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Oh, alright, thanks. I read it whe it was weekly, so I do not remember everything that well.
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Muzan vs Sukuna
- Thread starter Arkenis
- Start date
- Status
- 254
- 239
same ngl, honestly ill just wait for the movies to revisit (once again) that whole arc in depth. There's a ton that will be improve ig.
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Sukuna's wincons seem more consistent, voting him.
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Catbowtie
Any/All- 4,079
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Muzan just needs to cut Sukuna a few times to win.
XSOULOFCINDERX
They/Them- 26,478
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I'm gonna vote Sukuna with High Difficulty for the reasons stated previously in the thread.
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How will he do that when Sukuna enters his shadow realm? When he uses his rabbits as a shield and a distraction for him to retreat? When he uses Mahoraga as a shield? Muzan has no way to destroy them. Yeah, Muzan CAN kill Sukuna if he gets some solids hits in, but as the pages I sent before show, Sukuna IS more than capable of fighting running and dodging while Mahoraga adapts. If Sukuna jumps into his shadow, the only thing Muzan could try to do is pull him into Infinity Castle, but doing that would only speed up Mahoraga's adaptation.
And even if Sukuna is pulled back into Infinity Castle (which I don't think he can do once Sukuna is inside his shadow, since he isn't reachable anymore), he can always spawn a swarm of Rabbits to act as a shield and a distraction so he can retreat into the shadows ONCE AGAIN (the swarm of Rabbit Escape will create another shadow, from which Sukuna can escape into).
Sukuna, once inside his shadow, has no need to get out, and as was already proven, he has no reason to go outside out of his own will before he sees that Mahoraga has completed his adaptation. Sukuna is cunning and strategic, he won't put himself in unnecessary danger.
EldemadeDityjon
He/Him- 20,326
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Voting Sukuna because of @MonarchInYellow arguments
Catbowtie
Any/All- 4,079
- 2,247
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EldemadeDityjon
He/Him- 20,326
- 15,788
EldemadeDityjon
He/Him- 20,326
- 15,788
When does having more brain grant anyone to control CE?
It's definitely stretching. Not everyone gets CE out of nowhere just because they are exposed to it.
Arkenis
They/Them- 25,201
- 13,010
- Thread starter
- #173
I'm referring to how smart he'd be. And everyone has ce from birth, they just don't know how to control it. Genius demon with five brains figuring out how to control foreign energy inside himself isn't that far fetched when ce control is pretty similar to something like chi control.When does having more brain grant anyone to control CE?
It's definitely stretching. Not everyone gets CE out of nowhere just because they are exposed to it.
CripplingDepression6363
He/Him- 2
- 3
Voting Sukuna for MonarchInYellow's Reasons
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Not exactly, because not everyone is a sorcerer. Everyone has cursed energy, yes, but not everyone has potential to be a sorcerer. You must be born with your brain built in a specific way so that you can use CE and CT. That's why, normally, sorcerers comes from families of sorcerers. They are people who have innate talent for using jujutsu. And even then, they only know how to use it because there's someone to teach them. Normally, a kid manifests their cursed techique by the age of 5, if I'm not mistaken, and from that point they start getting trained into learning how to use their technique. Everyone we know in the series learnt how to use CE this way.
Also, there's one whole other talk about how much CE you're born with, your innate talent for using it, etc. Muzan CAN become a sorcerer because he can rewire his brain, but that doesn't mean he would be able to use it all by himself. He has no way to instantly know how exactly he needs to rewire his brain to achieve this, and even if he did, he still wouldn't know how to perfectly control CE. It works like chi, yes, but the way you generate and manipulate it works a little bit different.
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TO SUMMARIZE MY POINTS TO ANYONE WHO DOESN'T WANT TO READ EVERYTHING I WROTE BEFORE THIS:
1. ABOUT MUZAN AP ADVANTAGE:
Although Muzan only needs some good solid hits in to kill Sukuna, he has limited range, and Sukuna won't give Muzan a CQC fight. Although Sukuna is indeed a great fighter at CQC, he is, first and foremost, a sorcerer. As Meguna, Sukuna has always been shown to favour long range fights, where he relies way more on his shikigamis. And as I have already mentioned, Muzan has no way to interact with shikigamis, as they are made of cursed energy and Muzan cannot damage them, so they would be constantly be damaging him as the fight goes on (refer to point 4 as to why this is game changing). Sukuna, at any given moment, can simply enter his shadow and stay safe there, as we saw he do in his fight agaisnt Gojo, whenever he wanted to heal/watch Mahoraga fight.
Gojo is the only fight where, as Meguna, he "started" at CQC. But that was because Sukuna had no other choice. Gojo literally has CQC has his main style of fighting, and he wasn't taking no as an answer. Other than that, Gojo has Infinity and can kill his shikigamis, Sukuna was forced into using Domain Amplification to be able to get through Gojo's Infinity and cause damage to him. But that ended when Mahoraga finished his adaptation. As I have shown time and time again, after Mahoraga was able to hit through Gojo's Infinity, Sukuna went 100% into the defensive and let Mahoraga take the front (although he still had to participate in the fight as a support, since if he left Gojo alone, he would kill Mahoraga instantly), because that way he would finish his adaptation faster, and would develop World Slash quicker. I have already shown a page where he literally let Agito and Mahoraga beat Gojo down while he, himself, only watched and analyzed the fight until Mahoraga completed his World Slash. Only then Sukuna came out and went to kill Gojo.
In his fight agaisnt Yorozu, Sukuna did the same. From the beginning he avoided CQC, choosing to overwhelm her with his shikigamis while he applied the Wheel of Dharma on himself, so Mahoraga could start his adaptation. The only reason Sukuna didn't summon Mahoraga to fight by himself in both his fight agaisnt Yorozu and Gojo, was because he didn't want them to destroy Mahoraga before he could adaptate, as both of them had the means to do so (Hollow Purple and True Sphere). But here? That danger doesn't exist. He can see that Muzan doesn't have CE and that he doesn't have any cursed objects. He knows that no matter what Muzan does, he won't be able to destroy Mahoraga. He has literally no need to worry or make someone else take the burden of adaptation. He can sit back, overwhelm Muzan with his shikigamis, until Mahoraga adaptates.
2. ABOUT MUZAN'S INFINITY CASTLE AND BIO HAX
And as I already stated, Infinity Castle, according to VsBattle Wiki, works in the same way a Domain Expansion does (both are Pocket Reality Manipulation), and we already saw Mahoraga destroy Gojo's domain after adaptating ONLY to the effect of the Domain, so we know that Mahoraga can do the same here. After finishing his adaptation, he will simply destroy and nullify Infinity Castle, and then he would do the same to Muzan's bio-hax. I have provided examples, but the most basic result of Mahoraga's adaptation is the ability to destroy/cancel/nullify the effect he has adapted to. That's why he was able to instantly destroy any domain that Gojo expanded, that's why he instantly destroyed Yorozu's true sphere, that's why Mahoraga deactivated Gojo's infinity to EVERYONE when he was close, etc.
And even if Sukuna gets hit by Muzan's blood at some moment, as it was stated before, Slayers can (somewhat) resist Muzan's blood by simply controlling their blood flow through breathing. It doesn't stop completely the effects, but it allows them to resist it. And not only has Sukuna shown to be able to control his bloodflow through cursed energy (he destroyed his own heart and stayed alive by using cursed energy to keep his blood going), but we also know he can destroy his body parts and recreate them with surgical precision (he was literally destroying and recreating his brain WHILE fighting Gojo), so even if he get careless and gets hit by Muzan's blood, it wont be game over, since he can go into his shadows and heal (like he did agaisnt Gojo, after he was knocked out after that black flash). So for Muzan to guarantee the kill, he would need to go for the head (the gut won't work, he needs to insta kill Sukuna, because otherwise the King of Curses can summon Agito in his shadows and make Agito heal him through RCT).
Anyways, Mahoraga will able to nullify/destroy Infinity Castle after adaptating to it, and then will also be able to deactivate and nullify Muzan's bio hax once he adaptates to it. That's confirmed as the first result of Mahoraga's adaptation (see what he did to Yorozu's true sphere, to Gojo's domain and to Gojo's infinity).
3. ABOUT MUZAN'S REGENERATION AND AP ADVANTAGE
Muzan IS normally stronger than Sukuna. He has enough AP to kill Sukuna if he is able to get close enough (10 meters range) and deliver some solid blows (which won't happen EASILY because of the points made earlier about the way Sukuna engages his fights as Meguna). However, Muzan has no resistance to curses, and as I already explained and showed scans before (you can also confirm it in Cursed Energy Manipulation page), all damage made with Cursed Energy curses the opponent if they do not have a resistance to curses (all sorcerers are resistant to cursers, as they protect themselves with cursed energy). Muzan doesn't have resistance to curses, nor does he have any information that Sukuna's attacks are cursing him, so he wouldn't be able to realize it until it's too late. Every single time he gets cut or damaged by any cursed attack, he is going to get cursed.
When you are cursed, you slowly lose strength and willpower, as you get weaker and weaker alongside feeling intense pain. If the curse is strong enough, simply being cursed by it is enough for it to kill you. Although I don't think four or six blows would be enough to put Muzan down, the fact that he would be constantly being jumped by shikigamis, from the which he cannot defend himself from nor damage, means he would be constantly getting cursed, which in turn would drain him from his strength, until he gets way too weak to fight.
4. SUKUNA'S WIN CONDITION
Everyone here agrees that, if Sukuna manages to use Furnace (Fire Arrow) on Muzan, it would be enough to kill him. The problem is, Sukuna won't be able to use Furnace right away, since Muzan can simply use his Infinity Castle shenanigans to escape and disturb Sukuna's usage of Domain Expansion. He also won't be stunned by the constant slashes (although every single slash from the domain would keep applying curses to Muzan, further weakening him), so he wouldn't be stunned by the domain whatsoever and would be able to try and run away. However, as point 2 already discussed, Sukuna CAN nullify Infinity Castle and remove that safety from Muzan through Mahoraga's adaptation. And as point 3 discussed, Sukuna has a way to debuff and get Muzan slower and weaker, weak enough for him to be able to cast Domain Expansion from a safe distance (Muzan can only extend his limbs as long as 10 meters according to his page, and while Sukuna would be expanding his domain, he still has Mahoraga and the other shikigamis to hold Muzan down until Furnace is ready. Remember, Muzan cannot damage the shikigamis, so if they grab hold of him, he won't be able to break free). Sukuna's Fire Arrow has enough ap to reduce Muzan to ashes, and the fact it will completely incinerate Muzan, would make it so Muzan cannot regenerate from that.
It would be a hard fight, indeed, but as shown in Sukuna's fight agaisnt Gojo, he is used and more than capable of planning ahead on his fights and waiting for the best opportunity before striking.
For Muzan to win this, Sukuna has to go into CQC and let himself be hit by his attacks, which isn't realistic. Sukuna has Kamutoke, a long rang cursed tool which allows him to rain thunders into his opponents, has his shikigamis to fight for him, and has no reason to put himself in risk fighting Muzan at close range (he didn't do it agaisnt Gojo nor Yorozu when it wasn't needed, so why would he do that here? It makes no sense to think Sukuna would engage in CQC. Muzan would get cursed until he couldn't move anymore and then get instantly killed by Furnace.
5. CONCLUSION
Muzan has win conditions and CAN win this, but Sukuna's win condition is easier to achieve, considering he has more than enough ways to escape Muzan's grasp. Muzan literally has to deal with all of Sukuna's shikigamis constantly mauling him and trying to keep him away from Sukuna, all while Mahoraga keeps progressing in his adaptation. Muzan isn't doing a 1v1 agaisn't Sukuna, he will be facing all of Ten Shadows shikigamis, since Sukuna will be able to tell that he has no CE, and thus, no way of killing any of his shikigamis.
Sukuna's win con won't be fast, but he has no trouble waiting until Mahoraga finishes adaptating. His fight agaisnt Gojo was all about patience and waiting until he had Mahoraga adaptate. His fight agaisnt Yorozu was the same thing.
Not to say, IF at any given moment Sukuna gets critically hurt or damaged to the point where he thinks he cannot recover through RCT, he still has his second body which he can incarnate into and then get back to 100% HP. Even though he would then lose access to Ten Shadows, by that point Muzan would probably be cursed enough to the point where Sukuna could simply use his domain and try to use Furnace.
Not to mention, Sukuna doesn't stay still when he casts domain. Sukuna can still move. He can cast his domain and back away, while using Kamutoke to assist his shikigamis and stun/burn Muzan, all while cursing him even more by causing damage through cursed energy.
1. ABOUT MUZAN AP ADVANTAGE:
Although Muzan only needs some good solid hits in to kill Sukuna, he has limited range, and Sukuna won't give Muzan a CQC fight. Although Sukuna is indeed a great fighter at CQC, he is, first and foremost, a sorcerer. As Meguna, Sukuna has always been shown to favour long range fights, where he relies way more on his shikigamis. And as I have already mentioned, Muzan has no way to interact with shikigamis, as they are made of cursed energy and Muzan cannot damage them, so they would be constantly be damaging him as the fight goes on (refer to point 4 as to why this is game changing). Sukuna, at any given moment, can simply enter his shadow and stay safe there, as we saw he do in his fight agaisnt Gojo, whenever he wanted to heal/watch Mahoraga fight.
Gojo is the only fight where, as Meguna, he "started" at CQC. But that was because Sukuna had no other choice. Gojo literally has CQC has his main style of fighting, and he wasn't taking no as an answer. Other than that, Gojo has Infinity and can kill his shikigamis, Sukuna was forced into using Domain Amplification to be able to get through Gojo's Infinity and cause damage to him. But that ended when Mahoraga finished his adaptation. As I have shown time and time again, after Mahoraga was able to hit through Gojo's Infinity, Sukuna went 100% into the defensive and let Mahoraga take the front (although he still had to participate in the fight as a support, since if he left Gojo alone, he would kill Mahoraga instantly), because that way he would finish his adaptation faster, and would develop World Slash quicker. I have already shown a page where he literally let Agito and Mahoraga beat Gojo down while he, himself, only watched and analyzed the fight until Mahoraga completed his World Slash. Only then Sukuna came out and went to kill Gojo.
In his fight agaisnt Yorozu, Sukuna did the same. From the beginning he avoided CQC, choosing to overwhelm her with his shikigamis while he applied the Wheel of Dharma on himself, so Mahoraga could start his adaptation. The only reason Sukuna didn't summon Mahoraga to fight by himself in both his fight agaisnt Yorozu and Gojo, was because he didn't want them to destroy Mahoraga before he could adaptate, as both of them had the means to do so (Hollow Purple and True Sphere). But here? That danger doesn't exist. He can see that Muzan doesn't have CE and that he doesn't have any cursed objects. He knows that no matter what Muzan does, he won't be able to destroy Mahoraga. He has literally no need to worry or make someone else take the burden of adaptation. He can sit back, overwhelm Muzan with his shikigamis, until Mahoraga adaptates.
2. ABOUT MUZAN'S INFINITY CASTLE AND BIO HAX
And as I already stated, Infinity Castle, according to VsBattle Wiki, works in the same way a Domain Expansion does (both are Pocket Reality Manipulation), and we already saw Mahoraga destroy Gojo's domain after adaptating ONLY to the effect of the Domain, so we know that Mahoraga can do the same here. After finishing his adaptation, he will simply destroy and nullify Infinity Castle, and then he would do the same to Muzan's bio-hax. I have provided examples, but the most basic result of Mahoraga's adaptation is the ability to destroy/cancel/nullify the effect he has adapted to. That's why he was able to instantly destroy any domain that Gojo expanded, that's why he instantly destroyed Yorozu's true sphere, that's why Mahoraga deactivated Gojo's infinity to EVERYONE when he was close, etc.
And even if Sukuna gets hit by Muzan's blood at some moment, as it was stated before, Slayers can (somewhat) resist Muzan's blood by simply controlling their blood flow through breathing. It doesn't stop completely the effects, but it allows them to resist it. And not only has Sukuna shown to be able to control his bloodflow through cursed energy (he destroyed his own heart and stayed alive by using cursed energy to keep his blood going), but we also know he can destroy his body parts and recreate them with surgical precision (he was literally destroying and recreating his brain WHILE fighting Gojo), so even if he get careless and gets hit by Muzan's blood, it wont be game over, since he can go into his shadows and heal (like he did agaisnt Gojo, after he was knocked out after that black flash). So for Muzan to guarantee the kill, he would need to go for the head (the gut won't work, he needs to insta kill Sukuna, because otherwise the King of Curses can summon Agito in his shadows and make Agito heal him through RCT).
Anyways, Mahoraga will able to nullify/destroy Infinity Castle after adaptating to it, and then will also be able to deactivate and nullify Muzan's bio hax once he adaptates to it. That's confirmed as the first result of Mahoraga's adaptation (see what he did to Yorozu's true sphere, to Gojo's domain and to Gojo's infinity).
3. ABOUT MUZAN'S REGENERATION AND AP ADVANTAGE
Muzan IS normally stronger than Sukuna. He has enough AP to kill Sukuna if he is able to get close enough (10 meters range) and deliver some solid blows (which won't happen EASILY because of the points made earlier about the way Sukuna engages his fights as Meguna). However, Muzan has no resistance to curses, and as I already explained and showed scans before (you can also confirm it in Cursed Energy Manipulation page), all damage made with Cursed Energy curses the opponent if they do not have a resistance to curses (all sorcerers are resistant to cursers, as they protect themselves with cursed energy). Muzan doesn't have resistance to curses, nor does he have any information that Sukuna's attacks are cursing him, so he wouldn't be able to realize it until it's too late. Every single time he gets cut or damaged by any cursed attack, he is going to get cursed.
When you are cursed, you slowly lose strength and willpower, as you get weaker and weaker alongside feeling intense pain. If the curse is strong enough, simply being cursed by it is enough for it to kill you. Although I don't think four or six blows would be enough to put Muzan down, the fact that he would be constantly being jumped by shikigamis, from the which he cannot defend himself from nor damage, means he would be constantly getting cursed, which in turn would drain him from his strength, until he gets way too weak to fight.
4. SUKUNA'S WIN CONDITION
Everyone here agrees that, if Sukuna manages to use Furnace (Fire Arrow) on Muzan, it would be enough to kill him. The problem is, Sukuna won't be able to use Furnace right away, since Muzan can simply use his Infinity Castle shenanigans to escape and disturb Sukuna's usage of Domain Expansion. He also won't be stunned by the constant slashes (although every single slash from the domain would keep applying curses to Muzan, further weakening him), so he wouldn't be stunned by the domain whatsoever and would be able to try and run away. However, as point 2 already discussed, Sukuna CAN nullify Infinity Castle and remove that safety from Muzan through Mahoraga's adaptation. And as point 3 discussed, Sukuna has a way to debuff and get Muzan slower and weaker, weak enough for him to be able to cast Domain Expansion from a safe distance (Muzan can only extend his limbs as long as 10 meters according to his page, and while Sukuna would be expanding his domain, he still has Mahoraga and the other shikigamis to hold Muzan down until Furnace is ready. Remember, Muzan cannot damage the shikigamis, so if they grab hold of him, he won't be able to break free). Sukuna's Fire Arrow has enough ap to reduce Muzan to ashes, and the fact it will completely incinerate Muzan, would make it so Muzan cannot regenerate from that.
It would be a hard fight, indeed, but as shown in Sukuna's fight agaisnt Gojo, he is used and more than capable of planning ahead on his fights and waiting for the best opportunity before striking.
For Muzan to win this, Sukuna has to go into CQC and let himself be hit by his attacks, which isn't realistic. Sukuna has Kamutoke, a long rang cursed tool which allows him to rain thunders into his opponents, has his shikigamis to fight for him, and has no reason to put himself in risk fighting Muzan at close range (he didn't do it agaisnt Gojo nor Yorozu when it wasn't needed, so why would he do that here? It makes no sense to think Sukuna would engage in CQC. Muzan would get cursed until he couldn't move anymore and then get instantly killed by Furnace.
5. CONCLUSION
Muzan has win conditions and CAN win this, but Sukuna's win condition is easier to achieve, considering he has more than enough ways to escape Muzan's grasp. Muzan literally has to deal with all of Sukuna's shikigamis constantly mauling him and trying to keep him away from Sukuna, all while Mahoraga keeps progressing in his adaptation. Muzan isn't doing a 1v1 agaisn't Sukuna, he will be facing all of Ten Shadows shikigamis, since Sukuna will be able to tell that he has no CE, and thus, no way of killing any of his shikigamis.
Sukuna's win con won't be fast, but he has no trouble waiting until Mahoraga finishes adaptating. His fight agaisnt Gojo was all about patience and waiting until he had Mahoraga adaptate. His fight agaisnt Yorozu was the same thing.
Not to say, IF at any given moment Sukuna gets critically hurt or damaged to the point where he thinks he cannot recover through RCT, he still has his second body which he can incarnate into and then get back to 100% HP. Even though he would then lose access to Ten Shadows, by that point Muzan would probably be cursed enough to the point where Sukuna could simply use his domain and try to use Furnace.
Not to mention, Sukuna doesn't stay still when he casts domain. Sukuna can still move. He can cast his domain and back away, while using Kamutoke to assist his shikigamis and stun/burn Muzan, all while cursing him even more by causing damage through cursed energy.
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Sukuna fra
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Catbowtie
Any/All- 4,079
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Muzan can't see rabbit escape. It can't provide a distraction when Muzan literally cannot see the shikigami. Muzan's tendrils will just whip around Mahoraga, because again, Muzan is more skilled than Mahoraga at the very least. His tentacles are able to consistently tag Hashiras and tag people with enhanced senses. Inosuke can tell if someone is looking at him and he's able to sense killing intent. Zenitsu can discern surroundings from his hearing. All that and it still didn't prevent Muzan from hitting them. Mahoraga or Sukuna has like, none of that, and the sheer amount of attacks that are going to be thrown at Sukuna makes it incredibly hard for Mahoraga to effectively block all of them, especially when the tentacles can change trajectory on a dime.
No, Mahoraga isn't adapting to Infinity Castle and even if he could, Mahoraga would have to stop adapting to Muzan's blood to start adapting to Infinity Castle and vice versa which would just take way more time then necessary. Also Muzan uses Infinity Castle to bring Sukuna back into his range.
If Sukuna goes into the shadows, I'm sure Muzan can still sense him from his EP. Going into the shadows doesn't look to be able to shut off forms of EP, and if it did, Muzan would realize that he couldn't sense Sukuna and relocate himself using Infinity Castle.
Going back to how I said Muzan can effectively dodge Sukuna's shikigami, he performed this feat. So yes, Muzan will absolutely be able to sense Ten Shadows through the air.
Muzan would just use Infinity Castle to relocate himself out of Sukuna's range or just remove the floors and walls to make the Ten Shadows and Sukuna fall forever...Or just leave the Infinity Castle lmao.
Also where did these sleeper agents come from? One user has a total of 2 MESSAGES and one like.
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Isnt it only just CripplingDepression6363.
EldemadeDityjon
He/Him- 20,326
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Just because someone has a high IQ and potential doesn't mean they can automatically tap into cursed energy. Even Higuruma, despite his potential to rival Gojo, needed Kenjaku to modify his brain and grant him access to cursed energy. Your argument lacks logic within the context of the series itself. You're just making random claims.
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He can't see, but he can sense a swarm of curses. Or are you claiming he cannot even sense them now? If suddenly a bunch of creatures starts swarming in his direction, when he has already felt a bunch of those attack and not only hurt him badly, but also heavily weaken him, he has a reason to be careful. Either way, he wouldn't be able to reach Sukuna through Rabbit Escape. So yes, it CAN provide a distraction.
Mahoraga can fight by himself, yes, but he follows Sukuna's orders. You're forgetting that Sukuna was constantly telling Mahoraga what to do, and Sukuna would do the same here. I don't know what your point is by comparing children with super senses with Sukuna's lifetime of life or death experiences, but alright. Not that it would matter, Divine Dog also has enhanced senses, as it's literally it's main abiity (he is used by Megumi constantly as a way to detect his opponents), and the sheer number of Shikigamis would be more than enough of dealing with Muzan.
But it's good that you brought up that fact. Muzan was fighting Inosuke, Zenitsu and Kanao, the three of them whom he can intercept and actually damage, and he still couldn't kill them. All of them not only were only human (they didn't regenerate nor were invulnerable to his attacks), but also only fought with swords. What do you think will happen when Muzan gets jumped by superpowered beings he cannot see, just sense, who will keep beating him down, cursing and continuously debuffing him without letting him go away? Agito and Mahoraga, only the two of them, were constantly throwing combos at Gojo, who was able to fight agaisnt them. Muzan isn't able and won't be able to, and won't be able to do anything but get cursed. Muzan's tentacles only have around ten meters of range, he won't reach Sukuna with the shikigamis keeping him down. And if he uses Infinity Castle, he will simply speed up Mahoraga's adaptation, since Sukuna will simply use Rabbit Escape and return to his shadow once again.
Provide proof that he wont adapt to Infinity Castle. Mahoraga doesn't need to "stop" adaptating to something to adapt to another, that's not true. He was literally adapting to both Blue and Red at the same time during Sukuna's fight, as confirmed by Sukuna. The only reason he finished his adaptation to Blue first was because Gojo, on purpose, held back on using Red.
Muzan uses Infinity Castle, boosts Mahoraga's adaptation, and then Sukuna simply uses Rabbit Escape and returns to his shadow. Great work.
Maybe he can, maybe he cannot. Even if he can sense Sukuna, if he brings Sukuna out, he will simply go back through Rabbit Escape. That will also, once again, accelerate Mahoraga's adaptation.
He for sure is able to dodge, but that won't last. Zenitsu and the others fought with swords, the Shikigami has powers which Muzan do not know nor will even be able to understand, since he cannot see it, just sense it. Also, if he keeps simply dodging their attacks, he won't have any space to attack Sukuna, since, once again, he cannot damage them. They will keep attacking until they get him, and nothing Muzan does will stop that. Will he simply stay trying to dodge?
All of that will accelerate Mahoraga's adaptation up to the point where Mahoraga will simply destroy Infinity Castle and render the ability useless.
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Muzan's sheer regenerative power exceeds anything in the JJK verse. Even low-tier, average demons are listed as high-mid while Prime Sukuna's is listed as mid regenerative power. Gyutaro gaps these regenerative powers pretty widely by no diffing a poison in mere seconds that was struck into his neck, the most important part of a demon's body. The same poison can stall these low tier demons for a day despite high-mid regenerative power and adaptability. Muzan > Gyutaro in terms of regeneration and recovery power. Mitsuri, whom outpaced Muzan in speed, didn't perceive her attacks slicing through Muzan's neck. None of Sukuna's cleaves will do anything nor will Furnace. That is not a win-con, it failed to really put down Yuji in close-range and only really killed Choso, who's not that strong anyway. Inverse-Square Law takes care of this.
None of JJK's 'poison" should even be considered here as Prime Muzan upscales from Gyutaro's 'poison' which can kill hashira and affect Tengen, whom has consumed poison since childhood, in mere seconds based on deduction of the sequences, i.e Tanjiro walking a couple of meters and Tengen spamming explosions before Gyutaro states he should've died and that the poison is indeed affecting him. Inosuke does so as well and he would've succumbed to these.
I wonder, however, does speed equalization cover speed enhancements/increase in speed? If not, Muzan grows in speed/enhances his speed with blood and blitzes Sukuna with thigh whips or even arm or back whips. If yes, I can see Muzan tagging Sukuna in CQC as the narrator states that multiple arms/mouths is advantageous in a fight against sorcerers and each of Muzan's mouth inhalations either crush Sukuna and his shinigami or his blood turns Sukuna into a demon, with a small chance of turning him into a demon and thus a pawn or he instantly vaporizes due to having no adaptation feat on the level of Muzan's 'poison' nor will RCT cover that as their RCT is not that decent.
Also, I doubt Sukuna himself even has poison resistance feats on the level of Spider Brother. He has never resisted anything of that sort and he's not the king of lethal poisons or toxins either as that is a mistranslation. There might be something I missed regarding his poison resistance but as of now Muzan tags him once and he's done for.
If Sukuna decides to drown/trap Muzan via the shadow Muzan (as desperate as Muzan is and how he will do anything to survive) will just deploy his own domain, Infinity Castle, and/or create new constructs to defend himself against it and stay afloat, as shown in S4, EP1/7. Since the IC is massive or infinite in size, Sukuna would be forced to be crushed under the weight as that is how the shadow functions. Given IC's calculated Class P mass (Pretty sure) and Sukuna's, whom is Class G, (His page lists Class G but the calc he scales from lists Class M, I'm confused) would either be unable to move and get sliced into pieces in return or be crushed and die. The moment either Sukuna or Mahoraga are exposed to Muzan's 'poison' they're dead.
Any of his Shinigami would be useless except Maho and even then he has no adaptive feats nor should be able to adapt to IC at all. What is he even adapting to begin with? And no, just because Maho adapting to Gojo's domain doesn't now equate to Maho adapting to IC as that is a fallacious comparison. There's no feat of Maho that compares to IC at all. Maho has never shown DC on that level and neither will he find a way to escape as IC is in a different dimension, only granting exit or entry with Muzan's or Nakime's ability.
A case can be made for prime, healthy, non-drugged Muzan to utilize clones, the databook states that this is in-character and he does this every time. At worst, those clones should be approximately equal to Muzan's physical ability and have access to all of his abilities via Douma's ice-clone example. His efficiency in blood manipulation and power distribution should be superior to Douma's who has clones really close to his power.
His cannibalism-technique to deploy his flash and lightning shockwave should render either Sukuna or his shinigami useless for an unknown period of time. Muzan will and has tried spamming this technique numerous time, only failing due to the drug weakening and draining his stamina.
Give Muzan access to a part of Sukuna's body and he'll be able to read Sukuna's memories through his cells and gain knowledge of his battle style, abilities, shinigami and grasp of CE and apply that knowledge into the battle.
At last, if we allow tertiary canon in this vs matchup then Muzan will just teleport to Sukuna and behead him as he has done before.
TLDR: Muzan via BFR, outclassing in overall stats if speed equalization doesn't cover that, skill-gap in CQC, potential knowledge access to overall abilities, high adaptive capabilities, clone jumping, too fast regenerative power and no win-con for Sukuna to actively put him down. TP insta-kill if we allow tertiary canon.
None of JJK's 'poison" should even be considered here as Prime Muzan upscales from Gyutaro's 'poison' which can kill hashira and affect Tengen, whom has consumed poison since childhood, in mere seconds based on deduction of the sequences, i.e Tanjiro walking a couple of meters and Tengen spamming explosions before Gyutaro states he should've died and that the poison is indeed affecting him. Inosuke does so as well and he would've succumbed to these.
I wonder, however, does speed equalization cover speed enhancements/increase in speed? If not, Muzan grows in speed/enhances his speed with blood and blitzes Sukuna with thigh whips or even arm or back whips. If yes, I can see Muzan tagging Sukuna in CQC as the narrator states that multiple arms/mouths is advantageous in a fight against sorcerers and each of Muzan's mouth inhalations either crush Sukuna and his shinigami or his blood turns Sukuna into a demon, with a small chance of turning him into a demon and thus a pawn or he instantly vaporizes due to having no adaptation feat on the level of Muzan's 'poison' nor will RCT cover that as their RCT is not that decent.
Also, I doubt Sukuna himself even has poison resistance feats on the level of Spider Brother. He has never resisted anything of that sort and he's not the king of lethal poisons or toxins either as that is a mistranslation. There might be something I missed regarding his poison resistance but as of now Muzan tags him once and he's done for.
If Sukuna decides to drown/trap Muzan via the shadow Muzan (as desperate as Muzan is and how he will do anything to survive) will just deploy his own domain, Infinity Castle, and/or create new constructs to defend himself against it and stay afloat, as shown in S4, EP1/7. Since the IC is massive or infinite in size, Sukuna would be forced to be crushed under the weight as that is how the shadow functions. Given IC's calculated Class P mass (Pretty sure) and Sukuna's, whom is Class G, (His page lists Class G but the calc he scales from lists Class M, I'm confused) would either be unable to move and get sliced into pieces in return or be crushed and die. The moment either Sukuna or Mahoraga are exposed to Muzan's 'poison' they're dead.
Any of his Shinigami would be useless except Maho and even then he has no adaptive feats nor should be able to adapt to IC at all. What is he even adapting to begin with? And no, just because Maho adapting to Gojo's domain doesn't now equate to Maho adapting to IC as that is a fallacious comparison. There's no feat of Maho that compares to IC at all. Maho has never shown DC on that level and neither will he find a way to escape as IC is in a different dimension, only granting exit or entry with Muzan's or Nakime's ability.
A case can be made for prime, healthy, non-drugged Muzan to utilize clones, the databook states that this is in-character and he does this every time. At worst, those clones should be approximately equal to Muzan's physical ability and have access to all of his abilities via Douma's ice-clone example. His efficiency in blood manipulation and power distribution should be superior to Douma's who has clones really close to his power.
His cannibalism-technique to deploy his flash and lightning shockwave should render either Sukuna or his shinigami useless for an unknown period of time. Muzan will and has tried spamming this technique numerous time, only failing due to the drug weakening and draining his stamina.
Give Muzan access to a part of Sukuna's body and he'll be able to read Sukuna's memories through his cells and gain knowledge of his battle style, abilities, shinigami and grasp of CE and apply that knowledge into the battle.
At last, if we allow tertiary canon in this vs matchup then Muzan will just teleport to Sukuna and behead him as he has done before.
TLDR: Muzan via BFR, outclassing in overall stats if speed equalization doesn't cover that, skill-gap in CQC, potential knowledge access to overall abilities, high adaptive capabilities, clone jumping, too fast regenerative power and no win-con for Sukuna to actively put him down. TP insta-kill if we allow tertiary canon.
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Irrelevant. Those same demons, even with their regeneration prowess, died whenever they lost their head or got exposed to their sun. Not only that, burning their cells literally hampers their regeneration. Just heating up your blade is enough to weaken their regeneration through the sheer heat burning their cells. Yes, Muzan regenerated right as Mitsuri cut him, what does that change? Whenever Sukuna or his shikigamis damage Muzan, he will be cursed and get weaker. I was intentionally not going for this argument because honestly Sukuna doesn't even need this to win, but being honest, Muzan has no reason to be able to stay up after being cursed after a few attacks. He has NO curse resistance, and it's stated again and again in JJK that being cursed is enough to weaken and kill a person. He will get damaged, ignore it, and suddenly he's on the ground unable to move.
That was what happened to First Year Maki after she got SCRATCHED by a strong, but nameless curse. Sukuna's cursed energy is way more potent than that. Muzan has no resistance to curses, he IS going down.
Also, Furnace is stronger than any attack Muzan has ever withstood, so YES, Furnace would reduce Muzan to ashes and kill him for good. Fire Arrow sits at High 7-C, while Muzan's neck stays at 7-C. Burning demon's cells also stops their regen, that's literally how Yoriichi scarred Muzan to the point that he never completely healed. Sukuna's thermobaric explosions would literally puverize Muzan, and other Muzan supporters on this already agreed to this too, so no. Stop the cap.
JJK "poison", in it's great majority, refers to curses, so yes, it is considered. Gyutaro's poison. What X character has or doesn't have doesn't matter. Muzan cannot perceive CE and cannot protect himself from curses, he IS getting affected.
You clearly doesn't understand anything about Jujutsu Kaisen. No, Muzan is not able to tag Sukuna is CQC because of that. You didn't understand what the narrator meant by that, so let me explain that to you.
What you're quoting is: "Sukuna extra arms and mouths provide an immense advantage over other sorcerers". Why? Because of the other quote you purposefuly ignored. "Even when performing curse gestures, his hand's remained unfettered, and even when chanting a curs, his heart and lung remained unburdened".
Sukuna's body was MADE for sorcery, that's why Kashimo's X-Ray vision saw him as perfect. His multiple lungs and his multiple mouths allowed him to CHANT any curse faster than ANY other sorcerer. His four arms allowed him to execute hand chants faster than ANYONE, or perform them WHILE using the other hands to fight. Muzan creating multiple arms won't change anything, he cannot use sorcery, so it would be absolutely useless agaisnt Sukuna. Please, refrain from lying. If you do not understand X or Y, you can ask me about it, but do not lie. I don't know if you didn't know or if you did it on purpose, but refrain from it.
No, he is indeed the King of Lethal Poisons. That name comes from the fact that, he, himself, is a lethal poison. Consuming any cursed object is toxic or humans, since anything that possesses cursed energy can and WILL curse you. That's why anyone who tried consuming Sukuna's fingers before Itadori (that weren't curses themselves) ended up dead. Sukuna is the most lethal poison (curse) of all. But it's stated over and over again in the series that Sukuna is also immune to all kinds of poison, so your BELIEF that Sukuna is unable to resist that fodder's poison is irrelevant. His page on VsBattle considers him immune to all kinds of poison, and so he is. If you don't like that, open a CRT, because according to the rules, we must use what is on the character's page. Either way, Muzan won't be able to tag Sukuna for reasons already stated in my previous posts.
Sukuna can do that, but he has no reason to. At least, not before having the guarantee that it is the only way of dealing with Muzan, since Sukuna has never resorted to drowning an opponent in the shadows as a way to permanently defeat them (he only partially pulled Gojo in to let Mahoraga strike him easier). so all that you said is irrelevant. And once again, no, Sukuna wouldn't be affected by Muzan's poison (you mentioned poison, not his bio hax). Neither would Mahoraga or any other shikigami. Once again, you're simply spewing lies that makes absolute NO sense.
No matter what Muzan does, he would not be able to get rid of ANY of the shikigamis, as he cannot purify them, and Mahoraga WOULD adapt to his blood. He adapts to all and any phenomena.
IC, on VsBattle, is treated in the same way Domains are treated. That is, both are Pocket Reality Manipulation, and we have already seen Mahoraga destroy one before after SIMPLY being adaptated to it's effect, so yes, Mahoraga can and will adapt to IC, and will destroy it as soon as he does, just like we have already seen he do it before. Don't like it? Open a CRT. Nakime's page states that IC is an PRM, and Mahoraga CAN destroy those.
Douma's Ice Clones that matched the real one's strength were an product of HIS kekkijutsu, not him simply manifestating them out of thin air. Other than that, we have never seen Muzan summon Douma just to use his Kekkijutsu. Also, that's not on Muzan's page. Get that added through a content revision first, since you not only didn't provide where that's stated in the databook, and that's also not on Muzan's page.
"Should", "unknown". You cannot explain why nor how much, how can I debate with you about that? Either way, Sukuna won't be fighting at close range, it was already proven in the past posts that Meguna's favoured style of fighting is long range, letting his shikigamis fight head-on. Also, once again, Muzan cannot affect shikigamis. If he can spam that, cool, but that doesn't change the fact that Sukuna can retreat into his shadows and that this move won't do anything to his shikigamis.
Won't really change anything. He still cannot damage his shikigamis, Mahoraga will stay adaptating and all the curses accumulated from the damage he took won't disappear. He needs to attack in order to win, and if he just stops fighting back, Mahoraga and the other shikigamis will go on mauling him and cursing him to death.
No proof provided, none of that is mentioned on his profile... so no, that's not valid. If he could do that, why didn't he just teleport to Ubuyashiki, kill him, and teleport away? He had no reason to walk over right into his trap if he could do that.
BFR won't work, since Mahoraga will adapt and break down IF. Muzan doesn't skill gap in CQC, he literally has no training in martial arts, he simply swings his tentacles around without no ounce of technique. Sukuna is literally used to fighting agaisnt multiple enemies from Heian era, with many diverse and unique abilities. Muzan has no clone jumping, he cannot adaptate to anything Sukuna does (cursed energy), you didn't show any proof that invalidates Sukuna's MULTIPLES win conditions and that tertiary canon you mentioned is invalid, since you not only didn't provide any proof of that, but that also contradicts the manga, since Muzan never did that move, even when that could have gotten him the win.
So yeah, nothing of what I said has changed.
EldemadeDityjon
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Muzan isn’t outlasting Mahoraga’s adaptation or Cursed Energy poisoning, which is technically abstract in nature and derives its power from the negative feelings and thoughts of others (which is nothing in DS verse has shown to resist so far). So, I disagree with the idea that Muzan can outlast Sukuna to the point where he isn’t getting cooked by any of these.
Anyway, if Muzan supporters still think he can outlast Mahoraga’s adaptation and Cursed Energy poisoning, sure—agree to disagree. I'll still vote for Sukuna.
Anyway, if Muzan supporters still think he can outlast Mahoraga’s adaptation and Cursed Energy poisoning, sure—agree to disagree. I'll still vote for Sukuna.
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Not really. Sukuna fought everyone and his cursed energy pool was far from ending (his output was reduced, but his CE was NEVER lose to ending). If your reason for voting Muzan is thinking he would outlast Sukuna's CE pool, then I guess I can get you to change your vote.
Here:
Here, and in many other moments of the manga, it is said that Gojo would never run out of cursed energy. Why? Because his Six Eyes allows him to have such an ridiculous control over his CE that he almost doesn't lose any when doing his moves, and constatly Sukuna is compared to that. Even though Sukuna doesn't have endless CE, it is stated that his consumption of CE is so refined he almost doesn't use ANY. And it's not like Sukuna is going to have to use multiple big moves. All he has to do is wait until Mahoraga adaptates, and his shikigamis deal REGULAR cursed damage to Muzan. Muzan has no resistance to curses, so he will weaken quickly, since he has no way to stop the shikigamis from attacking him. Once that's done, he only needs to open his domain one single time and finish with Furnace.
There's no reason to believe Muzan would outlast Sukuna's cursed energy, when he's the one single person who has the biggest amount of Cursed Energy in JJK.
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If a regular Cursed Spirit's curse, through a SCRATCH was able to put Maki. who still had a bit of resistance to curses (although she has only a little, she still has CE and knows how to use it to protect herself) instantly down, there's literally no reason to believe that Muzan would be able to withstand Sukuna's curse for, when he doesn't have ANY resistance to that.
Once again, here you can see the result of a SCRATCH.
How does Muzan stop this from happening? Once again, Sukuna won't just scratch him. Him and his shikigamis would be constantly outputting damage on Muzan. Muzan has no reason to believe he won't regenerate, it's out of character for him to START THE FIGHT dodging all attacks at all costs. He would get constatly hit and constatly cursed. How does Muzan deal with this?
Once again, here you can see the result of a SCRATCH.
How does Muzan stop this from happening? Once again, Sukuna won't just scratch him. Him and his shikigamis would be constantly outputting damage on Muzan. Muzan has no reason to believe he won't regenerate, it's out of character for him to START THE FIGHT dodging all attacks at all costs. He would get constatly hit and constatly cursed. How does Muzan deal with this?
EldemadeDityjon
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Muzan can outlast Sukuna, sure—but only if Sukuna acts dumb and doesn’t use Mahoraga, doesn’t damage Muzan, and doesn’t curse him with Cursed Energy. I know demons have infinite stamina, but the idea that Muzan won’t get cooked before Sukuna’s stamina runs out is a no-go. I don’t see Sukuna being dumb enough to not use his arsenal (Mahoraga) against Muzan, who is far stronger than him, or to not try cursing him.
Not to mention, Sukuna himself has possession abilities based on the soul. I wouldn’t be surprised if Sukuna possessed Muzan if Muzan tried to take in one of Sukuna’s body parts and Sukuna used a Binding Vow to split his soul, similar to how he transferred from Yuji to Megumi.We know Sukuna is the king of Binding Vows when needed.
Not to mention, Sukuna himself has possession abilities based on the soul. I wouldn’t be surprised if Sukuna possessed Muzan if Muzan tried to take in one of Sukuna’s body parts and Sukuna used a Binding Vow to split his soul, similar to how he transferred from Yuji to Megumi.
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Muzan is someone who has no patience and would not entertain someone who dare opposes him. He would end the fight as quickly as possible with his 4.3x AP advantage to Sukuna's durability. Muzan has 11 different tentacles, and it would only take him 1 opportunity to dice Sukuna into pieces easily as all 11 of his tentacles are 4.3x stronger than Sukuna's durability. On top of that, all of Muzan's physicals attacks are coated in his blood. It is capable of instantly destroying his victims cells, causing rapid melting and vaporization, even to those with high passive resistance to bio hax such as the hashiras and slayers. It can also kill Upper moons who all have huge amounts of Muzan's blood and can withstand poisons that can kill demons 700 times over. The upper moons are also incapable of adapting to his blood as high dosages will instantly kill them. All of Muzan's slashes naturally contains huge dosages as his blood as proven when Tanjiro instantly got one shotted with only 3 quick slashes. This is backed by Kokushibo who stated that it takes a huge amount of blood to affect Demon Slayers and it takes several days to even affect them on top of that. Muzan also has range attacks such as his energy blast and a long range full aoe shockwave attack that can severely damage Sukuna as well.
It does not matter if Sukuna gives Muzan a CQC fight as Muzan has the means to combat this. His ranged attacks with his energy ball and full aoe shockwave can catch Sukuna to the ground and finish him off from there. Muzan with his vast control of the Infinity fortress can easily just teleport Sukuna right in front of him or teleport himself to Sukuna and slice him into pieces. He can also constantly shift the infinity fortress into his favor. Muzan can constantly spam teleport the Shikigamis outside of the infinity fortress as he has infinite stamina to do so. It would just be a 1VS1 against Sukuna.
It would not matter if Sukuna retreats into his shadows as Muzan's bio hax that had already spread throughout his body will finish him off inside due to how strong his bio hax is. The fact that Sukuna is so badly injured from Muzan's attack that he would retreat into his shadows is enough for his blood to finish him off there and then. To add on to this, if Sukuna even needed to retreat back into the shadows in the first place, there is really no reason for Muzan to not have killed him as his 11 tentacles would've just sliced him into pieces and decapitate his head off due to all 11 tentacles having a 4.3x AP advantages.
There is nothing that Mahoraga would adapt to combat the Infinity Fortress. Unlike the fortress, Domain Expansions are shown being capable of being destroyed from the inside but is just really resistant. Mahoraga also adapted to Unlimited Void's sure hit cursed technique and the CE powered domain to destroy the domain. Infinity fortress has nothing like this. We don't even know if he can even adapt to the infinity fortress, or the teleporting sure hit of it because nothing is hitting him. Domains like unlimited void creates a separate space and destroying the domain would let it disappear and nothing remains from it. The infinity fortress remains itself still exists even after Nakime has fully died and disappeared, meaning the materials of the infinity fortress aren't a blood demon art, theyre actual wood. Even if Mahoraga somehow adapts to it, hitting the ground wouldn't do anything as theyre just normal wood separate from the BDA. He'd have to attack Nakime as she is the center of the infinity fortress and all of space for infinity fortress warps around her. It also takes a long time to even adapt to something if the hax is complicated. There are so many assumptions that are involved with this win con that its a reach compared to simply just saying Muzan lops Sukuna's head off with his 11 tentacles, one shot him with bio hax, or flat out just teleporting Sukuna infront of him and instantly killing him.
Like I said before, he would only retreat into his shadows over life or death injuries and not some booboo. He would be one shotted and finished off by the bio hax due to being severely crippled from Muzan's tentacles and 4.3x AP advantage. Slayers like Tanjiro who has high passive resistance to Muzan's blood hax got completely one shotted out of nowhere and was actually dead due to the fact that he was incapable of manually resisting it with total concentration breathing/bloodflow control after the full effect of Muzan's blood got to him. When he got one shotted, Tanjiro was incapable of breathing and his heart stopped. For Sukuna to actually resist Muzan's bio hax with his bloodflow control, he'd have to be aware of it like the hashiras after seeing what happened to Tanjiro to slow down the effects, which Sukuna wouldn't be able to since he wont find out until after the full effects of it one shots him. This also includes Muzan's bio hax affecting Sukuna's guts and brain, cellularly destroying both of them.
Like I said previously, he has 11 different whip like tentacles that all have a 4.3x AP advantage with all of them targeting Sukuna. They would all be enough to slash sukuna into pieces and cut his head off. Even if he somehow escapes into the shadows, Muzan's bio hax will finish him off due to how strong his hax is and how heavily injured Sukuna is. Sukuna would not retreat into his shadows for a simple booboo. He would retreat into the shadows for life-or-death injuries and injuries that have him crippled to the ground, therefore the blood hax finishing him in the shadows.
Muzan was capable fighting against being jumped by the hashiras and the kamado squad until sunrise despite rapidly weakening due to being drugged and that said drugs having 4 different stages all specifically targeting Muzan's demonic biology. Muzan remained above town level even at the end of the fight after all the massive weakening he has gone through with the drug. Keep in mind the town level feat he scales to is from Upper moon 4 and all the other upper moons and hashiras above her far upscales from it. So we don't know how prominent the curses will be against him. Even if we say the curse would stack up, they would be unknown general curses rather than the drug that specifically targeted Muzan's demonic biology. This would not be a reliable win con for Sukuna itself and is practically doesn't matter when his only main win con is Mahoraga.
Like I said before, he would be capable of fighting with the debuffs and maintain being above town level as shown with his fight while being drugged for several hours. Going along with this win con and assuming mahoraga somehow magically adapts despite me already explaining the issues behind this, holding down Muzan wouldn't work either. Muzan was held down before and countered it by absorbing them. He would just absorb the shikigamis and then finish Sukuna off. Muzan also has ranged energy blasts and full aoe shockwaves like mentioned previously to catch Sukuna lacking.
Sukuna's only win condition isn't easier to achieve. Sukuna's win condition relies on heavy stalling and dragging out the fight for an adaption that requires heavy assumption to know if it is even possible or not. All the shikigamis gets countered by BFR/Infinity fortress manipulation. There is no actual plausible reasoning for why this is easier to achieve than Muzan's fast win cons of either slicing him with all 11 tentacles having 4.3x ap advantage, one shot bio hax, and BFR/Infinity fortress. Like genuinely how is Sukuna's complicated win con easier than Muzan's simple win con with him teleporting Sukuna to him or teleporting to Sukuna himself and slicing him into pieces alongside his bio hax, something that is in character for Muzan to do.
Incarnation wouldnt really matter as he'd already be dead long before any sort of adaption happens or him being able to reincarnate. Actually this would be a massive loss to Sukuna if he does that since you said he loses the ten shadows, his only win con. The fight wouldnt be dragged on long enough for Muzan to be cursed enough as every single attack will cripple Sukuna to the ground. Muzan being cursed might probably not even be enough either since he still fought getting jumped till sunrise despite being drugged for 5 hours.
All of Sukuna's slow win cons gets negated by how the fight instantly ends the moment Muzan using the infinity fortress to teleport to Sukuna and kill him, which is really easy and simple to do.
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EldemadeDityjon
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He didn't lose the Ten Shadows because of incarnation. He lost it due to Gojo destroying Mahoraga
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I only said that because they said it in the post tbf
Catbowtie
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For people just coming in:
In Yoriichi's fight against Muzan, Yoriichi flat out said that one scratch from Muzan would kill him. When the UNDISPUTED STRONGEST person IN THE VERSE, who has the INNATE RESISTANCE of a Demon Slayer Mark and can circumvent your blood with Total Concentration Breathing says that a single injection from your blood will kill him and got scared because of it, that HAS to mean something.
Muzan's Biological Deconstruction is goated
Muzan coats his tendrils and whips with his own blood. This blood, when injected into a bloodstream, will begin to rapidly mutate the invaded bloodstream, which results in the destruction of the cells and them melting and vaporization. Average people die in under 6~ seconds from intaking too much blood. Think of Muzan's Blood like a cancer that spreads throughout the body, rapidly mutating the person's cells as it goes through the bloodstream. Demons who have High-Mid Regeneration can't survive more than a small amount of Muzan's blood before dying the same way, so one can't simply Heal or Regenerate through it. Demon Slayers with Demon Slayer Marks who are flat out are resistant to Muzan's blood, on top of Breath practitioners using Total Concentration Breathing which slow the effects of blood throughout the bloodstream, have less than five minutes before they succumb to the effects of Muzan's blood. This timer is only shortened by each time Muzan scratches, stabs, or injects blood into a person.In Yoriichi's fight against Muzan, Yoriichi flat out said that one scratch from Muzan would kill him. When the UNDISPUTED STRONGEST person IN THE VERSE, who has the INNATE RESISTANCE of a Demon Slayer Mark and can circumvent your blood with Total Concentration Breathing says that a single injection from your blood will kill him and got scared because of it, that HAS to mean something.
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YO I COMPLETELY FORGOT ABOUT THAT. The Demon Slayer Mark implements a curse on the user and will kill them via a curse. Upper Moon 1 Kokushibo avoided dying to the curse and was unaffected by it via turning into a demon. Yoriichi also has the highest resistance to Muzan's blood hax, upscaling from all the hashiras and Tanjiro. Even he admits he would get one shotted and he could do nothing about it.
EldemadeDityjon
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Yeah, I know that. I'm just clarifying.
As for Sukuna getting shredded by Muzan’s tentacles, I think he should be able to survive that. Kashimo’s lightning discharge can completely destroy the body parts of opponents who are as strong as or stronger than him, as we've seen in similar cases.
Using his Incarnation Technique, he not only healed all the damage from his fight against Gojo (except for output and brain damage, since the brain stores Cursed Techniques, making it obviously not something easy to heal, as Cursed Techniques themselves are abstract in nature), but he also managed to survive that attack at that moment.
I think Sukuna will find an opening to hide inside his shadow once he realizes Muzan’s attacks are lethal and that he can’t fight him head-on if he uses incarnation.
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To be fair Sukuna has resistance to electricity on his profile. Sukuna wouldn't be able to heal Muzan's attacks because all he has to do his decapitate Sukuna or slice him in pieces. Hell, this is all Muzan ever does.
EldemadeDityjon
He/Him- 20,326
- 15,788
Electricity ≠ Lightning Discharge.To be fair Sukuna has resistance to electricity on his profile. Sukuna wouldn't be able to heal Muzan's attacks because all he has to do his decapitate Sukuna or slice him in pieces. Hell, this is all Muzan ever does.
Check Hakari profile. He also has resistance to electricity and still got his body parts destroyed.
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