[Marvel Comics] Agatha Harkness Profile Creation

[FentyBeauty]

i made a sandbox for agatha harkness here

sandbox before staff evaluation:

FentyBeauty/sandboxagatha

vsbattles.fandom.com

edited: updated sandbox based on staff evaluation

FentyBeauty/sandboxagatha

vsbattles.fandom.com

​

Spoiler: Changes

• separated her profile into two keys, one for her old self (before absorbing valtorr’s powers) and her younger self (with valtorr’s powers), and i also moved all the specific abilities she portrayed after midnight sons to her second key.
• removed pain manipulation: (Inflicts pain upon the Salem Seven) - the scan is vague abt her inducing pain on them, and they seemed confused by agatha’s spells rather than hurt by it.
• removed the scan: (which all happened in the breath between two of Darcy’s words) from her speed section as the feats performed in the scan was possibly due to magic rather than pure-speed.
• changed dimensional manipulation (Shifted the town of Salem from an alternate plane of existence into the Earth’s dimension) to spatial manipulation
• added a description about ebony, below agatha’s standard equipment
• reworded (Using Chthon’s heart as a conduit of chaos energy in her ritual, she was generating the power to recreate the Darkhold and was successful, although it manifested as a living being) to this: (She was able to draw out chaos magic from the manipulated heroes and channel it, generating chaos magic itself in order to recreate the Darkhold and she was successful, although it manifested as a living being) since she wasn’t using chthon’s heart in order to gain more power and to create the darkhold, she was using his heart for the darkhold’s ink instead, and allow the process to work. she was only channeling the chaos magic from the victors of the contest of chaos event, which allowed her to generate the energy to make the darkhold.
• added infinite speed via her holding off dormammu.

i’m a little icky with how her AP section is really long and i feel like some of the wordings for the justifications are really bad but idk how i could reword those so i just need advice on if its good enough or if there should be changes made.

edit: with the help of @Hixkaryana, i made some changes to the wording of the justifications:

Spoiler: New

Contended with the Scarlet Witch across multiple dimensions, though Wanda was weakened by containing Chthon, and ultimately prevailed, Agatha later revealed that her defeat had been deliberately planned.

With the blade she used to stab Korrosion, she absorbed Valtorr’s power from her—who surpassed Valtorr by accumulating power over the years, ultimately reducing him to a lifeless husk. Valtorr, a Splinter Realm lord and a member of the Octessence is comparable to Cytorrak, whose magical power enabled the Juggernaut to wrestle with Nightmare in the Dream Dimension. She then tore Chthon’s heart from his weakened, mangled body. After forcibly sending Clea to the Astral Plane, she briefly battled her as an equal before ultimately subduing her. Using Chthon’s heart as a conduit in her ritual, she was generating the power to recreate the Darkhold and was successful, although it manifested as a living being)

Spoiler: old

Contended with the Scarlet Witch across multiple dimensions, albeit it was clarified that Wanda was weakened due to containing Chthon at the moment, and she was also eventually outmatched by Wanda in the end. However, that was not the case as it was also stated by Agatha that she planned her own defeat.

Should be superior to her familiar, Ebony, who was capable of fighting Mephisto off-panel, long enough to give the Avengers and Agatha Harkness time to escape, and was being described slashing Mephisto down to ribbons until he gained the upper-hand over her. Afterwards, Ebony quickly recovered and began attacking him again. Along with Natalya and Wanda Maximoff, she defeated the abstract being Chaos, who is said to be equal to Eternity. With the blade she used to stab Korrosion, she absorbed Korrosion’s power, who became more powerful than Valtorr through accumulating his power for years and then left him as a lifeless husk, with Valtorr being a Splinter Realm lord and a member of the Octessence comparable to Cytorrak, whose magical powers allowed the Juggernaut to wrestle with Nightmare in the Dream Dimension. Ripped out Chthon’s heart from his weakened and mangled body. After she forcefully sent Clea to the Astral Plane, she briefly fought and matched her, and then managed to subdue her. Using Chthon’s heart as a conduit in her ritual, she was generating the power to recreate the Darkhold and was successful, although it manifested as a living being

Ebony

Spoiler: Equipment

also i was planning to put her familiar Ebony as a part of her standard equipment (or not since she’s an animal and not a weapon) but i wasnt sure about that since in Marvel Voice’s Infinity Comic #96, Agatha gave Ebony away n she isn’t rlly seen with her cat anymore in recent comic appearances so i put her in her optional equipment

more context on her justifications for her 1-A rating:

Spoiler: Scaling to Mephisto

(Should be superior to her familiar, Ebony, who was capable of fighting Mephisto off-panel, long enough to give the Avengers and Agatha Harkness time to escape, and was being described slashing Mephisto down to ribbons until he gained the upper-hand over her. Afterwards, Ebony quickly recovered and began attacking him again): i wrote that she should be superior to Ebony since it was stated by Agatha panels after that Ebony fighting Mephisto was actually her doing, however she also said that she does not have the power to defeat Mephisto, but since he reabsorbed Wanda’s twins that were supposedly shards of him, she took advantage of the fact that Wanda’s twins were still bound by Wanda’s magic, so by erasing Wanda’s memories of them, she basically dispersed Mephisto or broke him (something like that)

Source: West Coast Avengers Vol 2 #52

Spoiler: Ripping out Chthon’s heart

(Ripped out Chthon’s heart from his weakened and mangled body - Scarlet Witch Annual (2023) Vol 1 #1): I put this for her 1-A due to her basically affecting Chthon (although he was knocked out and torn apart since Darkhold Omega), with him being an Elder God too. in the Scarlet Witch 2023 annual, Agatha implied that the destruction that Wanda would face as a result of her losing control over him would be unlike anything Wanda has done before - Scarlet Witch Annual (2023) Vol 1 #1, which Wanda was also responsible for the Chaos Wave that wreaked havoc across the multiverse in House of M. The Elder Gods are also 1-A based on what Ultima has commented on them in the Revising Abstracts Part 2.5 thread (which occurred before marvel’s High 1-A got downgraded to 1-A).

Spoiler

https://vsbattles.com/threads/revising-marvels-abstracts-part-2-5-of.157896/page-3#post-6004734

sooo i’m not trying to scale Agatha to Chthon and the Elder Gods based on what she did to him, but rather i picked that out since the scan would be fitting for her Outerverse level rating alongside the other Outerverse level feats she demonstrated.

Spoiler: Absorbing Valtorr’s Powers

(With the blade she used to stab Korrosion, she absorbed Korrosion’s power, who became more powerful than Valtorr through accumulating his power for years and then left him as a lifeless husk, with Valtorr being a Splinter Realm lord and a member of the Octessence comparable to Cytorrak, whose magical powers allowed the Juggernaut to wrestle with Nightmare in the Dream Dimension): this feat is 1-A due to her taking Valtorr’s powers since Valtorr himself is a deity that rules over his dimension, the Veils of Valtorr, which is located in the Splinter Realms/Archipelago of Anguish and Redemption, indexed alongside the Dark Dimension and the Dream Dimension. Based on that, he should be pretty close to Nightmare, which is why Agatha would have 1-A for taking Valtorr’s powers from Korrosion. i would like to note she didn’t take all of Korrosion’s powers, only Valtorr’s powers from her as Korrosion was still alive and is still in the Veils of Valtorr as shown in Spider-Man Annual Vol 4 #1. I also wrote that he is comparable to Cytorrak since both of them are members of the Octessence, and in the scan used, Valtorr and Cytorrak, along with other mystical entities like the Vishanti were fighting each other over having Doctor Strange for themselves.

Sources:
“Absorbed Korrosion’s power” - Midnight Suns Vol 1 #5
“Left him as a lifeless husk” - Midnight Suns Vol 1 #4
“Member of the Octessence” - Official Handbook of the Marvel Universe A to Z #8
“Comparable to Cytorrak” - Doctor Strange, Sorcerer Supreme #49
“wrestle with Nightmare in the Dream Dimension” - Doctor Strange #180
“Splinter Realms/Archipelago of Anguish and Redemption” - Official Handbook of the Marvel Universe A to Z Vol 1 12 #2: Mystic Dimensions - From the Journals of Ian McNee

Spoiler: Recreating the Darkhold

(Using Chthon’s heart as a conduit in her ritual, she was generating the power to recreate the Darkhold and was successful, although it manifested as a living being): This is 1-A since the Darkhold itself scales to 1-A in potency according to the Marvel Magic page.

Sources of scans used: “Using Chthon’s heart as a conduit in her ritual” - Spider-Man Annual Vol 4 #1
“Recreate the Darkhold/Although it manifested as a living being” - Avengers Annual Vol 5 #1

 

[LMalone22]

Shouldn't she have 1-A durability she fought an even scarlet witch and lost in the end It should be at least 1-A Even though the battle scarlet witch didn't seem to take it seriously and really didn't want to fight her

 

[HenshinIntervention]

Shouldn't she have 1-A durability she fought an even scarlet witch and lost in the end It should be at least 1-A Even though the battle scarlet witch didn't seem to take it seriously and really didn't want to fight her

Profile looks good but I'm with Malone here, I think it should be consistent enough to be from 5-B to Outer

 

[FentyBeauty]

Shouldn't she have 1-A durability she fought an even scarlet witch and lost in the end It should be at least 1-A Even though the battle scarlet witch didn't seem to take it seriously and really didn't want to fight her

Profile looks good but I'm with Malone here, I think it should be consistent enough to be from 5-B to Outer

okayy, wait so do u guys prefer that i remove the 5-B from the sandbox and just change her stats to outright 1-A? (other than her durability section) because most of her 1-A feats were through prep, absorption, or like sometimes her magic in general, so i just kept the 5-B and the stuff she did to have that rating since they were feats done by her own powers rather than with preparation or other amps in her magic

 

[HenshinIntervention]

okayy, wait so do u guys prefer that i remove the 5-B from the sandbox and just change her stats to outright 1-A? (other than her durability section) because most of her 1-A feats were through prep, absorption, or like sometimes her magic in general, so i just kept the 5-B and the stuff she did to have that rating since they were feats done by her own powers rather than with preparation or other amps in her magic

idk
Unknown physically, 5-B to 1-A with magic? She did fight Scarlet Witch across dimensions but it looks like they were using Magic to amp themselves up. If her magic isn't always 1-A than 5-B to 1-A should work.

 

[FentyBeauty]

bump

i also added more justifications for her gifted intelligence too

 

[Eseseso]

She hasn't used any real demonic magic (since plenty of sorcerers use the Vapors of Valtorr as a normal spell) so I disagree with her having it.

Rest looks ok at a glance, will look more later. Nice work with the profile though.

 

[FentyBeauty]

She hasn't used any real demonic magic (since plenty of sorcerers use the Vapors of Valtorr as a normal spell) so I disagree with her having it.

Rest looks ok at a glance, will look more later. Nice work with the profile though.

thanks for ur input and ya i can remove that from the sandbox, i was trying to find some other stuff to add for that but so far i haven’t found anything yet

should i also remove demonic magic from her resistances as well?

 

[Eseseso]

thanks for ur input and ya i can remove that from the sandbox, i was trying to find some other stuff to add for that but so far i haven’t found anything yet

should i also remove demonic magic from her resistances as well?

Probably, yes. The Hellfire resistance looks good to keep, though

 

[The_2nd_Existential_Seed]

Agatha also manages to temporarily hold off Dormammu by her lonesome. It's from Giant-Size Avengers Volume 1 issue 4.

 

[FentyBeauty]

bump

 

[Excellence616]

Makes sense, i agree

 

[The_2nd_Existential_Seed]

Yeah makes sense to me. Agatha even in Guidebooks is consistently treated somewhat, keyword somewhat, as the witch equivalent to Doctor Strange, and there are definitely feats that suggest it isn't entirely hyperbolic.

 

[Antvasima]

@Qawsedf234 @Firestorm808 @EmperorRorepmeThree @Elizio33 @MarvelFanatic119 @Catzlaflame @Lightning_XXI @Deagonx @Eseseso @Excellence616 @ByAsura @Emirp sumitpo @Quantu @IdiosyncraticLawyer @PrinceofPein @LordTracer @ProfectusInfinity @Maverick_Zero_X @Dark-Carioca @ObberGobb @Elizhaa @DarkDragonMedeus @FinePoint @SamanPatou @Starter_Pack

What do you think about this?

 

[LordTracer]

At a glance, the profile looks fine.

 

[Elizhaa]

The updated profile looks fine.

 

[PrinceofPein]

Looks good

 

[Dark-Carioca]

Seems fine

 

[SamanPatou]

The profile looks pretty good and well done, it has my approval. Personal suggestion, link the latest revision history of the sandbox, and not the sandbox itself, so the same page will appear in the future even if you perform edits to the page for future projects.
Personally, I would add more details for Ebony, in case we want to make hir a more prominent part of the profile.
Also, not sure if it's relevant for the profile itself, but perhaps her change from old to young may warrant two keys and some additional abilities/conditions? Mind that I'm speaking from obliviousness.
Also, she totally should have Longevity listed among her powers.
I'm not fully convinced on Dimensional Manipulation, at least according to what we qualify for this specific label. Perhaps we could replace it with Spatial Manipulation, which still fits the type of feat performed.
Could you tell me more about Pain Manipulation? It doesn't appear that much clear to me that she's specifically inducing pain.
I'm not fully convinced on the first scans for resistance to magic either, in the first she might just have hit with an attack not meant to kill her, while the second seemed just a standard battle.
Very last thing, he speed is fine from scaling alone, but I feel like that scan portrays some example of time manipulation with a sliver of reality warping, rather than pure speed, considering that Agatha seemingly mistook the event for a fraud.
Also, this scan is a clear example of Italian Manipulation, as she summons the holy language to improve on a loathsome english comic

 

[FentyBeauty]

The profile looks pretty good and well done, it has my approval. Personal suggestion, link the latest revision history of the sandbox, and not the sandbox itself, so the same page will appear in the future even if you perform edits to the page for future projects.
Personally, I would add more details for Ebony, in case we want to make hir a more prominent part of the profile.

got it!

Also, not sure if it's relevant for the profile itself, but perhaps her change from old to young may warrant two keys and some additional abilities/conditions? Mind that I'm speaking from obliviousness.

two keys is fine. she did technically grow more powerful since she absorbed another being’s powers so her magic after that should definitely be distinct from everything she portrayed prior to that. she also does have 16 appearances as her younger self so that should be enough for another key too

I'm not fully convinced on Dimensional Manipulation, at least according to what we qualify for this specific label. Perhaps we could replace it with Spatial Manipulation, which still fits the type of feat performed.

spatial manipulation for that sounds reasonable

Could you tell me more about Pain Manipulation? It doesn't appear that much clear to me that she's specifically inducing pain.

i can remove that actually. i just reread fantastic four #14 & it seems like she was trying to do something to her son nicholas scratch rather than directly attack them since she was talking to him, and a few panels before the scan - they were linked with nicholas scratch, so ig whatever she’s doing to him is affecting them?? either way ya i can remove the pain manipulation since they only just seemed confused by whats happening and in the full scan, they just regrouped together and shook that off so it’s too vague for that ability anyway

I'm not fully convinced on the first scans for resistance to magic either, in the first she might just have hit with an attack not meant to kill her, while the second seemed just a standard battle.

i’m not rlly knowledgable on how marvel magic works so tbh i assumed every sorcerer can resist magic on their own level of sorcery or based on if they took magical attacks from others, since doctor doom does have his resistance to magic from taking attacks from wanda, morgan le fay, etc. magik, satana, and selene also have resistances to magic without any justifications. even in apocalypse’s profile, he has resistance to basic magic just for being a sorcerer. so if that’s not the case, then i can remove it

but i do also have these scans from the avengers (2023) annual, where agatha along with scarlet witch n carol get engulfed by the darkhold’s explosion at point blank, which according to wanda, was channeling chaos magic and said energy was being released from the explosion. and then afterwards, agatha was shown fine when she got washed up into a beach sooo maybe that could replace the first and second scans?

Very last thing, he speed is fine from scaling alone, but I feel like that scan portrays some example of time manipulation with a sliver of reality warping, rather than pure speed, considering that Agatha seemingly mistook the event for a fraud.

i don’t think she mistook it because imo it kinda seemed that she was just bantering with her. she mentions during the fight that wanda decided to use dimension-hopping just for the duel so when she snaps her finger, both of them teleport back. wanda does says that everything was real & a few panels after when agatha sneaks into wanda’s soul, she also acknowledges that they did have a cross-dimensional duel. but i agree with you that it might not be pure speed since perhaps their fight seemingly not have happened in darcy’s pov could be due to them going to other dimensions where time might just work differently. in that case i can remove the scan and just have her scale to wanda’s speed via the fight alone

 

[SamanPatou]

two keys is fine. she did technically grow more powerful since she absorbed another being’s powers so her magic after that should definitely be distinct from everything she portrayed prior to that. she also does have 16 appearances as her younger self so that should be enough for another key too

Yes, the minimum of appearances for multiple keys is 15 appearances, so she checks out.

i’m not rlly knowledgable on how marvel magic works so tbh i assumed every sorcerer can resist magic on their own level of sorcery or based on if they took magical attacks from others, since doctor doom does have his resistance to magic from taking attacks from wanda, morgan le fay, etc. magik, satana, and selene also have resistances to magic without any justifications. even in apocalypse’s profile, he has resistance to basic magic just for being a sorcerer. so if that’s not the case, then i can remove itbut i do also have these scans from the avengers (2023) annual, where agatha along with scarlet witch n carol get engulfed by the darkhold’s explosion at point blank, which according to wanda, was channeling chaos magic and said energy was being released from the explosion. and then afterwards, agatha was shown fine when she got washed up into a beach sooo maybe that could replace the first and second scans?

I guess it can stay, the magic page also features natural resistance to it for sorcerers.

I don’t think she mistook it because imo it kinda seemed that she was just bantering with her. she mentions during the fight that wanda decided to use dimension-hopping just for the duel so when she snaps her finger, both of them teleport back. wanda does says that everything was real & a few panels after when agatha sneaks into wanda’s soul, she also acknowledges that they did have a cross-dimensional duel. but i agree with you that it might not be pure speed since perhaps their fight seemingly not have happened in darcy’s pov could be due to them going to other dimensions where time might just work differently. in that case i can remove the scan and just have her scale to wanda’s speed via the fight alone

I was referring to Agatha saying something on the lines of "another of your tricks, uh?"
Anyway, I have the feeling there's some mystical shenanigan involved there, for it didn't feel like the pure doing of two speedsters.

 

[FentyBeauty]

Yes, the minimum of appearances for multiple keys is 15 appearances, so she checks out.

okayy! so if i were to give her another key, would i have to repeat the same abilities she used before she became young? like would i take scans/justifications of her using the same abilities that she used before (in her new look) and move those to the other key/tabber of her powers and abilities and also leave the ones where she demonstrated those abilities while old or would i just leave the whole thing allne without repeating it

like idk how to explain this but for example, in her p&a section she has empathic manipulation with these justifications:

• Empathic Manipulation (Had designed an enchantment that was used as a beacon of hope for the Daughters of Liberty. Forces Moon Knight and Taeguki to fight each other using the chaos magic within Etsium Crystals. Her magic influenced Venom and Deadpool to fight against each other)

her designing a beacon of hope was before she became young, but the justifications involving moon knight, venom, etc were from her latest comic appearances. so if i made another tabber in her powers and abilities, would i put empathic manipulation again (with those specific justifications) in the new key? or would i just leave those in old agatha’s portion of her p&a section so i don’t have to put that same ability again (srry if this is confusing bc i have no idea how i can word this right)

I guess it can stay, the magic page also features natural resistance to it for sorcerers.

okayy!

I was referring to Agatha saying something on the lines of "another of your tricks, uh?"
Anyway, I have the feeling there's some mystical shenanigan involved there, for it didn't feel like the pure doing of two speedsters.

i think thats reasonable. i can remove the scan then, if you want

 

[FentyBeauty]

okay i just edited the sandbox and created two keys for her older self (before her amp in midnight sons) and her younger self (after her amp)

i also added her being able to hold off dormammu briefly in her ap section (for old agatha) + added a description abt ebony below her equipment & put ebony in old agatha’s standard equipment since she has like about 40+ appearances with classic agatha

& i reworded this

Using Chthon’s heart as a conduit of chaos energy in her ritual, she was generating the power to recreate the Darkhold and was successful, although it manifested as a living being

to this since agatha was using chthon’s blood for the darkhold’s ink rather for power and she was using the heroes from the contest of chaos event for her darkhold thing

She was able to draw out chaos magic from the manipulated heroes and channel it, generating chaos magic itself in order to recreate the Darkhold and she was successful, although it manifested as a living being

 

[Hixkaryana]

How many votes do you need to post the profile again

 

[FentyBeauty]

How many votes do you need to post the profile again

i think maybe at least 3 or more? bc its a 1-A character

since i just updated my sandbox thing i probably need them to check it again tho

 

[Eseseso]

For her speed in her first key, Dormammu now has Infinite Speed at minimum

 

[FentyBeauty]

For her speed in her first key, Dormammu now has Infinite Speed at minimum

i fixed her speed section

FentyBeauty/sandboxagatha

vsbattles.fandom.com

 

[Antvasima]

@SamanPatou @Elizhaa @LordTracer @Dark-Carioca

Do you think that this page can be applied now?

 

[SamanPatou]

I will answer properly in a few hours, but my input is indeed positive.

 

[Antvasima]

Thank you for helping out.

 

[SamanPatou]

The new updates are fine.

 

[Antvasima]

The new updates are fine.

@Elizhaa @LordTracer @Dark-Carioca

What do you think?

 

[ActuallySpaceMan42]

Profile looks good.

 

[Firestorm808]

Has this been applied?

 

[FentyBeauty]

Has this been applied?

not yet bc i was waiting for input from the other 3 staff members that ant tagged

 

[Antvasima]

What do you think?

Has this been applied?

not yet bc i was waiting for input from the other 3 staff members that ant tagged

@LordTracer @Elizhaa

Do you find the updates here acceptable?

 

[LordTracer]

I think if her AP is separated into tabbers, then her other keys should be as well, just so the formatting is consistent.

If that gets fixed, then I think the profile will be good to go.

 

[FentyBeauty]

I think if her AP is separated into tabbers, then her other keys should be as well, just so the formatting is consistent.

If that gets fixed, then I think the profile will be good to go.

i fixed it!

i didnt know what to do w her stamina and intelligence tho since it wasnt separated like the others so i left it the same for both tabbers

FentyBeauty/sandboxagatha

vsbattles.fandom.com

 

[LordTracer]

i fixed it!

i didnt know what to do w her stamina and intelligence tho since it wasnt separated like the others so i left it the same for both tabbers

FentyBeauty/sandboxagatha

vsbattles.fandom.com

Looks good.

 

[FentyBeauty]

okayy i created the profile, this thread can be closed

Agatha Harkness (Marvel Comics)

Agatha Harkness is a powerful witch, and an expert in the mystic arts. She had existed during historical times, such as the Salem witch trials.[1] She formed her own coven to find ways to practice magic in the New World. Agatha possesses centuries of magical knowledge and prowess. She then came...

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