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MICHAEL/LUCIFER REVISION

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matt said that because the endless are biproducts of michael and lucifers creation, they do have conceptual manipulation, so i think it should be added
 
https://twitter.com/TheGreatBGA/status/833564808385425408

The creator is more of an aspect of the presence . He is not the god himself . The voice that appears in phantom stranger is infinitesimal aspect of the presence .

And also morrison never hinted the Presence to be an aspect of Primal monitor or referred to Primal Monitor as the god .

" Beyond that crumbling ledge in Monitor-World, those concepts don't exist and it's all non-dual Monitor mind, or God, or Kirby's Source, in which all contradictions are resolved into unity. "
 
I think Matthew and Ant already said that statements like these shouldn't be taken seriously.
 
and how come you cant edit profiles? arent you a staff member?

or maybe only top tier staffs can edit profiles, like antvasima... idk
 
He only has his mobile phone at the moment. His computer needs to be repaired.
 
Here's a list of all powers Lucifer should have:

Superhuman Physical Characteristics, Abstract Existence, Conceptual Embodiment, Non-Corporeal, Intangibility, Immortality (Types 1, 3, 4, 10), Transduality (Transcends The Endless and Creation), Regenerationn (True-Godly; Was inflicted infinite deaths simultaneously by The Basanos and shrugged it off, Exists outside Death of the Endless' grasp), Concept Manipulation, Creation and Destruction (Literally created The Endless as a side-effect of shaping Creation, and can destroy them should he wish), Reality Warping, Spatial Manipulation, Time Manipulation, Chaos Manipulation (Wielded and shaped the Primordials energy from which all was Created), Energy Manipulation, Matter Manipulation, Soul Manipulation, Dream Manipulation, Biological Manipulation, Existence Erasure, Void Manipulation, Life & Death Manipulation, Flight, Shapeshifting, Teleportation, Telekinesis, Telepathy, Light Manipulation, Fire Manipulation, Godly Magic, Nigh-Omniscience, Cosmic Awareness, Precognition, Immunity to Fate Manipulation (Exists outside Destiny himself and even burned Destiny's book), Power Nullification
 
Okay. I will insert them.
 
I have tried to fix it. Sorry that it took a while. I am on a trip with my family.
 
I do not think that we have a page for that.
 
You should read his profile to know why he has the Law Manipulation...
 
Matthew Schroeder said:
Here's a list of all powers Lucifer should have:
Superhuman Physical Characteristics, Abstract Existence, Conceptual Embodiment, Non-Corporeal, Intangibility, Immortality (Types 1, 3, 4, 10), Transduality (Transcends The Endless and Creation), Regenerationn (True-Godly; Was inflicted infinite deaths simultaneously by The Basanos and shrugged it off, Exists outside Death of the Endless' grasp), Concept Manipulation, Creation and Destruction (Literally created The Endless as a side-effect of shaping Creation, and can destroy them should he wish), Reality Warping, Spatial Manipulation, Time Manipulation, Chaos Manipulation (Wielded and shaped the Primordials energy from which all was Created), Energy Manipulation, Matter Manipulation, Soul Manipulation, Dream Manipulation, Biological Manipulation, Existence Erasure, Void Manipulation, Life & Death Manipulation, Flight, Shapeshifting, Teleportation, Telekinesis, Telepathy, Light Manipulation, Fire Manipulation, Godly Magic, Nigh-Omniscience, Cosmic Awareness, Precognition, Immunity to Fate Manipulation (Exists outside Destiny himself and even burned Destiny's book), Power Nullification
Click to expand...
will michael also get these powers?
 
Well, I will add Law Manipulation to Lucifer's page, but it took a long while to insert all of the other ones yesterday, and I am going to be busy IRL today, so I would appreciate if somebody else could update Michael's page.
 
Antvasima said:
Well, I will add Law Manipulation to Lucifer's page.
Click to expand...
whats the reason for lucifer having law manipulation?

he obviously has it, but i cant think of the specific reason or feat that proves he has it
 
Well, he helped to create all of existence, and to set its laws into effect, but maybe that is a bad justification.
 
i think thats fine. since lucifer is the one who "shaped" the multiverse, he most likely shaped the laws as well.
 
Okay. I will mention this in his page.
 
thanks.

and sorry for bothering you again, but why does it say in his page that lucifer cant create matter out of nothing? isnt creation one of his abilities? i mean, a 1-A character that cant create matter is very confusing and makes no sense
 
I do not know, but I think that it was stated that only Michael can do so. It seems to be a limitation imposed by The Presence.
 
My interpretation is that "Creating Matter out of Nothing" includes Michael's own energy. Like, he doesn't need to spend energies to create matter. He just does.
 
The limitations are completely bizarre even ignoring the 1-A rating, since Lucifer does have Materialization feats and Michael has Reality Warping feats too.

Maybe the writers simply didn't realize what they were doing.

It's akin to Superman weaknesses which only seem to work when the plot needs him to lose.
 
So, how do you think that we should handle it?
 
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