Mew Revision

[FictionalBlade101]

Considering the fact that Mew can learn any TM, Hm and Tutor move naturally, and what Hax was added to Mewtwo's profile, shouldnt Mew be given the same thing for having just as much, if not, much larger movepool of moves then Mewtwo has?

 

[Azathoth_the_Abyssal_Idiot]

Presumably, yes, I suppose.

 

[TheMightyRegulator]

Mewtwo was genetically altered to be superior to Mew. Considering Mewtwo also cannot shapeshift, something Mew does casually, or turn invisible pretty much proves they aren't complete copies of the other, hence their hax should remain separate.

 

[Azathoth_the_Abyssal_Idiot]

Mewtwo was genetically altered to be superior to Mew. Considering Mewtwo also cannot shapeshift, something Mew does casually, or turn invisible pretty much proves they aren't complete copies of the other, hence their hax should remain separate.

What can Mew learn naturally? I haven't raised one since Gen III.

 

[FictionalBlade101]

Mewtwo was genetically altered to be superior to Mew. Considering Mewtwo also cannot shapeshift, something Mew does casually, or turn invisible pretty much proves they aren't complete copies of the other, hence their hax should remain separate.

True, but it shouldnt change the fact that Mew can learn the same moves as Mewtwo plus much more. Like if Power/Guard Swap, Psych Up, Me First and so on are able to be quanified as legit moves for a VS battle, then any pokemon who can use it naturally should be given the same treatment to be fair. Also are you going by game, anime or manga when u say Mewtwo is superior? I dont know about the manga but Mew stalemated Mewtwo in the anime

 

[FictionalBlade101]

Mewtwo was genetically altered to be superior to Mew. Considering Mewtwo also cannot shapeshift, something Mew does casually, or turn invisible pretty much proves they aren't complete copies of the other, hence their hax should remain separate.

What can Mew learn naturally? I haven't raised one since Gen III.

It can naturally learn any move except for ones like Water Pledge, Grass Pledge, Fire Pledge, the signature moves for the final starter evolutions, Draco Meteor, and i think thats it. It can learn any other move naturally.

 

[TheMightyRegulator]

It can't. It can't learn the special moves of several Legendary Pokemon (Mewtwo being the obvious exception as well as possibly Darkrai though I'm not quite sure of that).

Also, Tms and HMs aren't natural moves, nor are even tutor moves for that matter.

Natural moves are moves Pokemon are shown to know in the wild, though exactly what those abilities are vary between media.

Pretty sure every media depicted Mewtwo as being the strongest generation 1 Pokemon, though this was obviously later contradicted in the first movie.

@Azathoth Mew's original natural moveset was pretty limited, with its only attacks being Pound, Transform, Mega Punch and Metronome.

By the latest generation it received several more moves not unlike Mewtwo, such as amnesia, Barrier, Me First, Psychic and probably much more I can't remember from the top of my head.

Precognition can be added to Mew's profile as it was added to Mewtwo's, but the majority of its other hax abilities it shares weren't accepted (I can't recall if Forcefields were added to the list of abilities?

Of course its ability to transform lengthens its moveset quite a bit, such as when it turns into Ho Oh.

 

[FictionalBlade101]

It can't. It can't learn the special moves of several Legendary Pokemon (Mewtwo being the obvious exception as well as possibly Darkrai though I'm not quite sure of that).
Also, Tms and HMs aren't natural moves, nor are even tutor moves for that matter.

I never said Tm, Hm and Tutor moves are natural moves im saying for Mew SPECIFICALLY it should be able to learn them naturally for it having the DNA of all pokemon. And even if it can't, Mew definitely has metronome which can naturally use any move, with it randomly happening as the only downside. So via Metrenome it can have a ridciclous amount of scenerios. Example: if someone argued Mew being able to use trick room in a VS match, it can just use metrenome and, out of all scenerios, one being it using Trick Room could pop out for Mew.

 

[The_real_cal_howard]

The likelihood is literally one of hundreds. That could and would never be argued. And also on the contrary, Mew could blow itself up via the bane of all Nuzlockers (Explosion and SelfDestruct) or literally kill itself to lower its opponents stats via Memento or to heal a friend via Healing Wish.

 

[FictionalBlade101]

The likelihood is literally one of hundreds. That could and would never be argued. And also on the contrary, Mew could blow itself up via the bane of all Nuzlockers (Explosion and SelfDestruct) or literally kill itself to lower its opponents stats via Memento or to heal a friend via Healing Wish.

Yea it would have both postive and negative effects depending on what comes up, just like a move like Psych Up. Copies both postivie and negative stat changes. But i see your point on how useless this can be as well.

 

[TheMightyRegulator]

There's no such thing as Learning a Tm/Hm move naturally, as the entire process is artificial.

You either learn it or you don't.

No Limits Fallacy. Contrary to its description the user can't even use simple forcefields in-game such as magic coat and barrier.

Who knows what moves it can't learn outside game mechanics.

I also agree with the Real Cal Howard.

 

[FictionalBlade101]

There's no such thing as Learning a Tm/Hm move naturally, as the entire process is artificial.
You either learn it or you don't.

No Limits Fallacy. Contrary to its description the user can't even use simple forcefields in-game such as magic coat and barrier.

Who knows what moves it can't learn outside game mechanics.

I also agree with the Real Cal Howard.

Then why is even the pokedex stating otherwise? Even Mew's dex entry confirms that from scientific research Mew is capable of using all kinds of moves and techniques, which is why they praise it to be the ancestor of all pokemon in the first place:

Why would Mew be refered to what it is if it could only do it via machinery, making it far far less impressive then what its being known to be? I think that when you are saying TM/HM/Tutor moves arent natural moves, you are meaning it in a more in-general way. Im only talking about Mew and Mew specifically about learning them naturally because of it's dex entry and having every pokemon's DNA.

No Limit Fallacy for what again?

 

[TheMightyRegulator]

You're statement regarding metronome was an NLF.

There's absolutely no evidence that Mew can use TMs/Hms without a TM/HM. That was never stated.

It's quite the leap of logic to go from "can use every move", to "can use every move without the things that make this possible."

 

[Dragonmasterxyz]

Metronome is fun to use but is rarely useful in battle anyway due to it being a type of Wild Card.

 

[FictionalBlade101]

You're statement regarding metronome was an NLF.
There's absolutely no evidence that Mew can use TMs/Hms without a TM/HM. That was never stated.

It's quite the leap of logic to go from "can use every move", to "can use every move without the things that make this possible."

How would it be an NLF? Can u further explain please because im not understaning how Mentronome would apply no limit to the move itself, especially if Mew is using it.

As for the other comment, with all due respect, you didnt answer my question. If mew could only learn those moves via machinery, then why it would be refered to as "The Ancestor" of all pokemon? Other than game mechanics, it makes absolutely no sense for it to be called that when it can only gain those abilities through a human made machnine. And no evidence? Is it not helpful that scientific research confirms it can use all kinds of moves?

 

[TheMightyRegulator]

I already did, by explaining that simple moves such as barrier and magic coat cannot be emulated, there is ample evidence that the term "every move" is an exaggeration.

As for your question, it makes every sense. Just because it's an artificial amplification, doesn't mean ever Pokemon can use every TM. Quite the opposite. Even Arceus can't learn attacks that involves punching someone.

Yes, no evidence. As was already stated, "the naturally" was never stated or implied.

 

[FictionalBlade101]

I already did, by explaining that simple moves such as barrier and magic coat cannot be emulated, there is ample evidence that the term "every move" is an exaggeration.
As for your question, it makes every sense. Just because it's an artificial amplification, doesn't mean ever Pokemon can use every TM. Quite the opposite. Even Arceus can't learn attacks that involves punching someone.

Yes, no evidence. As was already stated, "the naturally" was never stated or implied.

Well i guess so. So what your basically saying is that moves like those 2 have never been used by Metronome before then?

Actually if you go by the anime any pokemon can use a TM move. Conway's Dusknoir and the fairy type gym leaders Spritzee when both fighting Ash were capable of using Trick Room, a move that neither one can learn naturally. Heck, Bulbpedia even admits that TM's/HM's dont exist and that there are only a few kind of move tutors at all-http://bulbapedia.bulbagarden.net/wiki/Move

Since when did a legendary pokemons dex entry needed to be that literal? I know the rules here about dex entries for non legends like Charizard and Pikachu for example but for a legendary as well? Given that there specifically refering to Mew's DNA having all pokemon DNA, that was the main reason for scientists confirming it can use every move