D&D CRT: Specific Character Fixes

[Mr. Bambu]

Howdy. Quick CRT since the last one finished. A couple characters need modifying slightly, I'll post my suggestions and discuss with any willing.

Rad
Rad (Dungeons and Dragons): the page in question. TL;DR Rad's page currently doesn't include his form pre-Immortal ascension (Stephen Amber). This sandbox describes the suggested changes, but as a summary, it adds Rad's Low 6-B, possibly 6-B key and his Powers and Abilities from said key.

That's it, that's the suggested revision, feel free to compare.

Drizzt Do'Urden
His page blows. Drizzt Do'Urden. See? It's awful. This is arguably the most famous D&D character ever, and he has no summary. I haven't read enough on the guy to make it though I can feasibly put one together if need be using the Forgotten Realms wiki, since they source all of their information.

My main issue, however, is his tier. Drizzt is listed as Low 7-B, higher in the Hunter State. However, this guy consistently boxes well outside of that tier in lore (which takes precedence over CR). Drizzt and those comparable to him have, in their careers...

• Fought and killed Balors and Pit Fiends
• Fought and killed Old and Ancient Dragons
• Fought and killed Drow Matrons superior to Eclavdra (specifically, Bruenor Battlehammer cut Yvonnel Baenre in half)

...and almost certainly more that I'm not currently aware of. Essentially, they have too many feats above Low 7-B to be considered just that tier. My suggestion?

"At least Low 7-B, likely 6-C, possibly higher". For all of the Companions of the Mithral Hall, and anyone who would scale to them.

This is the entire CRT, discuss now.

 

[Qawsedf234]

For Rad I'm in full agreement.

For Drizzt were various instances before or after his monk training? Because that may warrant a new key.

 

[DarkDragonMedeus]

This seems fine

 

[Xulrev]

I've created probably the most comprehensive respect threads for several Forgotten Realms folk available on the internet: Drizzt, Entreri, Jarlaxle. I can get Drizzt a proper summary.

For his feats: he has only slain a Balor with Icingdeath, the drow Matron was nearly 1200 years old (400 years older than the longest living drow in history before her) and had been hit with an anti magic dweomer a fraction of a moment before her death, the dragons have absurdly mitigating context (inability to damage them, being the strongest mitigating context), and the Pit Fiend outright killed Bruenor *even when Bruenor was amped by all three Dwarven gods, Moradin, Clangeddin, and Duamothoin.

It took being chosen by three deities for Bruenor to 1v1 a pit fiend and he died in the effort. Scaling anyone above that level is folly

 

[Mr. Bambu]

"he has only slain a Balor with Icingdeath"

His main weapon, no? The weapon is magical sure but that's standard equipment. This reads like "Iron Man has only ever fought using his suit and thus can't be (insert tier)".

"the drow Matron was nearly 1200 years old (400 years older than the longest living drow in history before her) and had been hit with an anti magic dweomer a fraction of a moment before her death"

Granted, discussed on discord.

"the dragons have absurdly mitigating context (inability to damage them, being the strongest mitigating context)"

And yet they died. I don't really see the mitigating context here. On Discord you only really discussed Shimmergloom (I still disagree with your point there and think it hinges on Death of the Author territory), you never really accounted for the Dracolich.

"and the Pit Fiend outright killed Bruenor *even when Bruenor was amped by all three Dwarven gods, Moradin, Clangeddin, and Duamothoin.

It took being chosen by three deities for Bruenor to 1v1 a pit fiend and he died in the effort. Scaling anyone above that level is folly"

Fair.

 

[Xulrev]

For Rad I'm in full agreement.

For Drizzt were various instances before or after his monk training? Because that may warrant a new key.

All but one were pre monk training.

He fights an unnamed Balor in Gauntlgrym post training and redirects a kick back to its own face via some amazing body control/damage redirection and then relies on Icingdeath to slay it

 

[Xulrev]

"he has only slain a Balor with Icingdeath"

His main weapon, no? The weapon is magical sure but that's standard equipment. This reads like "Iron Man has only ever fought using his suit and thus can't be (insert tier)".

"the drow Matron was nearly 1200 years old (400 years older than the longest living drow in history before her) and had been hit with an anti magic dweomer a fraction of a moment before her death"

Granted, discussed on discord.

"the dragons have absurdly mitigating context (inability to damage them, being the strongest mitigating context)"

And yet they died. I don't really see the mitigating context here. On Discord you only really discussed Shimmergloom (I still disagree with your point there and think it hinges on Death of the Author territory), you never really accounted for the Dracolich.

"and the Pit Fiend outright killed Bruenor *even when Bruenor was amped by all three Dwarven gods, Moradin, Clangeddin, and Duamothoin.

It took being chosen by three deities for Bruenor to 1v1 a pit fiend and he died in the effort. Scaling anyone above that level is folly"

Fair.

getting used to the new site, sorry for wall quoting

Icingdeath specifically destroys creatures of fire, and puts them in agonizing pain while destroying their essence. Its more like arguing Metallo only consistently harms Superman due to Kyrptonite, moreso than your Iron Man example for fairness sake.

The dracolich was destroyed by a magic item which blows out the breath of a true dragon; Entreri merely made it follow him under the trap and let the item destroy it. Jarlaxle used an item to summon dead heroes to distract the lich long enough for a trap to be set, of note is that NOBODY could harm the dragon. Same for Shimmergloom, it took a barrel of oil to kill it, only Taulmaril the Heartseeker could even pierce a single scale, Wulfgar had his hammer just bounce off the scales, NOBODY could harm the dragons

 

[Mr. Bambu]

For now I'm gonna discuss this with you on Discord as its faster, just letting people know.

 

[Qawsedf234]

Fine with me, @Xulrev is the Drizzt guy.

 

[Mr. Bambu]

Fine with me, @Xulrev is the Drizzt guy.

I know KinkiestSins was also reading through the entire series some time ago, though I dunno if he's even active on VSBW anymore unfortunately. He's the one that initially showed me the Balor feat.

 

[DarkDragonMedeus]

His current account is @SinsofMan but he is often inactive yes.

 

[Xulrev]

If someone else has read all 36 books I'd absolutely welcome their input. I just benefit from having most every relevant feat scan from those 10k+ pages of material on hand, so it's convenient.

I'll look at making a summary for Drizzt tonight and give Bambu ideas on what would be appropriate for his tiering and abilities that are missing

 

[Mr. Bambu]

As it stands, following my discussion with Xulrev

I stand by Drizzt and co being rated as "At least Low 7-B, possibly 6-C" due to several feats. Drizzt has knocked back the head of a Balor with an (amplified) kick to the noggin, and managed to stab and severely wound that Balor with both of his weapons as well. His arrows have specifically punctured the scale(s) of Shimmergloom. He fought and survived attacks from an Aspect of Malcanthet (though we don't have tiers for that on her profile, IIRC they'd be from 8-C to 6-C depending on the aspect). He fought the marilith that caused all other mariliths to get their name- and ostensibly won. So on and so forth.

I think there's a consistent enough basis for, at the very least, "possibly 6-C" given how many feats exist.

 

[Mr. Bambu]

Lil bump?

 

[Qawsedf234]

Well if Xulrev is cool with it, I think "Low 7-B, possibly 6-C" is something agreeable. Since we can't confirm the strength of the aspect.

 

[Xulrev]

I can abide that rating, given his standard gear does indeed accomplish the feats in question, and then with Monk training he can dura negate highly rated fiends to harm them.

I'll work on the summary soon

 

[Mr. Bambu]

Alright, I'll be posting the new profiles then.

 

[Antvasima]

Is there anything left to do here?

 

[Mr. Bambu]

Waiting for Xulrev to speak on his particular changes.

 

[Antvasima]

Okay. I will unsubscribe to this thread due to time constraints. You can send me a notification later if you need my help.

 

[LephyrTheRevanchist]

Was this ever applied?

 

[Mr. Bambu]

Rad's was, Xulrev is still working on Drizzt's profile I believe but aye the ratings are accepted.

 

[LephyrTheRevanchist]

Alrighty then.

 

[Wdinatx]

Rad's was, Xulrev is still working on Drizzt's profile I believe but aye the ratings are accepted.

Necrothread but I’m surprised this hasn’t been done yet…

 

[Mr. Bambu]

Xulrev is dead and nobody wants to read novels. Shame shame.

If you're interested in helping out, feel free to make another thread, I don't want to bump a dead thread.