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Sonic General Discussion Zone Act 1: New Frontiers

AyOgUyS said:
Anyone have more evidence for Low 1-C to 1-C base cast? I've been gathering feats for a possible CRT in the future (once the current stuff is resolved ofc) and this is what I currently have:

1. Base Sonic survives Time Eater's blows, and Time Eater is 1-C via threatening all space and time (Scales to Generations and onwards base Sonic and all those who scale to him)
2. The base cast fights Void, who is Low 1-C via threatening the Precioustone which sustains the currently accepted 5-D Maginaryworld (Scales to Sonic Shuffle and onwards base Sonic, Knuckles, and Amy, and all those who scale to them)
3. One Chaos Emerald forced back Time Eater, so maybe a single Emerald can be 1-C? And this would upgrade all characters who use Chaos Emerald power like Perfect Chaos, and this upscales the base cast since base Sonic beat Perfect Chaos in Generations (this also means all Super Forms are 1-C by default)...but I'm not too sure on this one
4. Infinite being said stronger than all pre-Forces enemies (which technically includes like Solaris and Time Eater) and base Sonic survives a beat down from Infinite and later beats him (I know this is contentious but with all the other evidence of the base cast being Low 1-C to even 1-C, just to a lesser extent than Super Forms, I don't think its too ridiculous) and as consistency for Infinite upscaling Super Form level characters, he fights Super Shadow in Sonic Speed Simulator so the intention from SEGA that he is indeed a Super level threat that gets surpassed by the base cast is clearly there (Scales to Forces onwards base Sonic and all those who scale to him)
5. Base Sonic surviving attacks from the Titans who are currently 1-C I think (Scales to Frontiers onwards base Sonic and all those who scale to him)
6. Base Sonic and Knuckles surviving attacks from a casual Super Neo (I don't think this alone is enough for any upscaling but with all the other feats, I don't find it too ridiculous anymore)...tho hey maybe this is a super neo upscale from potentially 1-C to solidly 1-C if the base cast being 1-C gets accepted
7. The base cast being able to deal minor but still visible damage to Master Overlord (Scales to everyone in the fight who dealt damage which off of memory are: Sonic, Knuckles, and Blaze...and ofc anybody else who scales to them)
8. Sage briefly blocking attacks from The End which I think is already accepted and on her profile (Not sure anybody else in the main cast directly scales but still)

I'd appreciate feedback on what I should add, revise, or remove.
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I really wouldn't argue this at all or make a revision, esp since it would 100% open the floodgates of people trying to downgrade Sonic among how big if a revision it would be esp with everything else the Sonic verse is going through, but if you want to argue it

Remove 3 and 4. Chaos Emeralds repelling the Time Eater would end up being an endless loop, especially for being in the same game. Sonic beats Perfect Chaos, Perfect Chaos is weaker than Time Eater, Perfect Chaos is empowered by the Emeralds, but Perfect Chaos is still weaker than Time Eater who was repelled by a weakened Chaos Emerald. Infinite can upscale from stuff like the Super Egg Robot and True Area 51 Boss, but top tier Super bosses are a bit too big. Esp if the only pieces of evidence are a Roblox game and promotional material. Eggman's statement could work for Egg Salamander/Wizard and Time Eater, but it'd be much safer just to have Infinite where he is now.

You can make the argument that the Chaos Emeralds > Precioustone as a baseline, plus the Chaos Emeralds power Cyber Space without emotional amping which is a whole reality and on this wiki, is low 1-C. And The End was weakened being sealed inside Supreme, so that avoids a Perfect Chaos situation
 
ShakeResounding said:
If he can be damaged by higher AP alone and nothing else, then it isn't true Invulnerability. Thankfully, that never happens with Super Sonic.

Solaris? Chaos Emeralds' energy. Egg Salamander? Sol Emeralds' energy. Dark Gaia? Chaos Energy. Starfall Titans? Literally said to be fueled by "Chaos Emerald energy" verbatim. The End? Cyber Corruption, which stems from Chaos Energy. I don't want to go through every example though, that will be saved for the thread.
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Feels strange replying to such an old comment.

I just remember that a good example of "greater AP being useless against Invulnerability" would be the fight with the Egg Wizard. IIRC, the mech was amped by the Power of the Stars, which was stated to be superior to both the Chaos & Sol Emeralds, and yet... it couldn't properly harm Super Sonic & Burning Blaze ("only" stunning them).
 
TheStinkeer said:
I really wouldn't argue this at all or make a revision, esp since it would 100% open the floodgates of people trying to downgrade Sonic among how big if a revision it would be esp with everything else the Sonic verse is going through, but if you want to argue it

Remove 3 and 4. Chaos Emeralds repelling the Time Eater would end up being an endless loop, especially for being in the same game. Sonic beats Perfect Chaos, Perfect Chaos is weaker than Time Eater, Perfect Chaos is empowered by the Emeralds, but Perfect Chaos is still weaker than Time Eater who was repelled by a weakened Chaos Emerald. Infinite can upscale from stuff like the Super Egg Robot and True Area 51 Boss, but top tier Super bosses are a bit too big. Esp if the only pieces of evidence are a Roblox game and promotional material. Eggman's statement could work for Egg Salamander/Wizard and Time Eater, but it'd be much safer just to have Infinite where he is now.

You can make the argument that the Chaos Emeralds > Precioustone as a baseline, plus the Chaos Emeralds power Cyber Space without emotional amping which is a whole reality and on this wiki, is low 1-C. And The End was weakened being sealed inside Supreme, so that avoids a Perfect Chaos situation
Click to expand...
Thanks for the input!
 
TheStinkeer said:
I really wouldn't argue this at all or make a revision, esp since it would 100% open the floodgates of people trying to downgrade Sonic among how big if a revision it would be esp with everything else the Sonic verse is going through, but if you want to argue it
Click to expand...
yea I’m aware I’m gonna wait for everything else to be over first
 
TheStinkeer said:
I really wouldn't argue this at all or make a revision, esp since it would 100% open the floodgates of people trying to downgrade Sonic among how big if a revision it would be esp with everything else the Sonic verse is going through, but if you want to argue it

Remove 3 and 4. Chaos Emeralds repelling the Time Eater would end up being an endless loop, especially for being in the same game. Sonic beats Perfect Chaos, Perfect Chaos is weaker than Time Eater, Perfect Chaos is empowered by the Emeralds, but Perfect Chaos is still weaker than Time Eater who was repelled by a weakened Chaos Emerald. Infinite can upscale from stuff like the Super Egg Robot and True Area 51 Boss, but top tier Super bosses are a bit too big. Esp if the only pieces of evidence are a Roblox game and promotional material. Eggman's statement could work for Egg Salamander/Wizard and Time Eater, but it'd be much safer just to have Infinite where he is now.

You can make the argument that the Chaos Emeralds > Precioustone as a baseline, plus the Chaos Emeralds power Cyber Space without emotional amping which is a whole reality and on this wiki, is low 1-C. And The End was weakened being sealed inside Supreme, so that avoids a Perfect Chaos situation
Click to expand...
Aren't the Chaos Emeralds aspatial/atemporal? It's why collecting the Chaos Emeralds from other points in time wasn't an option. That and the Chaos Emeralds are known for having a varying level of power, so I'm having trouble believing in that endless loop argument.
 
ZothythoTheNephalem said:
Aren't the Chaos Emeralds aspatial/atemporal? It's why collecting the Chaos Emeralds from other points in time wasn't an option. That and the Chaos Emeralds are known for having a varying level of power, so I'm having trouble believing in that endless loop argument.
Click to expand...
Yes, but the point of the argument is to apply the power of the Chaos Emerald repelling the Time Eater to earlier scenarios like Perfect Chaos who appears in the exact same game. It makes more sense if we don't do this
 
TheStinkeer said:
Yes, but the point of the argument is to apply the power of the Chaos Emerald repelling the Time Eater to earlier scenarios like Perfect Chaos who appears in the exact same game. It makes more sense if we don't do this
Click to expand...
guys y'all gotta hear me on this one: a single chaos Emerald is bare minimum outer
 
AyOgUyS said:
guys y'all gotta hear me on this one: a single chaos Emerald is bare minimum outer
Click to expand...
Boundless and beyond the tiering system, actually. This is supported by Tails replying to me on Twitter (it was the real Tails I swear) and backing me up when I said that Sonic, Goku, and Frisk solo fiction
 
TheStinkeer said:
Boundless and beyond the tiering system, actually. This is supported by Tails replying to me on Twitter (it was the real Tails I swear) and backing me up when I said that Sonic, Goku, and Frisk solo fiction
Click to expand...
Holy shit it's the second coming of ZaStando, he was ahead of the curb once again /jk

But Imma be real with y'all for a sec, Mazinger Zero CLEARS not just Super Robot fiction, but all of fiction in general due to Photon Power, which destroyed all of Twitter. Thus any and all Twitter statements about any other fictional universe are invalid compared to Koji Kabuto's sheer might, willpower, and courage.
HGut0tEb0AA6c_i
 
TheStinkeer said:
Yes, but the point of the argument is to apply the power of the Chaos Emerald repelling the Time Eater to earlier scenarios like Perfect Chaos who appears in the exact same game. It makes more sense if we don't do this
Click to expand...
Yeah, but as said before the Chaos Emeralds have a varying level of power anyway and isn't like Chaos himself is attempting to repel the Time Eater. Not only so, but he only possesses the dark energy of the Chaos Emeralds, not the emeralds themselves. That might just be an Emerald thing than just being associated with chaos energy.
 
ShakeResounding said:
That Invulnerability revamp thread has passed and is about to be applied, likely with a follow-up thread to determine who qualifies.
Click to expand...
Sorry to ask something that's probably obvious but is this the thread about invincibility site wide, or invincibility for Sonic?
 
TheStinkeer said:
Clicked the post and was forced to see the "TE just BFR stuff" take so unfortunately I gotta report you a billion times sorry /j
Click to expand...
Feels like most "powerscalers" outside the wiki are kind of oblivious to the huge amount of statements regarding what happened in Generations.

Things get more messy when we take in consideration that EE and AP can be connected once this hax works on a universal (and above) range and it's done by a Tier 2 (and above) nuke.
 
Last edited:
ChaoticSapphire said:
Feels like most "powerscalers" outside the wiki are kind of oblivious to the huge amount of statements regarding what happened in Generations.

Things get more messy when we take in consideration that EE and AP can be connected once this hax works on a universal (and above) range and it's done by a Tier 2 (and above) nuke.
Click to expand...
TBF a lot of the statements of TE erasing all space-time are in external stuff rather than the game itself, the game also has the whole "jumping back and forth through time" thing which also doesn't look too good esp without considering other dimensions in the Sonic Verse for him to jump through time in (or the Hypertimeline.) But yeah I agree with you, there were even people who straight up said the Time Eater doesn't erase anything 😭
 
"The Master Emerald cannot exist in both the past and future"

I always find it funny any time that the Master Emerald is used for anything and no one acknowledges the bizarre property that Sonic Rivals gave about it being a singular object across space-time, but one directly mentioning it not being able to exist in two instances of time simultaneously is by far the funniest moment due to how specific it is.
 
Executor_N0 said:
Reading them it really makes me sad that they had to get rid of the cyber skills (Same goes for Superstars Emerald Powers being related to a single place instead of being the power of the emeralds themselves).
Click to expand...
Even tho they were used in OUTER SPACE... really feels like an excuse
 
ShakeResounding said:
late 2017
Click to expand...
Nearly a decade ago...


I remember I first got into powerscaling by taking a liking to how beautiful the "Magic & Skills system" in Slime was.

I even managed to be part of the Discord server known as "Tensura Café" and I was still in there when Rimuru got the "questionable" Immeasurable Speed upgrade.

All happened about 3 years ago.
 
ChaoticSapphire said:
Nearly a decade ago...


I remember I first got into powerscaling by taking a liking to how beautiful the "Magic & Skills system" in Slime was.

I even managed to be part of the Discord server known as "Tensura Café" and I was still in there when Rimuru got the "questionable" Immeasurable Speed upgrade.

All happened about 3 years ago.
Click to expand...
I BEEN SAID THIS. BTW.

Tensura is so cool. I like how it actually addresses the fantasy power system in a way that is organic, makes sense, and has real functionality instead of being "le op cheat skill that always wins". That and the way skills and magic works in that world is well-crafted and the best I've seen in a franchise rather than just being "a thing" that exists for the sake of upkeeping the fact that it's a fantasy world.
 
MysticMania said:
That's cool!
Click to expand...
Very much so! In a sense, I feel like I've been here to see the VSBW!Sonic fandom evolve into a group that is more tolerable than a fair amount of other places where Sonic fans converge.
MysticMania said:
I'm here because someone thought I bought Immeasurable speed Sonic. So they linked a Solaris downgrade thread, and that ended up convincing me of Immeasurable speed Sonic.
Click to expand...
Irony is one of the most beautiful forms of poetry, ain't it?
 
Decided to watch Sonic Prime, Sonic with a small amount of prism energy just by running creates a low quadrillions c shockwave, good feat to scale the base cast to since Shadow matches that Sonic in speed.
 
JJSliderman said:
Decided to watch Sonic Prime,
Click to expand...
I'm surprised you haven't until now, tbh. I thoroughly disliked many aspects but it was enjoyable enough to watch with my little sister.
JJSliderman said:
Sonic with a small amount of prism energy just by running creates a low quadrillions c shockwave, good feat to scale the base cast to since Shadow matches that Sonic in speed.
Click to expand...
LOL. Well I guess it's good you decided to watch it, because I certainly wasn't gonna rewatch it to piece that together lol. Helps to have good MFTL+ feats.

Can't even argue Shadow was amped either because he avoided the Shattering altogether.
 
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