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Garou vs Lightning

The issue is that one of Lightning's buffs is haste which speeds herself up. Given a few minutes Garou can evolve to match and surpass it, but it might allow her to land a fatal blow early. From what was said above, it sounds as if behaving like a freaking set-up sweeper in a bulky Pokémon meta game is in-character for Lightning, so starting with those buffs and debuffs might be her go-to move.

Garou being able to jump two tiers in a short time definitely means that if Lightning fails to bring him down quickly she's not going to like the massage she gets, but it is still a possibility that she'll land that telling strike before he can evolve.

Edit: actually, there's another concern about the poison. First, I'm not clear on whether Garou resists poison or just had high stamina, and I'm also unclear on what happens if Lightning poisons Garou, then Garou grabs her head and makes her brain burst out of her ears, does the poison stop working, because the caster is dead/battle is over, or does it just keep killing Garou until he's dead too?
 
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Random-Helper323 said:
because the caster is dead/battle is over, or does it just keep killing Garou until he's dead too?
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Poison does not stop if the caster is dead

But then, is inconclusive because they kill eachother but not at the same time?

And don´t forget that this is 2 vs 1, Odin will be with Lightning as his tank, that is his true first move by lore, against Caius? Summon Odin, when invading Cacoon ? Summon Odin, if she is alone, she summons Odin

But Garou is busted, I will vote for him when I see more arguments of both sides
 
I mean also, she can only apply a certain amount of debuff/buffs at a time, so either she goes all in on weakening Garou' AP, all in on his dura, all in on her buffs, or a little of all of them, which would negate the whole one shot thing, because this assumes she max buffs her AP, and max debuffs his durability, which isn't really likely.

Also, there's no evidence this is in character for Lightning either.
 
Cryo123 said:
I mean also, she can only apply a certain amount of debuff/buffs at a time
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She can apply all the important debuffs in a row, the less important ones like having resistance to status not and are completely useless here

And if she wants, she could max only her physical side instead maxing magic and physical and debuff only the physical side of Garou or viceversa
Cryo123 said:
there's no evidence this is in character for Lightning
Click to expand...
In lightning returns when alone, is what she does, using stop and debuffing, this is not LR, but like I say, in a team composition in the game, first thing to do against a boss is buffing and debuffing or the boss wrecks you, the same problem in every rpg, impossible to know what the characters do :rolleyes:
 
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Kazuma_kuwabara said:
In lightning returns when alone, is what she , using stop and debuffing, this is not LR, but like I say, in a team composition in the game, first thing to do against a boss is buffing and debuffing or the boss wrecks you, the same problem in every rpg, impossible to know what the characters do :rolleyes:
Click to expand...
The difference here is that this is the only way she wins... So if its not done in any of her cutscenes or mentioned to be her most frequent tactic, ect, then Garou gets a garunteed win.

Even if it is, I find using her in game pages to be a little dubious at best. Think about it, when you do all of these debuffs to a boss, they can still kill you with physical attacks, right? You don't almost 1 shot the boss by making them take 89% more damage and buffing your AP.

I smell game design here. Could she, outside of game mechanics, in cutscenes and such, spam all of these spells at once, and when she uses them, do they actually have such drastic effects on the other characters?
 
Cryo123 said:
Could she, outside of game mechanics, in cutscenes and such, spam all of these spells at once
Click to expand...
Outside this, she just spams backflips, fire her gun, summon Odin and do cool stuff, 0 use of even her magic so tell me the point of her having 30 types of spells and in cutscenes just using a gun, when the game is about her team developing as c'ieth

Edit: But yeah, vote Garou or call another supporter, because I don´t like this RPG mechanics in battles, always with having 600 options and in cutscenes 0 use of said options
 
RPG characters are a real pain in the butt. If you use cutscenes only, the special abilities almost never come into play and that's if the character does anything in cutscenes other than walk and talk. And often the players figure out ways to use RPG mechanics very effectively, that would be very cheap in a canon battle.
 
Random-Helper323 said:
Sounds like Garou's poison resistance needs to be clarified here. For the evolution vs the statuses, how much stronger does Garou get per individual evolution and how quickly and readily can he make multiple evolutions?
Click to expand...
Gapped a 13x speed difference instantly
Gapped a 15x AP difference instantly
Grew from being comparable in speed to PS to blitzing in .13 seconds
Grew from being near-oneshot to taking multiple hits with little issue
Grew from being destroyed to one-shotting even though he only had an hour of sleeping

There is much more btw.
 
Garou is kinda limited to 5-C due to us never seeing him evolve past 5-C but he will grow in power even if his power is cut in half
 
Spinoirr said:
There kinda is as we literally never seen him jump a tier In his 5-C state without outside help from god
Click to expand...
I mean that's because just as he takes real damage, Saitama puts more power behind his punch and 1 shots him. Kind of different from a limit to his growth.
 
Kachon123 said:
Gapped a 13x speed difference instantly
Gapped a 15x AP difference instantly
Grew from being comparable in speed to PS to blitzing in .13 seconds
Grew from being near-oneshot to taking multiple hits with little issue
Grew from being destroyed to one-shotting even though he only had an hour of sleeping

There is much more btw.
Click to expand...
That would certainly answer at least half of Lightning's status tricks straight away. If Lightning debuffs him by 90% while buffing herself 80%, it sounds like his evolution will instantly bring himself back to normal despite her debuff. And her speed buff from Haste was, I think, 50%, which would get easily overcome by a 13 times speed boost.

At that point, how quickly can Garou evolve again, and alternatively, how likely is he to use his durability negating attacks and blow her organs up?
 
Kachon123 said:
Very likely
Click to expand...
Does that mean it's a likely move early on? To be honest, without having read it myself the scan only shows me that he makes swirling energy shows for Bang and some other old fellow. I was given to understand he has to touch his opponent to make their organs pop. Still, with such a large speed advantage here, he is surely capable of grabbing Lightning in several places before she can stop him.
 
Random-Helper323 said:
Does that mean it's a likely move early on? To be honest, without having read it myself the scan only shows me that he makes swirling energy shows for Bang and some other old fellow. I was given to understand he has to touch his opponent to make their organs pop. Still, with such a large speed advantage here, he is surely capable of grabbing Lightning in several places before she can stop him.
Click to expand...
It's a barrage move.

Garou using it.
Bang and his brother Bomb (old fellow) using it
 
Random-Helper323 said:
I didn't yet, although right now I'm leaning in favour of Garou via speed boost and durability negation. It just took some time to get here because I couldn't get a solid answer as to how Garou's evolution would fare against the buffs and debuffs.
Click to expand...
If he gets reduced by 30%, he would just evolve past that again. It doesn't take much stamina from what we know, so in theory, he could evolve until she runs out of stamina.
 
Kachon123 said:
If he gets reduced by 30%, he would just evolve past that again. It doesn't take much stamina from what we know, so in theory, he could evolve until she runs out of stamina.
Click to expand...
If he can instantly bridge a 15 times AP gap, then her 90% debuff can be countered, and the remaining 60% boost from the evolution narrows the 80% buff she gives herself, and her Haste boost is 50% to her speed, which he counters with a 13 times speed boost, allowing him to show her his true calling as a massage therapist who removes organs.
 
Tural2004 said:
As far as I know we don't scale Orochi to that value. And not to mention, Orochi was holding back.
Click to expand...
Look at Garou's page. It literally says this:

At least Massively Hypersonic (Faster than before), up to At least Massively Hypersonic+ with Reactive Evolution (Is much faster than before and grew even faster during his fight with Orochi. Could keep pace with and eventually outrun numerous of a restrained Orochi's horns, which previously blitzed him
Click to expand...
We do scale Orochi to that value from upscaling far higher from Homeless Emperor, who blitzed Vomited Furher Ugly, who was comparable to Darkshine. Darkshine could outpace Atomic Samurai, who scales above that value.

Orochi >> Homeless Emperor >> Vomited Furher Ugly ~ Darkshine ~ Atomic Samurai > Psykos Beam = Mach 7278

Garou > Restrained Orochi = Mach 7278
 
Wait what? We scale people above "god" blast? How does that make any sense? That speed should be coming from Psykorochi, not Psykos. It also creates a circular scaling because Psykorochi scales above Orochi. I thought MHS+ rating comes from Psyko-jet's mach 5000
 
With that type of evolution, even with debuffs, Lightning can´t do anything, she can´t win in skill, she can´t win in the stats deparment for how broken Garou evolves, we already said that she starting with debuffs is one option, but not her first option (because in cutscenes every rpg character is dumb)

So Garou wins 99% of the time, the 1% is Lightning debuffing and using thunder/poison and one shotting in less than a second (yes, even poison would one shot, it inflicts a bit of damage on impact and that "bit" one shots if debuffed and buffed), the rest of time is Garou adapting or skill stomping
 
Kachon123 said:
Doesn't the lightning and poison have to hit?
Click to expand...
I assume that they instantly appear on you based on gameplay, so is absurdly difficult to dodge if not impossible

I will search a video and post it

Edit: And I know the boss is not moving, but even with enemies that moves around, the spell just appears on your body and follows you no matter the speed
 
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