TYBW Anime Cour 3 [Ichigo's Rivals Edition]

[Arc7Kuroi]

Here's the sandbox, it's both Uryu's and Renji's current keys that are being updated. A few things of note:

• Renji's Zagai Zekkou after being charged for 20 seconds ~ Vollstandig Blut Uryu > casualBankai Shutara (4-A) >~ Blut Uryu > Uryu (10x downscale) ~ Renji
  • Renji is not upscaling Squad 0 by any means whatsoever, he is downscaling from their casual power, and it then takes him 20 entire seconds of building up his spirit energy to reach their level.
• Gerard is not part of this thread for 2 reasons. So, please don't derail with Gerard...
  • 1) Renji was barely healed by the time him and Gerard fought, and we know from the first arc of Bleach that your life force ~ your spirit energy, alongside stuff like Ichigo being healed after Ulquiorra not restoring his spirit energy. Why is this important? Uryu steals Renji's energy and reishi during their fight, meaning we just have concrete evidence to say Renji isn't at full power here.
  • 2) He's being saved for cour 4 anyhow, since barely any of his fight got adapted at the end of cour 3. So, I'd rather not try to formulate the entire basis of his scaling on conjecture, when we can wait a couple months and just have the full fight.
• Mask needs to lose his Vollstandig and Blut Arterie rating lol. Renji no selling his supernova attack with his Bankai =/= Mask scales to Renji. Mask's conjecture about forcing Renji into Bankai with desperation is just proven wrong in their fight anyway.
  • Mask's tiering won't change at all since he gets his scaling from other characters + Blut multiplier.

So, that's it, two updates and one character gets a small portion of his AP justification removed. God bless.

Agree: Tracer, Lephyr, Reiner, Slayer
Neutral:
Disagree:

 

[LordTracer]

Aside from Uryu only having his AP in tabbers when it should be all of his stats, this looks good to me.

 

[Arc7Kuroi]

Aside from Uryu only having his AP in tabbers when it should be all of his stats, this looks good to me.

I didn't do that, someone else put it there originally...

 

[LordTracer]

I didn't do that, someone else put it there originally...

Ngl, haven’t looked at Uryu’s profile in a minute, didn’t know someone did that

 

[Specterxxxx]

Will their abilities be updated along with their physicals and AP? Including senjumaru's?

 

[Arcker123]

Agree. Solid work bae.

 

[LephyrTheRevanchist]

Good

 

[Reiner04]

Is fine.

 

[Arc7Kuroi]

Will their abilities be updated along with their physicals and AP? Including senjumaru's?

Nope. If you click the sandbox you can see that isn't the case.

 

[UchihaSlayer96]

Seems okie dokie to me.

 

[Apotheosis69]

Do you think there can be an explanation in Uryu's AP section (for his Sklave Rai and Blut Arterie), that his Sternenstaub was able to contend with Ichigo's Getsuga Jujisho?

And shouldn't Renji's normal AP for his Post-Royal Guard training be 20x weaker than his Zagai Zekko? Cus isn't it a Standard for characters' AP to be the amount of energy output they're emitting in a single second? Or am I trippin

I do have some more questions. But ofc don't wanna overwhelm ya, we can discuss it some other way/method.


This looks good.

 

[Deceived3596]

Will their abilities be updated along with their physicals and AP? Including senjumaru's?

If no one else addresses that before I do, I will revise his profile after I finish up all my larger, more important revisions.

As for this thread, I agree with the new additions and changes.

 

[Arc7Kuroi]

Do you think there can be an explanation in Uryu's AP section (for his Sklave Rai and Blut Arterie), that his Sternenstaub was able to contend with Ichigo's Getsuga Jujisho?

No, it’s heavily implied Ichigo wasn’t going all out, so I refrained from placing that in the AP section for the time being. Maybe things will change when I do Ichigo revisions.

And shouldn't Renji's normal AP for his Post-Royal Guard training be 20x weaker than his Zagai Zekko? Cus isn't it a Standard for characters' AP to be the amount of energy output they're emitting in a single second? Or am I trippin

No I think you’re tripping.

I do have some more questions. But ofc don't wanna overwhelm ya, we can discuss it some other way/method.


This looks good.

Yeah you can reach out to me on discord or sumn too.

 

[ShiftCtrlAltDeleteTabFn]

Seems good to me.

 

[SuperSonicTL]

Galactic level Renji when?

 

[Specterxxxx]

Ugh what about jugram? I thought everyone who scales from uryu would be in this CRT?. Didn't Ichigo want to tag team him along with uryu himself?.

 

[Arc7Kuroi]

Ugh what about jugram? I thought everyone who scales from uryu would be in this CRT?. Didn't Ichigo want to tag team him along with uryu himself?.

Jugram will be in a separate CRT. I’d appreciate it if you stopped cluttering this thread tho please

 

[Infinite9Luck]

Agree!

 

[Adam1396]

Leaning towards disagree for Renji rn. Since uryu had mimihagi mark when defeated senjumaru which didn’t appear against renji. Quite intentional from kubo.

 

[Arc7Kuroi]

Leaning towards disagree for Renji rn. Since uryu had mimihagi mark when defeated senjumaru which didn’t appear against renji. Quite intentional from kubo.

Unless you can prove that signifies anything other than his awakening, then it’s pure conjecture to say that’s an entirely separate form. And there’s just zero connection between that mark and a separate form

Edit: more importantly Uryu just said he didn’t hold back anyway. So we know he’s going all out

 

[Adam1396]

Unless you can prove that signifies anything other than his awakening, then it’s pure conjecture to say that’s an entirely separate form. And there’s just zero connection between that mark and a separate form

Edit: more importantly Uryu just said he didn’t hold back anyway. So we know he’s going all out

You gotta provide evidence it has any connection with awakening considering mimihagi was against yhwach, while uryu was against yhwach as well.

Uryu going out doesn’t mean he used same level of power or can just tap into that power willingly otherwise the mark would have appeared again. Considering he struggled to maintain form in his fight against senjumaru, it was definitely bigger boost. Symbol, marks doesn’t appear randomly in bleach.

 

[Arc7Kuroi]

You gotta provide evidence it has any connection with awakening considering mimihagi was against yhwach, while uryu was against yhwach as well.

Uryu going out doesn’t mean he used same level of power or can just tap into that power willingly otherwise the mark would have appeared again. Considering he struggled to maintain form in his fight against senjumaru, it was definitely bigger boost. Symbol, marks doesn’t appear randomly in bleach.

I did provide evidence, it’s what’s stated. You’re postulating it as truth without substantiation. I can dismiss it under equal interpretations.

Your claim is far more assumptive and unbacked. It’s quite literally conjecture. If you want to assert it’s an entirely separate level of power for Uryu, prove it. Elsewise I’m just going to ignore it as it’s nothing more than your personal opinion.

 

[Adam1396]

I did provide evidence, it’s what’s stated. You’re postulating it as truth without substantiation. I can dismiss it under equal interpretations.

Your claim is far more assumptive and unbacked. It’s quite literally conjecture. If you want to assert it’s an entirely separate level of power for Uryu, prove it. Elsewise I’m just going to ignore it as it’s nothing more than your personal opinion.

Having the mark itself is the evidence of it beinf different form. And it's a strong evidence in bleach context.
While nothing proves it's related to awakening.
Yeah it's just a word game you are playing atp

 

[Arc7Kuroi]

Having the mark itself is the evidence of it beinf different form. And it's a strong evidence in bleach context.
While nothing proves it's related to awakening.
Yeah it's just a word game you are playing atp

No the mark is not indicative of a new form. It’s the same base it’s the same Vollstandig. Were told Uryu went through a power up just like Yhwach. A PERMANENT power up. So no it’s not a word game. You’re providing pure conjecture. If you have nothing else to add that is beyond restating your claim, I’m fine agreeing to disagree. I’ll count your disagreement and we can move on.

 

[Adam1396]

No the mark is not indicative of a new form. It’s the same base it’s the same Vollstandig. Were told Uryu went through a power up just like Yhwach. A PERMANENT power up. So no it’s not a word game. You’re providing pure conjecture. If you have nothing else to add that is beyond restating your claim, I’m fine agreeing to disagree. I’ll count your disagreement and we can move on.

Nobody is denying him having a power up here. He can not just willingly tap into mimihagi marked power is my point. Mark is indicative of different form and power in bleach. You have to prove it appears randomly or as an awakening. Otherwise it's logical to follow what generally happens in bleach.

His voldstanding doesn’t have mimihagi mark as we have seen later. No sternritter had any particular mark either in VS. Having it means it provides extra power. You are totally ignoring his struggling part as well.

So yeah my point definitely stands still.

 

[Arc7Kuroi]

Having it means it provides extra power.

You haven’t proved this whatsoever. You’re mistaking correlation and causation. The mark appearing for his initial power up =/= him only having that strength when the mark is visible.

For example, Blut Vene isn’t always visible yet it’s there. So, once again, baseless claim.

 

[DragoZeroNova]

Agree
4-A Renji is great

 

[Apotheosis69]

Should this thread be closed now, since 4 staff have agreed?

 

[Arc7Kuroi]

Should this thread be closed now, since 4 staff have agreed?

It hasn’t been even 24 hours yet bub I’ll apply it tomorrow evening most likely.

 

[Apotheosis69]

Gotta speedrun this

 

[Adam1396]

You haven’t proved this whatsoever. You’re mistaking correlation and causation. The mark appearing for his initial power up =/= him only having that strength when the mark is visible.

For example, Blut Vene isn’t always visible yet it’s there. So, once again, baseless claim.

I proved it though. It's what generally happens in bleach and that's a strong point.
Another point is him struggling with mimihagi marked VS while being casual without it. Which again indicates it took more toll on him due to more power than him mastering his VS power in one try.

 

[Arc7Kuroi]

I proved it though. It's what generally happens in bleach and that's a strong point.
Another point is him struggling with mimihagi marked VS while being casual without it. Which again indicates it took more toll on him due to more power than him mastering his VS power in one try.

You didn’t prove it though. You attributed correlation (two things happening concurrently) with causation (one thing being the cause of the other).

There are plenty of things that could be attributed to his struggle, it’s the first time he’s awakened Vollstandig. It’s a power he’s never utilized before. So initially it’s difficult to use and we see its imperfection in the lack of finesse. Where upon subsequent usage he’s gained greater understanding of his power, more mastery, he uses more advanced techniques, etc.

You just haven’t provided any reasoning or evidence to why your interpretation is the superior one. While there’s evidence on the contrary. The Reio eye isn’t always present on Uryu while he’s fighting Shutara anyhow. If the eye is a separate form, that would mean Uryu was going in and out of that form during the entire fight, yet his performance did not change. Thus, the most logical deduction is that the eye isn’t a statistics power up. And given what we know of the manga (which can change in cour 4), it’s more likely to be foreshadowing as to why Yhwach cannot see Uryu with the Almighty. Just as Yhwach cannot see Mimihagi reflected in his eyes. Which is entirely a product of hax and not power.

Everything we have points to it not being a power amp transformation.

 

[Johner2133451]

Renji being above Yamamoto is kinda crazy ngl

 

[Arc7Kuroi]

Renji being above Yamamoto is kinda crazy ngl

Arguments from incredulity don’t hold any weight. Not saying you’re implying that Renji can’t be stronger than Yamamoto. Just putting it out there before someone goes “Renji can’t be stronger than Yamamoto because I can’t suspend my disbelief!”

 

[Guacamolefletcher]

I've already made my thoughs on this topic known, and I'll eventually evaluate the evidence with greater scrutiny, and I'll discuss it with Arc.

 

[Adam1396]

Renji being above Yamamoto is kinda crazy ngl

That's not an issue when a character has constant feat of facing superior characters. But the characters shouod indeed show enough feats.

But him needing to go bankai just to offset supernova is a big question. Idk how arc thinks it was proven wrong in the fight when he could have no sold such attacks even in base with such massive difference. But that didn’t happen.
And I don’t thing such a casual response addresss such a big question.

 

[Arc7Kuroi]

But him needing to go bankai just to offset supernova is a big question. Idk how arc thinks it was proven wrong in the fight when he could have no sold such attacks even in base with such massive difference. But that didn’t happen.
And I don’t thing such a casual response addresss such a big question.

Prove he needed to use Bankai. Once again you’re fallaciously asserting that correlation and causation are the same thing. That Mask justification is butt. He’s arrogantly boasting about his own strength, and is far from a reliable narrator on Renji whatsoever. He’s got zero credibility, and there’s no external evidence to suggest Renji needed to. My response wasn’t casual either, the justification was just so bad it didn’t require pages to debunk it.

 

[Adam1396]

Prove he needed to use Bankai. Once again you’re fallaciously asserting that correlation and causation are the same thing. That Mask justification is butt. He’s arrogantly boasting about his own strength, and is far from a reliable narrator on Renji whatsoever. He’s got zero credibility, and there’s no external evidence to suggest Renji needed to. My response wasn’t casual either, the justification was just so bad it didn’t require pages to debunk it.

I didn’t even mention what masked said.
External evidence like what? Statement? Pretty sure we don't evaluate fights that way. Why would went bankai at the last moment? Why would he need that if he is supposed to be far above mask in much weaker form? And why would have that to be at the last moment and for specific attack. Cause this attack was stronger than previous ones and he needed to if his shikai wouldn’t be able to completely save him or keep him fully unharmed. Whole situation shows it was out of necessity not out of a show off thing like ichigo who spams bankai almost every time. And very much no character in tybw just spams bankai without need.

 

[Arc7Kuroi]

I didn’t even mention what masked said.
External evidence like what? Statement? Pretty sure we don't evaluate fights that way. Why would went bankai at the last moment? Why would he need that if he is supposed to be far above mask in much weaker form? And why would have that to be at the last moment and for specific attack. Cause this attack was stronger than previous ones and he needed to if his shikai wouldn’t be able to completely save him or keep him fully unharmed. Whole situation shows it was out of necessity not out of a show off thing like ichigo who spams bankai almost every time. And very much no character in tybw just spams bankai without need.

Your reasoning is circular. You need to prove Mask scales to Renji. Your logic is that Renji used Bankai. When contested on why that matters, your answer is that Mask would’ve harmed Renji. Aka you’re claiming Mask scales to Renji because he scales to Renji. Alongside a bunch of other whataboutisms that just aren’t relevant to the argument, you just didn’t refute anything I said.

Let me posit a far more logical explanation for why Renji utilized Bankai. Renji saw that Mask could regenerate from slashes, so Renji surmised that more slashes weren’t the answer, and instead decided to burn his entire body to ashes instead. Given his Shikai cannot do that, he utilized his Bankai that could. We have no reason to believe Renji thought he was in any danger given he no sold Mask’s entire onslaught up to this point. Which is not only consistent with what I previously said about Mask being unreliable when it comes to ascertaining Renji’s power, but it is also internally consistent.

 

[DragoZeroNova]

The Renji-Mask thing would make more sense if it was a matter of power, but it does indeed seem like he used Bankai for the Hax, which is an entirely different issue. Less "I need more power" and more "I need something that can put this guy down for good"