MysticMania
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Crossover scaling can be valid, imo.
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Sonic General Discussion Zone Act 1: New Frontiers
- Thread starter Maverick_Zero_X
- Start date
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Crossover scaling is never valid unless it's Worlds Collide Megaman and Sonic or Heroes United Generator Rex or x y and z, apparently LMAO.
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Question: was that bit about them being data clones always in Sonic Blitz?
Also, keep an eye on any datamines for this game. If you know, you know.
Also, keep an eye on any datamines for this game. If you know, you know.
TheStinkeer
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I was able to find the JP encyclopedia of Unleashed and everything seems to be generally the same with the ENG one. That being said Egg Dragoon seems to be notably called "Eggman's ultimate masterpiece"
Egg Devil Ray seems to mention Sonic as supersonic speed, these supersonic speed statements are gonna be the death of us /j
also does anyone know what happens if you don't do anything at those traps in Generations 3DS? I can't find anything personally
also does anyone know what happens if you don't do anything at those traps in Generations 3DS? I can't find anything personally
MysticMania
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I've never though to check that.
TheStinkeer
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Guessing this meant the 3DS stuff, I was finally able to find out and nothing of note happens, Sonic just escapes anyways and hops in the air. Waste of time but still somewhat glad I made sure lmao
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This is cute
MysticMania
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I'll try checking later but does anyone know if power ups (Shield, Thunder Barrier, Invincible, Speed Shoes) can be gotten in SA2's multiplayer? I was gonna dig around in the treasure stages to see if Tikal and Chaos get anything from that, but I haven't found videos with anything yet. I wanted to check here before spending possibly hours drill diving every 2 feet in Wild Canyon basically.
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No, this and it being a Tails game is new.
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Figured I'd share the recent Sonic Blitz datamine stuff, since admittedly that seems to be what people care about most with this game:
There might be more, but since the update only recently came out people are still going through it.
There might be more, but since the update only recently came out people are still going through it.
MysticMania
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Oh, that's very fascinating. I guess it's just a one-time instance, though?
MysticMania
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I've got recordings for some power ups but not Invincible yet.
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I treasure every time I have the chance of spreading the lore of Shogakukan Sonic because Sonic being a warrior from a world beyond the speed of light that can freely move across space-time and is the embodiment of the power passed down by a jet pilot after he "died" after breaking the light barrier, sounds way too cool.
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Do you also think Blade of Courage feels much more "canon" (close to the games) than IDW?
The manga has some very good points:
The manga has some very good points:
- Sonic's characterization and battle prowess;
- the most blatant example of AD vs Metal;
- Chaos Emeralds making miracles when fueled by strong emotions;
- a decent degree of importance given to humans.
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Depends on which game you are talking about
Sonic showed that against Surge and Scrapnik Mecha i would argue
They did that with the Metal Virus
Considering Forces, Lost World, Generations, etc... i wouldn't say the games do that as a rule
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I understand the fight with Surge, but Scrapnik Mecha? Mind telling the specifics? It might have slipped my mind.
I should have been more clear on this one. I was referring to how much explicit the writers were about it. They straight up told us the reason Metal will probably never win against his "loathsome copy" and that even Eggman was left surprised by how Chaos Energy "resonated" with the will of the people.
I didn't talk about any "rule". It just felt more "fair" knowing Humanity as a whole can have a say in a world as chaotic as Sonic's Earth.
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Honestly? Not really. IDK what it is, but whenever people say it feels more "canon" than the actual canon, I just... don't see it.
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Oh i confused the points about this and AD... altho i still like this action scene
Mecha is said to be just as fast as Sonic, however Sonic is with a strained ankle that "feels like its being stabbed by a thousand needles", Mecha then says "you reached your limit" while keeping up with him, and then Sonic says "That's the thing about limits, they are meant to be broken" and then proceeds to speed up ahead of Mecha for the rest of the fight before winning against him... i would say that moment is very explicit
TBF That's less an IDW Problem and more of a "modern games" problem, legit i think the last time humans had any role or appearence before Shadow Generations was like... what, Unleashed? Colors onwards they kind of just... disapeared... and then Sega says "no humans" for IDW and... yeah
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btw i am not up to date with Blade of Courage... the chapters i read were very peak tho
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That's understandable.
I'm probably just in abstinence from events where Sonic shows why he is the most experienced and skilled individual and when he just go "****-impossible-odds" mode because yes.
Oh... that's quite amazing.
Peak after peak.
There are also a lot of punches from Blue.
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Yes, it's much better than IDW imo.
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Is that really a high bar tbf?
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Besides subtle way characters act, BoC is action manga while IDW has significantly less action than most Sonic stories. That already makes big different. IDW has characters talk in circle why they feel bad, Games have Shadow beat up Metal Overlord few months apart.
ShakeResounding
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Scrapnik Mecha is definitely valid, and also probably my favorite example, but Surge was somebody he simply skillstomped. Sonic simply had greater finesse (like using the Slide to trip her up mid-fight, or him stunting on her when they were in an afterimage frenzy) and made her look like a clown as a result.
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No, which is sad it can't be the standard.
ShakeResounding
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Blade of Courage is something I desperately wish was canon, but I can appreciate it a lot regardless of that. It did the character and his world (hehe) so much justice.
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Those 2 words will hunt us down forever
Anyway, I have a question about canonicity in general.
Is the hierarchy smth like this?
1- Games
2- Sonic Channel / Tails Tube / Encyclo-speed-ia (and other accepted manuals);
3- Prime / IDW / WoG;
4- secondary supporting material.
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The whole canon issue is more of a problem than it should be, coming from both the fans and the creators. Because at one point, canon has no meaning. Being literal, it really doesn't have any social construct that has no inherent meaning, only the meaning applied by those who share a certain identity, but Sonic has no clear identity to properly define its canon in both structure and reasoning, and it goes a bit into how the staff clearly has no idea what they want to do with the series, because every X thing they do, there's an Y thing that goes in the opposite direction.
Because at the same time they want to remove something from canon because of some light canonicity issue, they still want something like Prime to be canon, regardless of its inconsistencies in character, world, and even decision (Such as being produced by people who literally ignored notes on inconsistencies).
And this isn't even to say how they decanonized long-established details from the original Japanese source for no reason besides it not being what most Western fans think about the series.
Like, why remove the idea that Eggman and Sonic had a long rivalry before Sonic 1? Why reduce the time it took for Tails to keep up with Sonic? Why ignore the implication that Shadow had altered memories? It's stuff that had been long established on the Japanese side, but now it's gone. But of course, keeping Prime as canon is somehow necessary.
Because at the same time they want to remove something from canon because of some light canonicity issue, they still want something like Prime to be canon, regardless of its inconsistencies in character, world, and even decision (Such as being produced by people who literally ignored notes on inconsistencies).
And this isn't even to say how they decanonized long-established details from the original Japanese source for no reason besides it not being what most Western fans think about the series.
Like, why remove the idea that Eggman and Sonic had a long rivalry before Sonic 1? Why reduce the time it took for Tails to keep up with Sonic? Why ignore the implication that Shadow had altered memories? It's stuff that had been long established on the Japanese side, but now it's gone. But of course, keeping Prime as canon is somehow necessary.
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Its still interesting that some fans have noticed that Sonic is written differently when most casuals would be "wtf are you talking about". This kind of style change has happened quite a bit. Early Modern era starting with Adventure vs Classics, then more simplified stories with Unleashed-LW, lol at Forces and use of Flynn for Frontiers and beyond.
But IDW comics specifically catch some ire. I still believe that many fans on social platforms and IDW staff likely think differently from ST's opinions, hence some localization difference in Japanese scripts and BoC having different writer. Hell, Ian's work on Frontiers and ShadowGens is much better than at IDW. Can it really just boil down to IDW dragging it down?
But IDW comics specifically catch some ire. I still believe that many fans on social platforms and IDW staff likely think differently from ST's opinions, hence some localization difference in Japanese scripts and BoC having different writer. Hell, Ian's work on Frontiers and ShadowGens is much better than at IDW. Can it really just boil down to IDW dragging it down?
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Have I opened Pandora's box?
I was just curious about how the wiki approach this type of things regarding the "Constant Inconsistency".
ShakeResounding
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Genuinely my least-favorite removal put of everything. Having Sonic and Eggman be long-time enemies before Sonic 1 added an extra layer to their history that was fascinating to ponder over. What a shame.
I cannot agree with you enough. Man, you mentioning this has me stewing in my feelings over it once again.
ShakeResounding
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LOL.Those 2 words will hunt us down forever
You've got it mostly spot-on, actually!
I would argue that Manuals can vary between 2 & 3 depending on consistency/amount of details added/what was retconned, but nothing that requires us to review them with intense scrutiny. It's mostly plain.
The funny thing about IDW has been referred to as "secondary canon" by Ian himself on a BumbleKast, and in the same one he mentioned that the games override any contradictions in the comic. So I say you probably have it in the right place.
Ultimately, though, Executor's comment is a pretty nice summary of what canon off-site is like.
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I've mentioned this before, but I think the main issue with IDW comes from its nature as a Western comic that's meant to be canon to a Japanese video game series. The way I see it, there's a LOT of factors that play into how IDW presents itself, and not everything can line up 100% accurately no matter how hard they try.
But at least IDW actually DOES try: as somebody pointed out, Prime's writers just straight up ignored notes about the inconsistencies it had...
TheStinkeer
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Actually I don't think it was retconned. Sonic Origins just shows Eggman up to no good and Sonic notices, so he races off to stop him. Nothing says they couldn't have met before
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Sonic acknowledged both The Backrooms and Sonic's Schoolhouse in one fell swoop:
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