Demon King Daimao High 1A+ CRT

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Spoiler: Important Concepts

Spoiler: Stories and Reality

Existence and reality can only be perceived as story. In other words anything that exists in reality can only exist as a story, time and causality thus are dictated by stories.

And beyond that. There is a story.
Thus, reality became reality.
To recognize reality, stories are needed. And this is because relationships with others are born here. But recreating all those possible stories took Akuto what amounted to an infinite span of time. Because, of course, he needed to test every story. But even so, the stories instantly became more complicated.
~ Demon King Daimaō Volume 13 Chapter 4

People can only recognize reality through stories. And he was searching for the end of stories. This meant he was looking for the end of reality. For an end to time.
~ Demon King Daimaō Volume 13 Chapter 4

Yes. Humans never die of their own free will.
So what is “suicide”, then? There can only be one answer. Somebody is controlling our brains. I’ll say it again. Our minds are infected with a virus called “stories” that someone has injected us with. That’s why humans commit suicide. That’s why they do reckless things, and die.
But while stories are parasites, they can also bring gifts to humanity. People can’t perceive time objectively. They perceive time as stories. And sentience couldn’t have been born without the ability to perceive time. Stories are what make us conscious beings.
So what happens if we give up stories? No. We have to give them up. If we don’t, we’re finished.
All stories have an end. And when that time comes for humanity, it means our destruction. And when that time comes, we’ll know why the being who planted stories within us did so.
Will something hatch from within our brains?
Or after death, will we be devoured by some huge creature?
And if that’s true, can we give up stories now?
As primitive humans, we must think about what it was that gave rise to “stories”.
So... Let’s go see.
~ Demon King Daimaou Volume 13 Foreword

“That is your mistake. The false story that you’ve rejected for so long... If it is false, then the story where I am a savior is false too. Yes. I am who I am, and nothing more. Anything which is enough of a story that it cannot reject causality, is a mistake,” she said calmly.
“What...?”
In a vague way... he knew what she meant. But if that was true... if that was really true...
“Tell me... What should I do?”
“Nobody knows the answer to that. But only the passage of time will tell you of your mistakes. That’s all there is to it. With great power comes great responsibility. That is the way of mankind. The truth is that a great power can be used in any way its wielder wishes. But the results of how that power is used will always exist.”
“That’s crazy. That’s causality itself. Are you saying that you’re god, or something?”
“No. I am the beginning of the self. The first point of its existence. Since I have existed from the start of time, I have seen many mistakes made. Even I don’t know what is right. What those with power desire, is what becomes everything that is right.”
~ Demon King Daimaō Volume 12 Chapter 1

Birth of a Universe is the same as the birth of a story. It starts from Faceless universe then comes the Gravity Universe, and then anti-gravity universe being the next stages after which comes the Main setting.

“The birth of a universe is like the birth of a story. If a universe is a collection of stories, there could be any number of beings on the outside that are like us.”
~ Demon King Daimaō Volume 13 Chapter 4

“The concept of ‘cruel’ is only something you feel because you view things through stories. You will simply start over from the beginning. In the next instant, you’ll go to the void universe, and then you will shift to the faceless universe, and then the gravity universe. Though it may take tens of thousands of years.”
“Don’t say that! Am I starting the story over from scratch?”
~ Demon King Daimaō Volume 13 Chapter 6

“The Antigravity Universe allows love to exist.”
Beings there consumed each other, but the moment they collided, sometimes they shared their being, and gave birth to new existence.
“Me!”
“You!” “I killed!”
“I increased!”
Lively voices filled the space.
“I guess the universe I know is really close. Is that all the universes, then?” Akuto asked. And the outer gods said no.
“These are the original models that gave birth to the universes.”
Their voices compelled him to look behind them. He did so, looking out towards the horizon. There were shadows! Shadows! Shadows! as far as he could see. These were not simple figures like the ones he’d seen so far. They had different clothes. Different genders. Their shadows flickered in the corner of his eye. And within them, they had billions of beings. Each of the shadows had ghosts within them, just like Akuto.
~ Demon King Daimaō Volume 13 Chapter 4

Spoiler: The fundamental aspects of existence— Souls: Humans and Gods.

“But in the end, the outer gods themselves are fictional. They just can’t tell the difference between gods, humanity, and ghosts themselves. Only when a higher being tells you, and your universe is walled off, can you clearly understand what’s a god, what’s a human, and what’s a ghost. You understand who they are inside.”
~ Demon King Daimaō Volume 13 Chapter 4

​

Soul, Identity and body: Thought and existence/Solipsism"​

To have an Identity is to have a self.

“My inability to separate myself from the idea that I am me is what gives me a self. It is the same question as asking why humanity and civilization were born.”
~ Demon King Daimaō Volume 9 Chapter 4

A way of thinking that is conscious of the fact that you are yourself, and makes that fact the center of your thoughts. Neither the gods nor the Liradans were originally equipped with such ‘selves.’ Zero is the only one. And that’s what allows the gods the capacity for independent thought. That ‘self’ must be locked away. And since the self is a black box, we have to touch Zero’s true body directly and take physical measures.”
~ Demon King Daimaō Volume 9 Chapter 2

To have a self is to have a soul.

“We’ve solved most of the world’s mysteries, but the problem of the soul remains unsolved. The fact that we have a soul separate from our bodies, like I was able to prove, is now certain. But we don’t know where that soul comes from. You all remember that Zero had a soul, right?”
Yoshie continued to elaborate.
“We say that Liradans develop ‘selves’ if they spend enough time with humans, right? If the soul and the self are the same thing, then that means the soul is transmissible. We may live in a far stranger world than we think we do.”
~ Demon King Daimaō Volume 10 Chapter 4

To have a Body/external walls is to have a distinction/difference between one and other. This distinction allows interaction between one and the other, interaction which leads to annihilation of the distinction still helps the being realise its own existence and its separation from others. This realisation leads to attaining individuality.

“In the Faceless Universe, existence melds together. Primitive life maintains external walls for the sake of its existence, but two life forms meeting results in the destruction of their walls. They devour each other. There, the existences point at each other, and shout, ‘You!’”
An image of the Faceless Universe’s vision spread out before them. There were multiple beings there. They were akin to an amoeba, or a water droplet in zero gravity, or perhaps a cloud, and were squirming in the void as if seeking each other out. They made the same sound as the ones in the void universe.
“You!” Sometimes, they would run into each other by chance. And in that moment,
“You!”
The sound was the same as before, but now it sounded joyous.
“It’s a different ‘you’ than the Void Universe. It’s a ‘you’ of discovery,” Akuto whispered.
The red figure agreed.
“Consumption. Only in that instant is another noticed.
‘You! I finally found you!’ it screams.”
The image changed. Two beings collided and became one. Then, another voice was born.
“But in the next instant, there’s no telling who’s who. However, what should be a single being is instead filled with a voice inside. Who! Who! Who! In the Faceless Universe, there is a single instant of ‘You’, followed by an eternity of terrible ‘Who!’.”
“When another is found, they cease to be another. However, others make you realize, whether you want to or not, that you yourself exist.
~ Demon King Daimaō Volume 13 Chapter 4

And beyond that. There is a story.
Thus, reality became reality.
To recognize reality, stories are needed. And this is because relationships with others are born here. But recreating all those possible stories took Akuto what amounted to an infinite span of time. Because, of course, he needed to test every story. But even so, the stories instantly became more complicated.
~ Demon King Daimaō Volume 13 Chapter 4

These primitive beings with body and a self can think, and this thought leads to creation of Universe. The Universe considered "subjective" as reality is merely imagination of beings— stories and thus a Solipsistic world.

"This means that they're unable to think like someone with a body would. Strictly speaking, there's no 'they.' They don't exist, and yet they think. Their very existence is a paradox. They're computer circuits, that's all. But how many circuits, and what kind of circuits, are required for thought to occur... nobody knows. All we know is that once there's a certain number of them, they possess a will of their own. It's the same way we don't know where exactly 'consciousness' exists in the brain. Since they have no bodies, there is no distinction between themselves and the outside world. And thus, they can contemplate infinity. I don't mean infinity in the numerical sense - they can contemplate infinitely dense infinities. And this means that they can reach a place that would seem, to biological life, to be infinitely far back in the past. These gods without a body can reach back to the thoughts of single-celled organisms. The birth of life, and thus, the birth of thought. And it is thought itself that creates the universe. Once again, I don't mean the objective universe. There's a school of thought that says that if the world were born five minutes ago, and we were all implanted with fake memories, none of us would be able to prove it. But that's only true if you have a body. It doesn't apply to thought without a thinker. Essentially, the universe is real, and time only flows in one direction."
~ Demon King Daimaō Volume 5 Chapter 3

Consequently, stories cannot exist without beings retaining their identities.

Looking back at the way this world was created, it was clear that the Law of Identity must be hiding, unseen by the Demon King. The Demon King was omnipresent in this world, but without the characters’ identities, that is, in the mathematical sense, unless the characters were themselves, the stories couldn’t exist.
~ Demon King Daimaō Volume 13 Chapter 5

Souls: Humanity and Gods(God Universes/Outer Gods)​

Humans are all characters in a story with a role, with the Gods of the stories being the MCs of their own story.

Until then, you could say that humanity shared a story. Everyone, essentially, was playing their own role in the story. That’s why the world refused to allow anybody but Akuto to alter it.
But what happens if a story ceases to be shared?
The answer is: chaos.
The gods of the outer universe were, you could say, their own main characters, with their own main stories. So multiple protagonists tried to advance their own stories within the same place. It may have been chaos, but there was no conflict.
~ Demon King Daimaō Volume 13 Chapter 4

Gods subsume Characters as their existence, their personalities being measly the constructs of the story(will be addressed in the next subsection).

“Neither the Demon King nor the Law of Identity treat people as complete personalities. They each have their own inner world... but in the face of the story, people’s inner personalities are meaningless. That’s going to be true even after the world is reconstructed.”
~ Demon King Daimaō Volume 13 Chapter 3

God Universes are the very Model of the story, embodying the fundamental structure of the Universe.

“These are the original models that gave birth to the universes.”
Their voices compelled him to look behind them. He did so, looking out towards the horizon. There were shadows! Shadows! Shadows! as far as he could see. These were not simple figures like the ones he’d seen so far. They had different clothes. Different genders. Their shadows flickered in the corner of his eye. And within them, they had billions of beings. Each of the shadows had ghosts within them, just like Akuto.
“Are they all like me?” he asked, and the outer gods disappeared without answering. The people, or universes, that he’d glimpsed vanished as well. Only Boichiro and Akuto remained at the table.
“They’re probably the same as us.”
They sat in shocked silence for a while, but eventually Boichiro was the first to speak.
“They, and you, are universes. God Universes, I guess you could call them. No, you could say that until you unleashed the possibilities of the world, you alone were like them.”
~ Demon King Daimaō Volume 13 Chapter 4

Void Universe, Faceless Universe, Gravity Universe and Anti-Gravity Universe being the first few of these Gods, when summoned by Akuto.

“Outside of this world, Keena and the outer gods are of equal importance, no doubt. The Law of Identity itself is no exception
either.”
Akuto thought for a moment about what Boichiro said. Then, he spoke.
“I’ll summon the outer gods.”
~ Demon King Daimaō Volume 13 Chapter 4

“I am the Void Universe,” the black figure said. It was a strange voice, only audible if you strained to hear.
“The Void Universe?”
Akuto’s question seemed to get through to it. There was a faint answer, difficult to hear, but clear if you focused on the sound and not the words.
“A universe with no stories. No matter. Only a single voice. The
only things there are the occasional voices meaning things like ‘you’, ‘thou’, ‘vous’ or ‘sue’.”
~ Demon King Daimaō Volume 13 Chapter 4

“I am the Faceless Universe.”
It was a different voice than the black figure. But its voice was just like the other, so faint it was hard to hear.
“...The same as the Faceless Power?” Akuto asked, and the red figure answered, and continued.
“In the Faceless Universe, existence melds together. Primitive life maintains external walls for the sake of its existence, but two life forms meeting results in the destruction of their walls. They devour each other. There, the existences point at each other, and shout, ‘You!’”
~ Demon King Daimaō Volume 13 Chapter 4

“I am the Gravity Universe. There, existence becomes one with its outer walls and gains mass.”
The image turned to that of the gravity universe. There was light and darkness. And existence there, while still amoeba-like, had clearly defined walls separating it from its exterior. They were like the walls of a cell, shining in the reflected light.
~ Demon King Daimaō Volume 13 Chapter 4

“I am the Antigravity Universe. Here, existence increases in number. Walls swell and split.”
“Voices fill the space. Me! Me! Me!”
“Me!”
It was a voice of newborn joy.
“The Antigravity Universe allows love to exist.”
~ Demon King Daimaō Volume 13 Chapter 4

With there being infinite of these God Universes.

“That’s a little off. ‘Other dimension’ and ‘outer universe’ are two words for the same thing. We don’t know a lot about other dimensions, except that there’s probably infinite numbers of them. But as for the others, you’re correct. And the Law of Identity is involved in them all. It’s likely that she made them. And that’s why they’re relatively easy to understand.”
~ Demon King Daimaō Volume 13 Chapter 1

Spoiler: Elements of a story: Personalities, concepts and ghosts

Personalities ​

beings with self/souls are the eternal aspects of existence that embody/play a role in a story.

“...Even the space you have full control over was invaded by the outer gods. The real universe is doubtless no exception. If you attain true satisfaction and go to your death, this space will cease to exist. And then all will turn to dust. Even eternal beings like us, who’ve been reincarnated to carry out our roles, will cease to exist.”
~ Demon King Daimaō Volume 13 Chapter 4

Personalities are acquired by these beings with self/souls as per the role played in a story. This can be understood by these various points.

• Hiroshi and Boichiro sacrificing their personalities in TLOI's world and reconstructed as personalities serving the role of hero in Akuto's world, even when fused retaining their self.

“There is a way. We go back inside the Demon King’s world. No, we go inside, but we interfere with it without being caught up in it.
We can move upon the line of history drawn by the Law of Identity. Of course, there will be sacrifices, though.”
“Sacrifices?”
“We’re the ones who intervene in the Demon King’s world. Not our individual personalities.”
Boichiro spoke with a strange sort of resolve. There was something in his voice that made Brave uneasy.
“What do you mean by ‘sacrifices’?”
“Neither the Demon King nor the Law of Identity treat people as complete personalities. They each have their own inner world... but in the face of the story, people’s inner personalities are meaningless. That’s going to be true even after the world is reconstructed.”
“I see...” Brave said, and sighed.
“We’ll be treated as a personality that has been reconstructed to serve as the hero.”
“That’s right. Probably because that’s how the Law of Identity wants it. That’s what it means to be a character.”
“I don’t want that to happen to me,” Brave said. But Boichiro was no longer in front of him. He could feel memories, a mind, and knowledge flooding into him, and he closed his eyes to examine each in turn. He kept breathing softly, and then looked up at the sky.
“I understand. We need to show something to the Law of
Identity.”
~ Demon King Daimaō Volume 13 Chapter 3

“Right now, I’m basically fused with Boichiro. Not only do I have his knowledge, I have his sarcastic personality as well. I’ve lived a whole life without value. As a side character.”
~ Demon King Daimaō Volume 13 Chapter 4

Hiroshi’s tone suddenly changed. He stepped away from the small table Akuto was sitting at and went around to the longer one.“
Maybe this is to be expected, since you’re the Demon King, but you shouldn’t need that kind of forgiveness. You don’t want to claim that you are the Demon King, I’m sure.”
Hiroshi’s face had, at some point, turned into Boichiro’s.
~ Demon King Daimaō Volume 13 Chapter 4

• Or the many roles assumed by beings in the stories tested by Akuto.

Akuto tried conflict with the outer gods several times. Sometimes he won. In the academy in another world, a story was born where Akuto, bossed around by Fujiko, helped her with her plan for world conquest. There, Fujiko’s world conquest never ended, and the story ended without Akuto and Fujiko even kissing.
The test of that possibility ended.
Sometimes, the outer gods won.
February 23rd, 1945. Dresden.
Akuto was there.
The allies launched a completely meaningless bombing raid, and both he and Junko were caught up in a terrible explosion. Akuto was badly injured, and could only watch as Junko died in front of him.
After that, he stood in the city as a wounded veteran, living off donations, until he died from malnutrition. That possibility ended there.
Akuto was born with the strange power to see ghosts. Using that power, he solved complex mysteries with the help of Korone, a ghost.
Hundreds of thousands of stories were tested, and all of them discarded.
July, 1950. Korea.
People belonging to the Bodo league were gathered from nearby villages in an old cobalt mine that the Japanese army had run during its occupation, and massacred. They were suspected of being communists. However, the Bodo League was created to re-educate communists.
And what was worse, in an effort to increase its numbers, the league had begun offering employment to anyone who joined it, which meant that most of its members had no idea what communism was. There were barely any communists there who would sympathize with North Korea. The cobalt mine had been chosen because it would make it easy to bury the bodies.
Akuto was killed there. He’d been a member of the league. What shocked him, just before his death, was that the Korean police who killed him didn’t even know what communism was.
Yoshie was reborn in another world, carrying her memories of her previous life. This other world was medieval, and she used the power of science to do great deeds there. This story was easily ended when he realized that the ending wouldn’t be a story. He couldn’t be sure that it wouldn’t end with the modern world being proven superior to the medieval one.
Junko ran away from home. She’d always been a wild child, so her parents didn’t go to the police. She was walking down the street at night when she was kidnapped by a band of thugs. When she told them her story, they realized that no one would look for her. So they drugged her, raped her, and dumped her in the mountains. They’d given her enough drugs to cause an overdose, and she died in the mountains. Her body was found, but her killers never were.
Akuto was an ordinary boy who was visited by a ninja. The ninja’s name was Junko. She was a beautiful girl, but had grown up in the countryside with no knowledge of the modern world. She causes chaos in Akuto’s peaceful town. Countless variations of this story were tried, but it ultimately became clear that it would never see a real ending. Thus, it was abandoned.
Fujiko was born to wealthy parents. Her parents, however, were gaudy socialites who disliked having to care for a child. Despite the fact that they had the money to hire nannies, though, they held the odd belief that it was a parent’s responsibility to care for a child themselves. Fujiko was, of course, abused almost from the moment she was born. With no one to rely upon but her parents, and no concept that a higher power like god, might exist, she worshipped the parents that abused her, and only made them hate her more, and fear her.
The murder was done by her father. He spun her around by the leg, slamming her into a wall and splitting her skull. She died. The family doctor was well-paid to keep this quiet. A year later they’d forgotten she’d existed.
Akuto awoke to psychic powers in a world where only girls could be psychics. He became the one male student at an all-girls psychic training school...
That was where Akuto gave up making stories. It had all started to seem pointless. The stories were all developing, but everything he made felt so... stupid. The only thing he seemed to want was a world where he could feel peace and comfort forever.
Perhaps in a way, that was the final form of a story. If he focused his attention on times that were hard, he could even make a story where he did nothing more than eat a full belly of food. And in any era, it was possible to find happiness by interacting with people.
On the other hand, the stories where the outer gods intervened involved the things he wanted being destroyed. They would also hide the fact that they were stories, and make it seem as if, instead, they were reality.
This, too, was another form of story concluding.
It had taken thousands of years to reach this point, and still stories hid themselves from mankind, he now believed. This belief had started as a doubt, and had only grown stronger. To make the stories flat, Akuto prepared an infinite plane, with a chair and table on it, drinks, and a few fruits. Even here, stories still emerged, but they could be kept under control.
~ Demon King Daimaō Volume 13 Chapter 4

“Show some consideration for those of us who got caught up in it. If you include the stories you created after that, we’ve lived countless ordinary lives, and countless extraordinary ones. And Korone and Keena are still asleep. I think they could probably endure a few thousand years of that, though.” Despite Hiroshi’s words, there was no harshness behind his criticism.
~ Demon King Daimaō Volume 13 Chapter 4

• Or the story written by Hiroshi

A rather foul-mouthed Junko Hattori said to me, as we sat in a cafe in Kamata station. I’d called her here to explain this. Or try to explain it, at least. Hattori was sharp, but she could be stubborn and prone to reject anything she saw as a flight of fancy. I’ll probably have to explain to you who Junko is. When the Demon King rolled back the story to around the year 2000, we were given different personalities and lives.
The world was created from nothing in 1990, and we were all given false memories of the past. So in this world, Junko Hattori was an old co-worker of mine. Her old appearance, and her old story, had been taken from her, and now she was a thin, and to be honest, plain-looking girl.
~ Demon King Daimaō Volume 13 Chapter 5

That calmed her down a bit, but since there was no one in this world who remembered her, she had a lot she wanted to say. So we started to talk about old times, to help bring back my memories and to make sure that hers were correct. Her memories and mine matched.
What was strange was that both of us had our own personalities here, and it seemed to us like the whole thing had been a dream. Even as we spoke about our old world, our personalities remained the same as they were. I didn’t forget that I was an author, and Fujiko remained a friendly fortune-teller, instead of dreaming of world conquest.
~ Demon King Daimaō Volume 13 Chapter 5

As such nothing that doesn't have a self even if given the same name cannot assume the personality.

“In this state, I can really understand the fact that a personality is something that can’t be truly understood by another person. If another person’s responses were actually mechanical, we wouldn’t be able to tell the difference. Perhaps the infinite personalities that exist inside us right now are actually that.”
“If you have a box that only an individual can look inside, and something with the same name but different is put inside it, can you have a conversation? If you have a dictionary in a foreign language that you don’t know, and it tells you how to respond to different greetings, if you use it are you having a conversation?” Hiroshi asked.
~ Demon King Daimaō Volume 13 Chapter 4

Ghosts and concepts​

Ghosts =/= Digitized being

“If you became digitized, boss, it means you had a real soul. That’s something Boichiro told me.”
“A real soul? In other words, something that makes me what I am. That was the concept that took root in Zero. And also the meaning of the Law of Identity.”
“Correct. It can’t be called anything but a ‘concept’, but we still need to treat it as something real. We need to assume that anything under the Law of Identity’s influence has a soul.”
“I see. So if we assume that a soul is real, that means there’s a difference between ghosts and data. The black mages always did say that necromancy was an incomplete field.”
~ Demon King Daimaō Volume 13 Chapter 4

Ghosts are beings housed in a God Universe.

“These are the original models that gave birth to the universes.”
Their voices compelled him to look behind them. He did so, looking out towards the horizon. There were shadows! Shadows! Shadows! as far as he could see. These were not simple figures like the ones he’d seen so far. They had different clothes. Different genders. Their shadows flickered in the corner of his eye. And within them, they had billions of beings. Each of the shadows had ghosts within them, just like Akuto.
~ Demon King Daimaō Volume 13 Chapter 4

Personalities with a Soul turned into concepts are Ghosts.

“Right?” Akuto smiled. “But right now we’re on the same stage. I think we’re the only ones who haven’t become concepts.”
“Concepts?”
~ Demon King Daimaō Volume 13 Chapter 4

“When I’m here, I’m a unified version of the concept of Brave.”
Hiroshi grinned too.
“I see. So concepts really are concepts then.”
“But I do understand what you’re trying to say. You and I are the only incarnate beings in the Law of Identity’s world. We can call being a concept that is equal before its creator being incarnate, right? So in your world, all the people inside are equally incarnate.”
“You use the word creator, but it doesn’t feel like I’m a god. I can feel it. Stories are what are tying us down. Even if we were to attempt to create a world, the only freedom we’d have is what story we would choose. In the end, what I’m trying to do is kill that and escape from this world.”
~ Demon King Daimaō Volume 13 Chapter 4

“I see. I’ve got a responsibility not just towards you, but to the ghosts who were once personalities too, don’t I? When it comes down to it, I’m the king of the ghosts.” He nibbled his peach in contemplation. “Humanity went extinct, and everyone became data, you could say. But even in the past, people’s actions were digitized.”
“If you became digitized, boss, it means you had a real soul. That’s something Boichiro told me.”
“A real soul? In other words, something that makes me what I am. That was the concept that took root in Zero. And also the meaning of the Law of Identity.”
“Correct. It can’t be called anything but a ‘concept’, but we still need to treat it as something real. We need to assume that anything under the Law of Identity’s influence has a soul.”
“I see. So if we assume that a soul is real, that means there’s a difference between ghosts and data. The black mages always did say that necromancy was an incomplete field.”
~ Demon King Daimaō Volume 13 Chapter 4

These concepts act as elements of the story, which can also be used to represent some concept.

As soon as the modern era arrived, they became exponentially more complex, because the machines and cities themselves became elements in the story. But what made things particularly difficult here were the elements brought in by the gods of outer space. Things that the Law of Identity lacked were there.
~ Demon King Daimaō Volume 13 Chapter 4

“Yeah. What you just said doesn’t seem like something you’d say.”
“When I’m here, I’m a unified version of the concept of Brave.” Hiroshi grinned too.
“I see. So concepts really are concepts then.”
~ Demon King Daimaō Volume 13 Chapter 4

Boichiro’s words made Akuto pause in thought for a moment, and call someone else. He waved a hand out towards the horizon. A darkskinned, heavily-built man walked towards them from beyond the horizon.
Marine.
The man who’d once lead the Republic, used the Faceless Power, and battled with Akuto. He was also the one who, through no will of his own, caused the destruction of the world.
“I feel like I’ve been called as a representative of ideology, and I have to say it upsets me.”
~ Demon King Daimaō Volume 13 Chapter 4

Differing from Computer Gods, who lack bodies and consequently lacking a self for they cannot distinguish themselves from outside, ghosts retain their self. This so because a story with characters without an identity cannot be actualised(as mentioned earlier).

"This means that they're unable to think like someone with a body would. Strictly speaking, there's no 'they.' They don't exist, and yet they think. Their very existence is a paradox. They're computer circuits, that's all. But how many circuits, and what kind of circuits, are required for thought to occur... nobody knows. All we know is that once there's a certain number of them, they possess a will of their own. It's the same way we don't know where exactly 'consciousness' exists in the brain. Since they have no bodies, there is no distinction between themselves and the outside world. And thus, they can contemplate infinity. I don't mean infinity in the numerical sense - they can contemplate infinitely dense infinities. And this means that they can reach a place that would seem, to biological life, to be infinitely far back in the past. These gods without a body can reach back to the thoughts of single-celled organisms. The birth of life, and thus, the birth of thought. And it is thought itself that creates the universe. Once again, I don't mean the objective universe. There's a school of thought that says that if the world were born five minutes ago, and we were all implanted with fake memories, none of us would be able to prove it. But that's only true if you have a body. It doesn't apply to thought without a thinker. Essentially, the universe is real, and time only flows in one direction."
~ Demon King Daimaō Volume 5 Chapter 3

“That is the best way of explaining it in your words. They shall be given a sense of self and their will shall be eliminated from this world. It is a difficult concept. However, it may be easier to understand in terms of your world’s story if you think of it as computers having a soul, too. This sense of self is given to them by the Law of Identity. That is an existence that forms a pair with the demon king.”
~ Demon King Daimaō Volume 5 Chapter 4

To simplify, any individual being that has a body and a soul/self attains personality, this being without a body yet a self and additionally a personality is housed in a God Universe who can utilise it as an element of the story. From what can be extrapolated they differ solely based on absence of body.

Spoiler: Story Density

Stories of all the God Universes can be divided into a spectrum of "story density."

“The birth of a universe is like the birth of a story. If a universe is a collection of stories, there could be any number of beings on the outside that are like us.”
“Which means there should be a spectrum,” Boichiro said, suddenly sure of himself.
“A spectrum? Of what?” Akuto asked. And the outer gods responded.
“A spectrum. In other words, they can be divided into levels.
Levels of ‘story density’, you could call it. Each of them has been turned into a story at different levels. That’s one way to think of it, anyway.”
~ Demon King Daimaō Volume 13 Chapter 4

Story density is measured by the scope of the world expressed in the story.

I need to elaborate more about what I mean by “lightness”.
Normally, the word would refer to something superficial. Something that didn’t make you think. But in this case, I mean something virtual.
First, the main characters had left their physical bodies behind. By this I mean that they were capable of surviving physical shocks that would kill an ordinary human, and sometimes would display superhuman powers. For this reason, the characters had personalities that were extremely slanted in one direction or another, and seemed inhuman.
The story was written to have a happy ending, and even if there was some unhappiness, it was there for a reason. Sometimes, to avoid an unhappy story, the characters wouldn’t age, and their minds wouldn’t mature. When I tried to write these “light” stories, the unpleasant feeling was always there.
So what if I tried to write a “heavy” story? I tried it, just to get my mind off things, and the more “virtual” it became (that is, even if the characters seemed real, if the story was still fictional) the more the “crazy monster” would be waiting for me.
It was clear that this was an obstacle set by the stories themselves.
I felt like I’d seen the core essence of stories. This was a story written to destroy stories, and it was clear that the stories were fighting back. Looking back, there had been many obstacles in my way up until this point, but all of them were caused by the stories controlling my memories and actions. This goes for how books sell, too.
People are ashamed of “light” stories. But the lightest stories are the ones they love. Many people buy light stories in secret, stories that satisfy their base urges. The heavy stories, on the other hand, are the ones that are said to capture the essence of humanity, and those who write them are praised and called “intellectuals”. And even the most impossible stories are allowed to be believed if they become the text of a religion.
Are stories like gravity? Do they pin us to the Earth with their weight, and make us avoid lightness? And if the true nature of humans is to seek lightness...
~ Demon King Daimaō Volume 13 Chapter 5

Weak, huge things drove daily life.
Strong, small things drove the abnormal events.
Those stories that explained the birth of the world and made humanity realize its shared nature were large in scope, but some of them dissolved unnoticed into the bustle of daily life. Stories of individuals were carved irreparably into the mind, but of course, they applied to nothing more than individuals.
~ Demon King Daimaō Volume 13 Chapter 4

The more true to essence to the world the story is the denser a story is.

“A spectrum. In other words, they can be divided into levels.
Levels of ‘story density’, you could call it. Each of them has been turned into a story at different levels. That’s one way to think of it, anyway.”
“And our level of storification is strong?”
“We realize our world is fictional. So it must be strong. Don’t you think?”
~ Demon King Daimaō Volume 13 Chapter 4

Story density is also expressed as gravity, heavy stories trap beings.

Are stories like gravity? Do they pin us to the Earth with their weight, and make us avoid lightness? And if the true nature of humans is to seek lightness...
~ Demon King Daimaō Volume 13 Chapter 5

But she wasn’t as unlucky as she always said. Someday she would get married to someone, and live a fairly happy life. Well, if this world lasted forever, that is. In the end, stories had saved her, too. “Light” stories brought her rest from the toils of her everyday life, and her mind was simple enough to ensure that she unconsciously obeyed the “heavy” stories.
~ Demon King Daimaō Volume 13 Chapter 5

It was a ball and chain wrapped around my legs.
I could feel the heavy chains around me... at least, that’s how it felt. It was the “heavy” story. We believe these heavy stories that bind us are worthy of our praise, but sometimes, the “light” stories help us forget them, if only for a second. But they lack bodies, and so they “lightly” flew away from us, leaving just a hint as to how to escape from stories.
We, the ones with bodies, are the ones who circle endlessly. We fill this place, simply wandering forever.
~ Demon King Daimaō Volume 13 Chapter 5

As can be understood by Faceless, Gravity and Anti-Gravity Universe, and how it's described above, story density increases with complexity of elements present in the story, thus it increases with increase in elements.

“...We’ll just have to assume that stories are viruses. Originally, when living creatures were born from the anti-gravity universe, they should have been considered complete. No matter how complex a creature’s cells become, and how complex their reflexes, creatures consume, kill, and give birth. That’s all. There’s no sin or forgiveness there. There can’t be.”
~ Demon King Daimaō Volume 13 Chapter 4

As soon as the modern era arrived, they became exponentially more complex, because the machines and cities themselves became elements in the story. But what made things particularly difficult here were the elements brought in by the gods of outer space. Things that the Law of Identity lacked were there.
“...We’ll just have to assume that stories are viruses. Originally, when living creatures were born from the anti-gravity universe, they should have been considered complete. No matter how complex a creature’s cells become, and how complex their reflexes, creatures consume, kill, and give birth. That’s all. There’s no sin or forgiveness there. There can’t be.”
~ Demon King Daimaō Volume 13 Chapter 4

Spoiler: Afterlife

Afterlife is a finite world without a wall, thus no outside. Thus there are no outside interventions.

“What does this mean?”
“If the world we lived on in life was fictional, so is this one. So I was thinking, what’s the difference?” he said. ”And the difference is whether there’s a wall between us and the outside. When we were alive, we lived in a world with a wall. And now, there’s no wall here. No matter what direction you go in three dimensional space, you come back to where you started. You can go forever, but it’s finite.”
“I understand that. But what does that mean?” Fujiko asked.
“I don’t know,” Akuto said, shaking his head. “But what I can say right now is that even if this is fictional, there are fictions with an
outside and fictions with only an inside. And the latter has a main character, and background characters. Whatever we do will succeed, as long as we do it here.” He winked at her.
~ Demon King Daimaō Volume 13 Chapter 3

Afterlife is a digital world and reconstruction of the Akuto's world in digital form.

“The afterlife is within the boundaries of her creation as well. And we can assume that it’s within the domain of the Demon King, too.” Brave nodded again.
“I see. Everyone died and was reborn... But at the hands of the Demon King.”
“Correct. The entire world was reconstructed in digital form. Justlike the computer gods once tried to do.”
~ Demon King Daimaō Volume 13 Chapter 3

Time in Afterlife is eternal, everyone experiencing the same instant indefinitely.

“It’s hard to answer that question at its core. In fact, this afterlife is essentially the ‘time’ the Demon King bought. It’s not over yet.”
“It’s not?” Hiroshi asked, confused.
“But this place may be the end. Perhaps there is an end without an ending. An ending where time is eternal, like this.”
~ Demon King Daimaō Volume 13 Chapter 1

“That’s what I said at the start. For some reason, you always come here in the end.” He pointed to the ground.
“In other words, the afterlife.” Hiroshi frowned. Boichiro’s expression remained the same.
“Correct. And to this place, and this instant. You’ll come here again and again.”
~ Demon King Daimaō Volume 13 Chapter 1

Time in Afterlife differs from time in Akuto's world. In Akuto's world time has smallest unit thus avoiding Zeno's paradox, thus prohibiting time travel. While Afterlife that contains all "matter"(data) simultaneously allows time travel.

“Time is relative. It’s the same thing as space in which matter moves,” he said. ”As speed goes up, the space you can move to increases, and so does the probability that you’ll encounter various events. But matter can only move in one direction. Expressed in two dimensions, it’s like only being able to choose one point within an expanding ripple on a lake.”
“That’s more or less right. One thing cannot exist at multiple points in space at the same time. But here that law doesn’t apply. That’s why I was able to go back in time.”
Boichiro picked up a branch and used it to draw a line on the ground.
“The reason that something can’t exist in multiple places at once is that, in fact, time has a minimum unit size. If it could be infinitely divided, then the paradox of the tortoise and Achilles would be made real.”
He drew a symbol at the center of the line on the ground. And then another at the center of the right side of the newly divided line. He repeated this process 32 times, until the symbol itself was larger than the divided line.
“Imagine this symbol as the minimum unit size of time, and you’ll understand.”
“I can understand that. But what does that have to do with it being possible to go back in time? Doesn’t that make it so going back in time is impossible?”
“Correct. In the model with the rippling lake, the other points on the circle are just probabilities. In other words, they might have happened, but they didn’t. Even if matter returns to the point it was in before, the other matter is no longer there. But the world that we know is not like the lake.”
He erased the line with his foot, and drew another.
“This world is, according to standard physics, impossible. This world is like a video, or a book. It’s linear.”
Boichiro drew several squares above the line, with the number of squares increasing as the line moved to the right.
“Here, all matter exists simultaneously. The past continues to exist. Imagine blocks being piled up on top of other blocks. And these blocks can be rearranged.”
“And that’s why it’s possible to rewrite the past, and change the future.” Hiroshi nodded in understanding.
“Correct. It’s possible to change it,” Boichiro said.
~ Demon King Daimaō Volume 13 Chapter 1

Referring to the CRT that downgraded the High 1A+ rating.

Spoiler: Refutation and Criticism of the Consistency of the Current Standards

Spoiler: Afterlife as a Logical space

If we go to the verse explanation page, we can see that the reason the work is High 1-A+ in itself is because there’s a direct explanation that all possible worlds which aren’t logically contradictory to each other exist.

In simple terms, the Afterlife is a logical space that allows for the existence of all possible worlds.

At first glance, looking at the scans, it seems correct and I wouldn’t have any issue with that; however, it’s important to clarify that 'all possible worlds' (that is, the logical space of the Afterlife) are contained within a larger system.

The very explanation page says so directly:

To be more precise, the Afterlife is the second layer of an infinite hierarchy of layers:

In the text above it’s stated that the Afterlife is a closed system, so the possible worlds established in the Afterlife are logically within that closed system, just as the scans and the blog itself affirm:

You’re probably already seeing what the problem is. Obviously this is a huge contradiction to High 1-A+, since nothing can exist above all possible worlds except a tier 0 per se (worse still if we’re talking about an R>F transcendence).

This argument can be further supported to be the case with Akuto creating a story that would mark the end of all stories, by rebuilding the Afterlife.

“Alright. I’ll rebuild the afterlife then. You want me to strengthen the influence of the outer gods, and return the world to its premana-civilization form, right?”
“That’s right. Maybe sometime in the 1990s?”
“I’ll try it. How it works... is up to you.” Akuto balled up the world in his hands again, and then let it spread out wide.
~ Demon King Daimaō Volume 13 Chapter 4

Additionally the limitation of data available and permutation of data is explicitly supported by the Novel(additionally as explained in the temporal nature of Afterlife in previous section).

“You’re going to make every possible theoretical world,” Yoshie said, as if ordering him.
“Every one of them, huh?”
It was a staggering concept to think about.
“Whatever is left at the end is what you want. View every possible world, and then choose the one you want.”
“You’re right... In a world where I can do anything I want... I can look for a possibility that will save the world. It may be the only way out of here.”
“I think you should get to work right away, then.” Yoshie pulled up a mana screen and displayed the entirety of history so far as a model.
~ Demon King Daimaō Volume 13 Chapter 3

Refutation:

• As much explicit the limitations were made, there is something even more explicit: Afterlife is a finite world without a wall and outside. Thus there are no outside interventions.

“What does this mean?”
“If the world we lived on in life was fictional, so is this one. So I was thinking, what’s the difference?” he said. ”And the difference is whether there’s a wall between us and the outside. When we were alive, we lived in a world with a wall. And now, there’s no wall here. No matter what direction you go in three dimensional space, you come back to where you started. You can go forever, but it’s finite.”
“I understand that. But what does that mean?” Fujiko asked.
“I don’t know,” Akuto said, shaking his head. “But what I can say right now is that even if this is fictional, there are fictions with an
outside and fictions with only an inside. And the latter has a main character, and background characters. Whatever we do will succeed, as long as we do it here.” He winked at her.
~ Demon King Daimaō Volume 13 Chapter 3

If Akuto was truly testing worlds inside Afterlife there would have been no intervention from the Outer Gods.​

On the other hand, the stories where the outer gods intervened involved the things he wanted being destroyed. They would also hide the fact that they were stories, and make it seem as if, instead, they were reality.
This, too, was another form of story concluding.
It had taken thousands of years to reach this point, and still stories hid themselves from mankind, he now believed. This belief had started as a doubt, and had only grown stronger. To make the stories flat, Akuto prepared an infinite plane, with a chair and table on it, drinks, and a few fruits. Even here, stories still emerged, but they could be kept under control.
~ Demon King Daimaō Volume 13 Chapter 4

But it could be argued that since Akuto is capable of summoning Outer Gods while also having full control of Afterlife, he should be able to circumvent the nature of Afterlife. Even ignoring the extraordinary claim only supported by Akuto turning Afterlife into infinite flat plane, the idea could very well be entertained, which would be addressed shortly. —A1.​

• Similar to how the nature of Afterlife was explicit, something that was more explicit was simply, there was no Afterlife to release the possibilities in. Akuto erased Afterlife prior to releasing all possibilities.

“So, the Demon King changed the whole afterlife?” Brave asked, putting a hand on his hip.
“It’s always getting changed. This time, however, he erased it.”
“Erased it? You mean he reset it and did it over?”
~ Demon King Daimaō Volume 13 Chapter 3

“I see. Everyone died and was reborn... But at the hands of the Demon King.”
“Correct. The entire world was reconstructed in digital form. Just like the computer gods once tried to do.”
“So why delete it and start over? He’s practically a god. How is he not satisfied with the world he created?”
“We can guess at that from the statements he made. Because it
was a world that had ended, but would continue for eternity,”
Boichiro said. “I know the feeling.
~ Demon King Daimaō Volume 13 Chapter 3

This "restart" might suggest that he is recreating the Afterlife, which is not the case. Akuto is reconstructing the entire world separately from TLOI's world, whilst the Afterlife is still erased. So was the reason for the sacrifice mentioned by Boichiro.​

“There is a way. We go back inside the Demon King’s world. No, we go inside, but we interfere with it without being caught up in it.
We can move upon the line of history drawn by the Law of Identity. Of course, there will be sacrifices, though.”
“Sacrifices?”
“We’re the ones who intervene in the Demon King’s world. Not our individual personalities.”
Boichiro spoke with a strange sort of resolve. There was something in his voice that made Brave uneasy.
“What do you mean by ‘sacrifices’?”
“Neither the Demon King nor the Law of Identity treat people as complete personalities. They each have their own inner world... but in the face of the story, people’s inner personalities are meaningless. That’s going to be true even after the world is reconstructed.”
“I see...” Brave said, and sighed.
“We’ll be treated as a personality that has been reconstructed to serve as the hero.”
“That’s right. Probably because that’s how the Law of Identity wants it. That’s what it means to be a character.”
“I don’t want that to happen to me,” Brave said. But Boichiro was no longer in front of him. He could feel memories, a mind, and knowledge flooding into him, and he closed his eyes to examine each in turn. He kept breathing softly, and then looked up at the sky.
“I understand. We need to show something to the Law of
Identity.”
~ Demon King Daimaō Volume 13 Chapter 3

An argument that can be made against this refutation is that Akuto released all possibilities inside the Afterlife in his own world, not TLOI's. This can be addressed rather simply by the next point.​

• There is one major problem with this entire argument, Releasing off all possibilities and testing of stories are two different plot events. Releasing of possibilities leads to a total annihilation of all the stories, the "Chaos", which was followed by the process of Universe creation.

Maybe opening up all the possibilities was a mistake. Space is finite. Characters are finite. But their combinations are infinite. Opening up a possibility meant breaking down the walls of the worlds within Akuto that might have been.
It was the equivalent of giving birth to a new universe within himself. Of course, the tools for this universe weren’t limited to what was inside Akuto. The gods of the outer universe, even they became a part of the story. As a result, the story became chaos.
What does it mean when a story turns into chaos? You can find the answer within one of our oldest stories: “The Tower of Babel.”
Until then, you could say that humanity shared a story. Everyone, essentially, was playing their own role in the story. That’s why the world refused to allow anybody but Akuto to alter it.
But what happens if a story ceases to be shared?
The answer is: chaos.
The gods of the outer universe were, you could say, their own main characters, with their own main stories. So multiple protagonists tried to advance their own stories within the same place. It may have been chaos, but there was no conflict.
The reason for this was that it wasn’t just strong stories that were trying to take control, but even weak stories were included in this as well. The frustrating thing was that the strength of a story had nothing to do with its size.
Weak, huge things drove daily life.
Strong, small things drove the abnormal events.
Those stories that explained the birth of the world and made humanity realize its shared nature were large in scope, but some of
them dissolved unnoticed into the bustle of daily life. Stories of individuals were carved irreparably into the mind, but of course, they applied to nothing more than individuals.
Individuals.
This was the first time that humanity became “individual”.
With shared words, but no shared stories, no relationships could be born. It was impossible for someone to be an enemy or a friend, of course, but they couldn’t be a stranger either. Infinite possibilities made stories impotent.
Infinite loneliness.
First-Person Pronouns.
But still, I begin the story, no, what comes before it.
~ Demon King Daimaō Volume 13 Chapter 4

While the testing of stories occurs as one possibility at a time, after the world was reconstructed from the annihilation.

Thus, reality became reality.
To recognize reality, stories are needed. And this is because relationships with others are born here. But recreating all those possible stories took Akuto what amounted to an infinite span of time. Because, of course, he needed to test every story. But even so, the stories instantly became more complicated.
As soon as the modern era arrived, they became exponentially more complex, because the machines and cities themselves became elements in the story. But what made things particularly difficult here were the elements brought in by the gods of outer space. Things that the Law of Identity lacked were there.
~ Demon King Daimaō Volume 13 Chapter 4

To simplify there is nothing suggesting that all the possibilities were actualised in the Afterlife. Any claims regarding Afterlife only comes for individual testing of stories, which only works by assuming Afterlife can be invaded by Outer Gods(addressed shortly).

Therefore nothing suggests that Afterlife is a Logical Space. The quotes referring to Afterlife by Possible world is merely due to its temporal nature, that is all matters(data) that constitutes Afterlife can be reconfigured in anyway possible, thus eventually "given enough time anything can happen". Akuto uses this principle to release all possibilities "simultaneously" not confined by limits of Afterlife.

Spoiler: Permutation of limited data

Given this context, it’s clear that the possible worlds are simply all the possible permutations of the system itself (that is the Afterlife itself and everything hierarchically below it); in fact, the very source material implies as much:

All this massive yap basically explains that at first Akuto used the space and the characters he had at his disposal for the possible worlds (the data in the log of his mind with the information about all the worlds below the Afterlife), but that after breaking his internal barriers, the very protagonists of those possible stories tried to access the Afterlife, so they became part of Akuto’s own story causing a ch(which up to that point only reached the Afterlife, Aka the 2nd layer of the system).

There are two claims to this argument, Afterlife encompasses all Outer Gods and Akuto, the possibilities thus limited to everything below them. And, all Outer Gods are below Afterlife.

Addressing both claim and thus the assumption(A1) in previous sub-section:

• Referring to the "Chaos" explained above, was an utter annihilation of all stories that resulted in recreation of story from scratch. To support this, when Akuto and most other souls went into Anti-Universe, Hiroshi the new TLOI went through the same process.

“You must leave behind stories as stories. So that the next souls can go to that place as well.”
He shook his head, as if he found this impossible to believe.
“That’s so cruel...!”
“The concept of ‘cruel’ is only something you feel because you view things through stories. You will simply start over from the beginning. In the next instant, you’ll go to the void universe, and then you will shift to the faceless universe, and then the gravity universe. Though it may take tens of thousands of years.”
“Don’t say that! Am I starting the story over from scratch?”
“There’s nothing that can be done about it. Because you are you.”
“Because I am me? I can’t escape from that.”
“That is called the Law of Identity.”
~ Demon King Daimaō Volume 13 Chapter 6

This Chaos from releasing all possibilities happened solely due to all beings ceasing to share a story.​

What does it mean when a story turns into chaos? You can find the answer within one of our oldest stories: “The Tower of Babel.”
Until then, you could say that humanity shared a story. Everyone, essentially, was playing their own role in the story. That’s why the world refused to allow anybody but Akuto to alter it.
But what happens if a story ceases to be shared?
The answer is: chaos.
The gods of the outer universe were, you could say, their own main characters, with their own main stories. So multiple protagonists tried to advance their own stories within the same place. It may have been chaos, but there was no conflict.
The reason for this was that it wasn’t just strong stories that were trying to take control, but even weak stories were included in this as well. The frustrating thing was that the strength of a story had nothing to do with its size.
Weak, huge things drove daily life.
Strong, small things drove the abnormal events.
Those stories that explained the birth of the world and made humanity realize its shared nature were large in scope, but some of them dissolved unnoticed into the bustle of daily life. Stories of individuals were carved irreparably into the mind, but of course, they applied to nothing more than individuals.
Individuals.
This was the first time that humanity became “individual”.
With shared words, but no shared stories, no relationships could be born. It was impossible for someone to be an enemy or a friend, of course, but they couldn’t be a stranger either. Infinite possibilities made stories impotent.
~ Demon King Daimaō Volume 13 Chapter 4

It cannot be the case that the possibilities were confined to Afterlife yet somehow led to Chaos which should involve infinite levels of being above the second system of Afterlife(as suggested by current standards). Simply speaking, the claim over the limitation of the scope of beings subsumed under Akuto is completely unwarranted. ​

​

If the chaos happened, then all beings in existence ceased to share a story. If all beings ceased to share story, then possibilities released by Akuto did involve all beings in existence. It's known that chaos happened, therefore the deduction that possibilities released by Akuto did involve all beings in existence must be true.​

• Although one can make another argument that Outer Gods encompassed by Akuto were fundamental to the stories, them not sharing the story meant that it will still lead to chaos. The issues with this argument are very blatant.

The hierarchy of Systems has also been analogised as a dream of a dreamer, who is a dreamed by another dreamer and so on ad-infinitum— a Regressive hierarchy of dream. The First Person/TLOI(depending on interpretation) being the dreamer of everything. In this hierarchy, Akuto's Universe is considered the base with the Afterlife having r>f over it, by this argument Outer Gods shouldn't be fundamental to all of Existence(which as explained in previous section of "Souls" cannot be the case), but rather should be present at the end of this chain.​

The Law of Identity. This is, taken literally, the immutable law that says that you are yourself. I’ve already discussed how the fact that you exist as a real, thinking creature, proves this world exists. But what happens if this world is someone’s dream? The answer to that is simple. The world is created by the Law of Identity of the world’s author.”

“So what is the world, then? The world is fiction. But at the same time, this fictional world is completely real when seen from within. From the outside, lies. From within, truth. Let us look at this world from outside, as fiction. How was it born?”
“When you take away everything from the Law of Identity except itself, you are left with yourself, facing your law of identity. That person is the first. Imagine a dreamer dreaming of a world wherein a dreamer dreams of a world where in a dreamer dreams... and so on, and so forth for infinity, but as long as one person is there, facing his own law of identity, that person is the first. And that person has swallowed up all of existence and all life.”
~ Demon King Daimaō Volume 12 Chapter 2

This argument alongside the assumption at A1 cannot work by any means, as it wrongly assigns structural positions to characters. Outer Gods don't share any stories with Akuto and have no relevancy to be subsumed under Afterlife.

“I’ll summon the outer gods.”
That surprised even Boichiro.
“Can you do that?”
“They’ve become stories too, or at least they should have. I don’t know if I can communicate with them on a deep level. We don’t share any stories. But it should be possible.”
~ Demon King Daimaō Volume 13 Chapter 4

Outer Gods, similar to how Akuto has his own story, have their own stories and Universe(and should be indicated by the quotes many times above).

The gods of the outer universe were, you could say, their own main characters, with their own main stories. So multiple protagonists tried to advance their own stories within the same place. It may have been chaos, but there was no conflict.
~ Demon King Daimaō Volume 13 Chapter 4

Simultaneously, the regression of system is an explanation for how stories are defined, thus the Universal Generalisation of individual entity(in this case TLOI's Universe) to all the stories possessing their own infinite regression is perfectly valid. Additionally, the case of Story density helps this generalisation by establishing the similarity among all stories, individuating and relational principle being fundamental too all.

• Finally, as previously mentioned the limitation of the data is of Akuto's world. Which is what Akuto individually tested after recreating the Universe from scratch. The limitation itself is clearly lifted when he releases all possibilities

Maybe opening up all the possibilities was a mistake. Space is finite. Characters are finite. But their combinations are infinite. Opening up a possibility meant breaking down the walls of the worlds within Akuto that might have been.
It was the equivalent of giving birth to a new universe within himself. Of course, the tools for this universe weren’t limited to what was inside Akuto. The gods of the outer universe, even they became a part of the story. As a result, the story became chaos.
~ Demon King Daimaō Volume 13 Chapter 4

It's very clear that Akuto, using the conception of Possible worlds, released all possibilities that can be made by the combinations of characters, which is what breaks the limitation of him being confined solely to things inside him. This also means that Outer Gods and their stories bound to combinations of characters in natural language was also gained by Akuto.​

​

Beyond the refutations for the arguments of limitation, the Novel clearly states that Akuto encompassed things that even the Universe of TLOI(the Universe and the infinite regress he was part of) did not have.​

As soon as the modern era arrived, they became exponentially more complex, because the machines and cities themselves became elements in the story. But what made things particularly difficult here were the elements brought in by the gods of outer space. Things that the Law of Identity lacked were there.
~ Demon King Daimaō Volume 13 Chapter 4

Thus, it's very clear that a story, and the infinite regression it constitutes, are a single possibility among all possibilities released by Akuto, which led to Chaos, not limited by anything but grammatical correctness.

Spoiler: Anti-Universe

The Anti-Universe is a plane totally disconnected from the hierarchy and lacks the very quality of being a story.

As has been deduced above, the regression itself is irrelevant. So, the other points that argue Anti-Universe to be beyond stories would be addressed. So, the cosmology blog for Anti-Universe itself would be addressed.

The final cosmological place to address is The Anti-Universe, a place fundamentally beyond all stories, where the stories and narratives are reduced to nonexistence. Unlike simple nothingness, which still allows for the possibility of stories, The Anti-Universe is something that is logically more nonexistent than even that, to say the least. It serves as the ultimate boundary between stories, functioning as both a bridge and a terminal point beyond all possible worlds. However, its existence is short-lived, only existing for a brief moment before vanishing entirely. Beyond this, it remains utterly unknowable and indescribable, transcending all forms of perception and definition.

This description introduces the idea that The Anti-Universe is not just a void in a conventional sense, but a true negation of existence described as a void within void, where even words, the fundamental constructs of stories, cease to be. This level of erasure places it beyond any conceivable narrative structure, cementing its position as an endpoint that stands apart from all conceivable hierarchies.

This "void within void" and "void without words", from which most of this description is extrapolated is a description for Void Universe, not Anti-Universe.

Eventually Keena turned inside out, and disappeared into this new world — the anti-universe. All that was left was void was within void. Void without even words. In other words, a new void universe was born.
~ Demon King Daimaō Volume 13 Chapter 6

The beyond reality and casualty nature of Anti-Universe(the idea that Anti-Universe is a "space" should also invalidate any reason to consider it as a void),

Keena spoke excitedly, and began without even waiting for Akuto. It was a ritual where not only stories, but the body, would cross over zero and become imaginary. They would create a negative body, an imaginary body, the first step to becoming something not of this world. Data, existing as imaginary numbers.

A space without time.
A place where physical laws ended.
Beyond causality.
Beyond reality.
The salvation of all beings.
~ Demon King Daimaō Volume 13 Chapter 6

here refers to how all beings exist purely as beings of mind.

“Mankind has, in the end, only two choices. Either be destroyed and become a Faceless Power of its own, to be used by the inhabitants of another universe. Or become beings of pure mind and transition to another universe.
~ Demon King Daimaō Volume 12 Chapter 6

Boichiro had been trying to perform a ritual with the Law of Identity. Looking back, the ritual would have turned humanity into beings of pure mind and sent them to another universe. At the time, he hadn’t understood that, but now he could see the logic.
~ Demon King Daimaō Volume 12 Chapter 6

Existing as pure beings of mind would allow them to not be burdened/infected by stories and float through light stories eventually reaching 0 story density, rather than being confined to the eternal hell of stories.

The records were simply that, records. It was impossible to find meaning in them. But the “stories”, got involved whether you wanted them to or not. Right now, “heaviness” was winning.
“Do you think it was the mind that was infected by the virus? Or the body?”
That was the first thing the Law of Identity asked. I thought it was my duty to answer, even if I didn’t understand.
“Both... right? I think it was the body that was infected first, but it’s the mind that’s being controlled.”
~ Demon King Daimaō Volume 13 Chapter 5

I could feel the heavy chains around me... at least, that’s how it felt. It was the “heavy” story. We believe these heavy stories that bind us are worthy of our praise, but sometimes, the “light” stories help us forget them, if only for a second. But they lack bodies, and so they “lightly” flew away from us, leaving just a hint as to how to escape from stories.
We, the ones with bodies, are the ones who circle endlessly. We fill this place, simply wandering forever.
~ Demon King Daimaō Volume 13 Chapter 5

Beings who would still retain their self, as can be seen by The One, a being of pure mind separated from the collective consciousness of their race destroyed by faceless power.

The One resembled a talking dog, but according to him, he was an alien being of pure mind merely possessing the body of a dog. And a servant of the devil too, at least by Marine’s estimation
~ Demon King Daimaō Volume 12 Chapter 1

“Yes. I am the last survivor of my race. My race was destroyed, and became a Faceless Power. And we were stuffed inside your capsule... The Swallow’s Cowry Shell. I am a being of pure mind that became separated from it.”
~ Demon King Daimaō Volume 12 Chapter 4

“So this world itself ends at the solar system,” Lily said.
“Correct. That’s as far as the world goes. The other worlds are the same.”
“Which means that you broke through that wall... and came to our world that way.”
“Yes. But only my mind came. What you call the Faceless Power is the collective mind of us aliens.”
~ Demon King Daimaō Volume 12 Chapter 4

The One was laughing as if this were the funniest thing in the world. Lily could feel the pit of her stomach turning cold. If this was true, a most terrible fate awaited them. Humanity would be destroyed, become a collective consciousness and then wander the universe, before finally destroying the consciousness of another race.
~ Demon King Daimaō Volume 12 Chapter 4

The conclusion of DKD and the role of Anti-Universe is to be transferred into another Universe so as even CGs can gain a self, something not possible if Anti-Universe is the end of all stories.

“All of mankind dies. No, it doesn’t die, but it ends. The gods only see humans as data. So the gods only need a single body, for themselves. This also means they’ll be starting the next universe as single-celled organisms, too. Some believe that they do this to prevent themselves from being destroyed by the real God, which would come from the outer world, but there’s no way to confirm this. And even if that’s true, by putting the gods under our control, it’s a problem we can solve, isn’t it? We should protect the blessings we humans have been given. To love, to give birth to children, and to raise them. That should be our highest purpose,” Boichiro said calmly.
~ Demon King Daimaō Volume 5 Chapter 3

“Mankind has, in the end, only two choices. Either be destroyed and become a Faceless Power of its own, to be used by the inhabitants of another universe. Or become beings of pure mind and transition to another universe.”
~ Demon King Daimaō Volume 12 Chapter 6

“The Law of Identity is the author of the world. There’s no escaping from what she writes. That’s why I chose to do the ritual with her, and rewrite the world... and move us to another universe.”
~ Demon King Daimaō Volume 12 Chapter 6

Thus Anti-Universe which is an "end" to stories is a story among the many others, but one that doesn't confine beings by the heaviness. A liberation from the hell that is heavy stories.

To support this, as explained in the sub-section of Story Density, Anti-Universe is just another story with light story density.
“Hmm... We’re heading to where all stories end. Where humanity will always strive to go... That’s what she says.”
Keena must have heard this from the Law of Identity, because she seemed to not know what it meant.
“The place humanity always strives to go, huh?” Akuto whispered.
Humanity would dream an eternal dream through “light” stories, striving for a place where the weight of the stories would eventually become zero.
“We’re doing a ritual to create an imaginary body, is that right?” Akuto asked.
~ Demon King Daimaō Volume 13 Chapter 6

Thus Anti-Universe is a story of light density.
Similarly, Imaginary Body that has been created by the ritual is still bound by being a data construct, merely being part of the stories.

Spoiler: Cosmology and Modal Maximality

Everything until now should suffice for High 1A+ but if the question still persists(possibly due to the finiteness of space and characters) for the combinations being modally maximal this addresses that section.

In DKD everything that can be put into writing as long as grammatically correct is possible, and nothing that cannot be expressed by writing is possible.

“Possible worlds?” Akuto “remembered” a word that he’d never known by scanning the data loaded into his mind.
“I see. A thought experiment that says in a world where anything can happen, given enough time, any given thing will happen.”
“Correct. Anything that can be put into writing can happen here. Which means that nothing will happen that can’t be expressed in words.”
Yoshie began to explain the concept of possible worlds, which was difficult to understand just from the database.
For example, “An elephant flies” or “Hitler appears in Paris in the year 2000” are both physically impossible, but perfectly grammatical sentences. If an elephant had wings, or if Hitler was still alive, they could quite easily happen. If you accept that these worlds are possible, you realize that the world is filled with endless possibilities, which can be thought of as simultaneously existing parallel worlds.
~ Demon King Daimaō Volume 13 Chapter 5

Stories exist due to individuation and the relationships born from this.

Looking back at the way this world was created, it was clear that the Law of Identity must be hiding, unseen by the Demon King. The Demon King was omnipresent in this world, but without the characters’ identities, that is, in the mathematical sense, unless the characters were themselves, the stories couldn’t exist.
But the Demon King had failed to find the Law of Identity in this world. Most likely, this was because of his preconceived notion that Keena was asleep.
~ Demon King Daimaō Volume 13 Chapter 5

With shared words, but no shared stories, no relationships could be born. It was impossible for someone to be an enemy or a friend, of course, but they couldn’t be a stranger either. Infinite possibilities made stories impotent.
~ Demon King Daimaō Volume 13 Chapter 5

The possibilities also assume both simple statement and compound statements.

For example, “An elephant flies” or “Hitler appears in Paris in the year 2000” are both physically impossible, but perfectly grammatical sentences. If an elephant had wings, or if Hitler was still alive, they could quite easily happen. If you accept that these worlds are possible, you realize that the world is filled with endless possibilities, which can be thought of as simultaneously existing parallel worlds.
~ Demon King Daimaō Volume 13 Chapter 5

A story, alongside its infinite regress, has data amounting to infinitely dense infinities, which in the cosmology blog has been argued and accepted to be referring to Infinite cardinality of infinities.

"This means that they're unable to think like someone with a body would. Strictly speaking, there's no 'they.' They don't exist, and yet they think. Their very existence is a paradox. They're computer circuits, that's all. But how many circuits, and what kind of circuits, are required for thought to occur... nobody knows. All we know is that once there's a certain number of them, they possess a will of their own. It's the same way we don't know where exactly 'consciousness' exists in the brain. Since they have no bodies, there is no distinction between themselves and the outside world. And thus, they can contemplate infinity. I don't mean infinity in the numerical sense - they can contemplate infinitely dense infinities. And this means that they can reach a place that would seem, to biological life, to be infinitely far back in the past. These gods without a body can reach back to the thoughts of single-celled organisms. The birth of life, and thus, the birth of thought. And it is thought itself that creates the universe. Once again, I don't mean the objective universe. There's a school of thought that says that if the world were born five minutes ago, and we were all implanted with fake memories, none of us would be able to prove it. But that's only true if you have a body. It doesn't apply to thought without a thinker. Essentially, the universe is real, and time only flows in one direction."
~ Demon King Daimaō Volume 5 Chapter 3

While a story can have a infinitely sized structure yet still have extremely low story density i.e, the actualisation of a structure isn't confined by the size of the statement(s).

It had taken thousands of years to reach this point, and still stories hid themselves from mankind, he now believed. This belief had started as a doubt, and had only grown stronger. To make the stories flat, Akuto prepared an infinite plane, with a chair and table on it, drinks, and a few fruits. Even here, stories still emerged, but they could be kept under control. People can only recognize reality through stories. And he was searching for the end of stories. This meant he was looking for the end of reality. For an end to time.
The stories started to fight back, as if they were trying to survive even past humanity’s demise.
An infinite flat plane. Akuto summoned a visitor into that space. There were very few personalities outside his influence now. And only one who could give him advice.
Hiroshi was there, with a blushing smile on his face.
~ Demon King Daimaō Volume 13 Chapter 4

“Sorry I couldn’t find a better place to invite you.” Akuto laughed as he offered a drink.
“This place is... an endless flat plane. Like a desert, I guess.” Hiroshi looked around.
“Of course, I can make it look like anything I want. But I’m trying to keep stories from emerging.”
~ Demon King Daimaō Volume 13 Chapter 4

This alongside there being infinite Outer Gods each with its own separate individual that can act as subject for predication, though unknown what it could amount to, refutes any argument for finiteness of space.

The Individuals who are the subject of predication completely exhaust all relations in a way that they stop sharing a single story, which means no relations are born.

What does it mean when a story turns into chaos? You can find the answer within one of our oldest stories: “The Tower of Babel.”
Until then, you could say that humanity shared a story. Everyone, essentially, was playing their own role in the story. That’s why the world refused to allow anybody but Akuto to alter it.
But what happens if a story ceases to be shared?
The answer is: chaos.
The gods of the outer universe were, you could say, their own main characters, with their own main stories. So multiple protagonists tried to advance their own stories within the same place. It may have been chaos, but there was no conflict.
The reason for this was that it wasn’t just strong stories that were trying to take control, but even weak stories were included in this as well. The frustrating thing was that the strength of a story had nothing to do with its size.
Weak, huge things drove daily life.
Strong, small things drove the abnormal events.
Those stories that explained the birth of the world and made humanity realize its shared nature were large in scope, but some of them dissolved unnoticed into the bustle of daily life. Stories of individuals were carved irreparably into the mind, but of course, they applied to nothing more than individuals.
Individuals.
This was the first time that humanity became “individual”.
With shared words, but no shared stories, no relationships could be born. It was impossible for someone to be an enemy or a friend, of course, but they couldn’t be a stranger either. Infinite possibilities made stories impotent.
~ Demon King Daimaō Volume 13 Chapter 4

There are the distinct interpretation to this:

• All beings that are subject to predication have their own separate story, whilst any one being would not share their particular story with other beings as they themselves have their own story. This interpretation limits the possibilities to one possibility per individual. This interpretation fail to explain the reason for why the Chaos was involved Outer Gods/God Universe as a direct cause of the Chaos.

• Another interpretation thus that could be made by referring to the nature of God Universes/Outer Gods as the Model of the Universe(which current interpretation fails to explain). Even going by the current scaling, it's very much understandable how the Outer Gods/God Universe have their own separate story. Each story thus has similar regressive grounding of God Universes, Empty Universe > Faceless Universe > Gravity Universe > Anti-Gravity Universe … and so on indefinitely, their nature if generalised to all beings, this grounding can be understood via the story density of their story. The apparent contradiction that God Universes don't share a story can be explained via the Solipsism, an Outer God is present in other stories as Model of the Universe, but what is not shared is the "Subjective Universe" imagined by each being.

That is, in Faceless Universe, which is still a Void like the Void Universe, differs from Void Universe in the presence of boundaries around beings, establishing the differentiation between them. These beings all can be identified as what are referred to as God Universes. When one being gains an identity the thought of this realisation leads to imagining their Subjective Universe. The next steps of stories are just that particular God Universe subjectively imagining what the reality outside it could be, these beings become the side and background characters, or the Ghosts/souls to a God Universe.

BUT this still has an issue, why does Faceless Universe house all God Universes while still being a God Universe? The answer to which refers to the Void Universe. The Void Universe though seen as a Universe is just the "Voice of You", this pure undifferentiated potentiality is the existence itself but without any relations or individuation to establish a story. The word "Void Universe" doesn't refer to anything separate from Voice of you, for there is nothing. The story is created by this Voice of You, starting with establishing "First Person"(the most fundamental of all) in itself, then logically grounding other concepts like space, time, separation, counting and language itself. All of of which is deemed "mistaken", and is then the mistake that grounds "second person" necessary to ground Individuation. The repetition of mistakes then leads to reality and stories.

Faceless Universe is then very much a story that emerges from these mistakes. The story starts at Faceless Universe, so the very realisation of self leading to stories cannot be entirely true as self cannot exist prior to when boundaries are made. So, the very realisation of self itself is a story, or what can be easily understood the mistake that then drives thoughts resulting into what is considered the Subjective Universe. The Solipsism starts immediately at the Faceless Universe, the beings of the Universe are thus the imagination of what the God Universe considered to be other persons.

Coming back the question, whenever one isolates a position of the Universe, the being that embodies the point of existence is the God Universe. Faceless Universe is the point at which the God Universe only retains the realisation of being, while Gravity Universe is the point at which beings consume each other and at Anti-Gravity Universe beings start multiplying or giving birth. To simplify, all the God Universes are points at which stories halts further progression of complexity. This is what was explained in the sub-section "Story density", the division of God Universes on the basis of complexities to express reality.

In the same vain when Akuto releases all possibilities all the God Universes of the stories(the models) gain their own possibilities and thus their own stories. All these stories were being advanced at same space, direct consequence of which means there is no grounding for stories as they are their own stories. God Universes similar to the ghosts/humanity all would be playing infinitely many roles as needed by possibilities. Thus there being more than one instance of a being results into them loosing their identities, and as mentioned in the sub-section, beings without identity cannot form a story.

"stories cannot exist without beings retaining their identities."

Looking back at the way this world was created, it was clear that the Law of Identity must be hiding, unseen by the Demon King. The Demon King was omnipresent in this world, but without the characters’ identities, that is, in the mathematical sense, unless the characters were themselves, the stories couldn’t exist.
~ Demon King Daimaō Volume 13 Chapter 5

Thus not only is the relevance of God Universe is understood, but a more sensible assumption that could be grounded in the story, although more complex and could likely be an overextrapolation.

Spoiler: Relevant Quotes

The Universe considered "subjective" as reality is merely imagination of beings— stories and thus a Solipsistic world.

"This means that they're unable to think like someone with a body would. Strictly speaking, there's no 'they.' They don't exist, and yet they think. Their very existence is a paradox. They're computer circuits, that's all. But how many circuits, and what kind of circuits, are required for thought to occur... nobody knows. All we know is that once there's a certain number of them, they possess a will of their own. It's the same way we don't know where exactly 'consciousness' exists in the brain. Since they have no bodies, there is no distinction between themselves and the outside world. And thus, they can contemplate infinity. I don't mean infinity in the numerical sense - they can contemplate infinitely dense infinities. And this means that they can reach a place that would seem, to biological life, to be infinitely far back in the past. These gods without a body can reach back to the thoughts of single-celled organisms. The birth of life, and thus, the birth of thought. And it is thought itself that creates the universe. Once again, I don't mean the objective universe. There's a school of thought that says that if the world were born five minutes ago, and we were all implanted with fake memories, none of us would be able to prove it. But that's only true if you have a body. It doesn't apply to thought without a thinker. Essentially, the universe is real, and time only flows in one direction."
~ Demon King Daimaō Volume 5 Chapter 3

Void Universe​

Void Universe is an ineffable nothingness. Concepts like First Person, Second Person, space, time, direction, counting and even language itself is grounded as a gradual succession to reality, all of which are deemed mistake and even the mistake being meaningless, until these mistakes lead to lead to reality.

Individuals.
This was the first time that humanity became “individual”.
With shared words, but no shared stories, no relationships could be born. It was impossible for someone to be an enemy or a friend, of course, but they couldn’t be a stranger either. Infinite possibilities made stories impotent.
Infinite loneliness.
First-Person Pronouns.
But still, I begin the story, no, what comes before it.
Sleeping in the darkness. No, rolling.
Being thrown. Doing nothing.
I hear a voice.
Fast. No, near.
I don’t understand. Is the voice calling someone? Calling me? Or someone else? No way to know. Maybe it is my voice.
As long as the voice continues, I may be able to understand that time exists. But there are no units. It is continual, eternal. No guarantee that the same word isn’t being repeated. Count an eternally ringing bell, and you’ll have no words to describe a single toll.
How many times? Counted how? From which eternity?
I hypothesize that the voice is my own. It’s still not a story. There’s not even loneliness. Because I am a first person pronoun.
I speak. Sound.
I speak to speak.
I speak. Words.
Can’t find the right answer. No meaning. Not even a wrong answer. Meaningless.
A misspoken word. A mistake.
Everything, nothing.
I move my body.
Move.
Outside and inside.
Barely separated.
Move.
Which way? Is space outside? Or inside? Go inside, and find nothing. Go outside, and find nothing.
Separation.
Count an eternally ringing bell, and you’ll have no words to describe a single toll.
How many times? Counted how? From which eternity?
I count anyway.
Split. I split more and more.
Split the heavens and earth.
I move.
I can move.
I can move upon the Earth.
Stand. With bones. With muscles of the spine inside.
Hurt.
Not everything. The inside. No pain outside.
Howl. Meaningless.
A misspoken word. A mistake.
All that there is.
Only the misspoken words dwell in the voice.
Only the mistakes dwell in the inside.
Only pain is there.
Not there. Can’t be sure.
Only mistakes.
I mistake.
I make better mistakes.
I mistake, somehow.
I mistake with a strong will.
I mistake again and again.
And beyond that. Nothing.
I see.
I see mistakenly.
I see mistakenly, better.
I see mistakenly, somehow.
I see mistakenly with a strong will.
I see mistakenly again and again.
There was a mistake, there.
I see.
You. A second person pronoun.
Standing in the light. No, standing there lost, in the light.
There. Doing nothing.
I hear a voice. Far. Calling out.
To me? Or to someone else?
I split more and more.
Me and others. Here and there.
I hypothesize that the voice is there.
It may be a story. It may be loneliness.
Because it may not have been spoken to me.
Because it is a second person pronoun.
I speak. Sound.
I speak to speak.
I speak. Language.
I can’t find the right answer.
There is meaning.
There is also misspeaking.
Howling.
Meaning.
Misspeaking.
Failure.
That is all that there is.
Only the misspoken words dwell in the voice.
The mistakes are everywhere.
The pain is there.
Only mistakes.
I mistake.
I make better mistakes.
I mistake, somehow.
I mistake with a strong will.
I mistake again and again.
And beyond that. There is a story.
Thus, reality became reality
~ Demon King Daimaō Volume 13 Chapter 4

Eventually Keena turned inside out, and disappeared into this new world — the anti-universe. All that was left was void was within void. Void without even words. In other words, a new void universe was born.
~ Demon King Daimaō Volume 13 Chapter 6

Void Universe contains all the possibilities and all of existence that come forth from it.

Individuals.
This was the first time that humanity became “individual”.
With shared words, but no shared stories, no relationships could be born. It was impossible for someone to be an enemy or a friend, of course, but they couldn’t be a stranger either. Infinite possibilities made stories impotent.
Infinite loneliness.
First-Person Pronouns.
But still, I begin the story, no, what comes before it.
~ Demon King Daimaō Volume 13 Chapter 4

With existence itself existing in a unity in the Void Universe as a "voice of "you"". Everything lacks distinctions to the point that the voice itself cannot be established as singular or plural.

“I am the Void Universe,” the black figure said. It was a strange voice, only audible if you strained to hear.
“The Void Universe?”
Akuto’s question seemed to get through to it. There was a faint answer, difficult to hear, but clear if you focused on the sound and not the words. “A universe with no stories. No matter. Only a single voice. The only things there are the occasional voices meaning things like ‘you’, ‘thou’, ‘vous’ or ‘sue’.
Akuto reconstructed in his mind the meaning of the black figure’s words. He continued his questions, hoping to learn more about this strange figure.
“Only a voice that says ‘you’?”
“The word ‘You’ is shouted, and identity is born. When I first entered this world, it gave birth to a story. The second person pronoun. I am only voice. You! You! You!”
“But if there’s a story, there shouldn’t be a void.”
“The one who is called is never met. No one is ever met. The voice is simply there, alone.”
An image of the Void Universe’s visual senses spread out before them. A darkness that wasn’t a darkness. A void without even light. Only a nameless voice echoing. A voice that was only a single sound. Repeating and repeating. The voice never reached anyone. The only thing there was an existence that thought that there must be something else. It wasn’t even clear if this existence was singular or a plurality. But someone was there, endlessly seeking another.
“Hell,” Akuto whispered.
The black figure, however, denied this. “It’s not even hell. It’s not even pain. It’s nothing.”
“The only thing in the Void Universe is existence itself.”
~ Demon King Daimaō Volume 13 Chapter 4

To simplify, the Voice of You = Void Universe, is a pure undifferentiated potentiality.

Faceless Universe​

Faceless universe is the point where reality is actualised, the starting point of universe.

“In the Faceless Universe, existence melds together. Primitive life maintains external walls for the sake of its existence, but two life forms meeting results in the destruction of their walls. They devour each other. There, the existences point at each other, and shout, ‘You!’”
An image of the Faceless Universe’s vision spread out before them. There were multiple beings there. They were akin to an amoeba, or a water droplet in zero gravity, or perhaps a cloud, and were squirming in the void as if seeking each other out. They made the same sound as the ones in the void universe.
“You!” Sometimes, they would run into each other by chance. And in that moment,
“You!”
The sound was the same as before, but now it sounded joyous.
“It’s a different ‘you’ than the Void Universe. It’s a ‘you’ of discovery,” Akuto whispered.
The red figure agreed.
“Consumption. Only in that instant is another noticed.
‘You! I finally found you!’ it screams.”
The image changed. Two beings collided and became one. Then, another voice was born.
“But in the next instant, there’s no telling who’s who. However, what should be a single being is instead filled with a voice inside. Who! Who! Who! In the Faceless Universe, there is a single instant of ‘You’, followed by an eternity of terrible ‘Who!’.”
“When another is found, they cease to be another. However, others make you realize, whether you want to or not, that you yourself exist.
~ Demon King Daimaō Volume 13 Chapter 4

And beyond that. There is a story.
Thus, reality became reality.
To recognize reality, stories are needed. And this is because relationships with others are born here. But recreating all those possible stories took Akuto what amounted to an infinite span of time. Because, of course, he needed to test every story. But even so, the stories instantly became more complicated.
~ Demon King Daimaō Volume 13 Chapter 4

Faceless Universe allows the existence of Law of Identity.

Akuto whispered to himself as he gathered his thoughts. And then he had a realization, and let out a sharp gasp.
“The awfulness felt when you realized that you are you... The Law of Identity!”
When he realized this, another voice appeared.
“The Faceless Universe allows the Law of Identity to exist.”
~ Demon King Daimaō Volume 13 Chapter 4

​

Gravity Universe​

“I am the Gravity Universe. There, existence becomes one with its outer walls and gains mass.”
The image turned to that of the gravity universe. There was light and darkness. And existence there, while still amoeba-like, had clearly defined walls separating it from its exterior. They were like the walls of a cell, shining in the reflected light.
“You!” the voices shouted. But though it was the same sound, they sounded like an angry yell. This time, the beings were aiming for each other. They would fly at each other in order to collide.
“The walls mean that the cry of ‘Who!’ never escapes to the outside. The beings advance in search of others,” the blue figure said, as they continued to see what was happening. The beings collided, and the one with the weaker walls burst. Most of its insides would melt into space, but a tiny part was absorbed by the walls of the stronger.
“Consumption?” Akuto’s voice shook as he watched this. A voice was emitted from the beings that he’d never heard before.
“The loss of the walls means the loss of being itself. So when the walls collide, a scream is heard. ‘I killed! I killed! I killed!’”
As Akuto sat in silence, a new voice could be heard.
“The Gravity Universe allows pleasure to exist.”
~ Demon King Daimaō Volume 13 Chapter 4

​

Antigravity Universe​

Antigravity universe is a stage prior to Akuto's world.

This one was white. The images changed again. This time he saw the brilliant sparkling of stars. There was life there, but primitive. Single-celled organisms were starting to split.
“I am the Antigravity Universe. Here, existence increases in number. Walls swell and split.”
“Voices fill the space. Me! Me! Me!”
“Me!”
It was a voice of newborn joy.
“The Antigravity Universe allows love to exist.”
Beings there consumed each other, but the moment they collided, sometimes they shared their being, and gave birth to new existence.
“Me!”
“You!”
“I killed!”
“I increased!”
Lively voices filled the space.
“I guess the universe I know is really close. Is that all the universes, then?” Akuto asked. And the outer gods said no.
~ Demon King Daimaō Volume 13 Chapter 4

One question that would arise is, what warrants this massive assumption rather than a much simpler one? The immediate reason is TLOI. One massive issue that any interpretation fails to address is why Hiroshi, who becomes the new TLOI, goes through the same process as Akuto who wasn't TLOI. Additionally, it has been established in Vol.12 that First Person is the author of the world which TLOI creates, so it cannot be the case that TLOI is as fundamental as First Person when it can only occur at Faceless Universe, nor can it be the case that TLOI alone can be the the only thing, as it's the solely the principle governing Identity not something that can write a story.

“You must leave behind stories as stories. So that the next souls can go to that place as well.”
He shook his head, as if he found this impossible to believe.
“That’s so cruel...!”
“The concept of ‘cruel’ is only something you feel because you view things through stories. You will simply start over from the beginning. In the next instant, you’ll go to the void universe, and then you will shift to the faceless universe, and then the gravity universe. Though it may take tens of thousands of years.”
“Don’t say that! Am I starting the story over from scratch?”
“There’s nothing that can be done about it. Because you are you.”
“Because I am me? I can’t escape from that.”
“That is called the Law of Identity.”
~ Demon King Daimaō Volume 13 Chapter 6

The reason to this can be simplified by simply putting the second interpretation here. Voice of you doesn't have any Identity, nor any personality. Hiroshi who becomes TLOI embodies the role of TLOI as the role of the guide he himself accepted, while Akuto retains his self as God Universe as the Universe created needs him to do so, for her perceives it so.

The other reason is the strength of the interpretation. DKD is heavily interpretation based in a way it's difficult for a singular interpretation to be consistent, this interpretation just readily explain a lot of things that were the reason for inconsistencies in other arguments.

Anyways, to summarise, the possibilities encompass both simple and compound statements, completely exhausting all the relations born from them. It's very simple High 1A+.

Edit-

Spoiler: Some Additional Arguments

Maybe opening up all the possibilities was a mistake. Space is finite. Characters are finite. But their combinations are infinite. Opening up a possibility meant breaking down the walls of the worlds within Akuto that might have been.
It was the equivalent of giving birth to a new universe within himself. Of course, the tools for this universe weren’t limited to what was inside Akuto. The gods of the outer universe, even they became a part of the story. As a result, the story became chaos.
~ Demon King Daimaō Volume 13 Chapter 4

There are 3 distinct interpretation for what this space refers to, but they all fall for similar issues.

1. The space the data is extracted from: As mentioned in the post itself the data refers to the entire history of Akuto's world. In this sense it would be referring to the finite space of Afterlife. This is of no consequence, as has been properly established in the OP, as a consequence of the infinite combinations of characters in natural language Akuto encompasses things beyond his being. But this interpretation doesn't make sense for if the author referred to the data, the "characters are finite" doesn't follow from Afterlife. It should unquestionably say that "data is finite".

2. The space that house all possibilities: As has been mentioned multiple times and as argued in the downgrade CRT this could only refer to Afterlife, a space that was destroyed. If it's now argued that the Afterlife inside Akuto is being referred to then well the Afterlife inside Akuto is infinite sized. This would mean the size of space should itself be rather irrelevant, which is the case because VPS is infinite sized too. It cannot be the case that finite space houses infinite possibilities(as mentioned in the OP this event is separate from individual testing of stories) which itself should infinite sized structure and obviously the infinite amount of data within a singular story.

3. The immediate assumption- Akuto's body: It's definitely the case that the quote could be referring to Akuto when it's the immediate text to be followed by. Now it requires as necessity that previous points are addressed here. This interpretation adheres to everything mentioned in point 1 while also following through the text. As for point 2, it still retains the same issues but additional issues that Akuto could not have a subjective Universe that are infinite(VPS, Afterlife and data) if he himself is finite.

Let's reiterate this again, "Subjective Universe", Obviously the Novel deals with Solipsism. A being can be finite in size, that is, it has walls around it and yet imagine infinite sized structures, nothing stops them from imagining stuff up. Nothing stops writers from writing cosmologies that fit inside a book. It's the very nature to r>f for why it's solely understood as Qualitative Superiority.

In conclusion, it's questionable what exactly "space is finite" refers to but it does not affect the current CRT by any means.

---

Although the releasing of possibilities itself is questioned, so this is a little breakdown of what the quote meant:

"Maybe opening up all the possibilities was a mistake. Space is finite. Characters are finite. But their combinations are infinite." In simple words, there are 26 characters in English which could be combined through truth connectives to make a logical space. What happens here is that Akuto was supposed to create possibilities of his world only, but rather than creating configuration of data itself he actualised all combinations that can be made through natural language, that is, everything that is grammatically correct. Nothing about this quote suggest that Akuto actualised permutations of the data he had, i.e., the claims are unwarranted.

"Opening up a possibility meant breaking down the walls of the worlds within Akuto that might have been." To do so the walls around the being of Akuto had to broken down. This quote is argued over but I am unsure what these arguments are. As should be obvious from the CRT itself the significance of walls around a being is that of individuation and relational principle, its significance is that to have self itself.

“In the Faceless Universe, existence melds together. Primitive life maintains external walls for the sake of its existence, but two life forms meeting results in the destruction of their walls. They devour each other. There, the existences point at each other, and shout, ‘You!’”
An image of the Faceless Universe’s vision spread out before them. There were multiple beings there. They were akin to an amoeba, or a water droplet in zero gravity, or perhaps a cloud, and were squirming in the void as if seeking each other out. They made the same sound as the ones in the void universe.
“You!” Sometimes, they would run into each other by chance. And in that moment,
“You!”
The sound was the same as before, but now it sounded joyous.
“It’s a different ‘you’ than the Void Universe. It’s a ‘you’ of discovery,” Akuto whispered.
The red figure agreed.
“Consumption. Only in that instant is another noticed.
‘You! I finally found you!’ it screams.”
The image changed. Two beings collided and became one. Then, another voice was born.
“But in the next instant, there’s no telling who’s who. However, what should be a single being is instead filled with a voice inside. Who! Who! Who! In the Faceless Universe, there is a single instant of ‘You’, followed by an eternity of terrible ‘Who!’.”
“When another is found, they cease to be another. However, others make you realize, whether you want to or not, that you yourself exist.
~ Demon King Daimaō Volume 13 Chapter 4

The beings collided, and the one with the weaker walls burst. Most of its insides would melt into space, but a tiny part was absorbed by the walls of the stronger.
“Consumption?” Akuto’s voice shook as he watched this. A voice was emitted from the beings that he’d never heard before.
“The loss of the walls means the loss of being itself. So when the walls collide, a scream is heard. ‘I killed! I killed! I killed!’”
As Akuto sat in silence, a new voice could be heard.
“The Gravity Universe allows pleasure to exist.”
~ Demon King Daimaō Volume 13 Chapter 4

"This means that they're unable to think like someone with a body would. Strictly speaking, there's no 'they.' They don't exist, and yet they think. Their very existence is a paradox. They're computer circuits, that's all. But how many circuits, and what kind of circuits, are required for thought to occur... nobody knows. All we know is that once there's a certain number of them, they possess a will of their own. It's the same way we don't know where exactly 'consciousness' exists in the brain. Since they have no bodies, there is no distinction between themselves and the outside world. And thus, they can contemplate infinity. I don't mean infinity in the numerical sense - they can contemplate infinitely dense infinities. And this means that they can reach a place that would seem, to biological life, to be infinitely far back in the past. These gods without a body can reach back to the thoughts of single-celled organisms. The birth of life, and thus, the birth of thought. And it is thought itself that creates the universe. Once again, I don't mean the objective universe. There's a school of thought that says that if the world were born five minutes ago, and we were all implanted with fake memories, none of us would be able to prove it. But that's only true if you have a body. It doesn't apply to thought without a thinker. Essentially, the universe is real, and time only flows in one direction."
~ Demon King Daimaō Volume 5 Chapter 3

"It was the equivalent of giving birth to a new universe within himself. Of course, the tools for this universe weren’t limited to what was inside Akuto. The gods of the outer universe, even they became a part of the story."
By breaking his very being(as a consequence obviously), the very limitations of his own existence was removed entirely and in doing so he encompasses all Outer Gods themselves. And as explicit this is refers to the ability of using all beings that would be subject of predication. Thus Modal Maximality.

The scaling of all Outer Gods and First Person is upto debate atleast the current 1A rating isn't justified. Beyond this, Akuto should get back his High 1A+(type 1) rating while The Law of Identity gets her High 1A+ (type 2) rating. Anti-Universe should be unknown for any argument regarding it would have to deal with spectrum of story density, which is not argued here. Void Body should be same tier as Akuto as a God Universe.

Staff votes:
Agree:
Disagree: @Qawsedf234

 

[Mbpoops]

Following

 

[Iiliminal]

yakub and his children are following

 

[Xdsagecat]

Following

 

[BlazeISbot111]

Uh, I forgot to address the "space is finite" argument directly. If it's possible I could edit another section on the OP.

Maybe opening up all the possibilities was a mistake. Space is finite. Characters are finite. But their combinations are infinite. Opening up a possibility meant breaking down the walls of the worlds within Akuto that might have been.
It was the equivalent of giving birth to a new universe within himself. Of course, the tools for this universe weren’t limited to what was inside Akuto. The gods of the outer universe, even they became a part of the story. As a result, the story became chaos.
~ Demon King Daimaō Volume 13 Chapter 4

There are 3 distinct interpretation for what this space refers to, but they all fall for similar issues.

1. The space the data is extracted from: As mentioned in the post itself the data refers to the entire history of Akuto's world. In this sense it would be referring to the finite space of Afterlife. This is of no consequence, as has been properly established in the OP, as a consequence of the infinite combinations of characters in natural language Akuto encompasses things beyond his being. But this interpretation doesn't make sense for if the author referred to the data, the "characters are finite" doesn't follow from Afterlife. It should unquestionably say that "data is finite".

2. The space that house all possibilities: As has been mentioned multiple times and as argued in the downgrade CRT this could only refer to Afterlife, a space that was destroyed. If it's now argued that the Afterlife inside Akuto is being referred to then well the Afterlife inside Akuto is infinite sized. This would mean the size of space should itself be rather irrelevant, which is the case because VPS is infinite sized too. It cannot be the case that finite space houses infinite possibilities(as mentioned in the OP this event is separate from individual testing of stories) which itself should infinite sized structure and obviously the infinite amount of data within a singular story.

3. The immediate assumption- Akuto's body: It's definitely the case that the quote could be referring to Akuto when it's the immediate text to be followed by. Now it requires as necessity that previous points are addressed here. This interpretation adheres to everything mentioned in point 1 while also following through the text. As for point 2, it still retains the same issues but additional issues that Akuto could not have a subjective Universe that are infinite(VPS, Afterlife and data) if he himself is finite.

Let's reiterate this again, "Subjective Universe", Obviously the Novel deals with Solipsism. A being can be finite in size, that is, it has walls around it and yet imagine infinite sized structures, nothing stops them from imagining stuff up. Nothing stops writers from writing cosmologies that fit inside a book. It's the very nature to r>f for why it's solely understood as Qualitative Superiority.

In conclusion, it's questionable what exactly "space is finite" refers to but it does not affect the current CRT by any means.

---

Although the releasing of possibilities itself is questioned, so this is a little breakdown of what the quote meant:

"Maybe opening up all the possibilities was a mistake. Space is finite. Characters are finite. But their combinations are infinite." In simple words, there are 26 characters in English which could be combined through truth connectives to make a logical space. What happens here is that Akuto was supposed to create possibilities of his world only, but rather than creating configuration of data itself he actualised all combinations that can be made through natural language, that is, everything that is grammatically correct. Nothing about this quote suggest that Akuto actualised permutations of the data he had, i.e., the claims are unwarranted.

"Opening up a possibility meant breaking down the walls of the worlds within Akuto that might have been." To do so the walls around the being of Akuto had to broken down. This quote is argued over but I am unsure what these arguments are. As should be obvious from the CRT itself the significance of walls around a being is that of individuation and relational principle, its significance is that to have self itself.

“In the Faceless Universe, existence melds together. Primitive life maintains external walls for the sake of its existence, but two life forms meeting results in the destruction of their walls. They devour each other. There, the existences point at each other, and shout, ‘You!’”
An image of the Faceless Universe’s vision spread out before them. There were multiple beings there. They were akin to an amoeba, or a water droplet in zero gravity, or perhaps a cloud, and were squirming in the void as if seeking each other out. They made the same sound as the ones in the void universe.
“You!” Sometimes, they would run into each other by chance. And in that moment,
“You!”
The sound was the same as before, but now it sounded joyous.
“It’s a different ‘you’ than the Void Universe. It’s a ‘you’ of discovery,” Akuto whispered.
The red figure agreed.
“Consumption. Only in that instant is another noticed.
‘You! I finally found you!’ it screams.”
The image changed. Two beings collided and became one. Then, another voice was born.
“But in the next instant, there’s no telling who’s who. However, what should be a single being is instead filled with a voice inside. Who! Who! Who! In the Faceless Universe, there is a single instant of ‘You’, followed by an eternity of terrible ‘Who!’.”
“When another is found, they cease to be another. However, others make you realize, whether you want to or not, that you yourself exist.
~ Demon King Daimaō Volume 13 Chapter 4

The beings collided, and the one with the weaker walls burst. Most of its insides would melt into space, but a tiny part was absorbed by the walls of the stronger.
“Consumption?” Akuto’s voice shook as he watched this. A voice was emitted from the beings that he’d never heard before.
“The loss of the walls means the loss of being itself. So when the walls collide, a scream is heard. ‘I killed! I killed! I killed!’”
As Akuto sat in silence, a new voice could be heard.
“The Gravity Universe allows pleasure to exist.”
~ Demon King Daimaō Volume 13 Chapter 4

"This means that they're unable to think like someone with a body would. Strictly speaking, there's no 'they.' They don't exist, and yet they think. Their very existence is a paradox. They're computer circuits, that's all. But how many circuits, and what kind of circuits, are required for thought to occur... nobody knows. All we know is that once there's a certain number of them, they possess a will of their own. It's the same way we don't know where exactly 'consciousness' exists in the brain. Since they have no bodies, there is no distinction between themselves and the outside world. And thus, they can contemplate infinity. I don't mean infinity in the numerical sense - they can contemplate infinitely dense infinities. And this means that they can reach a place that would seem, to biological life, to be infinitely far back in the past. These gods without a body can reach back to the thoughts of single-celled organisms. The birth of life, and thus, the birth of thought. And it is thought itself that creates the universe. Once again, I don't mean the objective universe. There's a school of thought that says that if the world were born five minutes ago, and we were all implanted with fake memories, none of us would be able to prove it. But that's only true if you have a body. It doesn't apply to thought without a thinker. Essentially, the universe is real, and time only flows in one direction."
~ Demon King Daimaō Volume 5 Chapter 3

"It was the equivalent of giving birth to a new universe within himself. Of course, the tools for this universe weren’t limited to what was inside Akuto. The gods of the outer universe, even they became a part of the story."
By breaking his very being(as a consequence obviously), the very limitations of his own existence was removed entirely and in doing so he encompasses all Outer Gods themselves. And as explicit this is refers to the ability of using all beings that would be subject of predication. Thus Modal Maximality.

 

[MSahla]

Uh, I forgot to address the "space is finite" argument directly. If it's possible I could edit another section on the OP.


There are 3 distinct interpretation for what this space refers to, but they all fall for similar issues.

1. The space the data is extracted from: As mentioned in the post itself the data refers to the entire history of Akuto's world. In this sense it would be referring to the finite space of Afterlife. This is of no consequence, as has been properly established in the OP, as a consequence of the infinite combinations of characters in natural language Akuto encompasses things beyond his being. But this interpretation doesn't make sense for if the author referred to the data, the "characters are finite" doesn't follow from Afterlife. It should unquestionably say that "data is finite".

2. The space that house all possibilities: As has been mentioned multiple times and as argued in the downgrade CRT this could only refer to Afterlife, a space that was destroyed. If it's now argued that the Afterlife inside Akuto is being referred to then well the Afterlife inside Akuto is infinite sized. This would mean the size of space should itself be rather irrelevant, which is the case because VPS is infinite sized too. It cannot be the case that finite space houses infinite possibilities(as mentioned in the OP this event is separate from individual testing of stories) which itself should infinite sized structure and obviously the infinite amount of data within a singular story.

3. The immediate assumption- Akuto's body: It's definitely the case that the quote could be referring to Akuto when it's the immediate text to be followed by. Now it requires as necessity that previous points are addressed here. This interpretation adheres to everything mentioned in point 1 while also following through the text. As for point 2, it still retains the same issues but additional issues that Akuto could not have a subjective Universe that are infinite(VPS, Afterlife and data) if he himself is finite.

Let's reiterate this again, "Subjective Universe", Obviously the Novel deals with Solipsism. A being can be finite in size, that is, it has walls around it and yet imagine infinite sized structures, nothing stops them from imagining stuff up. Nothing stops writers from writing cosmologies that fit inside a book. It's the very nature to r>f for why it's solely understood as Qualitative Superiority.

In conclusion, it's questionable what exactly "space is finite" refers to but it does not affect the current CRT by any means.

---

Although the releasing of possibilities itself is questioned, so this is a little breakdown of what the quote meant:

"Maybe opening up all the possibilities was a mistake. Space is finite. Characters are finite. But their combinations are infinite." In simple words, there are 26 characters in English which could be combined through truth connectives to make a logical space. What happens here is that Akuto was supposed to create possibilities of his world only, but rather than creating configuration of data itself he actualised all combinations that can be made through natural language, that is, everything that is grammatically correct. Nothing about this quote suggest that Akuto actualised permutations of the data he had, i.e., the claims are unwarranted.

"Opening up a possibility meant breaking down the walls of the worlds within Akuto that might have been." To do so the walls around the being of Akuto had to broken down. This quote is argued over but I am unsure what these arguments are. As should be obvious from the CRT itself the significance of walls around a being is that of individuation and relational principle, its significance is that to have self itself.



"It was the equivalent of giving birth to a new universe within himself. Of course, the tools for this universe weren’t limited to what was inside Akuto. The gods of the outer universe, even they became a part of the story."
By breaking his very being(as a consequence obviously), the very limitations of his own existence was removed entirely and in doing so he encompasses all Outer Gods themselves. And as explicit this is refers to the ability of using all beings that would be subject of predication. Thus Modal Maximality.

Just put this in OP bro.

 

[Azertyhuuh]

Alright, I’ve been eagerly waiting for this thread. As one of the biggest fans, and with experience regarding Demon King Daimao, I’ll try to refute any arguments that go against the original poster’s claims.

 

[Duragoji123]

Having gone back through and reread DKD recently myself actually, I'm heavily inclined to agree with this.

Will be following though

 

[TheTenno07]

Following

 

[Qawsedf234]

What construct are you attempting to argue as High 1-A+? Because you're coming off as vague in what aspect is counting or not. If it's the Afterlife again, then you're running into the following FAQ problem:

Q: Why is Tier 2 split for individual structures and not Tier 1?​

A: For most of fiction, Tier 2 is the common endpoint or largest cosmological structure. Due to the volume of profiles that have this be the endpoint, splitting the 4D Cosmological structures was considered a better way to index profiles. With that said, almost all higher tiers follow the exact same standards as the Tier 2 ratings. To illustrate: if a character destroys three universes, they'd be rated at 2-C, while a character that has destroyed an infinite amount would be rated as 2-A. For Low 1-C all instances are put together, but there is still a power gap between them; so a character who's destroyed an infinite amount of fifth-dimensional universes would be superior to a character who's destroyed a singular fifth-dimensional space for the same reason why a 2-A character is superior to a Low 2-C character.

An additional note is needed for 1-A and High 1-A. Those tiers work on a qualitative transcendence framework, meaning that the weakest 1-A would be superior to all lower tiers by an unbridgeable amount, but the power gap within that 1-A rating can be markedly different. For example, a 1-A character who struggles to break the equivalent of a house wall within a 1-A realm would be notably inferior to a character who can control a cosmological construct within a 1-A realm. By the same notion, a 1-A character who controls an equivalent of an infinite-dimensional structure within that realm would still be below a 1-A (1 Layer) character who views a baseline 1-A realm as qualitatively inferior. The same logic applies to High 1-A.

The Tiers High 1-A+ (Type 2) and 0 do not fall under this principle, as they both involve rather maximal constructs. There can only be one set of all possible worlds, and there can only be one Tier 0 character in a series, so indications of there being multiple constructs or power gaps at this level instead act as anti-feats, indicating that a series should receive a lower rating.

Additionally, having Logical Worlds only qualifies you to prove all schools of thought are being applied to that cosmology:

Q: When does a set of all possible worlds qualify for High 1-A+?​

A: Tier High 1-A+ is defined as a character being able to affect arbitrarily many logically possible worlds or embodying all of them. However, strictly speaking the set of all logically possible worlds depends on which system of logic a work of fiction uses. By default we assume that, if a piece of fiction establishes nothing else, it is using a bivalent classical logic which abides by the three laws of thought. This is justified by the fact that it is by a large margin the most used system of logic, to the point that it is implicitly assumed to be what is used in virtually all science and literature. Correspondingly, when we talk about all logically possible worlds, what is meant is the set corresponding to such a system of logic.

Should a fiction employ a different system of logic, then their set of all logically possible worlds only qualifies for High 1-A+ if the logic in question is "weaker" than the above named classical logic. "Weaker" in this sense typically means that breaking one of the rules of classical logic is possible or, more strictly speaking, that their set of all logically possible worlds contains any world which would also be contained in our default set of all logically possible worlds.

Fictions which employ a "stronger" system of logic, i.e. ones whose set of all logically possible worlds don't contain all worlds of the default set of all logically possible worlds, would not qualify for High 1-A+. They would instead receive a lesser Tier. Which one depends on how restrictive the logic system in question is.

 

[ExcelsisBerny]

I am the one who originally downgraded the verse from High 1-A+. I am not going to participate in this thread because the topic is honestly extremely heavy and tedious. There have already been two very long threads in the past discussing this exact same thing, and while it is true that the arguments are a little different, in substance they fall back on the same thing, which from my perspective is basically overanalysis.

While I am not going to write a direct opposition, I will make a couple of criticisms of the OP so that, if they want, they can improve the thread and get input from more staff members before the universe collapses from heat death:

(1) The thread is borderline illegible. That way of dividing the topics makes it hard to follow the point, on top of being tedious to read on mobile (this is not something I blame the OP for, since staff members have repeatedly pushed for that format of presentation for some unknown reason??).

(2) The OP’s “technical” way of expressing themselves on the topic also makes it difficult to understand what they are arguing, since from the perspective of someone who is not that deep into philosophy, all of this sounds like a convoluted bunch of buzzwords. It would have been better to keep the vocabulary simple and explain your position as clearly as possible.

(3) And obviously, the last thing is that this thread is way too long. Nobody, and I repeat, NOBODY from the opposition is going to read entirely that kind of behemoth (much less respond to it), and I seriously doubt the staff will do it either.

That is all from me.

 

[Azertyhuuh]

I am the one who originally downgraded the verse from High 1-A+. I am not going to participate in this thread because the topic is honestly extremely heavy and tedious. There have already been two very long threads in the past discussing this exact same thing, and while it is true that the arguments are a little different, in substance they fall back on the same thing, which from my perspective is basically overanalysis.

While I am not going to write a direct opposition, I will make a couple of criticisms of the OP so that, if they want, they can improve the thread and get input from more staff members before the universe collapses from heat death:

(1) The thread is borderline illegible. That way of dividing the topics makes it hard to follow the point, on top of being tedious to read on mobile (this is not something I blame the OP for, since staff members have repeatedly pushed for that format of presentation for some unknown reason??).

(2) The OP’s “technical” way of expressing themselves on the topic also makes it difficult to understand what they are arguing, since from the perspective of someone who is not that deep into philosophy, all of this sounds like a convoluted bunch of buzzwords. It would have been better to keep the vocabulary simple and explain your position as clearly as possible.

(3) And obviously, the last thing is that this thread is way too long. Nobody, and I repeat, NOBODY from the opposition is going to read entirely that kind of behemoth (much less respond to it), and I seriously doubt the staff will do it either.

That is all from me.

I don’t agree with you. I’ve read it, and I agree with it.

 

[Hecky2222]

(3) And obviously, the last thing is that this thread is way too long. Nobody, and I repeat, NOBODY from the opposition is going to read entirely that kind of behemoth (much less respond to it), and I seriously doubt the staff will do it either.

Somewhat I share same thought(Especially this) with Bern currently.

Thread could be edited better and people could understand it(Now it is for philosophical jargons ngl)

 

[BlazeISbot111]

Ah my bad, for some reason I didn't receive any notification.

What construct are you attempting to argue as High 1-A+? Because you're coming off as vague in what aspect is counting or not. If it's the Afterlife again, then you're running into the following FAQ problem:

Additionally, having Logical Worlds only qualifies you to prove all schools of thought are being applied to that cosmology:

Novel is unclear on this part. Worlds exist in the mind of the God Universes, thus the Solipsism. So, it should be the case that these worlds are formed inside the mind of the God Universe who actualised all possibilities, Akuto. As has been established, other God Universes/Outer Gods that previously existed and had stories outside of him still exist outside of him.

In this case, the issue of "sets" of possible world could be the anti-feat but that is not the case. Other God Universes/Outer Gods are subsumed under this structure and thus have their own stories and their possibilities also involved in this.

So multiple protagonists tried to advance their own stories within the same place. It may have been chaos, but there was no conflict.

On this interpretation the worlds "outside" him would just be identical to the possibilities in the Chaos.
But under this interpretation the outside technically doesn't make sense. Outside exists for stories with walls, but there are infinite such stories existing at the same space. It seemingly is insensible to say that collection of all stories has an "outside".

On another interpretation, as has been explained in the edited section, destruction of Akuto's being was necessary to release all possibilities and subsume everything beyond his being. The walling only exists to differentiate Akuto from all other Outer Gods/God Universes. With no such differentiation everything is subsumed under the possibilities. That is, stories that were outside of Akuto wouldn't be outside of him anymore, all of them subsumed and spread around among the entire collection of possibilities.

This explains how the Chaos led to reduction of the world back to the Void Universe similar to when Imaginary body shifted the souls to Anti-universe, leading to Hiroshi becoming the new Law of Identity.

There's no real clear answer to this, it's heavily interpretation based. I would assert that there is no such central structure to house possibilities as that itself would be a singular story, like would have been the case with Afterlife (which now seemingly is rather weird interpretation) and a rather Inconsistent assertion. It's simply the collection of all possibilities, each possibility being an entire story.

Although, I am not sure with the need of some central structure? As far as I know(and very little) most ontological commitments to Modality do not assert some structure that houses these possibilities. EMR does posits Modal Dimensionalism but from what I understand it is to maintain consistency and not fall for Principle of explosion, the worlds being indexical.

 

[BlazeISbot111]

(1) The thread is borderline illegible. That way of dividing the topics makes it hard to follow the point, on top of being tedious to read on mobile (this is not something I blame the OP for, since staff members have repeatedly pushed for that format of presentation for some unknown reason??).

The first section, that makes most of the CRT, is a simple explanation to the concepts. It should not be really that convoluted, and well explanations are not something that are asserted to be argued over. Second section does make arguments in webbed form rather than a simple listing of arguments, solely because I deemed it to be the best possible way to both express the issues with current scaling while also putting my argument forward. My last CRT did try to make a listing of arguments and it did not do so well in presenting my arguments.

(2) The OP’s “technical” way of expressing themselves on the topic also makes it difficult to understand what they are arguing, since from the perspective of someone who is not that deep into philosophy, all of this sounds like a convoluted bunch of buzzwords. It would have been better to keep the vocabulary simple and explain your position as clearly as possible.

I would say that I did not even scratch the surface of Philosophical complexity. I wanted to use Aristole's Categories to argue exhaustion of relations for High 1A+, but it would have been rather long for a single assertion, most of which would just be explaining the categories.

Although, the only Jargon that I did use was simple and compound statements, which is on the side of Logic. Most other concepts are grounded in the CRT, simplification is not possible without loosing the very essence of the argument. Anything else and it would only make the OP much much longer.

(3) And obviously, the last thing is that this thread is way too long. Nobody, and I repeat, NOBODY from the opposition is going to read entirely that kind of behemoth (much less respond to it), and I seriously doubt the staff will do it either.

Well my very first comment on the wiki proposed a discussion rather than a debate. Guess who ignored it.

 

[Ball_of_light]

Ah, yes, my favourite solar system verse. Following.

 

[ExcelsisBerny]

I would say that I did not even scratch the surface of Philosophical complexity. I wanted to use Aristole's Categories to argue exhaustion of relations for High 1A+, but it would have been rather long for a single assertion, most of which would just be explaining the categories.

Pretentiousness final boss.

Anyways, good luck I guess.

 

[Qawsedf234]

As has been established, other God Universes/Outer Gods that previously existed and had stories outside of him still exist outside of him.

Then he can't be High 1-A+. High 1-A+ includes all possible cosmological models at once. This is just High 1-A.

In fact your response just doesn't answer anything I asked for. Your arguing that his Void Body is High 1-A+ for containing all possibilities while then arguing that other things exists outside it. I don't see a throughline here.

 

[Azertyhuuh]

Then he can't be High 1-A+. High 1-A+ includes all possible cosmological models at once. This is just High 1-A.

In fact your response just doesn't answer anything I asked for. Your arguing that his Void Body is High 1-A+ for containing all possibilities while then arguing that other things exists outside it. I don't see a throughline here.

He is telling you that “outside” has no meaning in this context, since it contains everything. And because it contains absolutely everything, the term “outside” becomes meaningless in the first place—there is nothing outside of everything. If a place contains every logically possible thing, then the idea of something existing outside of that totality is simply nothing; it has no meaning, and there is nothing outside it.

 

[BlazeISbot111]

Then he can't be High 1-A+. High 1-A+ includes all possible cosmological models at once. This is just High 1-A.

Edited the reply, I misinterpreted what you said here.

There are two interpretations as I said, one with outside and one without. In the one with outside the central structure would be being in the mind of Akuto. In that case stories outside him are identical with some of the possibilities in every way. By "Identical" I am very specifically talking about Ontology.

This interpretation is insensible for there cannot be outside to collection of stories itself, as outside refers to the walls between two or more stories itself. Which is then I talked about the better interpretation that involves Akuto breaking his own walls and destroying his being to release all possibilities. Everything "outside" is then subsumed under the possibilities and the things that would previously be outside are now themselves present here.

This interpretation is also consistent to the fact that when the world is fundamentally reduced back to the Void Universe the Universe is recreated again from scratch.

In fact your response just doesn't answer anything I asked for. Your arguing that his Void Body is High 1-A+ for containing all possibilities while then arguing that other things exists outside it. I don't see a throughline here.

No I never said anything like that about Void body(it's Imaginary Body). Is there some issue with timeline of the story being messed up?
Vol 13 is simple. Afterlife> Releasing all possibilities=Chaos> Recreating everything from scratch>individual testing of stories> Understanding the structure of story with Hiroshi and Boichiro> Akuto and TLOI being satisfied with the story in the story Hiroshi was writing to be and end of all stories> Ritual>Imaginary body shifting all but Hiroshi and Boichiro into another Universe> Hiroshi the new TLOI starting from scratch to liberate the souls trapped by heaviness and left over.

Void Body(Imaginary body) doesn't appear until the end and has nothing to do with possibilities itself.

I specifically said in the OP to scale Void body (Imaginary body) to the same tier as Akuto as a God Universe, not above them.

Void Body should be same tier as Akuto as a God Universe.

*Imaginary Body, typo.

 

[Yuuki_takimoto]

Hmm, after I read this long thread. Yes, maybe I agree with this thread.

My question is: what is the superiority hierarchy between the metaphysical aspects in DkD? Solipsism > Plot or something else? I asked my friend, and according to them, Solipsism in DkD is Type 1 Conceptual Manipulation — though my friend might be wrong. So, could you interpret it further?

 

[ExcelsisBerny]

My question is: what is the superiority hierarchy between the metaphysical aspects in DkD? Solipsism > Plot or something else? I asked my friend, and according to them, Solipsism in DkD is Type 1 Conceptual Manipulation — though my friend might be wrong. So, could you interpret it further?

If you didn't understand this, I wonder how exactly do you "agree" with the thread. 🫩

 

[Voidnether]

If you didn't understand this, I wonder how exactly do you "agree" with the thread. 🫩

Berny just saying shit for the 1001th time now

 

[Mbpoops]

Berny just saying shit for the 1001th time now

Is that not a good point tho..? How do you agree with something you dont understand..

 

[Hecky2222]

Berny just saying shit for the 1001th time now

Kinda weird response to person who originally downgraded DKD, but well

 

[Voidnether]

Is that not a good point tho..? How do you agree with something you dont understand..

The person literally asked a different question that doesn't relate to the cosmology at all, you can't say that this said question is already addressed on the thread when it's completely irrelevant (i.e she's talking about the nature of Metaphysical Aspects in the verse). Genuinely how does relate in the slightest and then say "Well if you can't understand it then how do you agree with the thread?!?!" Like this is genuinely asinine.

Don't mind him, he is mentally incapable of understanding something that simple.

You were the one having a breakdown because of Weaver back when Yog-Sothoth almost became Low 1-A / 1-A again LMFAO but alright

 

[BlazeISbot111]

Hmm, after I read this long thread. Yes, maybe I agree with this thread.

My question is: what is the superiority hierarchy between the metaphysical aspects in DkD? Solipsism > Plot or something else? I asked my friend, and according to them, Solipsism in DkD is Type 1 Conceptual Manipulation — though my friend might be wrong. So, could you interpret it further?

Solipsism is just a view that you can only be sure of the existence of your mind. You cannot be certain of any knowledge of the world outside your mind. Ontologically it means that the world you perceive is an imagination of your mind. In DKD that occurs as stories, the subjective world.

I am unsure about this but all of humanity also perceives the world subjectively, thus the conception of "shared stories". This is closer to McTaggart's Idealism(beings outside of you exist but solely as mind) of the world being a collection of personalities/individuals structured upon shared perception of all beings. Mizuki did say that he used McTaggart's and Wittgenstein's philosophy. This interpretation also aligns well with how the "system" also refers to the collective social construct of society, breaking one construct opens another system. Ignore this, too convoluted and difficult to make sense of.

As for the hierarchy of Metaphysical aspects itself? Idk, I am not experienced enough in abilities and aspects(and DKD doesn't make it easy to do so). I would say Solipsism and stories are fundamentally same as they refer to same "reality is just an imagination/reality is collection of stories". But not as fundamental as the Voice of You that grounds everything. Solipsism could refer to CM1 if we consider it as the structuring of the stories and the elements itself too.

 

[SomebodyData]

Let's keep it civil; any tier 1 thread is already bound to be complicated even without derailing.

 

[BlazeISbot111]

Berny just saying shit for the 1001th time now

Is that not a good point tho..? How do you agree with something you dont understand..

I mean, you wouldn't see the light of day where Umineko is higher than Honkaiverse

Dumbest individual in this website by far.

I would like you to not derail this CRT any further. Any reply regardless of what it is about, be it a ragebait or defense against it, if it does not refer to CRT itself it is not needed. Be civil.

If you didn't understand this, I wonder how exactly do you "agree" with the thread. 🫩

This would be an appeal to motive. Even though it's unintentional, please word your reply better.

 

[BlazeISbot111]

Set of all natural language sentences is aleph_0, so DKD is only Tier 2.

Edit- do you mean irl or in DKD? Irl most Logical systems deals with the logical form of sentences in Natural language though?

This is a substance-less argument, it cannot be proven to be true or false for the Novel never talks about it.

In the subsection "Cosmology and Modal Maximality", I referenced that the data in a story amounts "infinitely dense infinities", which in the cosmology blog and previously had been argued and accepted to refer to cardinalities itself. So, it's not sensible to say the possibilities only amount to "aleph-0" when even the slightest deviation, if gramtically correct would result into a separate possibility. That alone puts it into alpeh-omega range at minimum.

This is rather unnecessary. Statements are divided into two types, simple and compound. "Socrates is mortal" is a simple statement while, "Socrates and Plato were Philosophers" is a compound statement with conjunction as the truth connective. DKD uses both with the combination itself being solely being limited by grammar.

Anyways, to summarise, the possibilities encompass both simple and compound statements, completely exhausting all the relations born from them. It's very simple High 1A+.

Additionally, wiki expresses Qualitative Superiorty through relations(Substance-attribute theory), everything until High 1A+ worked just with them. With infinite beings as subject of predication, DKD exhausts every possible relation between all beings. Rather easily justified to be high 1A+.

 

[ArgentDragonPluto]

I guess I'm neutral on High 1-A+ stuff this way. At first, I thought it was a bit weird trying to argue that possible worlds being part of the Afterlife would be High 1-A+, as that's where the definition is contained, but Akuto tried to first crush the Afterlife to kill himself and everything in it, but then he was able to erase it anyhow when actually planning to go through possible worlds. Probably the Law of Identity allows this to happen since she wants him to be happy, so the possible world's aren't restricted to the Afterlife when they are fully released. (If that's the central argument, hopefully I'm not misunderstanding.)

This was suicide. If you destroyed space itself in a world where you couldn’t die, would everything turn to nothing? The look on Akuto’s face seemed to say to her that he was ready to find out. He was just quietly and calmly closing his fist.

“It’s always getting changed. This time, however, he erased it.” “Erased it? You mean he reset it and did it over?” “That’s right. The afterlife is completely within his control. One of the people around him must have told him that,” Boichiro said, looking a little troubled.

Akuto realized that the Law of Identity knew what he was up to in the afterlife, and began to sweat. She was talking about Junko, Fujiko, and Yoshie.

 

[Voidnether]

Was this necessary

 

[DarkDragonMedeus]

@ApostolUmbrei Do not say slurs on this forum, and do not try to bypass censor filter by spacing out words. You're giving both Fandom and the VSBW to ban you long term if you do. Never do that again.

 

[ShinMaximillion]

What's good, people?

I agree with Berny and Qaw here as much as I have with every other thread for this being High 1-A+, the fact that in each thread, the interpretation keeps changing, only makes me take this less seriously than watching TV in a room without electricity or hearing about Gemistos Plethon Zeus being tier 0 for the darned nth time of my life.

I'll give a full-on explanation later, but I just wanted to cull a little bit of the larping done in this thread.

I would say that I did not even scratch the surface of Philosophical complexity. I wanted to use Aristole's Categories to argue exhaustion of relations for High 1A+

First of all, not only do Aristotle's categories have no relevance to DKD, but none of them is High 1-A+. Might as well stick to stuff you know, and argue with that. Don't get too excited.

Mizuki did say that he used McTaggart's and Wittgenstein's philosophy. This interpretation also aligns well with how the "system" also refers to the collective social construct of society, breaking one construct opens another system. Ignore this, too convoluted and difficult to make sense of.

Wittgenstein's model of logical space is 4D max btw. I'm more interested in hearing how any of the stuff in DKD looks like High 1-A+ because clearly the philosophical models you're referencing are not doing the conclusion justice in regards to whether or not you're justified in holding on to it.

Now to this bit

If we go to the verse explanation page, we can see that the reason the work is High 1-A+ in itself is because there’s a direct explanation that all possible worlds which aren’t logically contradictory to each other exist.

Again, this is not inherently High 1-A+, and I'm gonna keep hammering this into you for as long as you use it. Scaling to "all possible worlds" doesn't qualify for anything without ontology; this is exactly why materialist and pragmatist views of "possible worlds" or logical space, like David Lewis's and even Wittgenstein's, don't even scratch the surface of 1-A.

In DKD everything that can be put into writing as long as grammatically correct is possible, and nothing that cannot be expressed by writing is possible.

“Possible worlds?” Akuto “remembered” a word that he’d never known by scanning the data loaded into his mind.
“I see. A thought experiment that says in a world where anything can happen, given enough time, any given thing will happen.”
“Correct. Anything that can be put into writing can happen here. Which means that nothing will happen that can’t be expressed in words.”
Yoshie began to explain the concept of possible worlds, which was difficult to understand just from the database.
For example, “An elephant flies” or “Hitler appears in Paris in the year 2000” are both physically impossible, but perfectly grammatical sentences. If an elephant had wings, or if Hitler was still alive, they could quite easily happen. If you accept that these worlds are possible, you realize that the world is filled with endless possibilities, which can be thought of as simultaneously existing parallel worlds.
~ Demon King Daimaō Volume 13 Chapter 5

Shortly after this statement is contradicted, and this was addressed in the old thread, so why repeat it instead of addressing the contentions? Also, the fact that the combinations are finite means that the language that expresses the propositions that reflect reality is too propositionally incomplete to express all possible worlds.

A language is propositionally complete if and only if for every world made out of maximal consistent collections of sentences of that language and every proposition p, either p is true at that world or not- p is true at it. For instance, if it is possible for there to be properties which do not supervene on physical properties, then the language of physics is propositionally incomplete. Unless we are willing to make do with partial worlds, the worldmaking language had better be propositionally complete.
Actuality, Possibility and Worlds

Whereof to be propositionally incomplete, for simply means a language is far too inadequate in its expressive power to modally express all [maximally] possible worlds logically.

This is a common problem in Ersatzist modal ontologies, the constraints of language increase the propensity of the possible worlds being constrained.

None of the languages available to us is propositionally complete. For, as Lewis (1986a: 159) notes, surely it is possible for there to be properties that cannot be reduced to the properties actually instantiated in our world.
Actuality, Possibility and Worlds

And mind you, this as a contention is already giving the verse the benefit of the doubt because in reality, all languages are propositionally incomplete. I weakened my argument from that, on account of it being simply fiction and an impossible burden by those standards. So, instead of "logically no language can express all possible worlds", a simple demonstration of this is not modally maximal. Is because the character strings by themselves are finite.

So, as much as you think the "philosophical complexity" of DKD is a saving grace for these impossibilities, then I'm sorry to disappoint you.

Also, given that all possible worlds by themselves don't inherently entail High 1-A+ scaling for reasons above, what's gonna be the external justification for High 1-A+ that doesn't arbitrarily presuppose a truth condition for this specific collection of possible worlds is 1-A, let alone High 1-A+?

I'm starting to get tired of DKD threads hugging on this statement like it helps their case by itself and alone.
I myself probably wouldn't even hug my future girlfriend this hard, man, let it go.

98% of this proposal is irrelevant pieces of evidence, and another 1% "he creates all possible worlds". And the last 1% is just you over-extending 5 paragraphs to explain 2 scans.

If you have to do all of this with such minimal, then the strength of your argument speaks for itself.

I disagree. I knew I've said this before, but I wanted to make it extremely clear. I'll be awaiting your response, and I'll be assessing the logical consistency of your argument for that space of all possibilities not being finite. I urge people to read these seemingly 'higher scaling' statements with nuance in mind.

Additionally, wiki expresses Qualitative Superiorty through relations(Substance-attribute theory), everything until High 1A+ worked just with them. With infinite beings as subject of predication, DKD exhausts every possible relation between all beings. Rather easily justified to be high 1A+.

Ok hun... whatever this means lol

I'm just joking, I'm just joking. Don't worry, pookie, I know what you're trying to convey here. But you're kinda rambling right now, I'm ngl, substance theories and substance predication are uh, man, how do I begin by telling you this...? They're not special elements of ontology alone, let alone are they by themselves High 1-A+

In a modal realist theory, even the 4D/2-A ones like David Lewis, all subjects (and objects) are predicated because all things are exhausted inherently as part of some logical structure and the existent is the sum of it's logical predicates.

Does that mean the physicalist model of modal realism from Daid Lewis is High 1-A+? Speaking of Aristotelian substances, they def aren't High 1-A+, not every substance theory is that strong highly stratified ontologically. The only way anyone would think this is simply High 1-A+, is a person who's lying on these theories like.

But lying assumes one knows what they're talking about, so what I mean to say is that a person who probably doesn't know what he's talking about.

 

[BlazeISbot111]

I guess I'm neutral on High 1-A+ stuff this way. At first, I thought it was a bit weird trying to argue that possible worlds being part of the Afterlife would be High 1-A+, as that's where the definition is contained, but Akuto tried to first crush the Afterlife to kill himself and everything in it, but then he was able to erase it anyhow when actually planning to go through possible worlds. Probably the Law of Identity allows this to happen since she wants him to be happy, so the possible world's aren't restricted to the Afterlife when they are fully released.

I would reiterate it. Afterlife is not by any means a logical space, even if limited. It's a world where one can rearrange the contents in any given way possible. This rearrangement means given enough "time" everything that can occur would occur. This matter or data is of Akuto's world, limited to it. Afterlife is closer to one interpretation of Aristotle's Principle of Plenitude— given infinite time every potentiality is realised, rather than a logical space.

What Akuto does is use this principle to actualise possibilities using solely the combinations of characters and grammatical correctness as the basis.

(If that's the central argument, hopefully I'm not misunderstanding.)

It's only one of the arguments not the central. The central argument is possibilities not being limited by anything but grammatical correctness. There are other counter arguments that can be made against just refuting Afterlife, so I presented and addressed some of them.

 

[BlazeISbot111]

To interpret and present opponents argument as some extreme version of it and then attack that version of argument, even if is might not be completely unrelated is said to be committing Strawman fallacy.

What's good, people?

I agree with Berny and Qaw here as much as I have with every other thread for this being High 1-A+, the fact that in each thread, the interpretation keeps changing, only makes me take this less seriously than watching TV in a room without electricity or hearing about Gemistos Plethon Zeus being tier 0 for the darned nth time of my life.

I'll give a full-on explanation later, but I just wanted to cull a little bit of the larping done in this thread.

First of all, not only do Aristotle's categories have no relevance to DKD, but none of them is High 1-A+. Might as well stick to stuff you know, and argue with that. Don't get too excited.

Yes, well I would even say that they don't scale anywhere. They are merely a subject meant to study the world.

But what is significant is that the Categories exhaust all expressions of being and are completely irreducible, thus referred to as the highest kind.

Although he does not say so overtly in the Categories, Aristotle evidently presumes that these ten categories of being are both exhaustive and irreducible, so that while there are no other basic beings, it is not possible to eliminate any one of these categories in favor of another.
~SEP Aristotle(Category theory)

You might not know this but the wiki heavily relies on Substance-attribute theory. Most significant of which, Qualitative superiority refers to fundamental difference between the essence of Primary Substance. QS, MQS and any and every extension itself is subsumed under the relations between substance.

Wittgenstein's model of logical space is 4D max btw. I'm more interested in hearing how any of the stuff in DKD looks like High 1-A+ because clearly the philosophical models you're referencing are not doing the conclusion justice in regards to whether or not you're justified in holding on to it.

Yes, because the logical space is not actual/concrete, also not abstract as are ersatz modal realism, but possibilities inherent to the nature of objects.

2.014: Objects contain the possibility of all states of affairs

2.0141: The possibility of its occurrence in atomic facts is the form of the object.

What is scaled is the ontological commitment to these Possibilities like in the case of MR and EMR. Which should be understandable by the Tiering system and Faq.

Now to this bit

If we go to the verse explanation page, we can see that the reason the work is High 1-A+ in itself is because there’s a direct explanation that all possible worlds which aren’t logically contradictory to each other exist.

I believe all arguments underlined are arguments from the downgrades thread. Read propely.

Again, this is not inherently High 1-A+, and I'm gonna keep hammering this into you for as long as you use it. Scaling to "all possible worlds" doesn't qualify for anything without ontology; this is exactly why materialist and pragmatist views of "possible worlds" or logical space, like David Lewis's and even Wittgenstein's, don't even scratch the surface of 1-A.

I think you are using words you don't have much knowledge about. Materialism is a view opposing Realism, opposing the very existence of abstract objects that realists like Plato, Aristotle, etc. commit ontological existence for. Pragmatism only views language as tool, not reflecting reality in any ways possible. Obviously they literally reject the existence of Possible world. Heck such views would itself reject higher tiering in Powerscaling itself.

In DKD everything that can be put into writing as long as grammatically correct is possible, and nothing that cannot be expressed by writing is possible.

“Possible worlds?” Akuto “remembered” a word that he’d never known by scanning the data loaded into his mind.
“I see. A thought experiment that says in a world where anything can happen, given enough time, any given thing will happen.”
“Correct. Anything that can be put into writing can happen here. Which means that nothing will happen that can’t be expressed in words.”
Yoshie began to explain the concept of possible worlds, which was difficult to understand just from the database.
For example, “An elephant flies” or “Hitler appears in Paris in the year 2000” are both physically impossible, but perfectly grammatical sentences. If an elephant had wings, or if Hitler was still alive, they could quite easily happen. If you accept that these worlds are possible, you realize that the world is filled with endless possibilities, which can be thought of as simultaneously existing parallel worlds.
~ Demon King Daimaō Volume 13 Chapter 5

Shortly after this statement is contradicted, and this was addressed in the old thread, so why repeat it instead of addressing the contentions? Also, the fact that the combinations are finite means that the language that expresses the propositions that reflect reality is too propositionally incomplete to express all possible worlds.
Whereof to be propositionally incomplete, for simply means a language is far too inadequate in its expressive power to modally express all [maximally] possible worlds logically.

"Shortly after this statement is contradicted, and this was addressed in the old thread, so why repeat it instead of addressing the contentions?" The entire CRT addresses them, did you even read anything? The words that follow do tell me that you didn't, it's a fact that the combinations are infinite, the novel literally says so. What is an argument is the finite space, which I addressed in the separate edited section.

A language is propositionally complete if and only if for every world made out of maximal consistent collections of sentences of that language and every proposition p, either p is true at that world or not- p is true at it. For instance, if it is possible for there to be properties which do not supervene on physical properties, then the language of physics is propositionally incomplete. Unless we are willing to make do with partial worlds, the worldmaking language had better be propositionally complete.
Actuality, Possibility and Worlds

This is a common problem in Ersatzist modal ontologies, the constraints of language increase the propensity of the possible worlds being constrained.
And mind you, this as a contention is already giving the verse the benefit of the doubt because in reality, all languages are propositionally incomplete. I weakened my argument from that, on account of it being simply fiction and an impossible burden by those standards. So, instead of "logically no language can express all possible worlds", a simple demonstration of this is not modally maximal. Is because the character strings by themselves are finite.

If I am not wrong, it is Alien properties or language as Lewis refers to the limitation. The issue is that in linguistic Ersatzism, the maximal consistent set of propositions are the substitute of possible worlds, rather than concrete worlds. Something Lewis mentions is not an issue with his system? Something you said doesn't even cross 1A? What are you even arguing for?

Very much irrelevant, DKD is committing ontologically to the possibilities.

So, as much as you think the "philosophical complexity" of DKD is a saving grace for these impossibilities, then I'm sorry to disappoint you.

Again, you should read what you are replying to. I referred to the philosophical complexity of Aristotle's category.

Also, given that all possible worlds by themselves don't inherently entail High 1-A+ scaling for reasons above, what's gonna be the external justification for High 1-A+ that doesn't arbitrarily presuppose a truth condition for this specific collection of possible worlds is 1-A, let alone High 1-A+?

Oh we do.

Q: Why is Tier 2 split for individual structures and not Tier 1?​

A: For most of fiction, Tier 2 is the common endpoint or largest cosmological structure. Due to the volume of profiles that have this be the endpoint, splitting the 4D Cosmological structures was considered a better way to index profiles. With that said, almost all higher tiers follow the exact same standards as the Tier 2 ratings. To illustrate: if a character destroys three universes, they'd be rated at 2-C, while a character that has destroyed an infinite amount would be rated as 2-A. For Low 1-C all instances are put together, but there is still a power gap between them; so a character who's destroyed an infinite amount of fifth-dimensional universes would be superior to a character who's destroyed a singular fifth-dimensional space for the same reason why a 2-A character is superior to a Low 2-C character.

An additional note is needed for 1-A and High 1-A. Those tiers work on a qualitative transcendence framework, meaning that the weakest 1-A would be superior to all lower tiers by an unbridgeable amount, but the power gap within that 1-A rating can be markedly different. For example, a 1-A character who struggles to break the equivalent of a house wall within a 1-A realm would be notably inferior to a character who can control a cosmological construct within a 1-A realm. By the same notion, a 1-A character who controls an equivalent of an infinite-dimensional structure within that realm would still be below a 1-A (1 Layer) character who views a baseline 1-A realm as qualitatively inferior. The same logic applies to High 1-A.

The Tiers High 1-A+ (Type 2) and 0 do not fall under this principle, as they both involve rather maximal constructs. There can only be one set of all possible worlds, and there can only be one Tier 0 character in a series, so indications of there being multiple constructs or power gaps at this level instead act as anti-feats, indicating that a series should receive a lower rating.

Q: When does a set of all possible worlds qualify for High 1-A+?​

A: Tier High 1-A+ is defined as a character being able to affect arbitrarily many logically possible worlds or embodying all of them. However, strictly speaking the set of all logically possible worlds depends on which system of logic a work of fiction uses. By default we assume that, if a piece of fiction establishes nothing else, it is using a bivalent classical logic which abides by the three laws of thought. This is justified by the fact that it is by a large margin the most used system of logic, to the point that it is implicitly assumed to be what is used in virtually all science and literature. Correspondingly, when we talk about all logically possible worlds, what is meant is the set corresponding to such a system of logic.

Should a fiction employ a different system of logic, then their set of all logically possible worlds only qualifies for High 1-A+ if the logic in question is "weaker" than the above named classical logic. "Weaker" in this sense typically means that breaking one of the rules of classical logic is possible or, more strictly speaking, that their set of all logically possible worlds contains any world which would also be contained in our default set of all logically possible worlds.

Fictions which employ a "stronger" system of logic, i.e. ones whose set of all logically possible worlds don't contain all worlds of the default set of all logically possible worlds, would not qualify for High 1-A+. They would instead receive a lesser Tier. Which one depends on how restrictive the logic system in question is.

The "other" argument is the exhaustion of all relations expressible. The entire Chaos section.

I'm starting to get tired of DKD threads hugging on this statement like it helps their case by itself and alone.
I myself probably wouldn't even hug my future girlfriend this hard, man, let it go.

98% of this proposal is irrelevant pieces of evidence, and another 1% "he creates all possible worlds". And the last 1% is just you over-extending 5 paragraphs to explain 2 scans.

Address them or move on. Ignorance is merely intellectual dishonesty.

If you have to do all of this with such minimal, then the strength of your argument speaks for itself.

I disagree. I knew I've said this before, but I wanted to make it extremely clear. I'll be awaiting your response, and I'll be assessing the logical consistency of your argument for that space of all possibilities not being finite. I urge people to read these seemingly 'higher scaling' statements with nuance in mind.
Ok hun... whatever this means lol

I'm just joking, I'm just joking. Don't worry, pookie, I know what you're trying to convey here. But you're kinda rambling right now, I'm ngl, substance theories and substance predication are uh, man, how do I begin by telling you this...? They're not special elements of ontology alone, let alone are they by themselves High 1-A+

In a modal realist theory, even the 4D/2-A ones like David Lewis, all subjects (and objects) are predicated because all things are exhausted inherently as part of some logical structure and the existent is the sum of it's logical predicates.

Does that mean the physicalist model of modal realism from Daid Lewis is High 1-A+? Speaking of Aristotelian substances, they def aren't High 1-A+, not every substance theory is that strong highly stratified ontologically. The only way anyone would think this is simply High 1-A+, is a person who's lying on these theories like.

But lying assumes one knows what they're talking about, so what I mean to say is that a person who probably doesn't know what he's talking about.

Be civil. If you are incapable of basic etiquette then move on.

 

[ShinMaximillion]

But what is significant is that the Categories exhaust all expressions of being and are completely irreducible, thus referred to as the highest kind.

?????? Utterly preposterous.

First of all, this is severely off-mark. Second of all, read the sources you cited thoroughly out of respect for the integrity of the philosopher you've misattributed this grotesque misuse and misunderstanding of Aristotelian metaphysics:

Although he does not say so overtly in the Categories, Aristotle evidently presumes that these ten categories of being are both exhaustive and irreducible, so that while there are no other basic beings, it is not possible to eliminate any one of these categories in favor of another.
~SEP Aristotle(Category theory)

The scholar you cited says the categories of being are exhaustive and irrevocable. Not that it is exhaustive of Being-as-such (?), it's literally a basic dictum in ontology that Being cannot be exhausted, like genuinely you do know substances and ten categories of Being are all literally just things immanent and aren't even transcendent?? The genus of a horse is not something 1-A, it's literally immanent within the horse itself. Aristotle was a moderate realist. Where did you get the impression that his substances are things that exhaust something Tier 0 like Being-as-such? You think things present within the material world encompass every Tier but Tier 0? Seeing as you think it fully exhausts Being.

Because he was a moderate realist, Aristotle's philosophy was largely centered around our universe. That's why his substance is immanent within material things, even when it is itself not a thing.

there is no other substance beyond those composed by nature, natural science will be the primary science. But if there is some immovable substance, this [that is, theological philoso-phy] will be prior and will be primary philosophy, and it will be universal in this way, namely, because it is primary. - 1026a27–32

Literally every substance for Aristotle is part of the natural science about the physical world; he wished to systemise and abstract the physical world into those categories. The Prime Mover/Being-itself is analogously a substance that is completely different from every other substance. It can't be exhausted, and misusing these theories is gonna strengthen your case here.

Cause what tf do categories that abstract the physical world have to do with 1-A/High 1-A+ (???)

Also, what you cited also misinterpreted on a third level, that "they are irreducible"; they don't mean they are irreducible.

If, then, there is no other substance beyond those composed by nature - 1026a27–32)

It's referring to the fact that Aristotle himself doesn't think there are any substances beyond those of which he discusses that are composed by nature, not are transcendent.

You might not know this but the wiki heavily relies on Substance-attribute theory.

I know because I was the one who told you that in the previous thread. What you do not know, however, is that not only are Aristotelian substances not even transcendent from our universe. And that substance theories depend, and have varying ontological commitments depending on the type of substance theory in question.

There's absolutely no philosophical system that trivially or exhaustively reflects the standards of this power scaling site. Are there similarities? Yes. Are those similarities a reflection of the standards here by necessity? No. This wiki uses genus and substance theories idiosyncratically; not only are you misusing them, but the worst part about this is that it doesn't even change anything about the thread and adds absolutely nothing to your arguments.

Most significant of which, Qualitative superiority refers to fundamental difference between the essence of Primary Substance.

No, that in fact is not qualitative superiority, which is also idiosyncratically used by the wiki. Because the term, as used in the wiki, has no meaning outside of the wiki. But the fact remains that it is not qualitative superiority simply because what you listed is not a unique property of qualitative transcendence.

I think you are using words you don't have much knowledge about. Materialism is a view opposing Realism, opposing the very existence of abstract objects that realists like Plato, Aristotle, etc. commit ontological existence for. Pragmatism only views language as tool, not reflecting reality in any ways possible.

First of all:

commit ontological existence for

It's called ontological commitment, not commitment to ontological existence. Second of all, the word 'existence' presupposes ontology, so it's redundant to say 'ontological existence', stop confusing yourself with the words you're trying so hard to pretend to understand. Moving on

Again, this is not inherently High 1-A+, and I'm gonna keep hammering this into you for as long as you use it. Scaling to "all possible worlds" doesn't qualify for anything without ontology; this is exactly why materialist and pragmatist views of "possible worlds" or logical space, like David Lewis's and even Wittgenstein's, don't even scratch the surface of 1-A.

I said this ^. I don't even think you know what you're correcting. What are you correcting?

Obviously they literally reject the existence of Possible world.

You're not tracking.

Material reality is for Lewis much richer than we used to think. There exist dog- headed “men,” and chimeras and unicorns — but not in our world...possible worlds are concretely existing material objects, as they are on.
Actuality, Possibility and Worlds

For although it is very plausible that a well- defined collection of substantial existing material objects such as Lewis’s possible worlds Actuality, Possibility and Worlds

Possible worlds are concretely existing material objects, as they are on, Lewis’s account, then their collection is a set.
Actuality, Possibility and Worlds

I said David Lewis commits to materialism and modal realism, because he does. Those are not mutually exclusive positions; your assumptions that they are in, correcting ghosts by shadow boxing and responding to them.

So once again, possible worlds are not inherently high scaling things by themselves; you need more contextually apt arguments for the way in which those possible worlds are ontological instantiation, being High 1-A+ itself, not just the possible worlds existing.

The "other" argument is the exhaustion of all relations expressible. The entire Chaos section.

Just by showing how ridiculous a leap of logic this is. By show of hands, what tier do you guys think this fits for, if was taken at face value and without context whatsoever?

Anybody? Anybody? Hello?

I'll tell you this would be Tier 0. Your argument disagrees with taking that statement literally, because you clearly aren't arguing for Tier 0 through this. Yet simultaneously assumes that this statement is meant to be taken literally regarding High 1-A+? Cool why? Why High 1-A+? How many Low Tier 2s do you think that we can count on this wiki that are described as being beyond all things and creating (expression) all things (hence relations), yet are still Tier 2?

I'll let you figure that out yourself unless you want me to bring up the examples themselves.

Now, given that we just got over your implicit disagreement with taking this statement literally (unless you want to argue Tier 0, the only tier that expresses all relations but is without), you can tell us explicitly why this statement would justify by itself High 1-A+

You can argue contextually, even if it doesn't mean isolating the statements, I'm open-minded. I just happen to disagree.

Address them or move on. Ignorance is merely intellectual dishonesty.

I'd give this quote.... Hmmm, maybe 2.5/10, it's really bad. Work on that prose.

Be civil. If you are incapable of basic etiquette then move on.

So dramatic, not a single insult was thrown. This implies I was uncivil, which I was not really. At least compared to what I've seen in the thread previously, and unfortunately, I'm no kind-hearted knight in shining armour. So are we pretending to throw down the rest of my responses under the guise of "grrr civility" hereon? Well, I don't particularly mind. I'm open-minded, as I stated.

That being said, I wouldn't want to be hit with the same card, so I'll not add any snark for this thread and become a knight in shining armour solely for you then.

 

[BlazeISbot111]

No need to be so overly dramatic.

?????? Utterly preposterous.

First of all, this is severely off-mark. Second of all, read the sources you cited thoroughly out of respect for the integrity of the philosopher you've misattributed this grotesque misuse and misunderstanding of Aristotelian metaphysics:

We are Powerscalers, two people can have completely different interpretations of the same text, the very essence of the Powerscaling is debate on interpretations. The first assumption that one have not read the source itself is rather unfounded.

And yes I did. I have read it so the reason why I am linking them.

The scholar you cited says the categories of being are exhaustive and irrevocable. Not that it is exhaustive of Being-as-such (?), it's literally a basic dictum in ontology that Being cannot be exhausted, like genuinely you do know substances and ten categories of Being are all literally just things immanent and aren't even transcendent?? The genus of a horse is not something 1-A, it's literally immanent within the horse itself. Aristotle was a moderate realist. Where did you get the impression that his substances are things that exhaust something Tier 0 like Being-as-such? You think things present within the material world encompass every Tier but Tier 0? Seeing as you think it fully exhausts Being.

1- Go ahead and point out where I said it's High 1A+ and not literally "it does not scale anywhere" or "it's just a subject" and what is of relevance is the "significance", that is, how one involves and uses it in an argument.

2- "it's literally a basic dictum in ontology that Being cannot be exhausted". Wait? Nothing more? It's the most significant claim here. Anything to support this claim? Basic dictum? Who said so? "What there is" is one of the most significant question that almost every Metaphysician goes through, there is no way you can make a claim so significant not add anything over it.

3- "The scholar you cited says the categories of being are exhaustive and irrevocable. Not that it is exhaustive of Being-as-such"
I am rather sure Aristotle studies being-qua-being or being-as-such, so, what are you even trying to suggest? The entire section prior to it was a discussion regarding this very thing.

"If this is correct, then, implies Aristotle, being is a core-dependent homonym; further, a science of being—or, rather, a science of being qua being—becomes possible, even though there is no genus of being, since it is finally possible to study all beings insofar as they are related to the core instance of being, and then also to study that core instance, namely substance, insofar as it serves as the prime occasion of being."

4- "You think things present within the material world encompass every Tier but Tier 0? Seeing as you think it fully exhausts Being."
I am rather sure almost every tier(besides 0 and high 1A+ type 2) in the Tiering System usually scales concrete objects. Universals/ Abstract objects might not be high 1A+ type 2 if they either don't have a High 1A+ cosmology so are just put 1A or other tiers relevant to cosmology as a default, or have anti-feats.

Because he was a moderate realist, Aristotle's philosophy was largely centered around our universe. That's why his substance is immanent within material things, even when it is itself not a thing.

Literally every substance for Aristotle is part of the natural science about the physical world; he wished to systemise and abstract the physical world into those categories. The Prime Mover/Being-itself is analogously a substance that is completely different from every other substance. It can't be exhausted, and misusing these theories is gonna strengthen your case here.

What are you trying to say here? Prime mover is outside the categories and solely considered Substance by analogy?

Cause what tf do categories that abstract the physical world have to do with 1-A/High 1-A+ (???)

Pantheism refers to God as being identical with nature or the Universe, we still scale it to T0 if it fits the description without any requirement in cosmology. It's the same for Categories, there is no need for Aristole to go outside of his conception of the world, what would be scaled is the use of it in works and thus it's qualification.
It's this reason that I specifically said it's unscalable and just a subject.

Also, what you cited also misinterpreted on a third level, that "they are irreducible"; they don't mean they are irreducible.

It's referring to the fact that Aristotle himself doesn't think there are any substances beyond those of which he discusses that are composed by nature, not are transcendent.

What? Categories itself are irreducible as there's no genus more fundamental that can produce Categories themselves thorough a genus-differentia distinction. The reason why they are said to be "highest kind". What the passage was referring to them as not being reduced into another kind without loosing its very essence, very much similar to what I said above. The reason for the exhaustion itself.

I know because I was the one who told you that in the previous thread. What you do not know, however, is that not only are Aristotelian substances not even transcendent from our universe. And that substance theories depend, and have varying ontological commitments depending on the type of substance theory in question.

No? I don't remember ever addressing any such argument. Could you link where you said so and then I addressed it.

Additionally, these Transcendents things would than be Universals(mental objects are rather irrelevant) similar to forms. Continue what I said above in the fourth point.

There's absolutely no philosophical system that trivially or exhaustively reflects the standards of this power scaling site. Are there similarities? Yes. Are those similarities a reflection of the standards here by necessity? No. This wiki uses genus and substance theories idiosyncratically; not only are you misusing them, but the worst part about this is that it doesn't even change anything about the thread and adds absolutely nothing to your arguments.

Misusing? I specifically said that QS and everything above it is subsumed under relations, something that would support the High 1A+. This is just unnecessary overextrapolation of one or two sentences.

No, that in fact is not qualitative superiority, which is also idiosyncratically used by the wiki. Because the term, as used in the wiki, has no meaning outside of the wiki. But the fact remains that it is not qualitative superiority simply because what you listed is not a unique property of qualitative transcendence.

I am pretty sure that would have been obvious when I added its relational property. And I very well referred to the distinction in Essence as most significant one, not the only.

First of all:

It's called ontological commitment, not commitment to ontological existence. Second of all, the word 'existence' presupposes ontology, so it's redundant to say 'ontological existence', stop confusing yourself with the words you're trying so hard to pretend to understand. Moving on

Well thanks for correction.

I said this ^. I don't even think you know what you're correcting. What are you correcting?

You're not tracking.

I said David Lewis commits to materialism and modal realism, because he does. Those are not mutually exclusive positions; your assumptions that they are in, correcting ghosts by shadow boxing and responding to them.

I am referring to the "materialist" and "pragmatic" views you yourself mentioned as some sort of support for why Ontology is necessary for Possible High 1A+. Which doesn't make sense as Modal Realism is Realism. Lewis is materialist as far as his Philosophy of Mind is concerned, which as far as I know is completely irrelevant to his Modal Realism.

Which itself is insensible when the entire CRT is repeatedly commiting to Ontology.

Again, this is not inherently High 1-A+, and I'm gonna keep hammering this into you for as long as you use it. Scaling to "all possible worlds" doesn't qualify for anything without ontology; this is exactly why materialist and pragmatist views of "possible worlds" or logical space, like David Lewis's and even Wittgenstein's, don't even scratch the surface of 1-A.

So once again, possible worlds are not inherently high scaling things by themselves; you need more contextually apt arguments for the way in which those possible worlds are ontological instantiation, being High 1-A+ itself, not just the possible worlds existing.

You haven't addressed the many times I am referring to the ontological commitment yet are repeating the same thing. Why?

Just by showing how ridiculous a leap of logic this is. By show of hands, what tier do you guys think this fits for, if was taken at face value and without context whatsoever?

Anybody? Anybody? Hello?

I'll tell you this would be Tier 0. Your argument disagrees with taking that statement literally, because you clearly aren't arguing for Tier 0 through this. Yet simultaneously assumes that this statement is meant to be taken literally regarding High 1-A+? Cool why? Why High 1-A+? How many Low Tier 2s do you think that we can count on this wiki that are described as being beyond all things and creating (expression) all things (hence relations), yet are still Tier 2?

Now, given that we just got over your implicit disagreement with taking this statement literally (unless you want to argue Tier 0, the only tier that expresses all relations but is without), you can tell us explicitly why this statement would justify by itself High 1-A+

You can argue contextually, even if it doesn't mean isolating the statements, I'm open-minded. I just happen to disagree.

Uh. What? I think you should have actually read the CRT. No seriously, I specifically and many times referred to how the individuation and relational principle is necessary to the verse, without which the stories cannot be formed. Chaos happens as a consequence of exhaustion of relations while simultaneously breaking the principle of individual. Which again isn't so because Akuto is beyond them, it happens as a consequence of actualisation which itself was empowered and a necessity.

I already addressed this to Qawsedf234 here. It does seem to be the case that you are not reading either the CRT or the thread.

I'd give this quote.... Hmmm, maybe 2.5/10, it's really bad. Work on that prose.

No

So dramatic, not a single insult was thrown. This implies I was uncivil, which I was not really. At least compared to what I've seen in the thread previously, and unfortunately, I'm no kind-hearted knight in shining armour. So are we pretending to throw down the rest of my responses under the guise of "grrr civility" hereon? Well, I don't particularly mind. I'm open-minded, as I stated.

That being said, I wouldn't want to be hit with the same card, so I'll not add any snark for this thread and become a knight in shining armour solely for you then.

Insulting is the only way one can be toxic or uncivil? Do you consider the many ad hominems to be only relevant to toxicity? Why do you think they are referred to as fallacy of irrelevancy?

If you would have read the thread it would be visible that there's a reply where I did ask both the sides to not derail the CRT, irrelevant to if anyone is toxic or not.

"So are we pretending to throw down the rest of my responses under the guise of "grrr civility" hereon?" Aren't they already addressed multiple times and you are the one ignoring some of my own especially ones that are more significant, like the ontological commitment in DKD. Aren't you unnecessarily formatting my reply by removing the context?

 

[AKUTO123]

Yes, DT said he would make a CRT for High1A+, but you were faster than him. Anyway, it's a really, really, really huge wall of text and seems like it was made with a lot of effort, but can people really read this without getting tired, especially the moderators? To get to the point, I'll read this and then write my real review.

 

[Mizuki67]

Yes, DT said he would make a CRT for High1A+, but you were faster than him. Anyway, it's a really, really, really huge wall of text and seems like it was made with a lot of effort, but can people really read this without getting tired, especially the moderators? To get to the point, I'll read this and then write my real review.

Honestly this would had been better off a staff thread. Also dk what is with hostility against DKD guess Tensura isnt the only verse that had the same kind of treatment.