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Nico Karias VS Jonathan Hall

Yuracion is a word I made up. But Yuracion is the name of the energy source of the series.

As for the battle, this is very close.
 
@Dragon: I just remembered that you have a blog about it. Wanna link that up to here so the others can know what it is and how it works and such?
 
I know, that's why i added that comment lol

Edit: Let's see what Dragon has to offer to the explo~
 
Oh boy this means more info blogs for me in the future. lol

Eternal Flames are basically the much stronger versions of the Holy Flames, also known as Blessed Flames. The Holy Flames themselves are the most powerful level of flames, surpassing that of even the flames of Ignis, the literal embodiment of Fire itself. The flames of the Angels, the highest ranked beings in the Xros Revolution cosmology.

To put into perspective, Ignis can create flames no mortal can replicate and are so powerful that even the strongest fire artes in the series cannot stand against them. Aside from Holy Flame Artes, which easily overpower Ignis' flames. Eternal Flames are the much stronger variations of the Holy Flames, that not has the added effect of burning...well....eternally, unless the user does not will it. And unlike the other flames including the Void Flame, Eternal Flames cannot be used by anyone without Quasar Dragon blood.

So basically, Eternal Flames and Void Flames are the second strongest flames in the series. Does this help?

For a scaling image here,

Oblivion Flames>>>>>>>>>>>Eternal Flames=Void Flames>>>>Holy Flames=Fallen Flames>>>>>>>>>>>>>>Ignis' Flames>>>>>>>Rainbow Flames>>Clear Flames>>>>>White Flames>>>Blue Flames>Regular Flames
 
@Dragon I mean.... that's useful from a lore perspective, but like.... in terms of Tier?

1-A? 1-B? 1-C? High 2-A?
 
How invested in Nico's wellbeing is Azrael?

Is he going to attempt to reconnect the Flame if Jonathan cuts Nico's connection to it?
 
Azrael is greatly invested in Nico seeing as he granted him the Black Seraphim armor, and has had his sights on him since Nico was born.
 
Well that is irritating.

However, Jonathan was still able to cut Mythrisha's connection to Alaya (while Alaya was being overtaken by Alastor)

And there are two ways to think about Alaya.

1) A low 2-C thing

2) A thing made out of pure High 1-A essence (Apeiron) that has an output of low 2-C
 
Probably not right away. But if he sees that Nico just won't die for some reason, he'd use his Sight to see get some more information, and immediately see the connections.

That being said, he can prevent severed connections from reconnecting if he wants, so he might be able to just stop Nico regenerating if he cuts off his head.
 
However, Nico will not just sit there and let his head get cut off. Even then, we are talking about guys who can be erased from existence and comback. The situation is that Yuracion Absolon characters can overwrite Power Nullification. They do this in every fight. It is second nature for them to utilize anti-regen. Literally all their attacks are powered up by Anti-regen artes as a way to counter their high speed regen. Power Null as a whole in Yuracion Absolon is not that useful as an ability unless you completely sever the connection from Yuracion Energy, permanently, and keep it from coming back. It will only take a few seconds for Nico to undo to anti-regen.

Not only that, as I said Nico won't just sit back and let himself get hit. Matter of fact, his basic attacks are a threat to Jonathan. His basic attack bypass conventional durability by attacking your very essence. In Xros Revolution, this means attacking ones mind, body, soul and characteristics directly, essentially attacking your existence. Only reason these guys don't die from one punch is due to them having a defense for such attacks.

Then we have to factor in Nico's hacking that he can use during battle. He can do this to a point in which he can literally manipulate his opponent's characteristics and remove from them properties they once has and essentially voiding resistances. This is the most Nico has done with his hacking, so he at most can remove resistances and make Jonathan's attacks do something completely different. And I will note that Nico is someone who is willing to use his hacks early on as he is used to fighting beings with multiple resistances. This was actually the first thing he did in his battle with King once he got the chance. He also has complete information analysis with his hacks and can see all his opponent's have to offer and their weaknesses as well. His greatest hacking feat was when he manages to hack his father Raphael's Faux Seraphim Armor. He did so to the point that Raphael's attacks had healing effects when attack him instead of damaging. Of course, in series, the hacking is short lived as beings in Yuracion Absolon can overwrite stuff like this. In his fight against King, he fought someone who resisted everything he had, however Nico can quickly react to his opponents and overpower them by hacking if the Void Flame isn't enough.

Finally, there is his Seraphi Armor, and the true power of the VoidFlame Seraphim is unleashed. During his fight with King, he could only enter this form for a few minutes, however as of the most recent arc (the 7-B tier) Nico can keep this armor on as long as he wants. In his Seraphim Armor, Nico is increasingly likely to utilize the Conceptual Erasing powers of his Void Flames.

However, the one fight that will be mentioned now and is very important here is his fight with his father Raphael. Raphael had basically the same power as Jonathan with his Faux Seraphim Armor. Matter of fact he cut off his bond with Azrael and attacked him with a "killing blow" literally a second afterward. However, even then it was too late as Azrael had already re-established said bond with Nico. Now Nico still lost the fight due to Raphael basically having the means to counter the Void Flames. These means were simply disconnecting his connection to Azrael and the Void Flames. However, it still failed spectacularly.

Can Nico even be killed then? Well, yes actually. Azrael had to literally jump in when Raphael revived Zavin from the dead as he knew Zavin would not only be able to disconnect their bond, but he could also permanently keep it severed due to still having the leftover powers of the Akashi Book. This also reveals a major weakness to Nico as a whole, as he can in fact be killed by Akashi Artes as well as if you kill him before Azrael instantly reconnect their separation. However, this does not recover stamina. So Nico can still lose from fainting or incapacitation if he uses to much power.

Sorry for the essay.
 
Dragonmasterxyz said:
However, Nico will not just sit there and let his head get cut off.
Click to expand...
Of course not. Just saying if it did happen.

Even then, we are talking about guys who can be erased from existence and comback.

So can several high tier hallows. That's why constant regen negation is so prized in the verse. Although, in this case is the Mid-Godly Nico's own, or is it because of the Void Flame/ angel armour?

The situation is that Yuracion Absolon characters can overwrite Power Nullification. They do this in every fight. It is second nature for them to utilize anti-regen. Literally all their attacks are powered up by Anti-regen artes as a way to counter their high speed regen.

So can Hallows. Any regen negation in Hallow Saga is constantly being held in place to make it stick, because otherwise Restoration just undoes the regen negation.

Power Null as a whole in Yuracion Absolon is not that useful as an ability unless you completely sever the connection from Yuracion Energy, permanently, and keep it from coming back. It will only take a few seconds for Nico to undo to anti-regen.

Did you say "sever the connection"?

"and keep it from coming back"?

Jonathan can do that.

Not only that, as I said Nico won't just sit back and let himself get hit. Matter of fact, his basic attacks are a threat to Jonathan. His basic attack bypass conventional durability by attacking your very essence. In Xros Revolution, this means attacking ones mind, body, soul and characteristics directly, essentially attacking your existence. Only reason these guys don't die from one punch is due to them having a defense for such attacks.

Divine Armour helps here. It reduces any unwanted changes to the user to a fraction (sometimes an infentisimal fraction so that it might as well be negated) of their original level. Destroying Jonathan's soul also won't kill him, souls simply aren't that important in Hallow Saga. Hallows also have exceptionally good mind resistance, as even Elena Mathews when she wasn't even a proper hallow yet was able to retain some of her original memories after Alaya tried to do a universal memory rewrite. And Alaya is kinda trying to erase Hallows all the time. It just can't.

Then we have to factor in Nico's hacking that he can use during battle. He can do this to a point in which he can literally manipulate his opponent's characteristics and remove from them properties they once has and essentially voiding resistances. This is the most Nico has done with his hacking, so he at most can remove resistances and make Jonathan's attacks do something completely different. And I will note that Nico is someone who is willing to use his hacks early on as he is used to fighting beings with multiple resistances. This was actually the first thing he did in his battle with King once he got the chance. He also has complete information analysis with his hacks and can see all his opponent's have to offer and their weaknesses as well. His greatest hacking feat was when he manages to hack his father Raphael's Faux Seraphim Armor. He did so to the point that Raphael's attacks had healing effects when attack him instead of damaging. Of course, in series, the hacking is short lived as beings in Yuracion Absolon can overwrite stuff like this. In his fight against King, he fought someone who resisted everything he had, however Nico can quickly react to his opponents and overpower them by hacking if the Void Flame isn't enough.

Again, Divine Armour reduces (in many cases to infinitesimal levels) unwanted changes to the user, and Resotration undoes any changes over a few minutes that does make it through. Also, the "data" of people in my verse is kinda held in their Ego... which is a High 1-A thing (it exists on the same level as Apeiron, and Apeiron is the direct emanations of the Zeroth, the tier 0) that no one has ever been able to touch except through verse specific mechanics.

Finally, there is his Seraphi Armor, and the true power of the VoidFlame Seraphim is unleashed. During his fight with King, he could only enter this form for a few minutes, however as of the most recent arc (the 7-B tier) Nico can keep this armor on as long as he wants. In his Seraphim Armor, Nico is increasingly likely to utilize the Conceptual Erasing powers of his Void Flames.

Jonathan has conceptual resistance, capable of passively defying the concepts of Alaya. So unless this is the full 1-A power of the void flames, he should be right.

However, the one fight that will be mentioned now and is very important here is his fight with his father Raphael. Raphael had basically the same power as Jonathan with his Faux Seraphim Armor. Matter of fact he cut off his bond with Azrael and attacked him with a "killing blow" literally a second afterward. However, even then it was too late as Azrael had already re-established said bond with Nico. Now Nico still lost the fight due to Raphael basically having the means to counter the Void Flames. These means were simply disconnecting his connection to Azrael and the Void Flames. However, it still failed spectacularly.

Did Raphael actually keep the connection severed? Or did he just sever it once and then Azrael immediately reconnected?

Can Nico even be killed then? Well, yes actually. Azrael had to literally jump in when Raphael revived Zavin from the dead as he knew Zavin would not only be able to disconnect their bond, but he could also permanently keep it severed due to still having the leftover powers of the Akashi Book. This also reveals a major weakness to Nico as a whole, as he can in fact be killed by Akashi Artes as well as if you kill him before Azrael instantly reconnect their separatio.

Considering Jonathan channels his power through his sword (though he can do it through his body), and he's using Excalibur , one of the abilities of is "always kills instantly with so much as a single scratch" and "qualifies as whatever weakness the target has", killing Nico before the connection is remade wouldn't actually be that hard. Sword hits -> Jonathan severs type 8 connections + Excalibur insta-death activates.

However, this does not recover stamina. So Nico can still lose from fainting or incapacitation if he uses to much power.

How much power is "too much power"?

Sorry for the essay.

All good. Very useful.
 
What kind of projectiles does Nico use?

Because in this situation, the only ranged attack Jonathan has is Excalibur's radiance (which is admittedly an attack that instantly burnt several beings who were 7-B with their footsteps alone to ash, so it's still a powerful attack). So it's possible Nico could just hop back and take advantage of his range.
 
"So can several high tier hallows. That's why constant regen negation is so prized in the verse. Although, in this case is the Mid-Godly Nico's own, or is it because of the Void Flame/ angel armour?"

It's a natural ability for Yuracion Energy masters.

"Did you say "sever the connection"? "and keep it from coming back" Jonathan can do that."

Not as easy as you think it is. But that's a blog for another time.

"Again, Divine Armour reduces (in many cases to infinitesimal levels) unwanted changes to the user, and Resotration undoes any changes over a few minutes that does make it through. Also, the "data" of people in my verse is kinda held in their Ego... which is a High 1-A thing (it exists on the same level as Apeiron, and Apeiron is the direct emanations of the Zeroth, the tier 0) that no one has ever been able to touch except through verse specific mechanics."

Nico hacks via Yuracion Energy...in which is a High 1-A power.....well....

"Jonathan has conceptual resistance, capable of passively defying the concepts of Alaya. So unless this is the full 1-A power of the void flames, he should be right."

Well, at this point in the armor, he can use the effects of the Void Flames to the fullest. However, he isn't gonna spam it as that takes a lot of stamina.

"Did Raphael actually keep the connection severed? Or did he just sever it once and then Azrael immediately reconnected?"

Yes. The Faux Seraphim armor was made to permanently keep Azrael from re-establishing a connection with Nico. However, Azrael reconnected before the instant where it would've been permanently shut down occured. So it's gonna be a speed brawl there. To specify, the instant Nico was cut, the bond was severed and at the same time was severed permanently, however, in that same instant, because Azrael has no life (ovo), he re-established said connection.

"Considering Jonathan channels his power through his sword (though he can do it through his body), and he's using Excalibur , one of the abilities of is "always kills instantly with so much as a single scratch" and "qualifies as whatever weakness the target has", killing Nico before the connection is remade wouldn't actually be that hard. Sword hits -> Jonathan severs type 8 connections + Excalibur insta-death activates."

Yuracion Absolon characters aren't getting insta-killed like that. They resist stuff like that. So at best he's giving Nico one really bad cut and severing his connection in which is a toss-up on whether it will cancel it out or Azrael reconnects it.(The running joke with Azrael is that he has nothing better to do since he's so anti-social. ovo)

"How much power is "too much power"?"

It depends. If Nico is spamming powerful attacks, give him a few hours. But, if he's playing it smart, he can last for days.

"What kind of projectiles does Nico use?"

He has: The common fire balls, flaming shockwaves, Swords made of flames, Blazing Explosions, Slash Waves, Fire Pillars, Not an attack, but forcefields, Giant Fireballs that multiple, Multiple explosive fire doppelgangers, etc.

Why are our verses so compatible???? ovo
 
^Cause you guys make some broken, OP shit (Referring to the last comment line) xD

Edit: Anyways as for you guys, i'm unsure as to what can lead to what since these are really good arguments with one another on the characters respectively. Considering how broken Yuracion on one hand and those connected to Alaya on another are like even for these kinds in this tier, i'll simply call it as an incon for me at the very least as a vote.
 
It's a natural ability for Yuracion Energy masters.

Ok, so even if Jonathan gets rid of the Type 8, Nico can still regenerate, so Jonathan will need to use his severing to get rid of it.

Not as easy as you think it is. But that's a blog for another time.

I'll wait for that blog then.

Nico hacks via Yuracion Energy...in which is a High 1-A power.....well....

High 1-A hacking? Though I'll explain. The Ego exists on the same level as Apeiron, which is the emanations of the Tier 0. No one has ever managed to directly affect someone else's Ego through power alone. Even the Soveiregn, the High 1-A of the verse who has touched the Zeroth and survived (everything else just merges back into the Zeroth), can't directly affect the Ego of another, and needs to use the verse specific mechanic of the Ego's True Name to control it.

Well, at this point in the armor, he can use the effects of the Void Flames to the fullest.

More 1-A hax in a 7-B...? Dragon plz

Yes. The Faux Seraphim armor was made to permanently keep Azrael from re-establishing a connection with Nico

I'll be more specific. When Jonathan severs something, and decides he wants to keep it from reconnecting, that severing becomes permanent. It isn't like he needs to psychically hold the two severed pieces away from each other and they automatically rejoin if he doesn't. It's just that when used against Hallows, Hallows Restoration will undo that permanent severing in a few minutes, so in that case he needs to fight back against their restoration.

It isn't that severed things rejoin automatically unless he "holds them apart". It's if the effect that actually undoes his making severing permanent (the Restoration effect) happens, the he needs to "hold them apart".

Yuracion Absolon characters aren't getting insta-killed like that. They resist stuff like that. So at best he's giving Nico one really bad cut and severing his connection in which is a toss-up on whether it will cancel it out or Azrael reconnects it.

Has Nico actually developed his Yuracion resistances to death manip or is it just the baseline death resist it gives? Because Excalibur's one-hit kill is kinda powered by the passive Apeiron of humanity warping reality to their desires and perspective. So it is a pretty powerful death manip.

It depends. If Nico is spamming powerful attacks, give him a few hours. But, if he's playing it smart, he can last for days.

Got it.

He has: The common fire balls, flaming shockwaves, Swords made of flames, Blazing Explosions, Slash Waves, Fire Pillars, Not an attack, but forcefields, Giant Fireballs that multiple, Multiple explosive fire doppelgangers, etc.

Yeesh. Likes his fire, doesn't he? How much of this carry Nico's hax though? Because if it's just (albeit magical and really hot) fire, Jonathan can probably tank it pretty easily.

Why are our verses so compatible???? ovo

No clue ovo

Also, how well can Nico deal with being constantly burnt to ashes?

Because the radiance of Excalibur is capable of instantly burning several lesser Chaosborn to ashes, and those things are capable of causing magnitude 8 earthquakes (7-B) with a single footstep. And that Radiance is always on, and independent of Jonathan's own power. So basically, just standing near that sword is going to be burning Nico to ash as fast as he can regenerate.

It also has a fear/despair effect on enemies that was capable of making Alastor Prince flinch away from its light, and Alastor could resist the combined negative feelings (all pain, all fear, all despair, all stress, etc) of all sentient beings in the universe, multiplied several times over, being shunted into his brain without any unnatural resistances.

Jonathan's causality manip also means that basically any attack that hits him without killing him won't be able to hurt him again, at least not for a while. Too much of a variety of attacks would overwhelm his ability to sever all of their causality (however, he doesn't automatically sever causality. If an attack hits him and he realises it isn't doing much damage, or he can just regen from it quickly, he won't bother severing its causality.
 
"High 1-A hacking? Though I'll explain. The Ego exists on the same level as Apeiron, which is the emanations of the Tier 0. No one has ever managed to directly affect someone else's Ego through power alone. Even the Soveiregn, the High 1-A of the verse who has touched the Zeroth and survived (everything else just merges back into the Zeroth), can't directly affect the Ego of another, and needs to use the verse specific mechanic of the Ego's True Name to control it."

No no no, not High 1-A hacking. I meant that Yuracion Energy is a High 1-A source, but not 1-A in power when used by others. Either way, I guess this is a moot point.

"More 1-A hax in a 7-B...? Dragon plz"

No, his flames aren't 1-A. When I say to the fullest, I mean he can use all the abilities with his Void flames. Not actually 1-A hax, more like scaled down full power Void Flames...if that makes sense. lol

"It isn't that severed things rejoin automatically unless he "holds them apart". It's if they do try to rejoin, he needs to "hold them apart"."

So basically, he'll be fighting back against Azrael.

"Has Nico actually developed his Yuracion resistances to death manip or is it just the baseline death resist it gives? Because Excalibur's one-hit kill is kinda powered by the passive Apeiron of humanity warping reality to their desires and perspective. So it is a pretty powerful death manip."

Actually, yes he has. He has fought the likes of Harvesters who can cast instantaneous death via a simple word. However...once again...a blog I need to make to explain to true extent of this. Hellbound Beasts are important for resistances for Yuracion Absolon characters. Apeiron is confusing me. Is this 1-A hax or what? Or is it a power source? It's hard to get a grasp on.

"Yeesh. Likes his fire, doesn't he? How much of this carry Nico's hax though? Because if it's just (albeit magical and really hot) fire, Jonathan can probably tank it pretty easily."

All of them, a simple small void flame fireball carries it's effects. Assuming Nico wants to kill the person he's fighting.

"It also has a fear/despair effect on enemies that was capable of making Alastor Prince flinch away from its light, and Alastor could resist the combined negative feelings (all pain, all fear, all despair, all stress, etc) of all sentient beings in the universe, multiplied several times over, being shunted into his brain without any unnatural resistances."

Nico's a pretty fearless guy. However, if this were Chase, I'd say no problem (Universe? Try Multiverse. Chase stood there without a care in the world), but Nico could get in trouble with that. However, he has very powerful mental resistance as he is able to be completely uneffected from the Empathic shenanigans of the Desires.

Basically, this is a big chaotic brawl. I think I'll go inconclusive due to the amount of factors in play.
 
No, his flames aren't 1-A. When I say to the fullest, I mean he can use all the abilities with his Void flames. Not actually 1-A hax, more like scaled down full power Void Flames...if that makes sense. lol

Oh I see. I thought as much, but saying "to their fullest extent" I was like "wait what?"

Actually, yes he has. He has fought the likes of Harvesters who can cast instantaneous death via a simple word. However...once again...a blog I need to make to explain to true extent of this. Hellbound Beasts are important for resistances for Yuracion Absolon characters.

How much instantaneous death we talking here? I'll wait for Hellbound Beasts.

Apeiron is confusing me. Is this 1-A hax or what? Or is it a power source? It's hard to get a grasp on.

Here ya go. https://fcoc-vs-battles.fandom.com/wiki/User_blog:Monarch_Laciel/Monarchverse_Explanation_Page. It isn't 1-A hax, it's a high 1-A substance that grants its wielders abilities similar (in effect, not scale) to that of God when they merge with it.

All of them, a simple small void flame fireball carries it's effects. Assuming Nico wants to kill the person he's fighting.

Ok then. He'd probably take damage from that then. Depending on how much Nico spams them though, he'd probably sever causality after one hits him so they can't hurt him again.
 
Holy shit I forgot about this.....Sorry about that...

To answer your question on a Harvester's Word of Death. Harvesters are beings who focus on getting rid of large planets worth of people at once. So we are talking about a creature who can spell instant death on millions of people at once. However, I will note that Nico barely resisted it since he was unlucky to face a Harvester of all things (A S++ Risk Rating Creature) for his first Hellbound creature.

This fights seems inconclusive to me.
 
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