Low 1-C Base Sonic characters

[Omegabronic]

But it does though Tails knows many of the Ancients devices can take base Sonic on in a fight

and Super Sonic via the Titans, and that they had access to the Chaos Emeralds

and when he sees an entity overpower the Ancients technology he says the power it showed in the vision is on par with Dark Gaia.

Yeah.... casual attack nowhere near its full power is = to DK "easily"... which would meam the real deal is >>>>>> DK, which would be >>> Base Sonic regardless as the Titans, who are a big challenge for Super Sonic, were defeated by it

Therefore that comparison means Tails thinks Dark Gaia at max power could replicate what The End did casually hence the comparison and what The End did casually was grossly overpower devices that rival base Sonic at minimum.

no? Tails was talking about The End, it is cassually on DG's level, we don't know the durability of the lasers the ancients used. And Tails know they had Chaos Emerald level weapons

All he said is that the power of the lasers were casually on DG's level, he never says WHY he reached that cpnclusion, you affirming the reason needs proof

So therefore the power comparison only makes sense if Dark Gaia is stronger than base Sonic and by extension Infinite.

No? It also makes sense if Infinite and Sonic are not as cassually on DG's level as that was, there are far more explanations that make sense?

Well, in that case, it wouldn't be a problem applying Eggman's statement of having learned the power of the Precioustone to the Super Eggrobo's power being immeasurable to him, right?

Again... why limit to the Precioustone?

 

[Snek]

All he said is that the power of the lasers were casually on DG's level, he never says WHY he reached that cpnclusion, you affirming the reason needs proof

He reached that conclusion from watching The Ends lasers overpower the Ancients technology. The statement from Tails literally means what he witnessed in the vision is on par with Dark Gaia.

 

[McFriesGuy075]

Again... why limit to the Precioustone?

To my knowledge, he never ascertains wether he knows of the full power of the Chaos Emeralds or the Jeweled Scepter.

Are you implying the Super Eggrobo is 1-C too?

 

[Omegabronic]

To my knowledge, he never ascertains wether he knows of the full power of the Chaos Emeralds or the Jeweled Scepter.

He literaly saw Sonic using them to their full power... multiple times, against himself even, and... he made the EggWizard and saw how powerful it was

Are you implying the Super Eggrobo is 1-C too?

I mean... yeah

Then again, i think it is a little beyond this thread, should prob be made its own thread

He reached that conclusion from watching The Ends lasers overpower the Ancients technology. The statement from Tails literally means what he witnessed in the vision is on par with Dark Gaia.

No, it means the thing he saw firing the lasers is, via it overpowering sp casually the people that could use the things used to defeat DG last time, you assuming he said that purely cuz they "one shot base Sonic opponents" is only that... an assumption

 

[Snek]

No, it means the thing he saw firing the lasers is,

Tails is literally using what he saw in the vision as a gauge for The Ends power. What does the phrase on par with mean to you?

via it overpowering sp casually the people that could use the things used to defeat DG last time,

Literally all of the Ancients technology runs on Chaos Emeralds that point is irrelevant.

you assuming he said that purely cuz they "one shot base Sonic opponents" is only that... an assumption

No I'm assuming that Tails said that because he literally watched a display of power and compared said display of power to Dark Gaia immediately after he witnessed it. It just so happens that casually wiping out the Ancients tech like that is a feat more powerful than base Sonic.

 

[Omegabronic]

Tails is literally using what he saw in the vision as a gauge for The Ends power.

Yeah, and what he saw was The End exterminating easily the race that had free, 24/7 access to the Chaos Emeralds to fight against it, and yet they still lost, aka, the same power used to defeat Dark Gaia

What does the phrase on par with mean to you?

On the same overall level, now answer me this: What does "casual attack" and "Easily on par" mean to you? Cuz Tails said The End's extremely casual attacks was "easily" on par with DK, aka, The End is >>>>>>> DG

Literally all of the Ancients technology runs on Chaos Emeralds that point is irrelevant.

Not it isn't? If all is powered by the Emeralds, then all of their tech had the potential to use their full power, if not, a good portion could, specially since Tails and Sonic saw the Titans at this point, which showed that the Ancients could access the full power of the Emeralds, and yet, it still easily dealt with all of them

The Chaos Emeralds is the power used by Light Gaia to always stop Dark Gaia, so being casually above that = "Easily on par with Dark Gaia"

No I'm assuming that Tails said that because he literally watched a display of power and compared said display of power to Dark Gaia immediately after he witnessed it.

Said Display being the civization with the power that is on par with Dark Gaia being wiped out easily, and him saying The End is "easily" on par with Dark Gaia, aka, being superior to Dark Gaia, you are forgetting the context and what he says alongside "on par", he is saying it is stronger, not equal

It just so happens that casually wiping out the Ancients tech like that is a feat more powerful than base Sonic.

Again, that is never said, the comparison made is to it being superior to Dark Gaia, a comparison to Base Sonic is never made

 

[Snek]

Yeah, and what he saw was The End exterminating easily the race that had free, 24/7 access to the Chaos Emeralds to fight against it, and yet they still lost, aka, the same power used to defeat Dark Gaia

Why would Tails have made the comparison to Dark Gaia specifically if it was the Chaos Emeralds powering the Ancients tech that was the basis of him being impressed by The Ends power display? After all if base Sonic and Infinite were stronger than Dark Gaia but still obviously vastly inferior to the Chaos Emeralds why wouldn't Tails have just said that was on par with the Chaos Emeralds easily rather than on par with Dark Gaia?

On the same overall level, now answer me this: What does "casual attack" and "Easily on par" mean to you? Cuz Tails said The End's extremely casual attacks was "easily" on par with DK, aka, The End is >>>>>>> DG

It means Dark Gaia is on par with The Ends casual attack that took out those parts of the Ancients technology. The easily part is an acknowledgement that The End is stronger than what it showed in the vision which doesn't discredit what was shown in the vision being a level of power comparable to Dark Gaia in the opinion of Tails. It simply means this suppressed attack is as powerful as Dark Gaia and that the entity held back when it preformed said feat.

Said Display being the civization with the power that is on par with Dark Gaia being wiped out easily, and him saying The End is "easily" on par with Dark Gaia, aka, being superior to Dark Gaia, you are forgetting the context and what he says alongside "on par", he is saying it is stronger, not equal

Tails saying The End is on par with Dark Gaia easily after seeing that specifc feat means that specific feat is on par with Dark Gaia otherwise Tails wouldn't have made that comparison. And again the easily part just means that The End is stronger than what it has shown which Tails knows not that what it has shown in that one vision wasn't on par with Dark Gaia.

Again, that is never said, the comparison made is to it being superior to Dark Gaia, a comparison to Base Sonic is never made

Yes but we can draw comparisons. And what we see is that Tails and Sonic witness a vision of The End wiping out multiple pieces of the Ancients technology and Tails says that is on par with Dark Gaia. And the comparison we can draw is that the Ancients tech rivals base Sonic even with Gaurdians so casually wiping them out as The End did is a feat that should surpass base Sonic and Dark Gaia scales to that casual feat.

 

[Omegabronic]

Why would Tails have made the comparison to Dark Gaia specifically if it was the Chaos Emeralds powering the Ancients tech that was the basis of him being impressed by The Ends power display?

I am merely saying that his statement is true regardless, as they had the Chaos Emeralds to be on par with Dark Gaia

You said it was exclussively because it was >>> Base Sonic, but that, evidently, wasn't the case at all

After all if base Sonic and Infinite were stronger than Dark Gaia but still obviously vastly inferior to the Chaos Emeralds

They are not "vastly inferior", Sonic as of now scales to them for his 2-C rating even

why wouldn't Tails have just said that was on par with the Chaos Emeralds easily rather than on par with Dark Gaia?

Why didn't he made the Comparison to the Time Eater then? He would be superior to Base Sonic and Dark Gaia.

He just choose to make a comparison to Dark Gaia, which is true regardless to DG being relative to the Emeralds in Unleashed, you are speaking as if him citing DG proves the latter is much superior to anything else he could have included, which would include infinite... when that isn't true, he already didn't mention being and enemies we know are stronger than Dark Gaia, ultimately, we don't know why he cited Dark Gaia specifically, if it was a matter of power, he could have cited the Time Eater, maybe that one attack he got a mere glimpse at was only Dark Gaia's level and not anyone else's, maybe it was the first thing that came to mind, we simply don't know

What you have to prove is that it was cuz Dark Gaia is >> Base Sonic and Infinite as of Forces and Frontiers, cuz that's your affirmation, something that is casually above Dark Gaia can very well be >>> Base Sonic and Infinite, considering how we don't know how much stronger Infinite is than the former, we can't say he is as casually above as how Tails perceived The End in that one cutscene

Tl;Dr: That cutscene is too vague to drawn such a specific conclusion as you are doing, you say it MUST be because Dark Gaia is >>> Them, while it could equally be because they aren't casually above Dark Gaia, at least, not in the same casual way The End is shown to be

It means Dark Gaia is on par with The Ends casual attack that took out those parts of the Ancients technology. The easily part is an acknowledgement that The End is stronger than what it showed in the vision which doesn't discredit what was shown in the vision being a level of power comparable to Dark Gaia in the opinion of Tails.
It simply means this suppressed attack is as powerful as Dark Gaia and that the entity held back when it preformed said feat.

Never said the opposite tho? Don't understand why you are talking about this

Tails saying The End is on par with Dark Gaia easily after seeing that specifc feat means that specific feat is on par with Dark Gaia otherwise Tails wouldn't have made that comparison. And again the easily part just means that The End is stronger than what it has shown which Tails knows not that what it has shown in that one vision wasn't on par with Dark Gaia.

When have i said it wasn't on par with Dark Gaia? again, what are you even arguing at this point?

Yes but we can draw comparisons. And what we see is that Tails and Sonic witness a vision of The End wiping out multiple pieces of the Ancients technology and Tails says that is on par with Dark Gaia. And the comparison we can draw is that the Ancients tech rivals base Sonic

Their tech SURPASSES base Sonic, the Titans, the Lasers tagging and knocking Sonic out of his Super Form, Tails being utterly impressed by the Lasers, etc

You are wrong on the tech not being above base Sonic... the tech very clearly is, Tails know that it is, Sonic knows and fought those that are above him, Tails saw people who could use the Power Source on par with Super Sonic, casually losing. You cannot affirm something that ignores all else we see in the story

You cannot argue that DG is = TE when the Statement is implying superiority

even with Gaurdians so casually wiping them out as The End did is a feat that should surpass base Sonic and Dark Gaia scales to that casual feat.

Dark Gaia downscales as that one casual attack is "easily" on par with it, aka, it is prob stronger, as Tails didn't had time to analyse the attack, he saw a mere glanse and made a quick statement, that's all

 

[Snek]

Look Tails simply said that what he saw was on par with Dark Gaia. Not stronger than Dark Gaia but on par with and that it was done easily not that Dark Gaia can't replicate the feat of The End wiping out an islands worth of the Ancients technology as the phrase on par with implies. And wiping out as much of the Ancients mid tier tech as Tails saw get destroyed in the vision is a feat above base Sonic because of how powerful said tech is so it doesn't matter that The End wasn't going all out when it did that the point is that Dark Gaia is on par with The End when it is suppressed and that is enough to be above base Sonic.

What I'm saying.
The End (at full power)>>>The End (suppressed) = Dark Gaia (according to Tails saying that was on par with Dark Gaia) >> The Ancients tech that was decimated in the vision > Base Sonic > Infinite.

 

[Omegabronic]

Look Tails simply said that what he saw was on par with Dark Gaia. Not stronger than Dark Gaia but on par with and that it was done easily not that Dark Gaia can't replicate the feat of The End wiping out an islands worth of the Ancients technology as the phrase on par with implies.

He briefly saw it, and said what he briefly witnessed(He didn't had the time to analyse the attack to know its strength) was EASILY on par with Dark Gaia, aka, it effortlessly was comparable, so he is saying that something is casually on par with it after only briefly seeing it without having time to analyse to know for sure, why are you assuming he instantly knew The End's power there effortlessly after only seeing it for a few seconds?

And wiping out as much of the Ancients mid tier tech as Tails saw get destroyed in the vision is a feat above base Sonic because of how powerful said tech is so it doesn't matter that The End wasn't going all out when it did that the point is that Dark Gaia is on par with The End when it is suppressed and that is enough to be above base Sonic.

So, The End suppressed is easily on par with Dark Gaia, aka, implying superiority as it would be without effort:
Easily
Definition: with no difficulty or effort

Aka, the force there is ABOVE Dark Gaia, as it without effort at all showed a power relative to Dark Gaia, and Tails KNOWS that the ancients had things stronger than Super Sonic in their disposal, so him saying that something that can wipe out an entire civilization that has tech on par with the Chaos Emeralds(As it literally used them)

In no part of the cutscene it is said that the feat "easily on par" with Dark Gaia is the destruction of the random lasers, It could just as easily be them seeing how one sided the conflicted between the Ancients and The End was

What I'm saying.
The End (at full power)>>>The End (suppressed) = Dark Gaia (according to Tails saying that was on par with Dark Gaia) >> The Ancients tech that was decimated in the vision > Base Sonic > Infinite.

Prove this part, prove that the tech in question is the strength tails is impressed by contrary to the more obvious example of The End wiping out the Ancients

Again, by your Logic Dark Gaia >>>>> TIme Eater and Tails didn't bother to mention him? We don't know why he mentioned specifically Dark Gaia, but given that he didn't mentioned the beings that are factually far stronger than him, power is likely not the reason

 

[Snek]

He briefly saw it, and said what he briefly witnessed(He didn't had the time to analyse the attack to know its strength) was EASILY on par with Dark Gaia, aka, it effortlessly was comparable, so he is saying that something is casually on par with it after only briefly seeing it without having time to analyse to know for sure, why are you assuming he instantly knew The End's power there effortlessly after only seeing it for a few seconds?

And why are you assuming one of the most knowledgeable characters in the franchise is incorrect to support your headcanon? Sure Tails may not know the exact level of power he saw in the vision but that doesn't mean his opinion is far from reality and of all characters Tails wouldn't say something like that without any basis meaning at worst Dark Gaia is still comparable to the tech that The End masacred as if he wasn't it would make no sense for Tails to compare Dark Gaia to The End for taking out that tech in the first place.

So, The End suppressed is easily on par with Dark Gaia, aka, implying superiority as it would be without effort:
Easily
Definition: with no difficulty or effort

Yes The End at full power is superior to Dark Gaia. Therefore preforming an attack equal in strength to Dark Gaia in the vision was easy for it that doesn't mean said attack wasn't equal to Dark Gaia just that it was easy to produce.

Aka, the force there is ABOVE Dark Gaia, as it without effort at all showed a power relative to Dark Gaia

So you admit it taking out those lasers is a feat on par with Dark Gaia then?

In no part of the cutscene it is said that the feat "easily on par" with Dark Gaia is the destruction of the random lasers, It could just as easily be them seeing how one sided the conflicted between the Ancients and The End was

Great in that case Tails would be comparing The End to Dark Gaia for wiping out a Super Sonic tier civilization and therefore Dark Gaia would have to be relavant power wise even to modern Super Sonic.

Prove this part, prove that the tech in question is the strength tails is impressed by contrary to the more obvious example of The End wiping out the Ancients

I don't need to because if Tails was impressed because of something taking out a Super Sonic tier civilization rather than being impressed by something overpowering those lasers and still made that comparison that butchers your argument not mine.

Again, by your Logic Dark Gaia >>>>> TIme Eater and Tails didn't bother to mention him? We don't know why he mentioned specifically Dark Gaia, but given that he didn't mentioned the beings that are factually far stronger than him, power is likely not the reason

No and for one is there any contradiction in lore to Dark Gaia being stronger than Time Eater aside from their AOE (and I'm asking as someone who thinks Time Eater should be stronger than Dark Gaia but really would their be any contradictions if that opinion wasn't true)? For two that doesn't mean Dark Gaia has to be stronger than Time Eater because The End was suppressed when it did the feat so Time Eater could just be superior to suppressed version of The End that Dark Gaia is equal to while The End at full power still surpasses both of them. Third it makes sense for Tails to not bring up Time Eater if he believed what he saw in the vision wasn't on par with it that is not a contradiction it just means The End was holding back significantly.

 

[Omegabronic]

And why are you assuming one of the most knowledgeable characters in the franchise

How can he be knowledgeable on something he is seeing for the first time for a few seconds? Being smart

is incorrect to support your headcanon? Sure Tails may not know the exact level of power he saw in the vision but that doesn't mean his opinion is far from reality

When have i said he was incorrect? My argument is that him being right or wrong has no bearing on this situation

and of all characters Tails wouldn't say something like that without any basis meaning at worst Dark Gaia is still comparable to the tech that The End masacred

Which you say is comparable to Sonic... so... ?

as if he wasn't it would make no sense for Tails to compare Dark Gaia to The End for taking out that tech in the first place.

He could see the beam itself and the power it contained on impact? He could simply be commenting on the fact it took out the Ancients that had the emeralds on their disposal, as i said, many possibilities, but you are the one saying there's only one, regardless if that contradicts stuff said before about the level of the characters in question

Yes The End at full power is superior to Dark Gaia. Therefore preforming an attack equal in strength to Dark Gaia in the vision was easy for it that doesn't mean said attack wasn't equal to Dark Gaia just that it was easy to produce.

It means that Tails sees The End as "easily" on par with Dark Gaia, aka, without any effort, by a casual attack, that he only saw for a few seconds, one time, without any measurement device to truly know its power
Your argument heavily relies on Tails' vibes about what he just saw... i am not even saying he's wrong, but clearly something "easily" on par with Dark Gaia, that he only saw for a second, implies superiority, as even without measuring it, he still saw as casually on Dark Gaia's level

So you admit it taking out those lasers is a feat on par with Dark Gaia then?

No, it is above, as The End is above Dark Gaia, and even a slightly glimpse of it without any measuring is on par with Dark Gaia by Tail's eyes, even when he only saw it once, for a few seconds, with no way to measure this power at all

Great in that case Tails would be comparing The End to Dark Gaia for wiping out a Super Sonic tier civilization and therefore Dark Gaia would have to be relavant power wise even to modern Super Sonic.

No? Again, WE DON'T KNOW, could just as easily be Tails comparing The End to Dark Gaia "easily" simply cuz he only saw that so far, not knowing what happened after, the state of the machine afterwards(Which there's still a lot btw), etc

Refer to above for more elaboration on my point, i won't repeat myself again

I don't need to-

You do... you really do

because if Tails was impressed because of something taking out a Super Sonic tier civilization rather than being impressed by something overpowering those lasers and still made that comparison that butchers your argument not mine.

Not really, as i said, we don't know how much stronger Infinite is compared to Dark Gaia, so it one shotting something on par with it can simply be above what Infinite can do

i said this like, 4 times already, you still do not answer it

No and for one is there any contradiction in lore to Dark Gaia being stronger than Time Eater aside from their AOE (and I'm asking as someone who thinks Time Eater should be stronger than Dark Gaia but really would their be any contradictions if that opinion wasn't true)?

The fact that Time Eater fought a stronger Super Sonic?(Super Forms grow alongside their users as shown in Frontiers and accepted here) and that it took 2 Super Forms to beat?

For two that doesn't mean Dark Gaia has to be stronger than Time Eater because The End was suppressed when it did the feat so Time Eater could just be superior to suppressed version of The End that Dark Gaia is equal to while The End at full power still surpasses both of them.

That is your headcanon, your point was that it didn't mention Infinite cuz Dark Gaia is stronger, by this logic i can just as easily say "The End was suppressed when it did the feat so Infinite could just be superior to suppressed version of The End that Dark Gaia is equal to while The End at full power still surpasses both of them"

Tell me why you are using an argument you were rejecting before

Third it makes sense for Tails to not bring up Time Eater if he believed what he saw in the vision wasn't on par with it that is not a contradiction it just means The End was holding back significantly.

You do understand i can say the same exact thing for Infinite... Right? "it makes sense for Tails to not bring up Infinite if he believed what he saw in the vision wasn't on par with him that is not a contradiction it just means The End was holding back significantly."

 

[Snek]

How can he be knowledgeable on something he is seeing for the first time for a few seconds? Being smart

Knowing the general strength of the Ancients technology and seeing it get overpowered.

When have i said he was incorrect? My argument is that him being right or wrong has no bearing on this situation

Because if Tails is right in saying The End as seen in the vision is equal to Dark Gaia it either means Dark Gaia is stronger than base Frontiers Sonic tier technology or is comparable to technology that downscales Super Sonic because it's in that vision where Tails sees The End beating the Ancients weapons and calls that on par with Dark Gaia.

He could see the beam itself and the power it contained on impact? He could simply be commenting on the fact it took out the Ancients that had the emeralds on their disposal, as i said, many possibilities, but you are the one saying there's only one, regardless if that contradicts stuff said before about the level of the characters in question

It can't be based on the power the beam had on impact because Dark Gaia has planetary AOE The End didn't show in that vision and that vision is the basis of the comparison Tails made. And if he is commenting on The End beating a civilization with the emeralds on hand then that changes nothing because the Ancients use Chaos Emeralds to make their base Sonic tier Gaurdians as well as those lasers and Tails thought obliterating them was on par with Dark Gaia which would make him stronger than base Sonic and Infinite by extension via that comparison anyways.

It means that Tails sees The End as "easily" on par with Dark Gaia, aka, without any effort, by a casual attack, that he only saw for a few seconds, one time, without any measurement device to truly know its power
Your argument heavily relies on Tails' vibes about what he just saw... i am not even saying he's wrong, but clearly something "easily" on par with Dark Gaia, that he only saw for a second, implies superiority, as even without measuring it, he still saw as casually on Dark Gaia's level

Yes casually on Dark Gaias level while obliterating the Ancients Technology at said level. My argument relies on Tails being not too far off in saying what The End did in the vision was on par with Dark Gaia. I'm just taking Tails at his word but why aren't you?

No, it is above, as The End is above Dark Gaia, and even a slightly glimpse of it without any measuring is on par with Dark Gaia by Tail's eyes, even when he only saw it once, for a few seconds, with no way to measure this power at all

Wiping out the Ancients tech was his way to measure that power. Hence why he made the comparison immediately after seeing the vision of The End overpowering those lasers.

That is your headcanon, your point was that it didn't mention Infinite cuz Dark Gaia is stronger, by this logic i can just as easily say "The End was suppressed when it did the feat so Infinite could just be superior to suppressed version of The End that Dark Gaia is equal to while The End at full power still surpasses both of them"

And then you would have a circular scaling chain The End (full power) >>> Infinite and Base Sonic > The End (supressed) = Dark Gaia > The Ancients technology > or = Base Sonic > Infinite

 

[JJSliderman]

Base Sonic isn’t above Infinite, he was never able to beat Infinite or the DER on its own.

 

[Robo432343]

this has been rejected

 

[JPTheGamer]

this has been rejected

Yeah, this thread isn't going anywhere, so I think it's just best to close it.

 

[Omegabronic]

It wasn't rejected(no staff even commented on it) but yeah, better to close it, the OP didn't even made the right proposal based on the evidence anyway

 

[McFriesGuy075]

The world isn't ready for cartoon talking animals being able to destroy infinite dimensional structures

 

[Apex_Predator_GX]

Bump

 

[TokiNoOuja]

Tbf since base Sonic grow stronger than before which contribute to Super form does'nt that makes every single Super forms in newest always stronger than the latest?

Eggman using the Ruby to powered the Egg Robot in Force and stated as his ultimate creation to the point' he will gave revenge from his last defeat hundred times (and at this point he already used Egg Salamander,Egg Wizard,Time Eater,etc) so Sonic from that point' should be straight up 1-C in base

 

[McFriesGuy075]

So characters from Sonic Shuffle to Sonic X Shadow Generations are Low 1-C and those from Sonic Lost World and onwards will be 1-C? Would the latter contradict the variable rating of Super Forms or would it just turn into an unquantifiable boost on top of the massively upscaled 128x multiplier?

 

[JJSliderman]

Idk if Low 1-C is just coming from Void scaling, might be an outlier.

 

[McFriesGuy075]

Idk if Low 1-C is just coming from Void scaling, might be an outlier.

Im pretty sure we can make it way less of an outlier by getting the Classic Cast to 2-C (I know multiple ways of getting them there anyway). The Low 1-Cs would be scaling off of Void and the incomplete Time Eater's feats.

 

[JJSliderman]

Base Sonic pretty much got smacked aside by the incomplete TE with ease, the only time they noted potential comparisons was the 3DS version maybe implying Sonic pushed back the TE with the boost when retrieving the Emerald, but it was kinda unclear.

 

[McFriesGuy075]

the 3DS version maybe implying Sonic pushed back the TE with the boost when retrieving the Emerald, but it was kinda unclear.

I thought it was pretty clear that the intention was Sonic knocking back TE with the Boost with that impact sound effect. Sonic not handling the Time Eater's strikes well in the beginning of Generations could easily be chalked up to it being stronger in the hierarchy, given Sonic still survives no problem.

3Ds Gens Sonic tolerates it better though

 

[JJSliderman]

I guess the issue is Sonic never actually definitively harms any of these low 1-C characters, the scaling seems dubious. Probably an “at most” is the highest feasible.

 

[Hypercyber37]

Base Sonic and Friends fight against Void. Base Shadow fights against Metal overlord but still the Infinite is Strongest villian statement that happens after all of them is considered inconsistent...

 

[Zyurtunder13]

I Disagree for the reasons stated

 

[Omegabronic]

Base Sonic and Friends fight against Void. Base Shadow fights against Metal overlord but still the Infinite is Strongest villian statement that happens after all of them is considered inconsistent...

It is not Base Shadow, it Shadow amped by the Doom Powers, we had a whole thread on that

 

[McFriesGuy075]

Probably an “at most” is the highest feasible.

That wouldn't be necessary since they can harm themselves, and besides, the Time Eater would scale far above "baseline" infinite Low 1-C by the time Sonic Generations happens.

The one thing I dont really agree with Void is his transformation providing a likely higher rating, he transformed into that state to get access to more abilities.

 

[TheHedgememe]

Shadow was amped during that time, so the MO fight doesn't matter for base forms

There are other statements to make it more consostent tho

Yep. I've already been corrected on that, don't worry.

Shadow doesn’t count, he had doom powers.

 

[ZothythoTheNephalem]

Tbh, maybe a new, more concise thread should be made that doesn't hinge on just one argument. No offense, it just feels like there isn't enough supporting evidence in the original post. I don't disagree, is the thing. I just feel like the original post is a bit poor and lacking too much evidence to support the claim.

 

[McFriesGuy075]

That wouldn't be necessary since they can harm themselves, and besides, the Time Eater would scale far above "baseline" infinite Low 1-C by the time Sonic Generations happens.

The one thing I dont really agree with Void is his transformation providing a likely higher rating, he transformed into that state to get access to more abilities.

but yeah if we wanna start by consistency we put aside Sonic Shuffle and start Tier 1 from the modern era, given we have feats and support for Tier 1 back to back to back in Sonic Generations, Sonic Lost World and Sonic Forces

I've got a rough sandbox for a simple Tier 1 Base Cast CRT, if there's anyone that wants to see it just DM me.

 

[CloverDragon03]

(Frankly I'm starting to think Tier 2 is pushing it a bit [at least if not for Prime], Tier 1 is a hell no)

 

[ZothythoTheNephalem]

Eternal Sonic scaling hater LMAO

 

[McFriesGuy075]

(Frankly I'm starting to think Tier 2 is pushing it a bit [at least if not for Prime], Tier 1 is a hell no)

Heavily debatable. Also, dude, you were the one that upgraded them to Tier 2 in the first place, now you think THAT is pushing the limits?

 

[CloverDragon03]

Heavily debatable. Also, dude, you were the one that upgraded them to Tier 2 in the first place, now you think THAT is pushing the limits?

See this might sound crazy but opinions can change over time

 

[ZothythoTheNephalem]

Convenient change of opinion, more like.

 

[CloverDragon03]

Convenient change of opinion, more like.

I've felt this way for a few months at least but have only spoken of it in private channels due to my fading interest in the wiki, don't talk so confidently about people you don't know just because they contest your precious scaling

This is also one of only 3 messages you've sent on this thread, only one of which was actually productive. So if you have nothing useful to say, don't say it

 

[ZothythoTheNephalem]

I've felt this way for a few months at least but have only spoken of it in private channels due to my fading interest in the wiki, don't talk so confidently about people you don't know just because they contest your precious scaling

This is also one of only 3 messages you've sent on this thread, only one of which was actually productive. So if you have nothing useful to say, don't say it

No, I just see you whinging hard about Sonic scaling whenever you get the chance and it's just become tired at this point.

Also, whatever you said was just as useless lol. It started with saying "no argument" and then "thread not concise", which was just about what I said. Then it went to "erhm maybe 2c isn't it". Check yourself, brother. Don't get jumpy. You're just as worthless to this thread.

If you want to flaunt some sort of superiority in this thread, actually make an argument. Otherwise, stay quiet.