Crusch VS Kaizo (7-1-0) GRACE

[V999]

Re Zero VS Power Sphera Universe

• Speed are equalized
• Both are 7-A
• Crusch : 205.4 Megatons
• Captain Kaizo : 137.51 Megatons
• Location : Lifaus Highway

Crusch Karsten : 7 (@VortechsTG, @SatellaTheWoE, @MasterOwOgay, @Success0906, @AThe1412, @Gigi_4_life, @V999)

Captain Kaizo : 1 (@Greatsage13th)

Inconclusive :

 

[Greatsage13th]

Right on schedule.

 

[Greatsage13th]

Their AP would roughly be equal as Kaizo can casually one shot the guy who did the mountain busting feat with minimal effort.

What can Crusch do against Kaizo's energy barriers that he can slam into her?

 

[V999]

This technique could help her:

One Blow, A Hundred Felled Sword Strike: Crusch can create an invisible blade by combining her sword skills with Wind Magic. The blade allows her to unleash an invisible sword strike that which can cut anything within her range of vision.

 

[Greatsage13th]

This technique could help her:

One Blow, A Hundred Felled Sword Strike: Crusch can create an invisible blade by combining her sword skills with Wind Magic. The blade allows her to unleash an invisible sword strike that which can cut anything within her range of vision.

Kaizo's energy stuff has power null. Just the residual energy that came from clashing with his energy sword nullified time manipulation.

 

[SatellaTheWoE]

Their AP would roughly be equal as Kaizo can casually one shot the guy who did the mountain busting feat with minimal effort.

What can Crusch do against Kaizo's energy barriers that he can slam into her?

No, because Crusch is considered a genius in combat and Rowan is exceedingly average. She also upscales from the value

Crusch should be more skilled cause she beat Julius in sparring and he is around Elsa's level in terms of skill
He also has no answers to her Anal precog, Instinctive or her fear manipulation/Aura which would cause his skin to feel like he is burning

About his powernull, can he do so against an invisible attack? Can he even sense invisible attacks?
The attack also spawns on her targets which would mean he cannot powernull it

 

[VortechsTG]

Crusch should be more skilled cause she beat Julius in sparring and he is around Elsa's level in terms of skill

There is absolutely zero evidence whatsoever that Julius is around Elsa's skill level. Just because he can beat her doesn't mean he's more skilled. He has extremely extremely powerful magic and he still is generally considered weaker than her. She's weak to magic and still barely loses to him.

He also has no answers to her Anal precog, Instinctive or her fear manipulation/Aura which would cause his skin to feel like he is burning

This is true.

About his powernull, can he do so against an invisible attack? Can he even sense invisible attacks?

It's literally wind bending so I have no idea why he would even be able to null it. He would have to nullify the momentum of a physical object. It's not some kind of construct like the powers in the clip on his profile. Doesn't look like he'd have any way to see them either.

The attack also spawns on her targets which would mean he cannot powernull it

She can spawn them anywhere there is wind in her line of sight but that's not exactly the same. She should still be able to spawn them right next to him. He will not sense them and then get cut down immediately.

Crusch appears to be far more skilled and has invisible attacks that she can spawn within his barriers. I think she would win pretty easily.

 

[Greatsage13th]

No, because Crusch is considered a genius in combat and Rowan is exceedingly average. She also upscales from the value

Kaizo is one of the most skilled fighters spanning numerous galaxies and also one shotted the guy who causally did the feat with nonchalant slash. At the very least they would be almost equal in stats.

Crusch should be more skilled cause she beat Julius in sparring and he is around Elsa's level in terms of skill
He also has no answers to her Anal precog, Instinctive or her fear manipulation/Aura which would cause his skin to feel like he is burning

Vortech would disagree on the skill part of your claim. The aura would do absolutely nothing when he could shrug off a clash with lightning.

About his powernull, can he do so against an invisible attack? Can he even sense invisible attacks?

He could slash wind attacks just fine from Cyclone. His power null is more or so going to nullify the ability to ignore distance.

The attack also spawns on her targets which would mean he cannot powernull it

He could still observe the direction she slashes and dodge accordingly before she finished the arc or simply summon a barrier to slam into her.

 

[VortechsTG]

Vortech would disagree on the skill part of your claim.

Barely. Elsa is just a step above. Julius and Crusch are still far far far more skilled than Kaizo's profile says he is.

The aura would do absolutely nothing when he could shrug off a clash with lightning.

This makes absolutely zero sense. There is no connection between her aura and lightning.

He could slash wind attacks just fine from Cyclone. His power null is more or so going to nullify the ability to ignore distance.

You realize those are the same abilities, right? You still need to prove both that he could powernull an ability like this and that he would know about it in the first place.

He could still observe the direction she slashes and dodge accordingly before she finished the arc

How?

or simply summon a barrier to slam into her.

Which would only separate them and give her the advantage.

 

[Greatsage13th]

Barely. Elsa is just a step above. Julius and Crusch are still far far far more skilled than Kaizo's profile says he is.

Julius I understand. What's Crusch skill supposed to be like?

This makes absolutely zero sense. There is no connection between her aura and lightning.

The connection is that he had resisted the sensation far more catastrophic compared to burning skin before. He also got oven roasted by fire that are hotter than magma.

You realize those are the same abilities, right? You still need to prove both that he could powernull an ability like this and that he would know about it in the first place.

Yes. He could do it indirectly from clashing or just snap his fingers like in the clip on his profile. He already powernulled elemental powers before on top of something unrelated to them like shadow and time, he does not need to know the content or context of an ability to nullify it.

How?

It's not a thought based attack isn't it? She still has to swing and he could see the trajectory of it.

Which would only separate them and give her the advantage.

Not necessarily, considering he can put her in energy cuffs in an instant after.

 

[SatellaTheWoE]

Julius I understand. What's Crusch skill supposed to be like?

what you need to know is that Julius and Crusch are somewhat relative and that She HEAVILY outskills him here, its to the point where she could straight up predict what he would do just from his intentions and dodge

The connection is that he had resisted the sensation far more catastrophic compared to burning skin before. He also got oven roasted by fire that are hotter than magma.

thats fire and heat resistance, the aura would make him feel pain regardless

Yes. He could do it indirectly from clashing or just snap his fingers like in the clip on his profile. He already powernulled elemental powers before on top of something unrelated to them like shadow and time, he does not need to know the content or context of an ability to nullify it.

he would need to be able to KNOW there is an attack before he can do that, plus it will land as soon as she swings which gives her an advantage because he would have trouble hitting her with her skill and dodging abilities

It's not a thought based attack isn't it? She still has to swing and he could see the trajectory of it.

He doesnt have any scan/power lisitng of him being able to analytically predict smth like that

Not necessarily, considering he can put her in energy cuffs in an instant after.

Flow Method isnt an elemental energy and is more just her buffing herself with her own mana, not exactly smth he can energy cuff here

 

[V999]

 

[Greatsage13th]

what you need to know is that Julius and Crusch are somewhat relative and that She HEAVILY outskills him here, its to the point where she could straight up predict what he would do just from his intentions and dodge

Gonna need more elaboration apart from the prediction that comes from knowing one's intention.

thats fire and heat resistance, the aura would make him feel pain regardless

The point is he already tolerated that level of pain before. So it wouldn't do much. He lacks fire resistance or heat resistance as well.

he would need to be able to KNOW there is an attack before he can do that, plus it will land as soon as she swings which gives her an advantage because he would have trouble hitting her with her skill and dodging abilities

He has AOE with his slashes. She can't do jack against the same AOE that nullifies powers as a side effect. As for how he would know there would be an attack—he can see when or not she swings her sword.

He doesnt have any scan/power lisitng of him being able to analytically predict smth like that

Any swordsman, fencer, duelist and fighter can do that shi—. It's not something that requires an exclusive perk to counter.

Flow Method isnt an elemental energy and is more just her buffing herself with her own mana, not exactly smth he can energy cuff here

Energy cuffs as it's name implies. It cuffs her, it doesn't matter what she had when her lifting strength is only class 5

 

[V999]

Now Kaizo Lifting Strength got massively Upgrade

 

[Greatsage13th]

Hnm

 

[Greatsage13th]

Bump

 

[Greatsage13th]

I'll vote Kaizo for the reasons given.

 

[VortechsTG]

Ok, I'll vote for Crusch since Kaizo wouldn't even know about her attacks before it's too late and he's cut in half. There has been no evidence given for why he would be able to predict and avoid a thought based, invisible attack that spawns directly next to him. Nor has there been any evidence that he would be able to nullify something like the momentum of a preexisting physical object. "He's nullified time manipulation" or anything else like that has absolutely no bearing on this.

Even if he were given prior knowledge, he would have to deal with an opponent who is generally a far more skilled fighter, knows his every move ahead of time, and causes him fear and pain by just being in the vicinity.

 

[Greatsage13th]

There has been no evidence given for why he would be able to predict and avoid a thought based, invisible attack that spawns directly next to him.

Do prove it. It's not even on the profile.

Nor has there been any evidence that he would be able to nullify something like the momentum of a preexisting physical object. "He's nullified time manipulation" or anything else like that has absolutely no bearing on this.

He's nullified flame, fire and water based abilities before that are all physical and not metaphysical like time. So this is of no concern.

Even if he were given prior knowledge, he would have to deal with an opponent who is generally a far more skilled fighter

I asked for elaboration which had not been provided hence invalid as a main factor.

 

[VortechsTG]

Do prove it. It's not even on the profile.

It literally is: One Blow, A Hundred Felled.

He's nullified flame, fire and water based abilities before that are all physical and not metaphysical like time. So this is of no concern.

Which the scan on his profile leads us to believe are just constructs. That is completely different. You need to provide actual scans.

I asked for elaboration which had not been provided hence invalid as a main factor.

That's not necessary. What is on her profile is already far beyond his. But if you're going to insist..

Flow Method

There was no cue to start the battle. Emilia charged without warning, keeping low as she did so. The sounds of firing crossbows overlapped as a rain of arrows tore through the air.
However, Emilia avoided them with a mere twist of her body. The arrows were too fast to track by eye, so she would dodge by reading the shooters’ intent. It was that simple, but there was the question of how many people could do such a ‘simple’ thing.
Surrounded by the sound of arrows piercing the snow, Emilia slammed her palm into a man’s torso.
- Bonds of Ice

As soon as he stepped out of the alley, a single arrows, clad in a gale, pierced toward Jamal.
Jamal responded to it with amazing reflexes, and cut it off with a clash of his twin swords. The impact bounced onto Jamal’s wrist, and his clenched teeth chattered as he laughed like a rabid dog.
The sensation of blood burning, heart leaping, and life boiling, overtook Jamal.
His extreme concentration made the world slow, and he felt as if he could feel every drop of sweat that ran down his skin, every grain of sand that flew around, and even the existence of air that should have been invisible.
Jamal: “――Hahaa!”
One after another, a storm of arrows poured down like a deluge.
Stepping on the ground, swinging his sword as if dancing, slicing the arrows and striking them down.
What ensued was a sword dance, the sword dance of Jamal Aurélie.
- Arc 7 chapter 27

Literally fodder to Crusch.

 

[Greatsage13th]

It literally is: One Blow, A Hundred Felled.

That's not by any means. Thought based. It still requires her to swing her sword. Even the anime stays true to that.

Which the scan on his profile leads us to believe are just constructs. That is completely different. You need to provide actual scans.

Physical constructs. That's enough proof to disprove that he can only affect metaphysical things like time and not something physical.

That's not necessary. What is on her profile is already far beyond his. But if you're going to insist..

Flow Method



Literally fodder to Crusch.

I'm not able to access the document.

As for the 2 scenarios. I agree that Kaizo can't surpass the skill that detects intent (Emilia's showing) but the skill required to dodge a super dense volley of arrows is nothing compared to what Kaizo exceeds. He is superior to BoBoiBoy previously who is also capable of slowing his perception of the world around him whilst maneuvering and dodging magma geysers and danmaku mid air while observing insects and birds. (BoBoiBoy Galaxy season 1 episode 17)

 

[SatellaTheWoE]

That's not by any means. Thought based. It still requires her to swing her sword. Even the anime stays true

As for the 2 scenarios. I agree that Kaizo can't surpass the skill that detects intent (Emilia's showing) but the skill required to dodge a super dense volley of arrows is nothing compared to what Kaizo exceeds. He is superior to BoBoiBoy previously who is also capable of slowing his perception of the world around him whilst maneuvering and dodging magma geysers and danmaku mid air while observing insects and birds. (BoBoiBoy Galaxy season 1 episode 17)

Clearly not as good as being able to count grains of sands and sense invisibility

 

[Greatsage13th]

Clearly not as good as being able to count grains of sands

That's more of superior brain power than anything.

sense invisibility

Like I said. Any man experienced with the blade can parry and strike at a blow directed at them just by glancing at the direction of their swing.

 

[SatellaTheWoE]

That's more of superior brain power than anything.

better ESP and better brain power
yeah thats the feats we are comparing here...
Crusch is better than kaizo at it then

Like I said. Any man experienced with the blade can parry and strike at a blow directed at them just by glancing at the direction of their swing.

true but there isnt anything to parry here, the attack just spawns on him from a distance

Anyways, voting for Crusch due to better skill and her signature attack
imo kaizo would have been at an advantage possibly if he was up against Julius but Crusch jsut has a straight up counter to his barriers

 

[Greatsage13th]

better ESP and better brain power
yeah thats the feats we are comparing here...
Crusch is better than kaizo at it then

ESP doesn't make one more skillful, it simply makes one more perceptive of oncoming troubles. Same thing with brain power. I'd say it gives Crusch an advantage but not so much it would make it completely one sided or too one sided as you suggest.

Besides that, Someone who can easily dash through a volley of exploding danmaku without a scratch is more impressive than simply dodging a volley of arrows.

true but there isnt anything to parry here, the attack just spawns on him from a distance

The clip shows otherwise.

Crusch jsut has a straight up counter to his barriers

She doesn't.

 

[VortechsTG]

That's not by any means. Thought based. It still requires her to swing her sword. Even the anime stays true to that.

Is it true that she often swings her sword? Yes, but not always. It is still a thought based attack. All magic is. In most cases where she does swing her sword it would just look like she missed since she would initially try to get into close quarters.

Physical constructs. That's enough proof to disprove that he can only affect metaphysical things like time and not something physical.

That's not the issue. The issue is that he's not doing something like eliminating momentum or deleting physical matter like would be required. Dispersing constructs made of some kind of energy would be useful if he were up against someone who actually used those instead of just manipulating the air all around.

I'm not able to access the document.

I think my phone pulled something out of the cache on my clipboard from literally ages ago or something like that because I have no idea how tf that got on there. I haven't even looked at that doc in probably years I'll edit it now.

As for the 2 scenarios. I agree that Kaizo can't surpass the skill that detects intent (Emilia's showing) but the skill required to dodge a super dense volley of arrows is nothing compared to what Kaizo exceeds.

As Satella already pointed out, it's more than that, and, as I already said, Crusch is far beyond these two.

He is superior to BoBoiBoy previously who is also capable of slowing his perception of the world around him whilst maneuvering and dodging magma geysers and danmaku mid air while observing insects and birds. (BoBoiBoy Galaxy season 1 episode 17)

Ok, that's far more impressive than anything mentioned hence forth by far. Still not as impressive as Crusch. But that doesn't matter because he would be killed instantly regardless of skill.

 

[VortechsTG]

imo kaizo would have been at an advantage possibly if he was up against Julius but Crusch jsut has a straight up counter to his barriers

I'm assuming you mean arc 3 Julius but even then Kaizo isn't doing shit to someone who can do everything Crusch can do and amp his reactions to hundreds of times their base value and more.

 

[SatellaTheWoE]

I'm assuming you mean arc 3 Julius but even then Kaizo isn't doing shit to someone who can do everything Crusch can do and amp his reactions to hundreds of times their base value and more.

true it did be a blitz-hax stomp (death hax + yang buff + yin debuff gg)

 

[Greatsage13th]

I'm assuming you mean arc 3 Julius but even then Kaizo isn't doing shit to someone who can do everything Crusch can do and amp his reactions to hundreds of times their base value and more.

Why isn't it on her profile? If so she would have had something separate from her supersonic speed rating.

Is it true that she often swings her sword? Yes, but not always. It is still a thought based attack. All magic is.

When we meant by thought based. We mean attacks that can be done without any physical movements but as shown currently and without me knowing any other instance which she can do so without a slash of her sword. This would not fall under thought based attacks.

In most cases where she does swing her sword it would just look like she missed since she would initially try to get into close quarters.

Then she would be at a disadvantage when Kaizo would fare better when she's the one charging at him and not the other way round. He could pull a move similar to her's excluding ignoring distance as shown in the notable techniques and attacks section of the profile named energy blade slash. (He doesn't even need to swing for it to land but only activate it)

That's not the issue. The issue is that he's not doing something like eliminating momentum or deleting physical matter like would be required. Dispersing constructs made of some kind of energy would be useful if he were up against someone who actually used those instead of just manipulating the air all around.

Fair. But the constructs are not even magical. They are just stone, fire, water and shadow. Even the shadow powers are actually based on the manipulation of nano-magnetic particles (at least 5 times larger than oxygen molecules) nanometers and not actual shadows. Hence, it would argueably nullify or at the very least hinder her usage of wind manipulation to ignore distance.

I think my phone pulled something out of the cache on my clipboard from literally ages ago or something like that because I have no idea how tf that got on there. I haven't even looked at that doc in probably years I'll edit it now.

Alright

As Satella already pointed out, it's more than that, and, as I already said, Crusch is far beyond these two.

Ok, that's far more impressive than anything mentioned hence forth by far. Still not as impressive as Crusch. But that doesn't matter because he would be killed instantly regardless of skill.

That would be a stomp my guy. If she just stands there. Thinks. And Kaizo is dead after. The match would be capsized and never added.

 

[VortechsTG]

Why isn't it on her profile? If so she would have had something separate from her supersonic speed rating.

Do you think I was talking about Crusch?

When we meant by thought based. We mean attacks that can be done without any physical movements but as shown currently and without me knowing any other instance which she can do so without a slash of her sword. This would not fall under thought based attacks.

Just because you are not well enough versed in a series to understand it doesn't mean it doesn't work a certain way. All magic is thought based. Period. It's true that weaker mages use incantations to make visualizing it easier but magic is aomething entirely brought forth by the vizualization of one's mind. Quit arguing that it doesn't work like this. You're making a fool of yourself.

Then she would be at a disadvantage when Kaizo would fare better when she's the one charging at him and not the other way round. He could pull a move similar to her's excluding ignoring distance as shown in the notable techniques and attacks section of the profile named energy blade slash. (He doesn't even need to swing for it to land but only activate it)

Why would she be at a disadvantage in close range? She's a swordswoman.

Fair. But the constructs are not even magical. They are just stone, fire, water and shadow. Even the shadow powers are actually based on the manipulation of nano-magnetic particles (at least 5 times larger than oxygen molecules) nanometers and not actual shadows. Hence, it would argueably nullify or at the very least hinder her usage of wind manipulation to ignore distance.

Are all of them made up of nanoparticles? Does Kaizo erase these particles from existence? Otherwise, why would this matter?

That would be a stomp my guy. If she just stands there. Thinks. And Kaizo is dead after. The match would be capsized and never added.

A stomp would be if he has literally no way of beating her whatsoever. She would start with attempting pure melee combat because that's the go to for singular, grounded opponents. It's simply that if she found herself struggling with his barriers then she would use magic.

 

[MasterOwOgay]

Crusch is kinda bad ngl
voting her for Satella and Vortech's reasons

 

[Greatsage13th]

Do you think I was talking about Crusch?

Get to the point.

Just because you are not well enough versed in a series to understand it doesn't mean it doesn't work a certain way. All magic is thought based. Period. It's true that weaker mages use incantations to make visualizing it easier but magic is aomething entirely brought forth by the vizualization of one's mind. Quit arguing that it doesn't work like this. You're making a fool of yourself.

You do know the burden of proof is on you to prove everything you state right? I'm simply giving a fair critique so you can prove you're right. Anyways, do give me an example of the thought based magic at a high level: Emilia, Rem, Roswaal, Betelgeuse, Beatrice and others have not shown it in any of the fights they've been in after all.

Why would she be at a disadvantage in close range? She's a swordswoman.

Because if she prefers to go close quarters most of the time. kaizo has AOE slashes that causes explosions making it almost impossible to dodge without being blown away unless she's out of his melee range.

Are all of them made up of nanoparticles? Does Kaizo erase these particles from existence? Otherwise, why would this matter?

Are you mistaking power nullification for existence erasure? Anyways, he has dispersed a tiger made of nano-magnetic particles with a slash before. (8:35) As well as dispersing a polar bear made up of the same thing with a punch. (9:00)

And on the topic of wind. He has also casually repelled a barrage of wind chakrams without much trouble. (8:27, go a many seconds back for proof that it was indeed a wind based attack. Chakram Angin = Wind Chakrams)

A stomp would be if he has literally no way of beating her whatsoever. She would start with attempting pure melee combat because that's the go to for singular, grounded opponents. It's simply that if she found herself struggling with his barriers then she would use magic.

Ah. But if that's the case, she'll be dealt with a lot of wide sweeping AOE slashes. How experienced is she in regards to that?

 

[SeijiSetto]

crusch can make wind cuts happen without a swing.

Crusch gently turned her wineglass around in her hand as she murmured offhandedly.
“The wind blows stronger. It would seem tomorrow’s weather will be somewhat stormy.”
Then, with a small sound, the melting ice cube within her glass neatly split in two.
— Re:Zero, Volume 5

 

[Kisaragi_Megumi]

Tldr for both arguments?

 

[Greatsage13th]

Tldr for both arguments?

Crusch:

• Overall superior skill in regards to CQC
• superior range with wind manipulation
• better mobility

Kaizo:

• Power nullification
• Almost every attack he uses has unblockable AOE.
• Energy barrier can be used offensively

That's the main summary of their advantages.

crusch can make wind cuts happen without a swing.

That happened to an ice cube within arms length. can she do the same to an alien many meters away, let alone a slash bigger than a wine glass?

 

[SatellaTheWoE]

Crusch:

• Overall superior skill in regards to CQC
• superior range with wind manipulation
• better mobility

Kaizo:

• Power nullification
• Almost every attack he uses has unblockable AOE.
• Energy barrier can be used offensively

That's the main summary of their advantages.


That happened to an ice cube within arms length. can she do the same to an alien many meters away, let alone a slash bigger than a wine glass?

well, duh?
her range is anywhere where she can see, I really dont understand what you dont get about this

it's not unreasonable to assume she doesn't need to swing AT ALL and does so out of choice, considering its literally just her waving her arms around for the most part

 

[Greatsage13th]

well, duh?
her range is anywhere where she can see, I really dont understand what you dont get about this

it's not unreasonable to assume she doesn't need to swing AT ALL and does so out of choice, considering its literally just her waving her arms around for the most part

Ah, now, with the evidence in hand. She still requires to swing. and hence you can no longer claim she can simply spawn the attack on top of Kaizo via thought. With that said, it is without doubt that Kaizo would dodge it or worse summon a barrier to both block and slam into Crusch.

 

[SeijiSetto]

Ah, now, with the evidence in hand. She still requires to swing.

Where in the paragraph does it say she NEEDS to swing?
Considering there's evidence of her doing it without swinging, it's on you to prove it's a requirement.

 

[Zabazab]

Where in the paragraph does it say she NEEDS to swing?

True

Spilling out pathetic cries of pain, Spica fell to her knees, as her left thigh had been pierced by white light―― Unable to use either of her hands, that had been done by a blow fired from Sphinx’s golden right eye.

“Fingers and tools can be used to assist with the invocation of magic. It is a mistaken conception that those who are not versed in magic are prone to having.” –Arc 8, Chapter 59

 

[Success0906]

With the evidences in hand, I am leaning more towards Crusch right now. But otherwise I am neutral. But if this hasn't gotten concluded by a single vote, then count me in for Crusch.