Question about luffy’s speed rating

[Billybobjoe321]

So if I am not mistaken, fifth emperor of the sea Luffy is 0.59c in base and snakeman was accepted as a 4x speed multiplier, but why are gear 2nd and boundman also treated as a 4x speed multiplier? His speed is listed as higher in gear 2nd and far higher in gear 4th, with gear 2nd being listed as 4 times faster at the end.

For rooftop Luffy, his base is listed as ftl for reacting to kaido, however he is listed as 2.36c. Kaido is listed as 1.35c. 2.36c is 4x faster than Luffy’s previous base. I believe he is listed as this because he surpasses the speed of boundman in his base, which for some reason is treated as a 4x speed multiplier. But if base luffy is 2.36c, then why is kaido still listed as 1.35c? Shouldn’t he be 2.36c, or more realistically 9.44c for being relative to gear 4 Luffy since it is treated as a 4x multiplier? There are also multiple other characters who should scale to luffy’s speed rating who don’t have it added to their profile.

 

[Billybobjoe321]

Bump

 

[Billybobjoe321]

bump

 

[Billybobjoe321]

Bump

 

[Billybobjoe321]

Bump

 

[ReallySwagGuy]

I still think it’s kind of weird that post-time skip base Luffy is apparently only sub-relativistic, if Luffy (and multiple other characters) either dodge light or perceive it. For example, Buggy during Marineford was able to react to light from Kizaru. I personally think that Luffy should be far higher than how he is right now, but that’s just me I suppose.

 

[Dark_Soul20189]

No, Luffy should be far lower than he currently is.

 

[ReallySwagGuy]

No, Luffy should be far lower than he currently is.

Luffy in Egghead Island reacted to light, dodged light, literally ate light, and even ran on an equal speed to clones of Kizaru who are at minimum SOL. Even in the scene where Luffy gets speedblitzed by him, Kizaru is stated to be accelerating past the speed of light.

That one data book statement where it states Kizaru to just be the speed of light is insanely outdated by now too, so that counter-argument wouldn’t work.

 

[Johner2133451]

No, Luffy should be far lower than he currently is.

Huh why?

 

[Dark_Soul20189]

Luffy in Egghead Island reacted to light, dodged light, literally ate light, and even ran on an equal speed to clones of Kizaru who are at minimum SOL. Even in the scene where Luffy gets speedblitzed by him, Kizaru is stated to be accelerating past the speed of light.

That one data book statement where it states Kizaru to just be the speed of light is insanely outdated by now too, so that counter-argument wouldn’t work.

That's in his Gear 5 form, that's currently accepted as 8c or something like that, I am not arguing that Gear 5 is Below SoL, what I am saying is that it should be a lot lower than it currently is.

Huh why?

Currently, the One Piece scaling has loads of Scaling chain mistakes, and Reaction speed calc, counts for full-out speed.

 

[Johner2133451]

Currently, the One Piece scaling has loads of Scaling chain mistakes, and Reaction speed calc, counts for full-out speed.

Ok but reaction = combat speed correct?

 

[Dark_Soul20189]

Ok but reaction = combat speed correct?

No, that's a common mistake, though.

 

[Johner2133451]

No, that's a common mistake, though.

I feel like many verses like to equate reaction and combat speed. If One Piece is getting downgraded because of this, a staff discussion should be made so it applies to other verses

 

[Dark_Soul20189]

I feel like many verses like to equate reaction and combat speed. If One Piece is getting downgraded because of this, a staff discussion should be made so it applies to other verses

Yes, it's an extremely common mistake, and the same can happen to any verse. The thing is that a user just needs to make a thread about it and prove that it's true.

Btw, here is the speed page definition of the two.

Reaction Speed

Reaction Speed​

Reaction speed is the speed at which a character can react to an event or action. This usually only grants a short movement upon reaction, whereas several movements at the same speed switch it to combat speed.

For example, let's say that character A shoots at character B with a gun and character B dodges. That is reaction speed. Keep in mind, sometimes a person aim dodges and it is not as good of a feat.

As another example, let's say that character A uses a minigun on character B, but the minigun takes a second or two to charge up and Character B sees this. If Character B dodges it is considered aim dodging since he/she knew that the attack was going to happen.

Reaction speed is reacting to an attack that you don't know is going to happen, or at a very close range. The reaction speed of a character also tends to be higher than their movement speed.

Combat speed

Combat Speed​

The speed at which a character can fight.

 

[ReallySwagGuy]

That's in his Gear 5 form, that's currently accepted as 8c or something like that, I am not arguing that Gear 5 is Below SoL, what I am saying is that it should be a lot lower than it currently is.

I don’t quite understand the idea of gear 5 being lower than 8c if even in base during the very beginning of post-time skip, Luffy was able to dodge light. Gear 2 would amp his speed by at least 4x, and gear 4 amps him further, and then post-Udon base Luffy outperforms gear 4 Luffy in every single way, including speed. The amps will still apply in this case, making Luffy vastly faster than how he is currently.

As for reaction speed ≠ combat speed, that should be for staff discussion.

 

[Johner2133451]

Yes, it's an extremely common mistake, and the same can happen to any verse. The thing is that a user just needs to make a thread about it and prove that it's true.

Btw, here is the speed page definition of the two.

Reaction Speed


Combat speed

So combat speed = hand 2 hand I suppose? While RS is just dodge

 

[Dark_Soul20189]

So combat speed = hand 2 hand I suppose? While RS is just dodge

basically yeah.

 

[Dark_Soul20189]

As for reaction speed ≠ combat speed, that should be for staff discussion.

It already has been one, and that was when they were split.

I don’t quite understand the idea of gear 5 being lower than 8c if even in base during the very beginning of post-time skip, Luffy was able to dodge light. Gear 2 would amp his speed by at least 4x, and gear 4 amps him further, and then post-Udon base Luffy outperforms gear 4 Luffy in every single way, including speed. The amps will still apply in this case, making Luffy vastly faster than how he is currently.

It's due to dodging a SoL attack doesn't instantly grant SoL, instead, there is a lot of math involved. to see how much and how fast he needed to move to avoid it.

 

[ReallySwagGuy]

It already has been one, and that was when they were split.

Even then, people like old Rayleigh was able to clash with Kizaru (with his light sword) along with perceiving said light sword, which is at minimum SOL. This would make old Rayleigh’s combat speed SOL, which characters such as Luffy would upscale from or at least be equal to. (Rayleigh was tired after his fight with Kizaru and was barely able to hold the clash, while gear 5 Luffy was fighting relative to Kizaru)

Also, Kizaru is FTL, which would make his attacks FTL. (Kizaru is able to incorporate speed into his attacks, as shown by when he first hit Luffy when he was in gear 4)

 

[Dark_Soul20189]

Even then, people like old Rayleigh was able to clash with Kizaru (with his light sword) along with perceiving said light sword, which is at minimum SOL.

It is not, nothing proves that he is swinging his sword at Light Speed, and seeing light has never been considered a SoL perception speed feat, you see colours no?

This would make old Rayleigh’s combat speed SOL, which characters such as Luffy would upscale from or at least be equal to. (Rayleigh was tired after his fight with Kizaru and was barely able to hold the clash, while gear 5 Luffy was fighting relative to Kizaru)

I explained why this would not work above.

Also, Kizaru is FTL, which would make his attacks FTL. (Kizaru is able to incorporate speed into his attacks, as shown by when he first hit Luffy when he was in gear 4)

Kizaru's FTL is complete bull, and should not exist.

 

[ReallySwagGuy]

It is not, nothing proves that he is swinging his sword at Light Speed, and seeing light has never been considered a SoL perception speed feat, you see colours no?

Even light in the visible spectrum moves at light speed, and we’re only able to see visible light due to the aftermath of visible light hitting objects, along with light hitting our eyes. Humans aren’t actually able to see light unless it hits their eye.

Kizaru's FTL is complete bull, and should not exist.

Kizaru is easily FTL. His attacks don’t cap out at light speed, it’s the speed of his attacks at a bare minimum. Kizaru accelerating past the speed of light when he blitzed Luffy directly supports this.

 

[Billybobjoe321]

Gear 2 would amp his speed by at least 4x, and gear 4 amps him further

But why is gear 2 treated as a 4x multiplier?

 

[Billybobjoe321]

Bump

 

[Billybobjoe321]

Bump

 

[BeTheWay1rst]

MFTL+++ to Immeasurable speed with future sight

 

[Saqphire]

Kizaru is easily FTL. His attacks don’t cap out at light speed, it’s the speed of his attacks at a bare minimum. Kizaru accelerating past the speed of light when he blitzed Luffy directly supports this.

People really need to let go of this fallacious way of considering Kizaru's max speed as lightspeed just cuz he is light; literally no other fruit has this arbitrary and non-existent limit except for his because we can't imagine light being faster than light in real life. I mean hell, Oda had to make that shi obvious in Egghead with him being able to accelerate in speed (light doesn't accelerate in speed therefore Kizaru's "SOL" isn't constant SOL thus there is no basis for his max speed being SOL)

 

[Billybobjoe321]

Bump

 

[Billybobjoe321]

Bump

 

[Billybobjoe321]

Bump

 

[Billybobjoe321]

Bump

 

[Billybobjoe321]

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[OrangeFR]

TBH there’s probably some random guidebook statement from pre timeskip saying Gear 2 is a 4x multiplier. I don’t actually know, but that is my guess.

 

[Lilybitdun]

TBH there’s probably some random guidebook statement from pre timeskip saying Gear 2 is a 4x multiplier. I don’t actually know, but that is my guess.

The only time I can think of where a multiplier statement is made about Gear 2 is the french translation of Databook Yellow

Not that it's used here considering the tenfold thing doesn't exist in the original Japanese lol

 

[Billybobjoe321]

Bump

 

[Billybobjoe321]

Bump