Espada and Quincy abilities

[Reio35]

All Esapda


Spatial Intangibility with negacion. Creates an isolated space using a beam of light. Within the light they can't be touched because they're in a different space. Negacion can be used by any menos grande which the espada are also.



Sealing with caja negacion and sealing resistance as caja negacion can not contain espada.



Quincy


Gremmy: created a being with non existent physiology (type 1) He could convert himself to a non existent being. Sense,memory,and illusion manipulation in version 3 he can erase his existence from mind and sight. When switching to version 2 he leaves behind a illusion of himself


Lille barro: Law manipulation alters the laws of causality so you can't harm him with your attacks. When he opens his eyes a 3rd time his body penetrates your blade and his shot penetrates your body.

Shun also says normal logic of him attacking lille no longer applies

 

[Deceived3596]

Spatial Intangibility with negacion. Creates an isolated space using a beam of light. Within the light they can't be touched because they're in a different space. Negacion can be used by any menos grande which the espada are also.

Disagree and Agree. Negacion shouldn't be classified as Spatial Intang since nothing is becoming Spatially Intangible by the Negacion, What the ability should be is Light Manipulation and Limited Sealing/BFR only to those that the users sees as an ally but i Agree the Espada (And any Arrancar at or above the Gillian evolution stage) should have Negacion.

Sealing with caja negacion and sealing resistance as caja negacion can not contain espada.

Agree with Caja Negacion point, It needs to be Sealing/BFR and Pocket Dimension Creation since it forcefully sends other into a different pocket dimension and seals them away forever.

Disagree with the Resistance point, Grimmjow directly states that Caja Negacion wasn't created to contain Espada within them which just shows the inherent weakness of the ability rather then Espada having inherent resistances towards Sealing.

Gremmy: created a being with void manipulation he could convert himself to a non existent being. Mind manipulation in version 3 he can erase his existence from mind and sight

It wouldn't be Void Manipulation but rather Non-Existence Physiology (Type 1) which is already accepted on Lee's Profile but i Agree he should have it since he's directly shown multiple times granting himself abilities or modifying his "Existence" like making his skin harder ect, To say he wouldn't have even a possible rating on his Profile for the ability despite my previous statement. Then your blatantly just wrong.

That's just Memory Manipulation rather then Mind Manipulation since he's erasing their memory of his existence from their minds. He also needs Intangibility as well since in Version 2 him erasing his existence from reality makes him become Intangible.

 

[Reio35]

Disagree and Agree. Negacion shouldn't be classified as Spatial Intang since nothing is becoming Spatially Intangible by the Negacion, What the ability should be is Light Manipulation and Limited Sealing/BFR only to those that the users sees as an ally but i Agree the Espada (And any Arrancar at or above the Gillian evolution stage) should have Negacion.

It's similar to kamui where the user is in another dimension so they people can't interact with them. Creates a isolated void of space so plp can't interact with them

Agree with Caja Negacion point, It needs to be Sealing/BFR and Pocket Dimension Creation since it forcefully sends other into a different pocket dimension and seals them away forever.

Disagree with the Resistance point, Grimmjow directly states that Caja Negacion wasn't created to contain Espada within them which just shows the inherent weakness of the ability rather then Espada having inherent resistances towards Sealing.


It wouldn't be Void Manipulation but rather Non-Existence Physiology (Type 1) which is already accepted on Lee's Profile but i Agree he should have it since he's directly shown multiple times granting himself abilities or modifying his "Existence" like making his skin harder ect, To say he wouldn't have even a possible rating on his Profile for the ability despite my previous statement. Then your blatantly just wrong.

Yes i agree with none existent physiology

.


That's just Memory Manipulation rather then Mind Manipulation since he's erasing their memory of his existence from their minds. He also needs Intangibility as well since in Version 2 him erasing his existence from reality makes him become Intangible.

Intangibility could be added as well. Yeah it should both memory manipulation,sense manipulation he makes it so you cant see him and illusion creation he leaves behind a illusion of himself when he shifts to version 2.

Also i forgot to add lille barro. I will make some edits

 

[Reio35]

B

 

[KingTempest]

How is that spatial intan?

That's just a barrier

 

[Reio35]

How is that spatial intan?

That's just a barrier

The light creates a isolated void or space so no one can interact with them. Doesn't seem like a barrier. Yamamoto describes it as being in another world. It's like madaras limbo clones which are in a different world.

 

[KingTempest]

Different world which people can literally look at and communicate with. Completely different from Limbo's.

That's just figurative speech.

 

[Reio35]

Different world which people can literally look at and communicate with. Completely different from Limbo's.

That's just figurative speech.

I mean it's a common trope in fiction. You can see and hear obito even tho he's intangible,sasuke can see limbos ect. Even the databook backs up yamas statement of it creating a isolated space so no one can interact. Anyway what's your thoughts on the other stuff

If it were a barrier you wouldn't be able to hear them either

 

[KingTempest]

I mean it's a common trope in fiction. You can see and hear obito even tho he's intangible,sasuke can see limbos ect. Even the databook backs up yamas statement of it creating a isolated space so no one can interact.

Sasuke can see Limbos via super enhanced sight.

A bedroom is an isolated space because it's isolated from the outside.

You're taking this way too literal.

Anyway what's your thoughts on the other stuff

@ Deceived basically shares my opinions

 

[Arc7Kuroi]

Disagree and Agree. Negacion shouldn't be classified as Spatial Intang since nothing is becoming Spatially Intangible by the Negacion, What the ability should be is Light Manipulation and Limited Sealing/BFR only to those that the users sees as an ally but i Agree the Espada (And any Arrancar at or above the Gillian evolution stage) should have Negacion.


Agree with Caja Negacion point, It needs to be Sealing/BFR and Pocket Dimension Creation since it forcefully sends other into a different pocket dimension and seals them away forever.

Disagree with the Resistance point, Grimmjow directly states that Caja Negacion wasn't created to contain Espada within them which just shows the inherent weakness of the ability rather then Espada having inherent resistances towards Sealing.


It wouldn't be Void Manipulation but rather Non-Existence Physiology (Type 1) which is already accepted on Lee's Profile but i Agree he should have it since he's directly shown multiple times granting himself abilities or modifying his "Existence" like making his skin harder ect, To say he wouldn't have even a possible rating on his Profile for the ability despite my previous statement. Then your blatantly just wrong.

That's just Memory Manipulation rather then Mind Manipulation since he's erasing their memory of his existence from their minds. He also needs Intangibility as well since in Version 2 him erasing his existence from reality makes him become Intangible.

I think this is a much safer interpretation of what occurred.

Edit: I'm not inherently opposed to spatial intang tbf tho.

 

[Reio35]

What about lille barro law manipulation which i just added

 

[Reio35]

Bump

 

[Deceived3596]

It's similar to kamui where the user is in another dimension so they people can't interact with them. Creates a isolated void of space so plp can't interact with them

It's.... Nowhere near similar to Kamui. Kamui sends the user's "body" into a separate pocket dimension created by the Kamui user, This causes the user's "body" that is physically shown to the "Outside World" to becomes completely intangible.

Negacion doesn't do that, when Yamamoto said they were in "Another World" he's talking within the Context that no one present could bypass the Negacion and such effectively making them in "Another World" which is later on shown to mean Hueco Mundo as that was the "World" Aizen and Crew were traveling to. That scan doesn't show Negacion's creating "Isolated Void of Space" at all, it shows Negacion being able to penetrate space which doesn't mean anything since hollow's and their abilities have shown the ability to bend and manipulate Space.

Lille barro: Law manipulation alters the laws of causality so you can't harm him with your attacks. When he opens his eyes a 3rd time his body penetrates your blade and his shot penetrates your body.

Shun also says normal logic of him attacking lille no longer applies

Completely Agree with this.

 

[EldemadeDityjon]

Negacion doesn't do that, when Yamamoto said they were in "Another World" he's talking within the Context that no one present could bypass the Negacion and such effectively making them in "Another World" which is later on shown to mean Hueco Mundo as that was the "World" Aizen and Crew were traveling to.

Caja negacion is also kinda similar. It's pretty much voided space.

I am not sure just saying*. Both sounds familiar

 

[Reio35]

It's.... Nowhere near similar to Kamui. Kamui sends the user's "body" into a separate pocket dimension created by the Kamui user, This causes the user's "body" that is physically shown to the "Outside World" to becomes completely intangible.

Negacion doesn't do that, when Yamamoto said they were in "Another World" he's talking within the Context that no one present could bypass the Negacion and such effectively making them in "Another World" which is later on shown to mean Hueco Mundo as that was the "World" Aizen and Crew were traveling to. That scan doesn't show Negacion's creating "Isolated Void of Space" at all, it shows Negacion being able to penetrate space which doesn't mean anything since hollow's and their abilities have shown the ability to bend and manipulate Space



Completely Agree with this.

Also i think perception manipulation may be a more accurate description of gremmys power

Perception Manipulation

Perception Manipulation is the ability to manipulate one's very perception, allowing one to alter the sensory stimuli received by an opponent. The ability can also be used to amplify one's own perception to greater levels. In many ways, the ability is analogous to Mind Manipulation and both...

vsbattles.fandom.com

As he controls plps perception so they don't notice he exists.

光の内と外は干渉不可かんぜんであり、完全に隔絶された空間となる
Those inside and outside of the light cannot interfere with each other, creating a completely isolated space."

In the raws you see the word "空間" is used which means "space" So it's creating a space where you can't interfere with them. Hence why yamamoto says aizen is beyond their reach. I think this would makes since caja negacion also manipulates space.

If i steelman this point would you agree this may be a form or law manipulation were it doesn't allow anyone to interfere with those in the light?

 

[Deceived3596]

Also i think perception manipulation may be a more accurate description of gremmys power

As he controls plps perception so they don't notice he exists.

He isn't manipulating the "Perception" of others to achieve that effect, he's literally removing aspects of himself from reality that causes others to not see his body or not remember him. So no i don't agree with this at all.

光の内と外は干渉不可かんぜんであり、完全に隔絶された空間となる
Those inside and outside of the light cannot interfere with each other, creating a completely isolated space."

In the raws you see the word "空間" is used which means "space" So it's creating a space where you can't interfere with them. Hence why yamamoto says aizen is beyond their reach. I think this would makes since caja negacion also manipulates space.

That doesn't combat what i'm saying because you're not adding the needed context of that scene to the translation, looking at a translation within a Vaccum without context makes the argument with it unusable because it's inherently faulty.

Caja Negacion doesn't manipulate space, it creates a pocket dimension that locks beings inside it for a certain amount of time depending on the strength-level of the opponent. Nothing about it manipulates space.

If i steelman this point would you agree this may be a form or law manipulation were it doesn't allow anyone to interfere with those in the light?

No because nothing that's related to Law Manipulation falls under what Negacion does as i explained in this post and a previous post.

 

[EldemadeDityjon]

https://vsbattles.com/threads/would-this-be-resistance-to-bfr-or-resistance-to-sealing-or-perhaps-both.123163/

Check this thread for caja negacion. It's unfinished

 

[Reio35]

He isn't manipulating the "Perception" of others to achieve that effect, he's literally removing aspects of himself from reality that causes others to not see his body or not remember him. So no i don't agree with this at all.


That doesn't combat what i'm saying because you're not adding the needed context of that scene to the translation, looking at a translation within a Vaccum without context makes the argument with it unusable because it's inherently faulty.

Caja Negacion doesn't manipulate space, it creates a pocket dimension that locks beings inside it for a certain amount of time depending on the strength-level of the opponent. Nothing about it manipulates space.


No because nothing that's related to Law Manipulation falls under what Negacion does as i explained in this post and a previous post.

Then why is negacion sealing/bfr? How does that relate to it's none interference ability?

 

[Reio35]

Bump

 

[Deceived3596]

Then why is negacion sealing/bfr?

Sealing (which is limited) is from the fact that no-one within the Negacion can actually escape it physically, similar to the people on the outside of Negacion can't actually penetrate it.

BFR is from the fact that Negacion forcefully transfers those inside it into a separate dimension like Hueco Mundo as shown by Aizen and Grimmjow.

How does that relate to it's none interference ability?

Those specific abilities don't "Interfere" with your assertion.

My argument against it was that you weren't using the context of the scene to extrapolate what the statement could mean, you just gave scans/translations within a vacuum and left it as that.

But now after reading most of the Light-Novels. Change my vote regarding Negacion to Neutral since their's a statement within SAFWY that heavily implies that Negacion has some-sort inherent ability that negates people's ability to interact with it harmfully.

 

[speedster352]

I agree

 

[Reio35]

Sealing (which is limited) is from the fact that no-one within the Negacion can actually escape it physically, similar to the people on the outside of Negacion can't actually penetrate it.

BFR is from the fact that Negacion forcefully transfers those inside it into a separate dimension like Hueco Mundo as shown by Aizen and Grimmjow.


Those specific abilities don't "Interfere" with your assertion.

My argument against it was that you weren't using the context of the scene to extrapolate what the statement could mean, you just gave scans/translations within a vacuum and left it as that.

But now after reading most of the Light-Novels. Change my vote regarding Negacion to Neutral since their's a statement within SAFWY that heavily implies that Negacion has some-sort inherent ability that negates people's ability to interact with it harmfully.

So this can mean possible law manipulation.

 

[Deceived3596]

So this can mean possible law manipulation.

Possibly but not very likely since nothing really points to it being Law Manipulation IMO, but hypothetically it could be since i don't know what kind of ability Negacion would be classified as on this Wiki.