is able to fight on par with older aliens, too.

 

[Spilxson2]

I think 10 year old XLR8 once harmed OS adult Gwen before. I don't know if she's High 5-A though. Only that she kept the charms of Bezel

 

[Spilxson2]

Don't know if this is off topic but are there calculations for OS Cannonbolt surviving atmospheric re-entry and surviving being punched by Vilgax 10000? That might upgrade his durability from Low 7-C

 

[Uzukeas]

I think 10 year old XLR8 once harmed OS adult Gwen before. I don't know if she's High 5-A though. Only that she kept the charms of Bezel

Most likely an outlier lol since she was off guard.
What’s your opinion on my justification about Gwen 10 aliens being able to fight on par with older Ben aliens?

 

[Spilxson2]

Most likely an outlier lol since she was off guard.
What’s your opinion on my justification about Gwen 10 aliens being able to fight on par with older Ben aliens?

Could probably work. Although if that was accepted then UAF/OV Aliens might need to be upgraded to High 7-A or 6-C. Only Goop has a 6-C tier but there's no justification next to it

 

[Spilxson2]

Honestly weaker aliens like Wildmutt, Wildvine, and Blitzwolfer should probably downscale from Low 7-C. They've either been hurt by weaker things or don't have enough feats

 

[Marvel_Champion_07]

Construction for Bloxx should be fine

Neutral on 7-A Heatblast

 

[Uzukeas]

Construction for Bloxx should be fine

Neutral on 7-A Heatblast

Have you read my points?
Basically, it'd be consistent since Gwen 10 Aliens should help justify a 7-A Heatblast.

 

[Marvel_Champion_07]

Have you read my points?

I didn't just stroll into this CRT without reading both your points and omegabronic's points

 

[Ayewale]

Agree with Bloxx, neutral on Kevin since the fight is veeery short. Also, Ben didn't "beat" Kevin; he knocked him off his feet yeah, but the dude is standing just fine seconds after.

 

[omegabronic]

May you explain how this is an outlier?
We literally see Gwen 10 aliens fight on par with older aliens.

you mean the alternate universe version of the aliens that have no relation or scaling to OS ben? Yeah, what of her?

This should be consistent considering Ben and Gwen are the same age and have the same aliens.

different universes, she has the feats and doesn't generate circular scaling, ben doesn't

This really shouldn’t be an outlier considering everything which happens in the series.

Explain the scaling chain then, Diamondhead=Kevin, Kevin gets utterly overpowered by Andreas/Armodrillo, armodrillo gets overpowered by Looma, who is about equal and matched 4 arms

Meanwhile in the original series Diamondhead can keep up against four arms, you see the problem?

 

[Spilxson2]

I still think there should be a separate key for UAF and OV Diamondhead. I doubt Kevin's as strong as the guy who punched him to the moon

 

[omegabronic]

I still think there should be a separate key for UAF and OV Diamondhead. I doubt Kevin's as strong as the guy who punched him to the moon

Not even diamond head is, hence why he is not high 5-A

 

[Uzukeas]

you mean the alternate universe version of the aliens that have no relation or scaling to OS ben? Yeah, what of her?

Not really a valid point when theres nothing pointing to them being biologically stronger. Gwen 10's universe is just a universe where Gwen found the omnitirx, all the alternate universes have been shown to been relative to one another, so whats your point? We literally see an Alternate universe version of an alien(Technobubble) fuse with a prime timeline version of Clockwork.
Also sorry, they're not universes, they're alternate timelines So they should help scale Ben nonetheless.

different universes, she has the feats and doesn't generate circular scaling, ben doesn't

Same universe, Different timeline. How does Ben generate circular scaling?


I don't see the problem with Diamondhead being 7-A then? Lol?
By denying Gwens feats of being able to keep up with the rest of Bens older aliens, you're ltierally denying undeniable proof. Its the same alien, but female, and on Gwens wrist. Its not an AU, its an alternate timeline. Same everything, just Gwen put on the watch instead of Ben.

 

[Spilxson2]

Human Ben fighting Simian should be considered an outlier to be honest. Simian also still folded him like a taco

 

[omegabronic]

Not really a valid point when theres nothing pointing to them being biologically stronger.

the fact that they scale to a version of ben's aliens that is stated and showed to be biologically stronger than his OS selves?

Gwen 10's universe is just a universe where Gwen found the omnitirx

and that any number of things could be different aside from just that, you don't have proof that it is the only difference, the fact that they can keep up with aliens far stronger than 10 year ben's is proof that there is other differences however

all the alternate universes have been shown to been relative to one another, so whats your point?

yeah, what of it? They are not ben scaling to his 10 year old self, what does this point bring of relevance to the discussion?

We literally see an Alternate universe version of an alien(Technobubble) fuse with a prime timeline version of Clockwork.

So what?

Also sorry, they're not universes, they're alternate timelines So they should help scale Ben nonetheless.

alternate timelines = alternate universes, potato potato

Same universe, Different timeline. How does Ben generate circular scaling?

nope, different universe = different timeline

I don't see the problem with Diamondhead being 7-A then? Lol?

will you cover my points or? He is 7-A, but while in the OS he scales directly to 4Arms, in UAFO he is completwly overpowered by him looking at the scaling it presenta

By denying Gwens feats of being able to keep up with the rest of Bens older aliens, you're ltierally denying undeniable proof.

i am not denying, it is a feat for her, not for OS ben, specially when thw show shows and states that the aliens got stronger and changed the scaling between themselves

Its the same alien, but female, and on Gwens wrist.
Its not an AU, its an alternate timeline. Same everything, just Gwen put on the watch instead of Ben.

Nope, they are alternate universes, timelines are the same here on the site

Human Ben fighting Simian should be considered an outlier to be honest. Simian also still folded him like a taco

Don't derail the discussion, there is other feats supporting thag

 

[Spilxson2]

Different universe equals different timeline?

 

[Uzukeas]

the fact that they scale to a version of ben's aliens that is stated and showed to be biologically stronger than his OS selves?


and that any number of things could be different aside from just that, you don't have proof that it is the only difference, the fact that they can keep up with aliens far stronger than 10 year ben's is proof that there is other differences however



yeah, what of it? They are not ben scaling to his 10 year old self, what does this point bring of relevance to the discussion?


So what?


alternate timelines = alternate universes, potato potato


nope, different universe = different timeline


will you cover my points or? He is 7-A, but while in the OS he scales directly to 4Arms, in UAFO he is completwly overpowered by him looking at the scaling it presenta


i am not denying, it is a feat for her, not for OS ben, specially when thw show shows and states that the aliens got stronger and changed the scaling between themselves


Nope, they are alternate universes, timelines are the same here on the site


Don't derail the discussion, there is other feats supporting thag

I’m going to fully reply to this..but
Alternate Timeline in Ben 10 is VASTLY different to alternate universe.
Clockwork even says “Alternate Timelines” in his explanation of timelines,
Also you have no proof that some type of enhancement happened which Made Gwens aliens supposedly stronger, that’s just not true.
I’m gonna finish an entire reply to this, but I also reccomend some experience Ben 10 supporters comment on this too.

 

[omegabronic]

Different universe equals different timeline?

Yeah, they are different names for the same thing

I’m going to fully reply to this..but
Alternate Timeline in Ben 10 is VASTLY different to alternate universe.
Clockwork even says “Alternate Timelines” in his explanation of timelines,

Irrelevant to my point

Also you have no proof that some type of enhancement happened which Made Gwens aliens supposedly stronger, that’s just not true.

Can you not put words in my mouth to try and make your points make sense? We don't know why they are stronger, probably due to a different universe differences, point is, we know that they objectively are

At least address the scaling problem i presented instead of just ignoring it

 

[Uzukeas]

Yeah, they are different names for the same thing

Yeah no this is completely wrong. Timelines and universes are completely different when it comes to Ben 10. Whenever they are talking about an alternate universe, they specifically say Alternate Universe. When they say Alternate Timeline, They mean Alternate Timeline. Eon and Prof. Paradox have the ability to travel to different timelines, not universes. Prof Paradox always says Timeline, never universe. So can you prove that they're different names for the same thing?

Can you not put words in my mouth to try and make your points make sense? We don't know why they are stronger, probably due to a different universe differences, point is, we know that they objectively are

There is nothing proving that they are stronger because of a universe difference, like you said Probably. They are probably stronger. For as far as we know, it's just a timeline where Gwen got the omnitrix instead of Ben. No Timeline has one set of aliens be stronger than the other set of aliens.
It should help support Heatblast or even the hightiers of the omntirix being 7-A considering that Ben and Gwen are the same age when they use their omnitrixes, and Gwen is able to fight relatively with every other hero.

There is nothing wrong with the scaling chain, as from your words..

Diamondhead=Kevin, Kevin gets utterly overpowered by Andreas/Armodrillo, armodrillo gets overpowered by Looma, who is about equal and matched 4 arms.
Whats directly wrong with this scaling chain? And whats wrong with diamondhead being able to keep up with OS Four Arms? Im genuinely confused about the problem,

 

[Uzukeas]

Agree with Bloxx, neutral on Kevin since the fight is veeery short. Also, Ben didn't "beat" Kevin; he knocked him off his feet yeah, but the dude is standing just fine seconds after.

Well at the same time, He is able to stagger and one punch an older Ben and cause him to fall, and then take a direct blast in the face and be relatively fine. So if that means anything to you..

 

[Emerald]

We can just downscale them from 7-A to 7-B, there's also that

 

[Uzukeas]

That works, but there is enough evidence to get them to 7-A, and that is most preferable.

 

[Emerald]

Iirc in Omniverse, 11 year old Ditto with some clones was able to gang up on Eon (i dont remember if he was damaged or threatened by them)

 

[Spilxson2]

Iirc in Omniverse, 11 year old Ditto with some clones was able to gang up on Eon (i dont remember if he was damaged or threatened by them)

They did gang up on him but Eon teleported away

 

[Maverick_Zero_X]

agree with bloxx, but 10 year old aliens scaling to Older aliens is a no go, ben notes that as he gets older his aliens get stronger to young ben, specially true when you consider that while diamond head scales to four arms in OS, the scaling later on makes it clear that aliens on the level of 4 arms completely stomp aliens on the level of diamond head, and this 1 7-A outlier against all of the consistent low 7-C feats is not only wrong by a lore stand point, but it creates circular scaling

Bloxx revision looks good, but disagree with the Heatblast proposal FRA

Unless Ben’ aliens have Reactive Power Level or something it’s contradictory circular scaling. It’s the same as scaling Kid Naruto to Boruto characters.