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Keigo Takami (Hawks) Vs Kaina Tsutsumi (Lady Nagant) (My Hero Academia) [2-7-0] GRACE

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CastoriceTheFifth

CastoriceTheFifth

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Hawks Vs Lady Nagant

Hawks
Attack Potency: 42.37 Petatons
Durability: 10.08 Kilotons
Lifting Strength: Unknown

Lady Nagant
Attack Potency: Downscales From 42.37 Petatons
Durability: 237.32 Tons, 42.37 Petatons With Rifle
Lifting Strength: Superhuman

Speed is unequalized
Fight takes place in that one city that Lady Nagant fought Deku
They both possess the same knowledge of each other from in the story.

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The Hero Public Safety Commission Assassin Replacement: @Catbowtie @CastoriceTheFifth
The Original Hero Public Safety Commission Assassin: @Arkansalter2 @TheRustyOne @Anonymous_Learner @XSOULOFCINDERX @Inferno3054 @Mapl3Sy4up @GodEarh206
 
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Considering Rewind AFO is just Prime AFO+. I don't see how AFO doesn't easily win.

AFO is more than willingly to anger All Might so he can blow a hole through him. And since he remembers their original fight, he'll know exactly what to say to do it.

While All Might isn't going to know that he's Rewinding. AFO also isn't going to be suffering from Tomura's emotions influencing him here either.

Although, it's not like this All Might will purposefully try to anger him like Armored All Might did.

I meant what I said. Only Izuku and Tomura at their strongest can defeat Rewind AFO in a 1v1.
 
TheRustyOne said:
Considering Rewind AFO is just Prime AFO+. I don't see how AFO doesn't easily win.

AFO is more than willingly to anger All Might so he can blow a hole through him. And since he remembers their original fight, he'll know exactly what to say to do it.

While All Might isn't going to know that he's Rewinding. AFO also isn't going to be suffering from Tomura's emotions influencing him here either.

Although, it's not like this All Might will purposefully try to anger him like Armored All Might did.

I meant what I said. Only Izuku and Tomura at their strongest can defeat Rewind AFO in a 1v1.
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Oh this matchup was supposed to be a scenario where All might has the same knowledge from when he actually fought Rewind AFO but at his prime instead. Did this because if this was just the clueless prime AM against an even stronger Prime AFO then there would be like zero point of the matchup since it’ll just end with all might getting cooked and AFO going Scott free instead.
 
CastoriceTheFifth said:
Oh this matchup was supposed to be a scenario where All might has the same knowledge from when he actually fought Rewind AFO but at his prime instead. Did this because if this was just the clueless prime AM against an even stronger Prime AFO then there would be like zero point of the matchup since it’ll just end with all might getting cooked and AFO going Scott free instead.
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You can't do that. That's not how the wiki works.

I mean you can, but it's not going to be added to the profiles.
 
CastoriceTheFifth said:
Wait does that not fall under prior knowledge?
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You cannot give a character the power of a previous key they don't have access to, while not using that previous key.

Ignoring that. All Might stomps by being several dozen of times better than Armored All Might. And because Rewind AFO is bloodlusted from Tomura's hatred and is already a young teen, he's going to disappear in way less than 20 minutes and won't have the intelligence to do anything by rampage around like an idiot.
 
TheRustyOne said:
You cannot give a character the power of a previous key they don't have access to, while not using that previous key.

Ignoring that. All Might stomps by being several dozen of times better than Armored All Might. And because Rewind AFO is bloodlusted from Tomura's hatred and is already a young teen, he's going to disappear in way less than 20 minutes and won't have the intelligence to do anything by rampage around like an idiot.
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Is this like a rule for in verse fights. It was more like “Prime AM has prior knowledge of AFO’s Social influencing and rewind”. If this isn’t allowed or it is a stomp for AFO then would “AM gets prior knowledge of AFO rewinding” be fine.

Mb, I’m just really confused since I gave Lemillion prior knowledge of cursed tools before. If both are cooked then I’ll just leave the match as is with Prime AM with no knowledge
 
CastoriceTheFifth said:
Is this like a rule for in verse fights. It was more like “Prime AM has prior knowledge of AFO’s Social influencing and rewind”. If this isn’t allowed or it is a stomp for AFO then would “AM gets prior knowledge of AFO rewinding” be fine.

Mb, I’m just really confused since I gave Lemillion prior knowledge of cursed tools before.
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Your OP says this is Armored All Might, but he magically gains his prime abilities. How else am I suppose to take that?

Either AFO stomps because it'll end the same as their last fight, but AFO is Rewinding and can't be killed. And All Might doesn't know he can outlast him.

Or All Might stomps because AFO is in a bloodrage, is already a young teen, and is far stronger and faster than him.

A few hits from All Might and he's already a helpless baby. Heck, considering his self destruct would've turned him into a toddler, I daresay he only needs one punch.
 
If OP meant for this to be Prime All Might, but he was given prior knowledge of AFO's abilities, they should write that in their post instead of that little story.

Prime All Might stomps even in that case. Because he'll know all of AFO's abilities, including the one that can blow a hole straight through him.

Meaning All Might will just keep his distance and blow him away even worse than Izuku did to Dark Might with his air pressure attacks.

AFO is slower and his other ranges attacks cannot even hurt All Might, or overpower his air pressure. Prime All Might only ever lost to Prime AFO because he let his guard down due to AFO's taunting, and because he never dodged and tanks all of his attacks. Without that, AFO doesn't stand a chance against him.
 
Seems like the problem here is that we're taking lore in consideration with Prime AFO damaging Prime All Might in the past. But AFO's current profile doesn't reflect that, as he is like over 50x weaker than All Might; Omni-Factor is excluded although that doesn't have a precise value either, but can presumably end All Might.

So if we're going strictly by what's in their profiles you can say that All Might can simply overpower AFO. Although AFO can win using his Space Warp Quirk. Correct me if I'm wrong.

This is probably not the place to discuss this, but as I recall, the reason Rewind AFO isn't scaled to Prime All Might level characters is because of the supposed scaling problems it would create for Bakugo, and the argument that it's not necessary for AFO to have the same AP as All Might to damage him.
 
TheRustyOne said:
Your OP says this is Armored All Might, but he magically gains his prime abilities. How else am I suppose to take that?

Either AFO stomps because it'll end the same as their last fight, but AFO is Rewinding and can't be killed. And All Might doesn't know he can outlast him.

Or All Might stomps because AFO is in a bloodrage, is already a young teen, and is far stronger and faster than him.

A few hits from All Might and he's already a helpless baby. Heck, considering his self destruct would've turned him into a toddler, I daresay he only needs one punch.
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The OP just says the Prime AM key will be used. The little lore thing is just there to say he went prime mode instead of going armored mode (he doesn’t have armored here).
Arkansalter2 said:
If he wants to do this, he should put this in Fun and Games.
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Did you vote all might under the basis that he doesn’t know about rewind. If you did then I’ll just get rid of all the prior knowledge. If the most fair option is to just give AM solely prior knowledge of Rewind then I’ll just set it as that since AFO can still yap about “I killed your master” as a win con.
 
Metalballrun said:
This is probably not the place to discuss this, but as I recall, the reason Rewind AFO isn't scaled to Prime All Might level characters is because of the supposed scaling problems it would create for Bakugo, and the argument that it's not necessary for AFO to have the same AP as All Might to damage him.
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Pretty sure it’s because we don’t know what quirk he used to damage am in the first place and all might was known to just bulldoze through every attack, including AFO’s quirks.
 
Metalballrun said:
This is probably not the place to discuss this, but as I recall, the reason Rewind AFO isn't scaled to Prime All Might level characters is because of the supposed scaling problems it would create for Bakugo, and the argument that it's not necessary for AFO to have the same AP as All Might to damage him.
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AFO doesn't scale because he has no reason to scale to Prime All Might. There is no scaling issue with Bakugo because AFO's body was stated to have become fragile when he turned into a child, and his attacks became weaker due to his Quirks turning against him at the last second.

We don't know what AFO used to blow a hole through All Might. However, we know it had to be something special or All Might dropped his guard. Because AFO states All Might's standard style is not dodging and just running through all attacks. All Might doing a plain feint was considered so out of character by AFO, that he instantly knew it was because someone else had been influencing him.
 
If we're going to ignore all lore in universe and just go by profile stats. Regardless if you give All Might prior knowledge or not.

All Might one shots the second the fight begins. The more intense the damage, the faster AFO rewinds.

A single punch will pulverize AFO's entire body, instantly turning him into a child at best.

There's nothing you can do to make this fight fair.
 
CastoriceTheFifth said:
Did you vote all might under the basis that he doesn’t know about rewind. If you did then I’ll just get rid of all the prior knowledge. If the most fair option is to just give AM solely prior knowledge of Rewind then I’ll just set it as that since AFO can still yap about “I killed your master” as a win con.
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I didn't even read the story. If you put whatever extra thing was there in the actual OP instead of the story, it might have swayed my opinion?
 
TheRustyOne said:
AFO doesn't scale because he has no reason to scale to Prime All Might. There is no scaling issue with Bakugo because AFO's body was stated to have become fragile when he turned into a child, and his attacks became weaker due to his Quirks turning against him at the last second.

We don't know what AFO used to blow a hole through All Might. However, we know it had to be something special or All Might dropped his guard. Because AFO states All Might's standard style is not dodging and just running through all attacks. All Might doing a plain feint was considered so out of character by AFO, that he instantly knew it was because someone else had been influencing him.
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I rechecked Chapter 409 and yeah, the reason Bakugo's explosions matched AFO's attacks was because his attacks had gotten weaker. I brought it up because those were the arguments I recall during the thread to decide Rewind AFO's tiering.

My question with how AFO will harm All Might still stands, although this is more about the rules of Versus Threads. Does the rule allow AFO using that unknown attack in versus threads? And like, what if this isn't All Might but another character? Do we operate under the assumption that AFO can deal fatal damage at 2.54 exatons level despite that not being clearly cited in his profile?

It seems counterintuitive if this is just a general discussion since we know it's a thing, but it does sorta matter in a debate thread with rules.
 
Metalballrun said:
My question with how AFO will harm All Might still stands, although this is more about the rules of Versus Threads. Does the rule allow AFO using that unknown attack in versus threads? And like, what if this isn't All Might but another character? Do we operate under the assumption that AFO can deal fatal damage at 2.54 exatons level despite that not being clearly cited in his profile?
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I was assuming so, but I guess obviously that shouldn't count. I'll considered that a fault on my part here.

So yeah, AFO cannot harm All Might with anything except Spatial Manipulation and Omni-Factor, since it includes Spatial Manipulation.

Going by our profiles, All Might just turns him into a child with a single punch and erases him with his second punch. Or maybe his first punch just erases him completely.

We've never seen what happens if Rewind AFO's entire body was reduce to dust.
 
Well, AFO with his Prime Body might be able to avoid complete body destruction, but what gets hit will get turned to red mist at worse (as seen with what happened to his cranium the first time). I reckon he can survive a few or several punches if he can avoid total body destruction, considering he did come back from several limb destruction and severe body disfigurement.

A bit tough to figure out, but he probably would go down definitively with 5 punches at most. Like how All Might said he'd beat the USJ Nomu.
 
Kaina shoots GGs. Keigo can only block one shot before he gets a new asshole where his stomach or head should be.
Kaina low diff.
 
Ah, a match up I've had in mind for years.

Hawks ability to detect vibrations through the air should let him find Lady Nagant's shots, so they won't sneak up on him.

His ability to fly is superior to Izuku's, and I'm pretty sure he's faster than him as well, even if it's not a big difference. So dodging her shots from 4 km away shouldn't be too hard for him. I know Hawks planned on taking Nagant down himself, but confidence scaling doesn't mean much. He also didn't know she had Air Walk.

Getting close to Nagant means more accurate bullets, which even Izuku struggled to dodge with Danger Sense. However, Hawks can attack her from over hundreds of meters away. So he doesn't have to get too close to her. As long as he makes sure he doesn't stay still, he should be able to avoid most deadly shots.

Of course with Air Walk, Nagant's mobility is greatly enhanced, even if it isn't on Hawks' level.

Both of them can one shot the other if their attack lands right. If Hawks can reach her without taking a fatal shot, I don't think Nagant has the mobility to avoid his Danmaku. However, with his range at hundreds of meters on the wiki, that makes it a challenge.

I think Lady Nagant would take it right now.

Hawks inferior range means he needs to get pretty close to Nagant, which isn't good. If she could land shots on Izuku, then she can land hits on Hawks as well. He lacks the speed boost of Fa Jin Izuku needed to get close to her. If she chooses to fly up high, Hawks cannot reach her without getting shot in the open.
 
Arkansalter2 said:
True, but Kaina can block feather shots and pretty sure shooting a rifle is faster than shooting a feather.
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Ah I’ll count vote then. Also after checking Hawks’ profile, he should really get social influencing for finessing the entire league of villains as a double agent (minus Dabi).
 
Hawks should be able to survive long enough to one shot Lady Nagant with feathers granted if she doesn’t hit him in the head or hit center mass. He’s endured one of All For One’s strongest attacks and was still willing to fight, or he can reinforce his durability by shrouding himself in Fierce Wings to protect himself against Lady Nagant’s bullets.

Lady Nagant also suffers from the weakness of every other sniper, which is if she shoots her sniper rifle, Hawks will immediately know where she’s at, especially when Hawks can sense vibrations of the bullet itself. Lady Nagant would see like 20 vibration-seeking feathers rising through the air and rapidly approaching her position, or Hawks can try to be sneaky and move his feathers low through the urban environment to catch Lady Nagant off guard considering that she can only really look at one place at a time. Lady Nagant would have to take the risk of either staying in the same place to continue to shoot at Hawks or try to re-position somewhere else to stay hidden. Take it with a grain of salt, but I could’ve sworn I saw a MHA clip where Lady Nagant immediately moved positions with Air Walk after shooting at Deku.

If she moves positions with Air Walk, she’s even more ****ed, as Hawks’ feathers would for sure know where she’s at, and that also gives time for Hawks to close the gap without fear of getting shot.

Or if Hawks really thinks he’s going to die, he can hide in the nearest building and start to spam the **** out of Fierce Wings, which can reach like 76+ individual feathers and all move at the same speed as Hawks and towards Lady Nagant.
 
Catbowtie said:
Hawks should be able to survive long enough to one shot Lady Nagant with feathers granted if she doesn’t hit him in the head or hit center mass. He’s endured one of All For One’s strongest attacks and was still willing to fight, or he can reinforce his durability by shrouding himself in Fierce Wings to protect himself against Lady Nagant’s bullets.

Lady Nagant also suffers from the weakness of every other sniper, which is if she shoots her sniper rifle, Hawks will immediately know where she’s at, especially when Hawks can sense vibrations of the bullet itself. Lady Nagant would see like 20 vibration-seeking feathers rising through the air and rapidly approaching her position, or Hawks can try to be sneaky and move his feathers low through the urban environment to catch Lady Nagant off guard considering that she can only really look at one place at a time. Lady Nagant would have to take the risk of either staying in the same place to continue to shoot at Hawks or try to re-position somewhere else to stay hidden. Take it with a grain of salt, but I could’ve sworn I saw a MHA clip where Lady Nagant immediately moved positions with Air Walk after shooting at Deku.

If she moves positions with Air Walk, she’s even more ****ed, as Hawks’ feathers would for sure know where she’s at, and that also gives time for Hawks to close the gap without fear of getting shot.

Or if Hawks really thinks he’s going to die, he can hide in the nearest building and start to spam the **** out of Fierce Wings, which can reach like 76+ individual feathers and all move at the same speed as Hawks and towards Lady Nagant.
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Voting Hawks FRA
 
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