A Song of Ice and Fire: Combat and Reaction Speed Upgrade (Staff Needed)

[TheSwordOfTheEvening]

This calculation was accepted and would therefore give Khrazz (who currently does not have a profile) Subsonic combat and reaction speed. It would also upgrade Barristan Selmy to Subsonic combat and reaction speed, as he was able to calmly react to and block Khrazz's blows.

There are many speed feats in this verse that are comparable to this one, as well as one feat in the books that is fully comparable. However, I specifically suggested this feat to be calculated because it could also be used to upgrade other well trained warriors in this verse to Subsonic speed. Selmy stated that Khrazz was as fast as any man he had ever fought, essentially as fast as any well trained fighter.

 

[TheSwordOfTheEvening]

I completely forgot to mention that this upgrade would not apply to Daenerys Targaryen, Brandon Stark (son of Eddard Stark), Varys and Melisandre.

There are also some uncertainties regarding where certain characters speed would scale at this point. The following characters are affected:

Arya Stark: She has received some training, but nothing comparable to that of a trained Westerosi knight. However, she was able to react to Syrio’s strikes, which came at her in a blur, although he was definitely holding back against her and even warning her before attacking. Arya even noticed that Syrio was toying with her during their training when he faced five Lannister guards simultaneously and beat them, it also became clear that he was significantly faster than he had shown himself to be.

Petyr Baelish and Tyrion Lannister: Petyr appears to have martial training, as he showed to be skilled and very precise with a dagger. Looking at his past, he even challenged Brandon Stark (Eddard’s older brother who was a skilled swordsman) to a duel out of love for Catelyn. Petyr was curbstomped, but that’s also because he was still a boy and physically smaller, whereas Brandon was a grown man in his 20s. Despite this, Petyr seemed to be able to hold his own to some extent I guess? Tyrion is trained in arms, as shown in his profile. He has participated in multiple battles and has faced & killed trained opponents in combat.

There are also some uncertainties regarding the wights. They are stated to be slow and clumsy, but this may be more about their intelligence and posture. One example that comes to mind is the fight between Jon Snow, his direwolf and a wight. The wight managed to bodyslam Jon into a table before Jon could react. Of course factors such as fear may have played a significant role in that moment. Jon is a highly trained fighter who was trained by Winterfell’s master-at-arms, Ser Rodrik Cassel (who currently does not have a profile). There are strong statements regarding the training of a noble born in Westeros. According to Jaime, a noble born child begins training as soon as they learn to walk, spending years training until fighting becomes as natural as breathing. This statement comes from a semi-canon source, but this particular claim is canon, as it is also included and implied in the books.

 

[TheSwordOfTheEvening]

Bump

 

[The_Renegade_Slugger]

Petyr Baelish and Tyrion Lannister: Petyr appears to have martial training, as he showed to be skilled and very precise with a dagger. Looking at his past, he even challenged Brandon Stark (Eddard’s older brother who was a skilled swordsman) to a duel out of love for Catelyn. Petyr was curbstomped, but that’s also because he was still a boy and physically smaller, whereas Brandon was a grown man in his 20s. Despite this, Petyr seemed to be able to hold his own to some extent I guess? Tyrion is trained in arms, as shown in his profile. He has participated in multiple battles and has faced & killed trained opponents in combat.

There are also some uncertainties regarding the wights. They are stated to be slow and clumsy, but this may be more about their intelligence and posture. One example that comes to mind is the fight between Jon Snow, his direwolf and a wight. The wight managed to bodyslam Jon into a table before Jon could react. Of course factors such as fear may have played a significant role in that moment. Jon is a highly trained fighter who was trained by Winterfell’s master-at-arms, Ser Rodrik Cassel (who currently does not have a profile). There are strong statements regarding the training of a noble born in Westeros. According to Jaime, a noble born child begins training as soon as they learn to walk, spending years training until fighting becomes as natural as breathing. This statement comes from a semi-canon source, but this particular claim is canon, as it is also included and implied in the books.

Disagree with Petyr scaling. Having fancy knife-balancing skills doesn't mean you're a skilled warrior. Nor does getting stomped by a warrior when you were ten; imo the Brandon duel is more or less unusable for scaling, Brandon was explicitly holding back because of Catelyn's begging to literally spare Petyr's life, and he still kicked his ass. He's likely improved since then, sure, but there's nothing to suggest he suddenly became a great warrior (which would lowkey go against his character too: "I'm not gonna fight them, I'm gonna **** them." Right?)

Neutral on Tyrion

Agree with Wights scaling. I always interpreted them as moving in a jerky/erratic way (like zombie's often do in fiction), in which case I don't think it's too hard to rationalize them as both slow and clumsy, and having bursts of speed that can blitz Jon.

Arya Stark: She has received some training, but nothing comparable to that of a trained Westerosi knight. However, she was able to react to Syrio’s strikes, which came at her in a blur, although he was definitely holding back against her and even warning her before attacking. Arya even noticed that Syrio was toying with her during their training when he faced five Lannister guards simultaneously and beat them, it also became clear that he was significantly faster than he had shown himself to be.

Arya's speed needs an overhaul in general, but I disagree with scaling her here. She isn't comparable to Syrio. He was holding back massively while training her, and Arya still perceived him as a blur. Logically this is exactly how a subsonic character would do an athletic human character.

Also I don't really like this calc in general, the language feels hyperbolic. But if it's accepted it's accepted, I'm no CGM. (And hey, I won't complain too much about ASOIAF upgrades lol)

 

[TheSwordOfTheEvening]

Disagree with Petyr scaling. Having fancy knife-balancing skills doesn't mean you're a skilled warrior. Nor does getting stomped by a warrior when you were ten; imo the Brandon duel is more or less unusable for scaling, Brandon was explicitly holding back because of Catelyn's begging to literally spare Petyr's life, and he still kicked his ass. He's likely improved since then, sure, but there's nothing to suggest he suddenly became a great warrior (which would lowkey go against his character too: "I'm not gonna fight them, I'm gonna **** them." Right?)

Neutral on Tyrion

Agree with Wights scaling. I always interpreted them as moving in a jerky/erratic way (like zombie's often do in fiction), in which case I don't think it's too hard to rationalize them as both slow and clumsy, and having bursts of speed that can blitz Jon.
Arya's speed needs an overhaul in general, but I disagree with scaling her here. She isn't comparable to Syrio. He was holding back massively while training her, and Arya still perceived him as a blur. Logically this is exactly how a subsonic character would do an athletic human character.

I think you might’ve slightly misunderstood what I was getting at. I wasn't suggesting that Petyr, Arya, Tyrion, or the Wights should automatically scale to Subsonic. I was just pointing out some uncertainties and who might or might not be affected by the upgrade.

 

[Ezaru]

So, moving as a blur can be calced using distance and human perception speed?

 

[TheSwordOfTheEvening]

So, moving as a blur can be calced using distance and human perception speed?

Yes, blur is being translated into a human perception time assumption and then used with distance to calculate speed

 

[Ezaru]

Yes, blur is being translated into a human perception time assumption and then used with distance to calculate speed

Huh, I was under the impression you needed to disappear from sight for that

That is good to know. Sorry for the only tangentially related question

 

[The_Renegade_Slugger]

I think you might’ve slightly misunderstood what I was getting at. I wasn't suggesting that Petyr, Arya, Tyrion, or the Wights should automatically scale to Subsonic. I was just pointing out some uncertainties and who might or might not be affected by the upgrade.

Yes and I'm saying Petyr and Arya shouldn't be affected

 

[TheSwordOfTheEvening]

Bump

 

[TheSwordOfTheEvening]

Bump

 

[TheSwordOfTheEvening]

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[Ser_Hakim_Dayne]

Bump ASOIAF characters will be faster than LOTR characters

 

[TheSwordOfTheEvening]

Bump

 

[The_Renegade_Slugger]

Bump (Sword I sent you a message on your message wall)

 

[TheSwordOfTheEvening]

Bump

 

[TheSwordOfTheEvening]

Bump

 

[TheSwordOfTheEvening]

Bump

 

[TheSwordOfTheEvening]

Bump

 

[TheSwordOfTheEvening]

Bump

 

[TheSwordOfTheEvening]

Bump

 

[The_Renegade_Slugger]

Bumpp

 

[The_Renegade_Slugger]

Bumppp

 

[The_Renegade_Slugger]

Bumpppp

 

[The_Renegade_Slugger]

Bumppppp

 

[Ser_Hakim_Dayne]

I asked some staff members on their walls to take a look at this CRT.