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Minor Naruto Revisions | Part 1

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Foriaa

Foriaa

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Hello. This purpose of this thread is to provide numerical values to Bijuu Bombs. Some of this thread is based around calcs that were accepted here, the rest will be inverse scaling :

Heat Scaling​


All Jinchuriki would be granted external resistance and internal only when in V2 cloak due to Kn4 swallowing the BB and discharging it from his mouth. Bijuu are generally shown resisting their own output + heat :

Can produce + resist:​

This should grant the following characters both output and resistance to at least 1,561,622 C :

Can only resist:​

Now for character's who would be granted resistance to this level of heat:
 
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I wanted to talk about Ametarasu, but I have issues with the consistency of it's heat scaling. I might get into it later if it's brought up again.
 
Foriaa said:
I wanted to talk about Ametarasu, but I have issues with the consistency of it's heat scaling. I might get into it later if it's brought up again.
Click to expand...
At the very least it should upscale above son Goku lava considering gyuki could take it and was relatively fine while for amaterasu he was burning severely.

For the thread itself, if the calc is already approved fine then the scaling looks good to me
 
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Amaterasu's inconsistency comes from how it interacts with the environment, not characters.
 
Just a question: why is the Bijuu Dama being compared to a nuclear explosion? It has a much higher vaporization density, but I'm still wondering if that's the reason.

Edit: I think I get it now; you're calculating the thermal radiation of the Bijuu Dama. In that case, there would be no way to calculate this for all the *Bijuu dama's some of which are more powerful than this one.
 
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OiEuSouDuvi said:
Just a question: why is the Bijuu Dama being compared to a nuclear explosion? It has a much higher vaporization density, but I'm still wondering if that's the reason.

Edit: I think I get it now; you're calculating the thermal radiation of the Bijuu Dama. In that case, there would be no way to calculate this for all the *Bijuu dama's some of which are more powerful than this one.
Click to expand...
The comparison being made is that explosions release energy in different forms: shockwaves, heat, radiation, etc. This does not mean that Bijuu Bombs are nukes themselves. What the formula is figuring out is how much thermal energy is present within the affected volume, which is then used to estimate the effective temperature of the blast.

Bijuu Bombs are generally treated as vape, meaning that every cubic centimeter of what they come into contact with gets sublimated into gas, which would likely increase the temperature value, if anything.
 
OiEuSouDuvi said:
Edit: I think I get it now; you're calculating the thermal radiation of the Bijuu Dama. In that case, there would be no way to calculate this for all the *Bijuu dama's some of which are more powerful than this one.
Click to expand...
The more output the Bijuu Dama has, the higher the thermal energy, which in turn increases the temperature, I'm using the accepted calc as a lowball since I'm too lazy to get the values for the others
 
The calculation that is based on is accepted only as "possibly" rating for Naruto. This is the version of the calculation for KN6 Naruto's Biju Bomb that is accepted for having a solid rating.
 
Uhhh is this sort of heat scaling allowed? I’ve personally never seen anyone get a heat resistance rating from “enter generic anime explosion here” unless explicitly stated.

Kinda like Yamamoto’s Bankai. Or the Gamma Ray Burst thing from Garou.

This level of heat is also contradicted within Naruto itself Isnt via Amaterasu? Which is heat of the sun. So a few thousand C if I recall.

Then you have the whole Lava dimension thing too..
 
I'm not sure why it wouldn't be accepted, if you can point me to the guidelines regarding heat scaling, I'd be glad to take a look. As for the Amaterasu stuff, I agreed above with it's heat showing being inconsistent and would be fine for dropping it, the Bijuu Bombs however, which is the premise of this CRT, has no inconsistency when it comes to it's heat showings, in fact, every Bijuu Bomb is currently accepted as vaping, meaning that nearly all of it's total energy should be in the form of heat, in my case, I divide it by 0.35.
 
Sigurd_Snake_in_The_Eye said:
Uhhh is this sort of heat scaling allowed? I’ve personally never seen anyone get a heat resistance rating from “enter generic anime explosion here” unless explicitly stated.

Kinda like Yamamoto’s Bankai. Or the Gamma Ray Burst thing from Garou.

This level of heat is also contradicted within Naruto itself Isnt via Amaterasu? Which is heat of the sun. So a few thousand C if I recall.

Then you have the whole Lava dimension thing too..
Click to expand...
I am leaning in this direction; I think generally for heat resistance, the heat has to be sustained. Something as brief as an explosion or a flash of lightning for example, wouldn't be considered valid as there is no indication of a sustained resistance. Real-life humans have survived being struck by lightning which has enormously high temperatures but because it happens so briefly there isn't a sustained transfer of heat.
 
Damage3245 said:
I am leaning in this direction; I think generally for heat resistance, the heat has to be sustained. Something as brief as an explosion or a flash of lightning for example, wouldn't be considered valid as there is no indication of a sustained resistance. Real-life humans have survived being struck by lightning which has enormously high temperatures but because it happens so briefly there isn't a sustained transfer of heat.
Click to expand...
Sustained for how long?
 
Damage3245 said:
Something as brief as an explosion or a flash of lightning for example, wouldn't be considered valid. Real-life humans have survived being struck by lightning which has enormously high temperatures but because it happens so briefly there isn't a sustained transfer of heat.
Click to expand...
The lightning analogy just wouldn't work here, the Bijuu Bombs aren't just brief explosions of heat, people outright stare at them and have dialogue. They also straight up make the Bijuu Bomb within their body, with some characters like Kn4 and Gyuki discharging from within
b34fe95d6999.jpeg
 
Foriaa said:
I'm not sure why it wouldn't be accepted, if you can point me to the guidelines regarding heat scaling, I'd be glad to take a look. As for the Amaterasu stuff, I agreed above with it's heat showing being inconsistent and would be fine for dropping it, the Bijuu Bombs however, which is the premise of this CRT, has no inconsistency when it comes to it's heat showings, in fact, every Bijuu Bomb is currently accepted as vaping, meaning that nearly all of it's total energy should be in the form of heat, in my case, I divide it by 0.35.
Click to expand...
I understand what you’re saying. It’s just basic science. But it’s anime, so things like this aren’t necessarily taken at face value. Kind of like light speed meaning infinite mass and etc.


As for heat scaling there is no page for it as far as I’m aware. I’m just saying I’ve never seen anyone do this.

So you should get some admins opinion on this, as any verse could “abuse” this. Not saying you are.
 
I don't know how reliable this method is. When we look at the character's reaction to actual heat-based attacks in the series, Killer B (with Eight-Tails transformation) gets burned just by Itachi's flame-coated shuriken:

0549-013.png


Unless we're proposing that Itachi's base flame shuriken are over 28 million degrees Celsius, nearly twice as hot as the core of the Sun?
 
Sigurd_Snake_in_The_Eye said:
It’s just basic science. But it’s anime, so things like this aren’t necessarily taken at face value.
Click to expand...
I'm not taking it at face value, this is VSBW, it's not meant to.
Soulking22334 said:
by your logic her lava >sun core ???
Click to expand...
That she can cause a holding back Madara's Susanoo to melt a bit?
Damage3245 said:
I don't know how reliable this method is. When we look at the character's reaction to actual heat-based attacks in the series, Killer B (with Eight-Tails transformation) gets burned just by Itachi's flame-coated shuriken:
Click to expand...
I'm not even trying to be disrespectful here, but are you actually reading the scan you sent. B isn't fully transformed in that panel, that his hand blocking Itachi's jutsu.

I only want to grant the scaling to full Biijuufication and their Jins in V2
 
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Bijuu bombs are just chakra which is a supernatural energy. So theirs no proper way to quantify how much thermal energy it uses. Even meteors which get up to 3000 degrees can vape rocks. Using mostly Kenetic energy. I'm pretty sure chakra doesn't undergo something like nuclear fusion until Baryon mode
 
Foriaa said:
The lightning analogy just wouldn't work here, the Bijuu Bombs aren't just brief explosions of heat, people outright stare at them and have dialogue. They also straight up make the Bijuu Bomb within their body, with some characters like Kn4 and Gyuki discharging from within
b34fe95d6999.jpeg
Click to expand...
Kn4 isn't a good example since you're using Kn6 for the calc. And Gyuki doing it doesn't last long.

Foriaa said:
I'm not sure why it wouldn't be accepted, if you can point me to the guidelines regarding heat scaling, I'd be glad to take a look. As for the Amaterasu stuff, I agreed above with it's heat showing being inconsistent and would be fine for dropping it, the Bijuu Bombs however, which is the premise of this CRT, has no inconsistency when it comes to it's heat showings, in fact, every Bijuu Bomb is currently accepted as vaping, meaning that nearly all of it's total energy should be in the form of heat, in my case, I divide it by 0.35.
Click to expand...
Well ama is the inconsistency. We can't ignore it just because its not a biju bomb.

Foriaa said:
I'm not even trying to be disrespectful here, but are you actually reading the scan you sent. B isn't transformed in that panel, that his hand blocking Itachi's jutsu.
Click to expand...
Which is partial transformation. Are you arguing just for the biju forms to resist it? You know Pain was caught in the blast, and while in the rain village Jiraiya thinks he'd have been fried with 3 paths active by his oil and fire jutsu. This just seems like it becomes inconsistent if we look for more examples.
 
ichimojii said:
I'm pretty sure chakra doesn't undergo something like nuclear fusion until Baryon mode
Click to expand...
Not at all what I'm saying, read here :
The comparison being made is that explosions release energy in different forms: shockwaves, heat, radiation, etc. This does not mean that Bijuu Bombs are nukes themselves. What the formula is figuring out is how much thermal energy is present within the affected volume, which is then used to estimate the effective temperature of the blast.

Bijuu Bombs are generally treated as vape, meaning that every cubic centimeter of what they come into contact with gets sublimated into gas, which would likely increase the temperature value, if anything.
Arkenis said:
Kn4 isn't a good example since you're using Kn6 for the calc.
Click to expand...
Why wouldn't it be a good example, the phys of of Kn6 and Kn4 stays the same, only difference is that Kn6 has a higher release.
Arkenis said:
Well ama is the inconsistency. We can't ignore it just because its not a biju bomb.
Click to expand...
We have over a dozen showings of Bijuu Bombs, all vaporizing anything they come into contact with, then we have amaterasu, that doesn't vaporize or melt anything worth noting. If Amaterasu was actually 5,000c or comparable to the surface of the sun, we wouldn't be seeing this:
b40931e8e60b.jpeg

Not melting the Raikage arm or metal gauntlets
7c44d78093bf.jpeg

Not melting or vaporizing any leaf's despite sitting there for a decent duration
f9606d7cfbf3.jpeg

Not effecting the Uchiha hideout despite sitting there for a decent duration
fb809310849c.jpeg

Sits on Madara's armor with no implication of melting happening

There's more, but I think you guys get what I'm trying to say. What sigurd said above is true, that we shouldn't take statements at face value, if that's the case, why should we treat Amaterasu as being comparable to the surface of the sun?
 
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Arkenis said:
You know Pain was caught in the blast, and while in the rain village Jiraiya thinks he'd have been fried with 3 paths active by his oil and fire jutsu. This just seems like it becomes inconsistent if we look for more examples.
Click to expand...
Pain doesn't get hit by all of the Bijuu Bomb, only partially, he was to the side, it's why we don't say he scales to it fully, from what I can recall. We'd have to compare the surface area affected
 
VSBAttleRules:

“Calc stacking refers to the practice of using results from one calculation in order to calculate other feats. Usually, calc stacking is believed to be flawed, so that calculations that use it should be disregarded almost always.”

“The reason it is usually disregarded is because it has shown itself to be inconsistent many times and usually gives inflated results. Through the method any long-running franchises could also scale their stats infinitely upwards without actually ever showing any feats in the range they are listed.”

“Only parameters that can’t change between calculations can be re-purposed.”

“When dealing with a feat that is heat related only, we can still manage to find Destructive capacity, by finding the given temperature of the object in question, estimate or calculate its surface area and emissivity, and apply the values to the following Calculator… It is usually assumed that only 1 second of the calculated joules per second value contributes to the attack potency, or less if the object only had that heat for less than one second.”
Click to expand...

The only acceptable path is to calculate Amaterasu’s own feats directly (its own temperature/destruction), or to argue qualitative comparability through proper powerscaling BUT never by importing the Bijuu Bomb’s number.

Or if the author/verse explicitly stated the two abilities have equal energy output, or if a UES with proven proportional scaling tied them together, a qualitative comparison could be argued.

But even then, transplanting the exact calc’d value would remain disallowed by VSbattle standard rules, only the tier-level “comparable” assessment would be on the table.
 
What's being calc stacked here? There's one calculation being done, using another as a reference for it.
 
Foriaa said:
I'm not even trying to be disrespectful here, but are you actually reading the scan you sent. B isn't fully transformed in that panel, that his hand blocking Itachi's jutsu.

I only want to grant the scaling to full Biijuufication and their Jins in V2
Click to expand...
I never said he was fully transformed.
 
Yea, I'm not arguing for partial transformation aside from v2 having that resistance.
 
If these higher values are not accepted, the accepted temperature for vaporizing granite is 3095°C; this would be the minimum for any Bijuu Dama (if that figure isn't already being used).
 
Foriaa said:
Not at all what I'm saying, read here :
The comparison being made is that explosions release energy in different forms: shockwaves, heat, radiation, etc. This does not mean that Bijuu Bombs are nukes themselves. What the formula is figuring out is how much thermal energy is present within the affected volume, which is then used to estimate the effective temperature of the blast.

Bijuu Bombs are generally treated as vape, meaning that every cubic centimeter of what they come into contact with gets sublimated into gas, which would likely increase the temperature value, if anything.


fb809310849c.jpeg

Sits on Madara's armor with no implication of melting happening
Click to expand...
Meteor's vaporize rock to and their nowhere near 1 million degrees
 
Please cite the contradiction. If Mei's lava release isn't shown to produce that much heat, we can remove it.
 
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