- 1,219
- 112
- Thread starter
- #41
Well if things are okay then the proposed changes should be made and the thread be closed.
-
This forum is strictly intended to be used by members of the VS Battles wiki. Please only register if you have an autoconfirmed account there, as otherwise your registration will be rejected. If you have already registered once, do not do so again, and contact Antvasima if you encounter any problems.
For instructions regarding the exact procedure to sign up to this forum, please click here. -
We need Patreon donations for this forum to have all of its running costs financially secured.
Community members who help us out will receive badges that give them several different benefits, including the removal of all advertisements in this forum, but donations from non-members are also extremely appreciated.
Please click here for further information, or here to directly visit our Patreon donations page. -
Please click here for information about a large petition to help children in need.
About Sailor Moon
- Thread starter Lancer45Man
- Start date
- Status
- 1,219
- 112
- Thread starter
- #43
- 1,219
- 112
- Thread starter
- #47
Basically, a lot of things I've pointed out (Besides Usagi's resistance to Fate Manipulation and some minor abilities addition) are based on Pure Speculations and Assumptions with no concrete evidence or proof to back them up but have Contradictory things to debunk their merit.
- 995
- 229
They only agree on certain things but there's seems like a bunch of things he wants to change or take out and already opening up every page. But then I don't even see the non-existent stuff on Chaos because that was never applied.
edit: alright nevermind about the non-existent stuff
edit: alright nevermind about the non-existent stuff
- 1,219
- 112
- Thread starter
- #50
I'm opening up every page of the Senshis to remove the Intangibility part as there was no solid feat or evidence given. It was just slapped on the profiles of the Sailor Senshis without any justification with concrete feats. If anyone wants to provide feats for their Intangibility, feel free.
- 1,219
- 112
- Thread starter
- #51
@Ant required changes have been made. You can check the profiles and close them as well as this thread if you like
- 3,493
- 1,360
1. There was no reason to remove the speed feat from the profiles. It's a completely valid calc: and anyone can read it here:
https://vsbattles.fandom.com/wiki/User_blog:DodoNova2/Usagi_attack'speed
It calced how fast the light form the silver crystal reached wiseman (which was almost instatanously) who was at the end of spacetime. The light still traveled through space and that was what was calced.
If you say, its' an immeasurable feat. Fine. But to then say it's outlier isn't making sense.
A. The feat has been repeated in the series. Why would it be considered an outlier the first time and then not the second time.
B. The crystal has been stated repeatedly to be able to cut across space and time throughout the same arc. In fact, Death Phantom repeats a similar attack as well. He distorts spactime so much that the cast falls all the way from earth to his palace at the end of spacetime. Sailor Moon then undos the destruction and sends everyone back to earth. That's three times in the same arc that an attack invovling somewhere in the solar system and the end of spacetime.
https://gallery.missdream.org/albums/scanlation_smoon/smoon_act25/043.jpg
https://gallery.missdream.org/albums/scanlation_smoon/smoon_act25/044.jpg
C. The feat hasn't been contradicted. Attacks in the series happen seemingly instatenously. (in the 4th arc, even across universes)
D. You said that it wasn't an attack. This is not true. It is an attack against Saphir who was at that very moment going to impale a depowered Usagi. The light from the crystal stopped him dead in his tracks. It was a defensive manuever.
https://gallery.missdream.org/albums/scanlation_smoon/smoon_act22/027.jpg
https://gallery.missdream.org/albums/scanlation_smoon/smoon_act22/028.jpg
https://gallery.missdream.org/albums/scanlation_smoon/smoon_act22/029.jpg
The light even destroys his weapon. Notice it is no longer in his hand.
In conclusion: I believe the speed feat should be put back on the profiles. If an immeasurable rating won't be accpeted, then the quintilion should be. The light still traveled through space and that's what was calced.
2. I'll conclue it's not really important.
3. I did not ignore what you said. It's been appartent throughout the entire series that future changes as long as the series progresses. I beleive this is nitpicking. Diana states that Eternal Sailor Moon. is second to power only to Neo Queen Serenity. This statement while contradicts a previous one should be taken over the other one. Because it's a newer statement made by the Author. We must remember that Naoko Takeuchi never wanted to Sailor Moon to lasted one arc. As things go on, new things are added and retconned. It's an entirely metastory issue.
Senshi:
1. Chibi-usa did not wish for it. The Mirror acted on it's own.
https://gallery.missdream.org/albums/scanlation_smoon/smoon_act45/023.jpg
2. I honestly don't see what your point is? She erased the silver millenium and then solar system started over again. You asked why this "Can reset a being and the evolution of the same to zero" was on the profile, and I'm telling you it's about her destroying the silver millenium so that it can start over again. it can be editted to make it more apparent. But I feel like were arguing semantics.
3. I conclude. Not that important. I can make a seperate case for that later.
Chaos
1. I conclude. I'll make argue this in my other thread.
2. The Proof that Chaos Seed is a sailor crystal is because it has a Guardian like the Sailor Crystals. Sailor Senshi both have a sailor crystal and a starseed. Starseeds do not have a gaurdian.
Here is an example of a Gaurdian:
https://gallery.missdream.org/albums/scanlation_smoon/smoon_act48/037.jpg
The page below shows Sailor Aluminum Siren holding Sailor Mercury's and Jupiter's Sailor Crystal.
https://gallery.missdream.org/albums/scanlation_smoon/smoon_act51/042.jpg
The next page shows us Sailor Galaxia holding thier star seeds and then destroying them.
https://gallery.missdream.org/albums/scanlation_smoon/smoon_act52/025.jpg
Chaos is non-existent because he was never born from the Cauldron. Since he was never born he doesn't have a starseed. Everything that exists within the Sailor Moon verse has a starseed, organisms, planets, stars. etc. They all have star seeds and were born from the Cauldron. Chaos specifically says he was never given the chance to be born. Or in other words, a chance to exist in the universe. Chaos seed, like sailor crystals (which both have gaurdians) is a source of power.
Starseeds give things their existence.
https://gallery.missdream.org/albums/scanlation_smoon/smoon_act54/030.jpg
Sailor Crystals gives things their powers.
https://gallery.missdream.org/albums/scanlation_smoon/smoon_act52/004.jpg
3. I still don't understand your logic. Chaos has all their abilities including their passive ones. Passive abilties don't need extra proof than manual abilities. The spawn already prooved that their passive abilities are passive. Why would Chaos be able to make those abilites passive for his weaker incarnations but not passive for himself?
https://vsbattles.fandom.com/wiki/User_blog:DodoNova2/Usagi_attack'speed
It calced how fast the light form the silver crystal reached wiseman (which was almost instatanously) who was at the end of spacetime. The light still traveled through space and that was what was calced.
If you say, its' an immeasurable feat. Fine. But to then say it's outlier isn't making sense.
A. The feat has been repeated in the series. Why would it be considered an outlier the first time and then not the second time.
B. The crystal has been stated repeatedly to be able to cut across space and time throughout the same arc. In fact, Death Phantom repeats a similar attack as well. He distorts spactime so much that the cast falls all the way from earth to his palace at the end of spacetime. Sailor Moon then undos the destruction and sends everyone back to earth. That's three times in the same arc that an attack invovling somewhere in the solar system and the end of spacetime.
https://gallery.missdream.org/albums/scanlation_smoon/smoon_act25/043.jpg
https://gallery.missdream.org/albums/scanlation_smoon/smoon_act25/044.jpg
C. The feat hasn't been contradicted. Attacks in the series happen seemingly instatenously. (in the 4th arc, even across universes)
D. You said that it wasn't an attack. This is not true. It is an attack against Saphir who was at that very moment going to impale a depowered Usagi. The light from the crystal stopped him dead in his tracks. It was a defensive manuever.
https://gallery.missdream.org/albums/scanlation_smoon/smoon_act22/027.jpg
https://gallery.missdream.org/albums/scanlation_smoon/smoon_act22/028.jpg
https://gallery.missdream.org/albums/scanlation_smoon/smoon_act22/029.jpg
The light even destroys his weapon. Notice it is no longer in his hand.
In conclusion: I believe the speed feat should be put back on the profiles. If an immeasurable rating won't be accpeted, then the quintilion should be. The light still traveled through space and that's what was calced.
2. I'll conclue it's not really important.
3. I did not ignore what you said. It's been appartent throughout the entire series that future changes as long as the series progresses. I beleive this is nitpicking. Diana states that Eternal Sailor Moon. is second to power only to Neo Queen Serenity. This statement while contradicts a previous one should be taken over the other one. Because it's a newer statement made by the Author. We must remember that Naoko Takeuchi never wanted to Sailor Moon to lasted one arc. As things go on, new things are added and retconned. It's an entirely metastory issue.
Senshi:
1. Chibi-usa did not wish for it. The Mirror acted on it's own.
https://gallery.missdream.org/albums/scanlation_smoon/smoon_act45/023.jpg
2. I honestly don't see what your point is? She erased the silver millenium and then solar system started over again. You asked why this "Can reset a being and the evolution of the same to zero" was on the profile, and I'm telling you it's about her destroying the silver millenium so that it can start over again. it can be editted to make it more apparent. But I feel like were arguing semantics.
3. I conclude. Not that important. I can make a seperate case for that later.
Chaos
1. I conclude. I'll make argue this in my other thread.
2. The Proof that Chaos Seed is a sailor crystal is because it has a Guardian like the Sailor Crystals. Sailor Senshi both have a sailor crystal and a starseed. Starseeds do not have a gaurdian.
Here is an example of a Gaurdian:
https://gallery.missdream.org/albums/scanlation_smoon/smoon_act48/037.jpg
The page below shows Sailor Aluminum Siren holding Sailor Mercury's and Jupiter's Sailor Crystal.
https://gallery.missdream.org/albums/scanlation_smoon/smoon_act51/042.jpg
The next page shows us Sailor Galaxia holding thier star seeds and then destroying them.
https://gallery.missdream.org/albums/scanlation_smoon/smoon_act52/025.jpg
Chaos is non-existent because he was never born from the Cauldron. Since he was never born he doesn't have a starseed. Everything that exists within the Sailor Moon verse has a starseed, organisms, planets, stars. etc. They all have star seeds and were born from the Cauldron. Chaos specifically says he was never given the chance to be born. Or in other words, a chance to exist in the universe. Chaos seed, like sailor crystals (which both have gaurdians) is a source of power.
Starseeds give things their existence.
https://gallery.missdream.org/albums/scanlation_smoon/smoon_act54/030.jpg
Sailor Crystals gives things their powers.
https://gallery.missdream.org/albums/scanlation_smoon/smoon_act52/004.jpg
3. I still don't understand your logic. Chaos has all their abilities including their passive ones. Passive abilties don't need extra proof than manual abilities. The spawn already prooved that their passive abilities are passive. Why would Chaos be able to make those abilites passive for his weaker incarnations but not passive for himself?
- 40,470
- 12,953
I promise you that no matter how many times it's repeated, 90% of Sailor Moon's characters being immeasurable will be a giant outlier for the verse.
- 24,183
- 3,938
- 3,493
- 1,360
Put aside the fact that I'm not even agreeing with the immeasurable rating.The real cal howard said:
Why would a feat that is constantly repeated in the series be an outlier?
- 1,219
- 112
- Thread starter
- #58
1) The calc is a complete Nitpicking of the feat. You're using an Immeasurable attack speed to quantify the 1.45 Quadrillion xSoL. It's like saying if an Infinite Speed Being's attack can be dodged by X character 2 miles away, then X Character should have quantifiable value even tho the X Character would logically have Infinite speed for dodging the attack. Your can calculate any other attack speed but that attack speed is completely invalid.
2) That's a blatant feat of Teleportation rather than Space-Time breaking. Senshis have Resistance to Space-Time Manipulation but they don't have Space-Time breaking for Destroying pocket realms or dimensions. If destroying dimensions = Destroying Space-Time, then a lot of characters in this Wiki would get that ability.
3) Let me Reiterate what I said, where is the proof that NQS is = Current Sailor Moon??? Because there's a lot of Contradictions to it. Diana's statement =/= Author's statement and it's even less credible than the one made by NQS. NQS didn't even know who Death Phantom was or where he came from despite Main Timeline SM knowing who he was and defeating him. NQS couldn't even destroy him at all. NQS didn't even know why Time and Space was being affected in Arc 5 despite Sailor Moon fighting Galaxia and Chaos and knowing about it. It could literally be like Future Trunks from DBZ where Chibiusa's time travel could've created a Parallel Universe which is the main timeline. This makes more sense than Diana's one statement of comparing NQS and Eternal Sailor Moon. And her statement is not much of merit when similar statements have been made in the series such as Sailor Cosmos stating she can never match the valor and power of Lambda Usagi despite Lambda Usagi being comparatively weaker than Cosmos. So yeah, Statements without any solid proof or evidence shouldn't be taken seriously.
Senshi
1) Ofc it came to Chibiusa on its own because Chibiusa subconsciously wished to see about the Outer Senshis. Not like in a death battle those talismans would come together and summon hotaru. If you think otherwise then please do show me a scan of the Talismans invoking hotaru on their own.
2) It's Void Manipulation. Nothing more. We don't give every Void Manipulation beings the Ability to "Reset a person and their evolution back to zero" especially when they have shown no feats of doing so.
Chaos
1) LMFAO so you're ignoring the fact that Chaos has a Starseed and only relying on Chaos's self statement of being not born from the Cauldron as well as failed to become a star as proof of Non-Existent??? Furthermore Guardian Cosmos mentions in the scan The Core of Chaos, The Chaos Seed, and Guardian Cosmos which includes three things and not only two things. The Core of Chaos IS THE SAILOR CRYSTAL for Chaos. This completely disproves your interpretation that Chaos Seed is = Sailor Crystal.
2) Where is the proof that Chaos has the same Passives as his spawns?? Burden of Proof lies on you because you've claimed the positive whereas I've been asking for proof since my initial argument.
2) That's a blatant feat of Teleportation rather than Space-Time breaking. Senshis have Resistance to Space-Time Manipulation but they don't have Space-Time breaking for Destroying pocket realms or dimensions. If destroying dimensions = Destroying Space-Time, then a lot of characters in this Wiki would get that ability.
3) Let me Reiterate what I said, where is the proof that NQS is = Current Sailor Moon??? Because there's a lot of Contradictions to it. Diana's statement =/= Author's statement and it's even less credible than the one made by NQS. NQS didn't even know who Death Phantom was or where he came from despite Main Timeline SM knowing who he was and defeating him. NQS couldn't even destroy him at all. NQS didn't even know why Time and Space was being affected in Arc 5 despite Sailor Moon fighting Galaxia and Chaos and knowing about it. It could literally be like Future Trunks from DBZ where Chibiusa's time travel could've created a Parallel Universe which is the main timeline. This makes more sense than Diana's one statement of comparing NQS and Eternal Sailor Moon. And her statement is not much of merit when similar statements have been made in the series such as Sailor Cosmos stating she can never match the valor and power of Lambda Usagi despite Lambda Usagi being comparatively weaker than Cosmos. So yeah, Statements without any solid proof or evidence shouldn't be taken seriously.
Senshi
1) Ofc it came to Chibiusa on its own because Chibiusa subconsciously wished to see about the Outer Senshis. Not like in a death battle those talismans would come together and summon hotaru. If you think otherwise then please do show me a scan of the Talismans invoking hotaru on their own.
2) It's Void Manipulation. Nothing more. We don't give every Void Manipulation beings the Ability to "Reset a person and their evolution back to zero" especially when they have shown no feats of doing so.
Chaos
1) LMFAO so you're ignoring the fact that Chaos has a Starseed and only relying on Chaos's self statement of being not born from the Cauldron as well as failed to become a star as proof of Non-Existent??? Furthermore Guardian Cosmos mentions in the scan The Core of Chaos, The Chaos Seed, and Guardian Cosmos which includes three things and not only two things. The Core of Chaos IS THE SAILOR CRYSTAL for Chaos. This completely disproves your interpretation that Chaos Seed is = Sailor Crystal.
2) Where is the proof that Chaos has the same Passives as his spawns?? Burden of Proof lies on you because you've claimed the positive whereas I've been asking for proof since my initial argument.
- 3,493
- 1,360
1. The original cal isn't nitpicking and it's not doing anything like that. The original calc isn't taking an immeasurable speed feat. The feat isn't even immeasurable. Wiseman's palace is in a physical universe, at the edge of spacetime. The edge of the universe is not infinite distance away. It can be calced.
2. What are you even talking about? Sailor Mars set a dimension on fire in the third chapter. It has nothing to do with teleportation. I already said that I would let it go.
3. The NQS on the profile is MAINTIMELINE usagi. It's main character usagi who would ascend to Neo Queen Serenity in her own right. Not NQS from the second arc.
Senshi
1. You're moving goalposts. You said that CHibiusa wished for the mirror to appear. I proved that false. The mirror acted on it's own accord to help Chibi-usa. The talismons literally acted on their own and summon Sailor Saturn on their own during the final battle. I already posted the scans above when I replied to gargoyle.
2. It's not void manipulation. Sailor Saturn destroyed the Silver millenium and the civinilization had to start over again in the solar system. That's what "setting back to zero is refering to".
CHAOS
1. Did you not read anything I said? I already proved that the Chaos seed is like a sailor crystal and not a regular star seed. We don't know what the Chaos core is, as it's not something that's been stated before in the entire series. That's the first time in the series that a Core was ever mentioned. Sailor Crystals have never been reffered to as a core. But they have been referred to as special star seeds. It's in the scans I posted. You need to prove that the Chaos crystal is the core.
Your explanation is not based on anything in the series and it needs to completely disregard a statement Chaos made about himself. It is a pivitol statement. Chaos wants to become a sailor senshi. That's one of his major goal. THat's what he always wanted. My explanation doesn't disregard any statements and fits with everything we've seen before and I've backed up with scans. You have to prove that chaos core is a crystal. I'm waiting for a scan form anywhere in the series that staes sailor crystatls are also caleld cores.
2. I already proved it. IT's basic logic. Chaos has the spawn's abilities. The spawn's abilities include passive abilities. Chaos has the spawn's passive abilities. Why would the abilities not be passive when its his own powers that created them?
2. What are you even talking about? Sailor Mars set a dimension on fire in the third chapter. It has nothing to do with teleportation. I already said that I would let it go.
3. The NQS on the profile is MAINTIMELINE usagi. It's main character usagi who would ascend to Neo Queen Serenity in her own right. Not NQS from the second arc.
Senshi
1. You're moving goalposts. You said that CHibiusa wished for the mirror to appear. I proved that false. The mirror acted on it's own accord to help Chibi-usa. The talismons literally acted on their own and summon Sailor Saturn on their own during the final battle. I already posted the scans above when I replied to gargoyle.
2. It's not void manipulation. Sailor Saturn destroyed the Silver millenium and the civinilization had to start over again in the solar system. That's what "setting back to zero is refering to".
CHAOS
1. Did you not read anything I said? I already proved that the Chaos seed is like a sailor crystal and not a regular star seed. We don't know what the Chaos core is, as it's not something that's been stated before in the entire series. That's the first time in the series that a Core was ever mentioned. Sailor Crystals have never been reffered to as a core. But they have been referred to as special star seeds. It's in the scans I posted. You need to prove that the Chaos crystal is the core.
Your explanation is not based on anything in the series and it needs to completely disregard a statement Chaos made about himself. It is a pivitol statement. Chaos wants to become a sailor senshi. That's one of his major goal. THat's what he always wanted. My explanation doesn't disregard any statements and fits with everything we've seen before and I've backed up with scans. You have to prove that chaos core is a crystal. I'm waiting for a scan form anywhere in the series that staes sailor crystatls are also caleld cores.
2. I already proved it. IT's basic logic. Chaos has the spawn's abilities. The spawn's abilities include passive abilities. Chaos has the spawn's passive abilities. Why would the abilities not be passive when its his own powers that created them?
- 1,219
- 112
- Thread starter
- #60
1) Wiseman's domain was stated to be at the END of Space-Time and Sailor Moon's Silver Crystal's light can Cross through Time Which is how NQS's power up was felt by Wiseman and stated it is disrupting all of Space-Time. So yes, it's an Immeasurable speed feat and you're Nitpicking as well as backtracking on your comments. Also it really doesn't matter what the distance is, an Immeasurable speed attack would reach anywhere and anywhen instantly.
2) I meant escaping and BFRing everyone from Death Phantom's planet. My point still stands. Destroying a pocket realm/dimension =/= Space-Time breaking.
3) I'm sorry but at this point you're comments are becoming desperate. There's blatant Contradictions of NQS being main timeline Usagi. Anyone who has read the series without any Bias can easily tell that.
Senshis
1) Because Usagi and the Outer Senshis wanted to Invoke her. they had to gather together with their Talismans which then invoked her. There's specific requirements that need to be met for Invoking her. In a death battle those Talismans or Outer Senshis won't be present. So she can't come back on her own. Case Closed.
2) Erasing everything is Void Manipulation. Where does it state that SHE was the one who made everyone in Silver Millennium reincarnate???
Chaos
1) Chaos Core would logically be the Sailor Crystal type of thing for Chaos which is prolly the source of his power considering Chaos Seed = Star Seed of Chaos. Which is why there's a Guardian Chaos because of Chaos Core. And no the burden of proof on you to show how Chaos Seed is = Sailor Crystal of Chaos especially when Guardian Cosmos mentions three things that include Chaos Core, Chaos Seed, and Guardian Chaos. Your proof and explanation gets Debunked when Cosmos herself states the three things. If Chaos has a Chaos Core, Chaos Seed, and a Guardian Chaos then Chaos isn't Non-Existent. As for Chaos to be Non-Existent he shouldn't have a Star Seed but he HAS A STAR SEED named CHAOS SEED.
2) Proof that they're Passive for Chaos??? Because "It's Basic Logic" isn't Proof. He has their Abilities yes but they aren't Passive for him because you'd need to give proof to show that they are Passive.
2) I meant escaping and BFRing everyone from Death Phantom's planet. My point still stands. Destroying a pocket realm/dimension =/= Space-Time breaking.
3) I'm sorry but at this point you're comments are becoming desperate. There's blatant Contradictions of NQS being main timeline Usagi. Anyone who has read the series without any Bias can easily tell that.
Senshis
1) Because Usagi and the Outer Senshis wanted to Invoke her. they had to gather together with their Talismans which then invoked her. There's specific requirements that need to be met for Invoking her. In a death battle those Talismans or Outer Senshis won't be present. So she can't come back on her own. Case Closed.
2) Erasing everything is Void Manipulation. Where does it state that SHE was the one who made everyone in Silver Millennium reincarnate???
Chaos
1) Chaos Core would logically be the Sailor Crystal type of thing for Chaos which is prolly the source of his power considering Chaos Seed = Star Seed of Chaos. Which is why there's a Guardian Chaos because of Chaos Core. And no the burden of proof on you to show how Chaos Seed is = Sailor Crystal of Chaos especially when Guardian Cosmos mentions three things that include Chaos Core, Chaos Seed, and Guardian Chaos. Your proof and explanation gets Debunked when Cosmos herself states the three things. If Chaos has a Chaos Core, Chaos Seed, and a Guardian Chaos then Chaos isn't Non-Existent. As for Chaos to be Non-Existent he shouldn't have a Star Seed but he HAS A STAR SEED named CHAOS SEED.
2) Proof that they're Passive for Chaos??? Because "It's Basic Logic" isn't Proof. He has their Abilities yes but they aren't Passive for him because you'd need to give proof to show that they are Passive.
- 3,493
- 1,360
1. Space-time is the fabric that the unvierse is made of. The end of spacetime is the edge of the universe where the spacetime ends. The Cut across space and time is referring to how the Silver crystal of the present did not work in the future. After Neo Queen Serenity's powerup, the power of teh Sivler crystal of the present cut across space and time to work in the future. I'm not nitpicking anything. You're confusing the two statements.
2. In order to destroy a dimension you need to be able to damage space-time, what space is made of. (Also I've already said I've concluded on this. No need to go back on it)
3. I'm sorry but I don't know how I can explain anymore that the NQS in the profile is the NQS Usagi becomes at the end of the series? I'm just repeating myself. It's not NQS from the second arc. It's EOS Sailor Moon as she ascends the throne.
Senshi
1. You need to reread. They do not invoke her at all. The talismons act on thier own. Everyone is shocked that they started to light up. THat's an objective fact. They acted on their own.
2. I never said she was the one who made them reincarnate. Her destroying the silver millenium is what allowed everything to start oveer again. (again this is a nonissue, I've already said that it should be editited so it's more understandable)
Chaos.
1. No it's not. YOu're making assumptions and disregarding Chaos's own statement. I already proved that the Chaos Seed is like a crystal. Reread what I wrote. You need to prove that core is would be the sailor crystal. There is no information at all in the series about what a core is and never is any crystal called a core ever in the series. You keep ignoring my arguments and claiming I need to provide the burden of proof.
And read Gaurdian Cosmos's entire statment. She says, "It is possible they could be reborn again someday". Starseeds are not reborn. They die with the person. What does get reborn? Sailor Crystals. When a senshi dies, the crystals return to the cualdron to be reborn as a different senshi. Hence why Sailor Chaos was able to be reborn from teh Cauldron.
In order for your statement that the Chaos seed is Chaos's starseed you would need to:
1. Disregard what he said about being never born
2. violate the established precdent that only sailor crystals get reborn
3. Prove the chaos core is the sailor crystal or sailor crystal like
4. Prove that chaos has a special indestructible starseed that doesn't get melted back into the sea and can be reborn and is seperate form the sailor crystal.
My explanations that I have already give do not contradict anything in the story nor do they disregard any statements. All I have to prove is that:
1. The Chaos seed is a sailor crystal or sailor crystal like
I've already proven that by providing scans that call Sailor Crystals special star seeds. Showing that senshi have both a starseed and a sailor crystal. That the sailor crystal is indestructible and represents their power and can be reborn and the star seed cannot be reborn and represents the person.
I have evidence on my side.
2. In order to destroy a dimension you need to be able to damage space-time, what space is made of. (Also I've already said I've concluded on this. No need to go back on it)
3. I'm sorry but I don't know how I can explain anymore that the NQS in the profile is the NQS Usagi becomes at the end of the series? I'm just repeating myself. It's not NQS from the second arc. It's EOS Sailor Moon as she ascends the throne.
Senshi
1. You need to reread. They do not invoke her at all. The talismons act on thier own. Everyone is shocked that they started to light up. THat's an objective fact. They acted on their own.
2. I never said she was the one who made them reincarnate. Her destroying the silver millenium is what allowed everything to start oveer again. (again this is a nonissue, I've already said that it should be editited so it's more understandable)
Chaos.
1. No it's not. YOu're making assumptions and disregarding Chaos's own statement. I already proved that the Chaos Seed is like a crystal. Reread what I wrote. You need to prove that core is would be the sailor crystal. There is no information at all in the series about what a core is and never is any crystal called a core ever in the series. You keep ignoring my arguments and claiming I need to provide the burden of proof.
And read Gaurdian Cosmos's entire statment. She says, "It is possible they could be reborn again someday". Starseeds are not reborn. They die with the person. What does get reborn? Sailor Crystals. When a senshi dies, the crystals return to the cualdron to be reborn as a different senshi. Hence why Sailor Chaos was able to be reborn from teh Cauldron.
In order for your statement that the Chaos seed is Chaos's starseed you would need to:
1. Disregard what he said about being never born
2. violate the established precdent that only sailor crystals get reborn
3. Prove the chaos core is the sailor crystal or sailor crystal like
4. Prove that chaos has a special indestructible starseed that doesn't get melted back into the sea and can be reborn and is seperate form the sailor crystal.
My explanations that I have already give do not contradict anything in the story nor do they disregard any statements. All I have to prove is that:
1. The Chaos seed is a sailor crystal or sailor crystal like
I've already proven that by providing scans that call Sailor Crystals special star seeds. Showing that senshi have both a starseed and a sailor crystal. That the sailor crystal is indestructible and represents their power and can be reborn and the star seed cannot be reborn and represents the person.
I have evidence on my side.
- 3,493
- 1,360
At least let the people who have been listed as having information on the series respond. The people who agree with Lancer aren't known for their knowledge on the series nor have I seen responding much on any of the content threads before.
- 3,493
- 1,360
Well I've said what I've said. I don't think I need to repeat myself or continue arguing. I'll ask others to take a look at the thread and give their comments on the issues.
- 3,493
- 1,360
Sorry for the double post.
Also, next time a thread like this should be broken up into several threads. It gets really difficult and confusing to address multiple things across the entire series in one thread all at once. It's confusing to outsiders who don't know the series as well. It makes the posts extra long and it's extremely hard to try to keep arguments coherent over time.
Also, next time a thread like this should be broken up into several threads. It gets really difficult and confusing to address multiple things across the entire series in one thread all at once. It's confusing to outsiders who don't know the series as well. It makes the posts extra long and it's extremely hard to try to keep arguments coherent over time.
- 1,219
- 112
- Thread starter
- #68
1) Read my previous comment. Space-Time is a Timeline and End of Space-Time is the End of a Timeline. And it doesn't matter where you're situated because an IMMEASURABLE SPEED ATTACK can literally REACH ANYWHERE AND ANYWHEN INSTANTLY. The calc treats it as a normal attack when it is not and is actually an Immeasurable Speed attack.
2) No just no. You can ask any admin or mod and they'll say the same thing I have said. Destroying a pocket dimension/realm is not a feat of Breaking Space-Time
3) Because there's blatant Contradictions of NQS being the main timeline Usagi and you can't prove otherwise.
Senshi
1) Reread the scan, they had to come together and their gathering caused the Talismans to act on their own and invoke her. Provide feats of when the Three Talismans came together acted on their own without the aid of Outer Senshis or Usagi?
2) Which is a Void Manipulation feat. Nothing more.
Chaos
1) Prove that Chaos Seed = Sailor Crystal for Chaos. Is there any statement or scan of anyone stating as such? Because Cosmos statements of Chaos having Chaos Core, Chaos Seed, and Guardian Chaos greatly imply that Chaos Core = Chaos's Power Source/Sailor Crystal, Chaos Seed = Star Seed of Chaos via Occam's Razor. You're the only one who's misinterpreting everything because of Chaos's vague statement.
And no Galaxia dropped all Star Seeds of the Senshis into the Cauldron and they were erased and yet Usagi could Ressurect them. So no, Starseeds can be reborn.
Also I love how you strawman and shift the burden of Proof. Chaos stated that he wasn't born from the Cauldron and he failed to become a Star. It's completely vague and doesn't give any indication of Chaos being Non-Existent due to the fact that Guardian Cosmos states how Chaos has a Chaos Core, Chaos Seed, and Guardian Chaos. It's completely evident even for a blind person as to how Chaos Seed = Star Seed of Chaos if the Author wasn't obvious enough to imply that. Your misinterpretation of Chaos Seed = Sailor Crystal of Chaos lacks 0 merit considering going by Occam's Razor and even the Author's intention, Chaos Core = Sailor Crystal for Chaos for which there's a Guardian Chaos and Chaos Seed = Star Seed.
2) Show me Scans of Chaos displaying Passive Mind hax, Energy Drain, Darkness Manipulation, Reality Warping,etc?
2) No just no. You can ask any admin or mod and they'll say the same thing I have said. Destroying a pocket dimension/realm is not a feat of Breaking Space-Time
3) Because there's blatant Contradictions of NQS being the main timeline Usagi and you can't prove otherwise.
Senshi
1) Reread the scan, they had to come together and their gathering caused the Talismans to act on their own and invoke her. Provide feats of when the Three Talismans came together acted on their own without the aid of Outer Senshis or Usagi?
2) Which is a Void Manipulation feat. Nothing more.
Chaos
1) Prove that Chaos Seed = Sailor Crystal for Chaos. Is there any statement or scan of anyone stating as such? Because Cosmos statements of Chaos having Chaos Core, Chaos Seed, and Guardian Chaos greatly imply that Chaos Core = Chaos's Power Source/Sailor Crystal, Chaos Seed = Star Seed of Chaos via Occam's Razor. You're the only one who's misinterpreting everything because of Chaos's vague statement.
And no Galaxia dropped all Star Seeds of the Senshis into the Cauldron and they were erased and yet Usagi could Ressurect them. So no, Starseeds can be reborn.
Also I love how you strawman and shift the burden of Proof. Chaos stated that he wasn't born from the Cauldron and he failed to become a Star. It's completely vague and doesn't give any indication of Chaos being Non-Existent due to the fact that Guardian Cosmos states how Chaos has a Chaos Core, Chaos Seed, and Guardian Chaos. It's completely evident even for a blind person as to how Chaos Seed = Star Seed of Chaos if the Author wasn't obvious enough to imply that. Your misinterpretation of Chaos Seed = Sailor Crystal of Chaos lacks 0 merit considering going by Occam's Razor and even the Author's intention, Chaos Core = Sailor Crystal for Chaos for which there's a Guardian Chaos and Chaos Seed = Star Seed.
2) Show me Scans of Chaos displaying Passive Mind hax, Energy Drain, Darkness Manipulation, Reality Warping,etc?
- 1,219
- 112
- Thread starter
- #69
Like Ant said, Majority of the people here agree with me including Dodo. You can bring anyone knowledgeable in the verse in this thread.
- 3,493
- 1,360
I'm just going to state one thing.
Galaxia did not drop the star seeds of the senshi in the cauldron. She dropped their sailor crystals. We see her presonally destroy their star seeds in her hands.
It's in the scan I showed you earlier. She grinds them into dust.
https://gallery.missdream.org/albums/scanlation_smoon/smoon_act52/025.jpg
Galaxia did not drop the star seeds of the senshi in the cauldron. She dropped their sailor crystals. We see her presonally destroy their star seeds in her hands.
It's in the scan I showed you earlier. She grinds them into dust.
https://gallery.missdream.org/albums/scanlation_smoon/smoon_act52/025.jpg
- 1,106
- 546
SM
1) I agree calc is invalid for using an Immeasurable Speed attack to quantify the calc
2) Agree. Reality Warping should be used instead
3) It should be because of her resisting nehelinia's curse for which she should get resistance to fate hax
4) Idk honestly
5) Agreed
6) I'm neutral on this
7) I believe it's for Galaxia's concept manip which lambda Usagi has
Senshis
1) Agreed. It should be Inapplicable for Combat
2) Agreed
3) idk why they have intangibility and reading the entire thread, it's evident that they don't have any intangibility feats
Chaos
1) Abstract Existence wasn't even accepted in the previous thread and I agree that it should go due to extremely vague statements and stuff
2) nonexistent physiology isn't even applicable for chaos and looking at OP's comments, it's more sensible and logical that Chaos Seed = Star Seed while Chaos Core = Sailor Crystal for Chaos
3) I believe he only has their abilities but they aren't his passives. Chaos likely has no Passives.
1) I agree calc is invalid for using an Immeasurable Speed attack to quantify the calc
2) Agree. Reality Warping should be used instead
3) It should be because of her resisting nehelinia's curse for which she should get resistance to fate hax
4) Idk honestly
5) Agreed
6) I'm neutral on this
7) I believe it's for Galaxia's concept manip which lambda Usagi has
Senshis
1) Agreed. It should be Inapplicable for Combat
2) Agreed
3) idk why they have intangibility and reading the entire thread, it's evident that they don't have any intangibility feats
Chaos
1) Abstract Existence wasn't even accepted in the previous thread and I agree that it should go due to extremely vague statements and stuff
2) nonexistent physiology isn't even applicable for chaos and looking at OP's comments, it's more sensible and logical that Chaos Seed = Star Seed while Chaos Core = Sailor Crystal for Chaos
3) I believe he only has their abilities but they aren't his passives. Chaos likely has no Passives.
- 3,493
- 1,360
I should repeat: Sailor Crystals are special star seeds. Chaos core can't be a sailor crystal. We don't know what a core is and it's never been stated in the entire series until that page.
- 1,219
- 112
- Thread starter
- #73
Which serves literally no merit in proving how Chaos Seed is equal to Sailor Crystal for Chaos. Like the Author is blatantly mentioning the word '''Seed''' in Chaos Seed to indicate that Chaos Seed is the Star Seed of Chaos
- 3,493
- 1,360
The author has also called Sailor crystals star seeds. Sailor crystals are special star seeds that contain the power. They are different from regular star seeds that are the person. Sailor Crystals are recycled through the cauldron. Regular starseeds are not.
My argument is that Chaos lacks a regular star seed, the one that makes a person a thing that exists in the universe.
We cannot go by name association with the Sailor Moon series. This is a series that called the Moon and planets, and individual people stars. (and if you're wandering why they are all referred to as stars? it's because they are made with starseeds, and guess what Chaos said he failed to be come? a star)
My argument is that Chaos lacks a regular star seed, the one that makes a person a thing that exists in the universe.
We cannot go by name association with the Sailor Moon series. This is a series that called the Moon and planets, and individual people stars. (and if you're wandering why they are all referred to as stars? it's because they are made with starseeds, and guess what Chaos said he failed to be come? a star)
- 1,219
- 112
- Thread starter
- #75
Scan of Author saying that? And even if that's the case, I see no reason to not assume Chaos Core as Sailor Crystal of Chaos rather than assuming/misinterpreting Chaos Seed as Sailor Crystal of Chaos especially when Occam's Razor dictates so.
Your argument is based on Chaos's self statement that he wasn't born from the Cauldron and failed to become a Star. It only means that he existed since time Immemorial a isn't bound by life or death making him a Non-Corporeal Type 5 being. Chaos would need a statement like I don't exist/I never existed/I don't have a Star Seed/I was never part of existence to get him Non-Existence Physiology. A vague statement along with Contradictory things don't get him Non-Existence Physiology.
Guess what? Chaos has a Star Seed named Chaos Seed and nothing states he lacks a Starseed. Him failing to become a star is not proof of his Non-Existence, it just means he exists as a Primordial Non-Corporeal entity since the beginning of Creation.
Your argument is based on Chaos's self statement that he wasn't born from the Cauldron and failed to become a Star. It only means that he existed since time Immemorial a isn't bound by life or death making him a Non-Corporeal Type 5 being. Chaos would need a statement like I don't exist/I never existed/I don't have a Star Seed/I was never part of existence to get him Non-Existence Physiology. A vague statement along with Contradictory things don't get him Non-Existence Physiology.
Guess what? Chaos has a Star Seed named Chaos Seed and nothing states he lacks a Starseed. Him failing to become a star is not proof of his Non-Existence, it just means he exists as a Primordial Non-Corporeal entity since the beginning of Creation.
- 3,493
- 1,360
If you're going to truly invoke Occams's Razor, it would be that the Chaos seed is neither a starseed nor a Sailor Crystal since Guardian Cosmos doesn't exactly state what the Chaos seed or the CHaos core is. Why didn't Guardian Cosmos say, Chaos's star seed in stead of the Chaos Seed if the Chaos seed was no different from a star seed? Yet the distinction is made therefore we cannot call it either.
Anyway I conclude all my arguments. I will be busy for the next coming days and won't be here to state anything or defend any of my posiitons. You've already made the changes. I'll just make another thread sometime in the future to argue for reinstatement.
You can lock this Antivisma.
Anyway I conclude all my arguments. I will be busy for the next coming days and won't be here to state anything or defend any of my posiitons. You've already made the changes. I'll just make another thread sometime in the future to argue for reinstatement.
You can lock this Antivisma.
- Status
Similar threads
