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Maou Gakuin Discussion Thread

Alright I read the entire thing, idk about context but if I understood properly the argument is that the God of Traces has Qualitative superiority over the traces (His dream) with anything happening in his dream being incapable of affecting him or the reality he exists in correct ?
Now somethings I wanna talk about and again not rlly versed in MGK or the tiering system so the only counter I can think of is that
- This looks like a downward flow, kinda like a normal human doesn't get QS for creating a video game so this might affect some stuff potentially

Also another thing is that “Is it possible for your main body to be somehow affected whilst inside the dream ?”

Anyways best of luck with this.
 
Alright I read the entire thing, idk about context but if I understood properly the argument is that the God of Traces has Qualitative superiority over the traces (His dream) with anything happening in his dream being incapable of affecting him or the reality he exists in correct ?
Now somethings I wanna talk about and again not rlly versed in MGK or the tiering system so the only counter I can think of is that
- This looks like a downward flow, kinda like a normal human doesn't get QS for creating a video game so this might affect some stuff potentially

Also another thing is that “Is it possible for your main body to be somehow affected whilst inside the dream ?”

Anyways best of luck with this.
It's not creating video game like stuff. LOT is a Domain which is stated to be miniature copies of the world. Whatever it's in there is real.

Though not really sure about what hyper is proposing. I gotta think it over so no comments on that. Anyway everything in LOT real things.
 
It's not creating video game like stuff. LOT is a Domain which is stated to be miniature copies of the world. Whatever it's in there is real.
I should make a thing for that, cause the traces are real in the LOT, since they are able to interact with the source but it's just that it is of no real consequence to beings outside of the LOT.
 
It's not creating video game like stuff. LOT is a Domain which is stated to be miniature copies of the world. Whatever it's in there is real.

Though not really sure about what hyper is proposing. I gotta think it over so no comments on that. Anyway everything in LOT real things.
So it's just a copy of stuff from the past ? Doesn't that invalidate R>F or QS ?
 
Trying to see if I have enough evidence for this, would anyone be able to look over it to see if there's anything wrong with it? I'm just trying to get the idea for the foundational justification for R>F existing, maybe we could get this going. Maybe even help add some context to solidify it

Perhaps Anos's journey to greatness is getting shorter.
Also, are the Land of Traces that Arcana saw in his dream different from the Land of Traces that Anos destroyed?
 
So it's just a copy of stuff from the past ? Doesn't that invalidate R>F or QS ?
It's not really a copy in the literal sense, just not the real deal. Because it is real in the LOT, just not the actual thing it is recording.

So it is stated that those things are the things that the traces record, it's just they are not the present things therefore less "real" then the actual objects of the traces. I only use the term "copy" since it's easier to understand in the framework of R>F. It's like history books, those events occurred, but the items/people in the text are not the actual people/items, since the records only showcase their prior forms, not current.

So when the book of traces materializes the objects/spells from the traces, it is the real deal, but the present spell/item can become stronger than the past. For example Egil Grone Angdroa was a world destroying spell, however since Anos' source was being destroyed by the trace of it, it pushed his source farther to destruction and then overcame that and thus he became stronger. So if he sent another Egil Grone Angdroa at THAT point, it would most likely be far more powerful than any trace of it since the traces only cover the past versions.
 
Perhaps Anos's journey to greatness is getting shorter.
Also, are the Land of Traces that Arcana saw in his dream different from the Land of Traces that Anos destroyed?
Yeah, same place. It even states so;
- Volume 6, Chapter 37
I cast my eyes across the kingdom to see a point with no magic towards the west. It was two hundred kilometers away from where I was, at the ruins of Ligalondrol. I flew west using Fless at my highest speed and arrived above Ligalondrol in no time at all.
The Divine Dragon’s song echoed in multiple voices at a deafening volume. I descended and smashed through the door, charging into the underground ruins. I went down deeper and deeper, but unlike the last time we were here, there was no end in sight.
Eventually, despite being inside the ruins, a sky appeared before me. A dome stretched out overhead. It was the same wasteland I had witnessed in the God of Traces’ dream: an endless space with bookshelves extending into the horizon. At the center of the bookshelves was a robed god with a book in his hand—it was Revalschned, the God of Traces.
 
Yeah, same place. It even states so;
That's a bit concerning, because right now Anos isn't in a dream and is using a real-world body, but when he enters LoT (a dream), LoT doesn't collapse. I remember there was an anti-feat where character 1A descended to a lower realm and that realm didn't collapse.
 
That's a bit concerning, because right now Anos isn't in a dream and is using a real-world body, but when he enters LoT (a dream), LoT doesn't collapse. I remember there was an anti-feat where character 1A descended to a lower realm and that realm didn't collapse.
Care to elaborate? Cause are you saying the in 38 when he fights the god of traces, that he is using a real world body and isn't in a dream?

Also are you saying LOT doesn't collapse?
 
On their first trip to LoT, Anos and Arcana had to enter a dream state to reach it, their real bodies naked in the real world.

But the second time, Anos was in the real world and went straight to LoT without dreaming. He was transported into LoT even though he was awake in his real body. This could become an anti-feat, as a real object can enter a dream without destroying the dream itself.
 
That's a bit concerning, because right now Anos isn't in a dream and is using a real-world body, but when he enters LoT (a dream), LoT doesn't collapse. I remember there was an anti-feat where character 1A descended to a lower realm and that realm didn't collapse.
Yea if a 1-A enters a non 1-A realm with their True body and not an avatar it's typically regarded as an anti feat.
 
R>F is always questionable if it only applies to a specific world or worlds rather than “the world” as the entire cosmology or the entire lower cosmology. I have not seen a verse that qualifies for it simply by viewing a specific place as fiction. A similar argument was made in Trinity Seven in the High 1-A proposal, and if it does, then it would be wanked on some level, as @Agnaa made clear.
I was going to Use LoT in order to back up the idea that Gods view the mortal world as something similarly insignificant. Since the Firmament of the Gods encompasses all of the divine domains which are miniature copies of the world. You can also use the Crystal world and the LoT as justification for the Firmament to be Far superior to the likes of the mortal world.

I think when Dilfred was explaining how gods view the mortal world, that wasn't JUST hyperbole or a metaphor, but might be more true than people realize. The order of traces archives things in books to read and manipulate by others. The order of the future is of a crystal ball which is a metaphorical medium for divination and foreseeing through tricks and fake fortune telling.

It's just an observation, I think it being called a dreamworld would add some validity to things if I can prove the Firmament of the Gods is QS to the mortal world, which is my next step.
 
On their first trip to LoT, Anos and Arcana had to enter a dream state to reach it, their real bodies naked in the real world.

But the second time, Anos was in the real world and went straight to LoT without dreaming. He was transported into LoT even though he was awake in his real body. This could become an anti-feat, as a real object can enter a dream without destroying the dream itself.
It seems that maybe that could be true, but also what if Anos was forced to sleep and didn't realize? Cause his second time going into the was not the same, there was no pool of water and the ruins were endless;
The Divine Dragon’s song echoed in multiple voices at a deafening volume. I descended and smashed through the door, charging into the underground ruins. I went down deeper and deeper, but unlike the last time we were here, there was no end in sight.
The thing is, perhaps he was already in the LoT when he flew down. Also gods can open up their divine domain even in the world below, but it isn't the same as it would be in the firmament.
Divine domains were spaces like Ennessone’s Divine City of the Sprouting Palace or Naphta’s restricted worlds. Each scene shown was emitting a tremendous amount of magic power. Being in the Divine Realm meant the gods could make the most of their power.
So Anos being forced into it doesn't contradict anything especially when it was due to Arcana's power that Anos was even able to enter the LoT originally.

Now if you are trying to say that Anos being able to view the LoT in dreams and therefore shouldn't be subjected to having his real body enter the LoT, wouldn't that just be solved by the fact that he isn't QS to the LoT at the time? The LoT is a dream to the god of traces and arcana considering their ability over dreams and memories, not Anos. Anos would only equal to their level of existence because he is a misfit that is a being who defies order passively. He isn't bound to the worlds logical framework which would be proven in volume 8.

In simple terms, Anos himself was a resident of the world, not equal to the gods, but was an existence who could affect them simply because of the being he was, not cause he was on equal footing regarding his level of existence. So this would be more so proving that the beings who DO have the ability to view the LoT as nothing but a dream as R>F and not others. And this would also prove further that LoT is a place viable for R>F cause the god, who resides in a higher realm, the firmament of the gods, had the ability to force someone who isn't a god/being residing in a higher realm, into the place that is meant to be qualitatively inferior to the higher realm, no?

EDIT: Also, we are already given clear understanding the LoT is a dreamworld and is the dreams of the gods of traces, therefore even if Anos was brought into it, who's to say he wasn't in a dream at the time? It was the only way to get to the LoT as far as we know.
 
I was going to Use LoT in order to back up the idea that Gods view the mortal world as something similarly insignificant. Since the Firmament of the Gods encompasses all of the divine domains which are miniature copies of the world. You can also use the Crystal world and the LoT as justification for the Firmament to be Far superior to the likes of the mortal world.

I think when Dilfred was explaining how gods view the mortal world, that wasn't JUST hyperbole or a metaphor, but might be more true than people realize. The order of traces archives things in books to read and manipulate by others. The order of the future is of a crystal ball which is a metaphorical medium for divination and foreseeing through tricks and fake fortune telling.

It's just an observation, I think it being called a dreamworld would add some validity to things if I can prove the Firmament of the Gods is QS to the mortal world, which is my next step.
Hey, how many times before SS God talked a metaphor? Only the actors from Dilfred?
 
I see that wankers wanked while I was away, useless wank as always, wankers need to lock in.
 
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