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Big Problems With D.Gray-Man Feats and Calcs (Downgrade)

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Millenium Earl Calc


Problem #1: It uses the size of modern-day Tokyo, while the series takes place at the end of the 19th century. The calc uses a radius of 26426.73 meters, which is far higher than the actual radius would be. I couldn't find any direct data on the area of Tokyo is this time period, but I did find this map from 1907 (close enough I think). Measuring the distance between Osaki Station and Tabata station (luckily they still exist), located on opposite borders of the city, I got a diameter of 13500 meters, or a radius of 6750 meters. This is more than 4x smaller than the size the calc uses. My size measurement does not need to be used, if someone else can find a better source then that will work as well. It just needs to be something from this general time period instead of the 21st century. If anything, 1907 is still a big highball considering the Edo period is still ongoing in DGM while it ended in 1868 irl, so the city is probably far smaller than its real-life counterpart from the same time period.

Next, I'll get into issues with the calc that don't really have anything to do with the series, but rather just the methodology. Take these with more of a grain of salt since I know less about calcs than I do D.Gray-Man, but I still feel strongly that there are fundamental issues with the methodology of the calc:

Problem #2:
I don't understand the reasoning for the "volume" of Tokyo. The 40 meters doesn't refer to the "height" of the city, it refers to its elevation above sea level. The Millenium Earl flattened the city, that has nothing to do with its elevation above sea level. So basically I have no idea why a feat of flattening a city is being treated like a feat of vaporizing a 40 meter high cylinder of stone.

Problem #3: The feat is the Millenium Earl destroying Edo, with the value supposedly coming from the vaporization of the whole city. The value it gets is very inconsistent with other sources I have found (in large part I think because of the 40 meters of stone chosen for some reason). For example, according to this calculator, a 18000000 kiloton (18 gigaton) explosion would result in a fireball with a radius of ~26500 meters. This calculator agrees, with 18000 megatons resulting in an airbust fireball of 26.6 kilometers. Both of these calculators give a result that makes far more sense to me, and the currently used calc resulting in a value 100x higher than the aforementioned calculators really makes me question the validity of the current calc. I don't know if its the heat method, or if its the 40 meter thing leading to these inflated results.

Lavi Calc

This one is much simpler. The move Lavi used to perform this feat isn't actually an attack, so this should just become Environmental Destruction.

5-B Heart​

This one I really don't get, because the justifications for the 5-B key directly explain why the feat isn't 5-B. The heart didn't blow up the planet, the "end of the world" was the Great Flood. It should be replaced with the already accepted calc for flooding the Earth. I am also unsure about scaling the Millenium Earl to it directly. We have no idea what "fighting" the Heart means in this situation, so I don't think we can assume that he scales at all to its causing of the Great Flood. I see no reason to assume it was a 1v1 fight between the Millenium Earl and the Heart, or that the Earl could in any way stand up against the full power of the Heart. It seems much more likely to me that it is referring to Innocence rather than specifically the Heart itself.

Proposal:​

1. Recalc the Millenium Earl feat with the correct size of Tokyo/Edo and a more accurate/reliable method. Explosion seems the most resonable to me, but if there is a method for calculating the vaporization of the city that is more accurate, then that works too. This value should become the primary value of scaling for most series.

2. Lavi's calc should become Environmental Destruction that scales only to him.

3A. Remove scaling from the Heart entirely
3B. Change the wording to "possibly," and the value from 5-B to 6-A.
 
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I'll comment on this thread in more depth later. But I'll say that I most likely agree with removing the Tier 5 stuff entirely. Going over the information again, I don't believe we have enough evidence to say it's actually capable of destroying the planet in the amount of time needed to actually qualify for Tier 5, rather than an overtime feat through a smaller, consistent value.
 
I've been dealing with personal issues IRL and issues with other verses on this site, so I probably won't be able to respond in a timely manner for this thread. I'm also planning on revising the verse entirely after I'm done with another series, so I would personally ask that we take this thread low and slow until I have enough free time to address all the issues going on with it.
 
That calc still seems very weird to me. Like why is he finding the volume of Tokyo like its a cylinder of stone?
 
That calc still seems very weird to me. Like why is he finding the volume of Tokyo like its a cylinder of stone?
Allegedly, according to the original calc, that 40 meters is like the height of the ground or sumn due to average elevation. Which is why I kept it in, since the Early flattened Edo. You can bring that up with calc members and whatnot too, I don't hold strong opinions on that matter. My main issues with the old calc was the size and heat transfer stuff.
 
I agree with your issues with the size and heat transfer, but I disagree about using the 40 meters. I don't think we have any reason to believe he vaporized everything all the way day to sea level, when the wording seems to just imply he wiped out the surface. Like the translation used is just that "Edo's landscape is completely cleared off." The translation used on Viz is that he "flattened Edo."
 
I'd be fine changing it to be like volume = area x average edo building height x 0.1 (account for 90% hollowness), and going from there.

Doesn't Edo have a lake or some shit close by? Doubt that would have been left unscathed.
Kinda impossible to tell from the limited perspective we get.
 
Fair enough. Although I'm wondering since the feat wasn't exactly vaporization since he left glass behind. Doesn't quite seem like outright vaporization tbh.
 
Fair enough. Although I'm wondering since the feat wasn't exactly vaporization since he left glass behind. Doesn't quite seem like outright vaporization tbh.
All glassing is, is heating up something (normally like quartz sand) until it is a liquid, and then when it cools it forms a not quite solid called glass. Technically glassing something doesn't require as much energy as full on vaporizing something. However, in this case the ground being glassed is more so evidence that the temperature within the actual dark matter explosion itself was hot enough to vaporize.
 
Would it be possible to calc just glassing the ground? Like I think calcing the buildings might be hard since there would have to be so much guesswork with building density, material, and wall thickness.
 
Yeah the material thing is another point.
Would it be possible to calc just glassing the ground? Like I think calcing the buildings might be hard since there would have to be so much guesswork with building density, material, and wall thickness.
According to a quick Google search buildings in 17th century Japan were made with timber and clay.
 
I am also unsure about scaling the Millenium Earl to it directly. We have no idea what "fighting" the Heart means in this situation, so I don't think we can assume that he scales at all to its causing of the Great Flood. I see no reason to assume it was a 1v1 fight between the Millenium Earl and the Heart, or that the Earl could in any way stand up against the full power of the Heart. It seems much more likely to me that it is referring to Innocence rather than specifically the Heart itself.
If he died fighting it, that does sound like a direct battle.
 
Sure, but we have no idea the circumstances of that battle. We just know that he lost. Aside from that we don't know how long that direct confrontation was, he well the Millenium Earl did, what assistance he had, what assistance the Heart had, or if he even fought the Heart directly or just fought small manifestations like Apocryphos or even just Exorcists wielding parts of its power. For all we know, he fought a long war against Innocence but was one-shot by the Heart. Characters say that the Exorcists are fighting a war against the Millenium Earl, but that doesn't mean all of them have directly fought him in a 1v1.
 
Do you know where those would be? If that's true then I'd be willing to accept a "possibly" or "likely."
 
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