Derro and Gargoyle CRT

[Tllmbrg]

Tllmbrg/SandboxGargoyle

vsbattles.fandom.com

Added powers, general clean-up and added a key

Tllmbrg/SandboxDerro

vsbattles.fandom.com

Added powers and general clean-up

 

[Tllmbrg]

@Mr._Bambu @Qawsedf234

 

[Mr. Bambu]

I hate what our spell sections are becoming and prefer my walls of text tbh, even if it is a stylistic choice

Tllmbrg, why do you have a demon on the Gargoyle page

 

[Tllmbrg]

I hate what our spell sections are becoming and prefer my walls of text tbh, even if it is a stylistic choice

I hate working on spellcasters in general, but I'd be dammed if I left their spells a text wall

Tllmbrg, why do you have a demon on the Gargoyle page

It isn't a demon, 4e labels it as a "Medium elemental humanoid (earth)", so I think someone in the office just randomly chose the demonic name for it
Or maybe there's some lore there we never got told about a conflict between the Earth Realm and Abysss idfk, either way it's a legit Key

 

[Mr. Bambu]

Nabassu are Tanar'ri, consistently portrayed as such across all other editions. 4e also, iirc, did away with listing such creatures as "fiends". Either way, 100% against including the Nabassu on a Gargoyle profile, it is consistently portrayed as not-that. 4e would be the outlier here, and as of 5e they're reverted.

 

[Tllmbrg]

Nabassu are Tanar'ri, consistently portrayed as such across all other editions. 4e also, iirc, did away with listing such creatures as "fiends". Either way, 100% against including the Nabassu on a Gargoyle profile, it is consistently portrayed as not-that. 4e would be the outlier here, and as of 5e they're reverted.

I don't think it's a literal demon here Bambu, it's not listed as a fiend in the text either.
I think considering their often minion status and the fact that in this edition they come from the elemental chaos it's more so implied that it's just Gargoyles that serve those demons/have been infused with demonic energy

Also it's a separate entity from the regular Gargoyle, idk how it's inconsistent for a unique variant to be something else when accounting for editions

 

[Mr. Bambu]

Well I think considering the 4e book called the Demonomicon lists them as Demons they're probably still Demons but that's just me. The text also refers to them as demons:

4e somewhat changed the lore but these are absolutely the same guys from other editions. So, I'm against having them on the Gargoyle page. Even if we were to try and argue that "ah well, common origin, they're gargoyles really", at that point we're arguing...

• All Devils are Angels
• All Undead are also their previous forms
• Etc etc etc

They're called demons, they're demons.

 

[Tllmbrg]

Off the lore here it seems like Nabassu Gargoyles are Elemental corrupted into a demonic creature, so why can't they be a key even if they're demons?
You were okay with Girallons having a key for something where they're a devil/breed to be a different creature type then they originally were

 

[Mr. Bambu]

The difference for the Girallon would be that the Girallon is a normal creature who was at some point given an infernal variant, whereas the Nabassu you're trying to argue for has more or less no lore even in the edition you're using, and in all other editions is presented vastly differently.

 

[Tllmbrg]

The difference for the Girallon would be that the Girallon is a normal creature who was at some point given an infernal variant, whereas the Nabassu you're trying to argue for has more or less no lore even in the edition you're using, and in all other editions is presented vastly differently.

No???
Even in your own scans it's noted that Nabassu Gargoyles are a result of Orcus were corrupted from elementals to demons when he became a demon lord.
Dragon Magazine 423 further elaborates and says Gargoyles are mallable, with many being corrupted by Orcus which is how you get the Nabassu variant.
So no, they have lore in this edition and are a variant of the regular one who got infused with demonic energy

Btw I added additional limbs as a power and the fact they can be made from different materials due to missing it before hand

 

[Mr. Bambu]

No???
Even in your own scans it's noted that Nabassu Gargoyles are a result of Orcus were corrupted from elementals to demons when he became a demon lord.
Dragon Magazine 423 further elaborates and says Gargoyles are mallable, with many being corrupted by Orcus which is how you get the Nabassu variant.
So no, they have lore in this edition and are a variant of the regular one who got infused with demonic energy

Btw I added additional limbs as a power and the fact they can be made from different materials due to missing it before hand

...Yes?

The Girallon is an established monster, the Nabassu was established as a demon and, in 4e, given lore that was later removed (no reference to Gargoyles exists as of 5e, nor, to my knowledge, before).

You're well aware of the inconsistencies of 4e's lore compared to others and our standards regarding it.

 

[Tllmbrg]

Alright after discussing over Discord the matter we agreed to remove the Nabassu Key
However two other Keys were added instead that of Rock Thrower and Rocktempest

 

[Qawsedf234]

The key section needs to be updated for the Gargoyles.

 

[Tllmbrg]

Changed
Can I apply this CRT?

 

[LephyrTheRevanchist]

Well, since the issue got resolved (sorry for not seeing it earlier btw), I agree with the update.

 

[Qawsedf234]

Can I apply this CRT?

I think you can since I don't see any glaring issues at the moment.

 

[Tllmbrg]

All applied, this CRT can be closed