Danganronpa Revisions

[Queen_Dasania]

I have a few revisions I wish to propose for the Danganronpa verse. I decided it would be quicker to put it all in one revision thread.

First off:

1. Hina should move up to subsonic with hypersonic+ reactions
I say this because her brother Yuta can move his arms so fast when he's swimming that they appear to be a blur. It seems generally agreed upon that things appearing as a blur tend to be subsonic. So if he can move his arms that fast, his combat speed should be subsonic. Thus applies to Hina since we know through implication that she's a faster swimmer. As a bit of potential backing evidence, I made this calc for Hina's speed, and if the high end was accepted, it would be subsonic

2. K1-B0 and the exisals should be moved down to supersonic
It's only a little below where they are now. They're at supersonic+ for dodging bullets, but that seems like weak evidence to me. Yasuhiro dodged bullets and was at superhuman. There's no calcs for Keebo dodging bullets, and many of the bullets just flat out seem to miss. That being said, I did several calcs for Keebo, but the fastest calc is supersonic. It's close to where's he at now, and would have evidence behind it if the calc is accepted. He could reasonably dodge bullets at this speed

3. Keebo and Gonta should be placed on peak human lifting strength
They currently are on the placeholder superhuman area. However, I did some calcs for Gonta's lifting strength, and if those are accepted, it would really just find a more solid placement for Gonta. Keebo should at least scale to this. He doesn't scale to the exisals, but should scale to Gonta at the very least.

4. Akane should be moved down to class 1 lifting strength
Akane is stated to be class 5 because she should be superior to Shirokuma, but we don't see any evidence that she should lift more than him. Sure her speed, ap, and durability are higher, but that doesn't immediately mean lifting strength too. If anything, we know through the pillar she failed to lift that she can't be above class 1 (if that calc is accepted)

5. Kokichi should be moved to wall level
Kokichi knocked over and stunned Kaito with his punch. Sure he didn't overpower him, and Kaito was weakened, but people were asking Kaito if he was ok, clearly Kokichi hit him hard. To add to this, if we apply the kinetic energy equation to Kokichi, he should be able to hit at wall level, though not as high as Kaito and Ryoma's accepted ap.

6. Ibuki and Izuru should have transonic attack speed
They both use soundwaves to attack, so this one is self explanatory. It's an especially important addition for Ibuki since it's higher than her speed

 

[Queen_Dasania]

Bump

 

[Rau]

1- blurring something doesn't give subsonic speed. The same logic becomes blurred if you wave your hand quickly. subsonic is best suited for Transonic.

I need to watch the 2nd scene There can be many explanations for this.

3- I agree

4- Absolutely not.

5- Kokichi is already higher than the wall level.

6- This attack is aimed at sound manipulation, not speed.

 

[Queen_Dasania]

1- blurring something doesn't give subsonic speed. The same logic becomes blurred if you wave your hand quickly. subsonic is best suited for Transonic.

I need to watch the 2nd scene There can be many explanations for this.

3- I agree

4- Absolutely not.

5- Kokichi is already higher than the wall level.

6- This attack is aimed at sound manipulation, not speed.

1. I'd probably agree, in the end. It is a shady result, and obviously he's moving his hands far faster than any human could, but superhuman hand movement is already plenty fast for this to be reasonable. And the calc is from the anime, which I've heard is treated as less Canon on here, and I think the high end would be considered Calc stacking. Every other end is superhuman. So unless anyone else sees merit in raising her speed, I'd agree she should probably stay where she's at.

2. I'm not sure if you were replying to the Kiibo speed thing here, but if so, what is a possible explanation for the supersonic+?

3. Good. We just need more opinions on this

4. I would still argue this point. We've only seen a class 5 lifting feat from a Monokuma unit. No one has shown to be lifting strength stronger than them, we just assume they should be. I'd still accept this for most people, except Akane, who failed to perform a class 1 feat. She also is far below Nekomaru, as she has never beat him, so it would be reasonable to assume her lifting is below the other multi city block level people, who seem to be higher than her

5. Kokichi with exisals is, but base Kokichi is human level, unless it's changed since I made this. And I'm arguing base Kokichi should be wall level

6. Hm ok, I see

 

[Adem_Warlock69]

Agree with Supersonic Keebo

 

[Rau]

1. I'd probably agree, in the end. It is a shady result, and obviously he's moving his hands far faster than any human could, but superhuman hand movement is already plenty fast for this to be reasonable. And the calc is from the anime, which I've heard is treated as less Canon on here, and I think the high end would be considered Calc stacking. Every other end is superhuman. So unless anyone else sees merit in raising her speed, I'd agree she should probably stay where she's at.

2. I'm not sure if you were replying to the Kiibo speed thing here, but if so, what is a possible explanation for the supersonic+?

3. Good. We just need more opinions on this

4. I would still argue this point. We've only seen a class 5 lifting feat from a Monokuma unit. No one has shown to be lifting strength stronger than them, we just assume they should be. I'd still accept this for most people, except Akane, who failed to perform a class 1 feat. She also is far below Nekomaru, as she has never beat him, so it would be reasonable to assume her lifting is below the other multi city block level people, who seem to be higher than her

5. Kokichi with exisals is, but base Kokichi is human level, unless it's changed since I made this. And I'm arguing base Kokichi should be wall level

6. Hm ok, I see

1- As I said, here is the maximum transonic speed. Hypersonic+ certainly can't.
4- It would be wrong to put it a little lower than that just because it can't be eaten.
5- agree with kokichi base wall level

 

[Queen_Dasania]

1- As I said, here is the maximum transonic speed. Hypersonic+ certainly can't.
4- It would be wrong to put it a little lower than that just because it can't be eaten.
5- agree with kokichi base wall level

1. Hypersonic+ is just where her reactions are currently listed. The change I was suggested would just bring her to subsonic, but my mind has changed on that, so she'd just stay where she's at

4. Then how would you explain her failing to perform a class 1 feat? Obviously the calc hasn't been approved yet, and even small measurement mistakes can change a feat, so perhaps it was a higher feat. But if it was indeed class 1, it would be weird if she couldn't lift it, and we're expected to believe she's class 5

 

[StrymULTRA]

Lemme check a lot of this, because it seems sus af in most of the parts.

 

[Rau]

1. Hypersonic+ is just where her reactions are currently listed. The change I was suggested would just bring her to subsonic, but my mind has changed on that, so she'd just stay where she's at

4. Then how would you explain her failing to perform a class 1 feat? Obviously the calc hasn't been approved yet, and even small measurement mistakes can change a feat, so perhaps it was a higher feat. But if it was indeed class 1, it would be weird if she couldn't lift it, and we're expected to believe she's class 5

1- As I said, blurring does not give subsonic.

4- What is your defense in short? Akane is already class5 in her profile.

 

[Queen_Dasania]

1- As I said, blurring does not give subsonic.

4- What is your defense in short? Akane is already class5 in her profile.

1. Exactly, I agree now. That's why I'm saying I've changed my mind

4. Akane failed to perform a feat that seems to be class 1. That should cancel out assuming that her lifting strength should be higher than a standard Monokuma unit due to her ap and speed being higher

 

[Queen_Dasania]

Lemme check a lot of this, because it seems sus af in most of the parts.

Please do! That's what this site is for, after all. And my mind has been changed on two of these, so it's possible I'm wrong

 

[Rau]

1. Exactly, I agree now. That's why I'm saying I've changed my mind

4. Akane failed to perform a feat that seems to be class 1. That should cancel out assuming that her lifting strength should be higher than a standard Monokuma unit due to her ap and speed being higher

4- ap and speed do not give lift force. Being stronger than the standard monokuma unit makes it class 5. it's already written in this vsb profile. Akane Owari can't remove a column even with help. this calc is wrong on one side and right on the other hand. The density of concrete cannot be given a feat without knowing its weight.

 

[Queen_Dasania]

4- ap and speed do not give lift force. Being stronger than the standard monokuma unit makes it class 5. it's already written in this vsb profile. Akane Owari can't remove a column even with help. this calc is wrong on one side and right on the other hand. The density of concrete cannot be given a feat without knowing its weight.

The profile says that, but it doesn't necessarily make it right without evidence for her being stronger. That being said though, I did take the highest known density for concrete, which put the pillar at 1,196 kg, which would put the feat at class 5, even accounting for Hajime helping. So I'm seeing a bit more how it's not necessarily enough to move her down

 

[StrymULTRA]

1. Hina should move up to subsonic with hypersonic+ reactions
I say this because her brother Yuta can move his arms so fast when he's swimming that they appear to be a blur. It seems generally agreed upon that things appearing as a blur tend to be subsonic. So if he can move his arms that fast, his combat speed should be subsonic. Thus applies to Hina since we know through implication that she's a faster swimmer. As a bit of potential backing evidence, I made this calc for Hina's speed, and if the high end was accepted, it would be subsonic

Okay I guess.

But for the calc you need evalutation.

2. K1-B0 and the exisals should be moved down to supersonic
It's only a little below where they are now. They're at supersonic+ for dodging bullets, but that seems like weak evidence to me. Yasuhiro dodged bullets and was at superhuman. There's no calcs for Keebo dodging bullets, and many of the bullets just flat out seem to miss. That being said, I did several calcs for Keebo, but the fastest calc is supersonic. It's close to where's he at now, and would have evidence behind it if the calc is accepted. He could reasonably dodge bullets at this speed

3. Keebo and Gonta should be placed on peak human lifting strength
They currently are on the placeholder superhuman area. However, I did some calcs for Gonta's lifting strength, and if those are accepted, it would really just find a more solid placement for Gonta. Keebo should at least scale to this. He doesn't scale to the exisals, but should scale to Gonta at the very least.

Fine too, but you need to evalutate it.

4. Akane should be moved down to class 1 lifting strength
Akane is stated to be class 5 because she should be superior to Shirokuma, but we don't see any evidence that she should lift more than him. Sure her speed, ap, and durability are higher, but that doesn't immediately mean lifting strength too. If anything, we know through the pillar she failed to lift that she can't be above class 1 (if that calc is accepted)

Huh... Neutral.

5. Kokichi should be moved to wall level
Kokichi knocked over and stunned Kaito with his punch. Sure he didn't overpower him, and Kaito was weakened, but people were asking Kaito if he was ok, clearly Kokichi hit him hard. To add to this, if we apply the kinetic energy equation to Kokichi, he should be able to hit at wall level, though not as high as Kaito and Ryoma's accepted ap.

Absolutely disagree. We don't use speed for KE calcs unless it's a very specific situation like Flash, otherwise every MHS+ verse gets Tier 7.

6. Ibuki and Izuru should have transonic attack speed
They both use soundwaves to attack, so this one is self explanatory. It's an especially important addition for Ibuki since it's higher than her speed

Scans for that? I don't remember-

 

[Queen_Dasania]

punches KaitoOkay I guess.

But for the calc you need evalutation.

I've somewhat changed my mind here, unless you see merit in the argument. But the speed for blurring does seem like it's possible at superhuman.
And I was told in another thread that the anime is treated as less Canon on this wiki, and that's where the calc comes from. Also, after looking, it seems the high end for the feat would be classified as calc stacking, since it uses the superhuman speed from the bullet dodging feat for the reaction time. So, if it does get accepted, it's more likely a lower end will be taken, which are all superhuman. So I've changed my mind personally on this argument, unless anyone else thinks it could still work

Fine too, but you need to evalutate it.

Yeah, I submitted them a while ago, am waiting for evaluation. What do you think purely about K1B0's supersonic+ based off bullet dodging to be weak evidence?

Huh... Neutral.

I've also changed my mind here, as the weight of concrete seems to vary. Though, i will say that the class 5 rating for the peak danganronpa humans seems reliant on them being stronger than standard monokuma units, which we havent necessarily seen lifting wise

Absolutely disagree. We don't use speed for KE calcs unless it's a very specific situation like Flash, otherwise every MHS+ verse gets Tier 7.

Fair, but Kokichi did punch Kaito hard enough to knock him over, and have people asking if he was ok. Sure Kaito was weakened, but I still find it hard to imagine Kokichi doing that at simply human level

Scans for that? I don't remember-

It's listed on Ibuki and Izuru's profiles. Others have said though that it classifies more as sound manipulation rather than attack speed. I can find specific scans though

 

[Rau]

Scans for that? I don't remember-

Definitely Sound manipulation.

Okay I guess.

But for the calc you need evalutation.

Yes, it needs to be evaluated. but Hina was going really fast on stage.

 

[StrymULTRA]

Fair, but Kokichi did punch Kaito hard enough to knock him over, and have people asking if he was ok. Sure Kaito was weakened, but I still find it hard to imagine Kokichi doing that at simply human level

It literally is. He literally was coughing blood and barely standing, he was not Wall level.

 

[Rau]

The profile says that, but it doesn't necessarily make it right without evidence for her being stronger. That being said though, I did take the highest known density for concrete, which put the pillar at 1,196 kg, which would put the feat at class 5, even accounting for Hajime helping. So I'm seeing a bit more how it's not necessarily enough to move her down

this is a bit confusing but i don't think it should be taken because there is not enough context.

 

[Queen_Dasania]

this is a bit confusing but i don't think it should be taken because there is not enough context.

Agreed. We have Size, but not density

 

[Queen_Dasania]

It literally is. He literally was coughing blood and barely standing, he was not Wall level.

Fair enough. I suppose that, if Kaito was weakened enough, even a human level punch could impact him

 

[Queen_Dasania]

Okay I guess.

But for the calc you need evalutation.


Fine too, but you need to evalutate it.

Huh... Neutral.

Absolutely disagree. We don't use speed for KE calcs unless it's a very specific situation like Flash, otherwise every MHS+ verse gets Tier 7.

Scans for that? I don't remember-

Just an update, Gonta's lifting was approved. waiting on the other, but that was approved