Question about Goku's power.

[Seventy96]

100% base Goku = 1% ssj1 or not?

 

[LordGriffin1000]

I think base Goku would be stronger, someone please correct me if I'm wrong.

 

[The_real_cal_howard]

Base Goku is above 1% of SSJ. Even with those 50x multipliers we don't use would make him 2%. Given that we don't use them, he's far greater, but an unquantifiable amount higher.

 

[Antoniofer]

Yeah, 100% base Goku = 2% SS Goku, but only Fist Grade SS and only during Frieza Saga, after that is unquantificable.

@Lord, I'm guessing that he asking about Namek Arc.

 

[The_real_cal_howard]

I wouldn't even say that. We don't use that multiplier. And 50x is a big gap. If Frieza wasn't one-shotting Goku without SS, toying around or not, then he would be the one getting one-shotted, Goku holding back or not.

 

[LordGriffin1000]

They can hold back their power perfectly though (Beerus didn't kill Bulma with his slap for example)

 

[Antoniofer]

It was the only time the PL were linear, with 100% Frieza being 120M, and 50% being equal to 20xkk Goke, being 60M. After that, and ever before is unquantificable without any statement.

 

[The_real_cal_howard]

@Ant. Power levels, as TFS Vegeta (People get riled up if I don't state TFS) stated, are kinda bull. Frieza using different percentages is an iffy topic. It may or may not be a case of multipliers, which I plan to make a thread about.

@LG. Not trying at all, like that, along with PIS or severely holding back (like SSB Goku vs Krillin) is a different story. The cases I'm talking about is if you're trying to kill/maim/defeat your opponent, like Goku vs Vegeta (Saiyan Saga) or Jin Mo-Ri vs 666:Satan (it's not DB that messes with it).

 

[SunWukong1986]

Do Power Levels Even Matter In Dragonball? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6tlX59mmvuQ

That's something I came across with the Youtuber Prince Vegeta has stated the same like Nick Landis (aka, Lanipator) as Vegeta from TeamFourStar says from episode 26.

 

[ProspectX]

Power levels have been irrelevant since eons ago, they dont matter. Goku was fighting against beerus in his base form but he used SSB against krillin and android 17. Just not applicable to a fight.

 

[Amexim]

SSJ is a x50 times multiplier. This is Canon, enough said. As for the power levels thing-- they're only useful for scaling purposes and are completely worthless for stating characters. Those moments where characters survive hits they shouldn't-- like that Goku vs Vegeta fight and when Goku goes from SS to SSB and ***** up Bergamo who has universal power-- swapping hands with a universal entity as a solar system level being (according to this wiki, which I think is dumb and headcanon, but, I'm not an admin, so...)-- shift in power has been ridiculous. Piccolo being able to distract Frieza while Goku was charging the spirit bomb is another example of a character surviving shit he shouldn't-- power levels or not.

Mathematically speaking, he should be 2% ss in his base.

 

[SunWukong1986]

Basically, the reason why power levels existed was for us to understand the power difference between them, but now the author has somehow foreseen that "if they knew the concrete number, then they could tell who would win or lose in the fight".

 

[ProspectX]

Power levels are not appicable to a fight, when trunks fought cell he basically powered-up and resulted to be stronger than him physically, but also slower. So simple numbers are not relevant in a fight. A scouter would just mislead you in a fight.

 

[Huesito88]

Well to be fair ultra ssj is the execution to that rule as when goku fought captain ginyu

 

[ProspectX]

Not just trunks, every other 1vs1 battle. They are not relevant because they severly mislead you and can lead to understimating the opponent. Think logical, who's you gonna trust better? Your own battle instict or a robotic scouter that's not even accurate.?

 

[Elms_Trampos]

^The only reason why scouters are inaccurate is because the characters can change their PL during the course of the battle by raising their ki, but, once they've already done that and if the characters don't have any hax THEN we can use PL.

Unless we are talking about Super or filler

 

[ProspectX]

Since all factors are included in battle, ki sensing of a martial artist is far more reliable than trusting the mechanism of non-sentient constructs.

Why would super be excluded?, power levels are displayed to be a distrusted source since saiyan saga.

 

[ZoroNotZolo]

In Dragon Ball Z, then 100% Base Goku = 2% SS Goku

In Dragon Ball Super, the concept of God Ki, and Saiyan Beyond God sort of screwed us all up. Did God Ki make the Super Saiyan Multipliers lower? What happened? That's a different forum in itself.

 

[Elms_Trampos]

Oh, if you're talking about things like inteligence, the location, specific weaknesses and special techniques then yeah PL aren't everything. When I say scouters are reliable I mean it in as in not in the middle of a battle since they're too slow. I agree that judging the Z fighter's relaxed/non fighting PL as if that's all they have is wrong if that's what you're saying but when the guides say Kaiokenx3 Goku has a PL of 24000 (don't know if that's the exact number) then I don't see a reason to distrust them

When I say Super I mean things like Android 17 being SSB tier, Roshi not getting one shotted by Goku, Tagoma not killing Tien, Krillin or Roshi when hitting them, Rose Black getting asspull power ups,etc.

 

[SunWukong1986]

Which is what the video link I putted talked about the characters of Dragon Ball rising and lowering their energy.

 

[Amexim]

Saiyan beyond God isn't Canon. Well, it's not a different Transformation-- in the Anime or Manga. The concept of Goku's base being comparable to God is Canon though. This wiki uses that headcanon idea of it being used in the anime probably because the scaling would be ****** up. I agree with most of the rankings, but not because Goku or the SS forms aren't universal, but because he was holding back, simply put. It's in character and the only available explanation in the anime and manga alone. Never once were the words "Saiyan Beyond God" and "Transformation" used in a way that explicitly States or even heavily implied it exists as a separate transformation. So, on the topic of the multipliers, I don't think we can ever really use Multipliers to scale up in DB because it's too crazy of a boost. SS is equal to SSG, and SS2 is twice that, and SS3 is 4 times that, so, it's 8 times stronger than God, and SSB and SSG have a tremendous boost-- making an SS3 Goku fodder in comparison to SSG-- the reason I don't use the multipliers to scale up in the case of this Universal Status of DB specifically, (retroactively it's fine I guess...?) Is because there's no way Goku is even 2 times Universal, no matter what, the story doesn't really make that clear. As for this wiki's stance on it, I respectfully disagree, but I understand it's predicament with how it makes very little sense for Goku to be fighting Universal fighters all the time now. OBD is the real NVP tho. Universal Frost. Depending on whether or not Goku was suppressed, it makes sense. The Multipliers, while Canon, are useless when trying to understand the powers as of now because the plot ignores them. Goku as a Super Saiyan 1 can box with Bergamo, then not be creamed by Blue. Goku goes from SS2 to Blue instantly in fights and the battles continue like the boosts were nothing. They're Canon, it's just that the fights are too close for it to really mean anything I guess? Or Goku's suppressed...