Arifureta: Soul Elements (✔)

[EL_xWatcher1234x]

Soul:
Let's start with this

Spirit Magic: The ability to interfere with souls. The more precise definition of spirit magic is magic that manipulates the incorporeal elements of sentient beings. In more concrete terms, it could be used to manipulate the heat, electricity, and other energy without matter that circulated within a person’s body. That also included things like memories, thoughts, and consciousness. With enough skill, a spirit magic user could take those incorporeal elements, duplicate them, and create a new soul out of them. In other words, create another person.

Soul and other forms of supernatural energy(mana, spirit element, willpower, element of thought...) are similar to fundamental particles and are formed from a smaller particle(Element).

Alfard explained that there was an old fairy tale in the vampire kingdom that still inspired stories to this day. It was about people being reborn. Upon hearing that, Oscar looked more than a little intrigued.

“Laus-dono has a theory that both mana and souls are simply different forms of the same energy.”

“Wait, does that mean when we use mana, we’re depleting our souls?”

“Not exactly. His idea is that when energy from the natural world enters people’s bodies, it takes concrete form as either mana or a soul, so they came from the same source, but aren't one and the same."

"Hmm, I think I get it? Is it like how if you desynthesize different types of ores and minerals, you’ll see they’re all made from the same basic components?”

“You can look at it that way, yeah. Some scholars also claim that everything in existence is made up of a combination of extremely tiny particles banding together and forming more complex structures.”

Alfard finished eating his last sandwich, which seemed to mark the end of this strange topic of discussion.

“Anyway, the point is that when people die, their souls dissipate, but they don’t disappear. They simply become a part of the natural world again. They’re still there.”

“Still there...”

“Then after eons and eons, when the right vessel is born, they once again coalesce and enter that vessel.”

“So what you’re trying to say is that when a person dies, their soul turns into primal energy, and eventually, that primal energy enters another person and becomes their soul?” Zero Vol 6 p471

According to the report, that energy was named as “Star Energy” by Harden.

Of course the energy was unknown by the world. Because Stole Harden was the only one who succeeded in observing this unknown energy that was flowing in the planet itself.

Harden continued to secretly research that star energy. And then, it seemed he discovered that the energy was going around the planet like blood vessels inside the human body and also how there were spots where that energy was concentrated and burst out to the surface.

The former was named “Star Vein”, while the later was named “Star Point”.

「That was why the very first thing Harden targeted was the holy land. It was in order to obtain the world’s greatest Star Point that is the holy land, no, the “sacred tree” that made the holy land called as holy land.」

「……Sacred tree, you say?」

Hajime’s mutter didn’t reach G10 who was desperately trying to hold back its despair. In exchange shudder ran through Kouki and Kousuke’s expression.

「Don’t tell me……」

「It’s exactly as you think, Kouki-sama. Mother killed Harden and obtained it at the same time.」

There was no meaning of the star energy in itself. In order to make use of that energy meaningfully, first it had to be converted into other forms of energy like electricity or heat energy that would act as the fuel for existing weaponry.

Yes,

「The “Element Arrangement Equal Conversion System”. It can freely convert the star energy into any form of known energy.」

With that, Mother could use the energy that was running through this very planet itself. Ch 378

「If I remember it right, magic power, blessing power, and even the sky dragon power in Grasp Gloria, all will lead to the element (origin) if you follow them back to their root. That was what you said right?」

「That’s right. The sacred tree and great tree――let’s just call of them the world tree. This thing is most likely a natural conversion system.」

The energies that were flowing in each of their respective world were like elementary particle at physics. It seemed they were made from very small grains that were smaller than each of them.

That was “element”. It was the smallest material that became the base of any kind of energy.

And then, the world trees that existed at each world were absorbing those elements from somewhere and converted them into energy that suited each world they were in and released them out. That was Hajime’s theory. Ch 381

Elemagia: An artifact as big as a baseball that converts electricity into magic power.

Element Arrangement Equal Conversion System: An artifact which allows him to convert element, the smallest material that became the base of any kind of energy, into energy.

Soul clone:

By copying the information of one’s own soul and imprinting it into a body of magic power, it became possible to have another body that could move autonomically and share information. It was a magic with the highest level of difficulty.

「I thought that it would be possible somehow if it’s just creating one clone but……after all I can insert pseudo soul into plant to make it fight for me.」

「I guess there is a world of difference in difficulty level between simple combat action and a perfect copy of the user. In addition there was also the matter of time limit.」

「Yeah. To think that it’s that difficult to grant the clone the same level of autonomy like the original self……furthermore maintaining the magic also become more difficult the more advanced it is. Just what in the world is Endou-kun who is able to maintain several such clones all the time?」Ch 483

There is a difference between creating a pseudo soul and a soul clone, because the latter require copying information. And from artifact like Eto Shin and Spirit Whale, we know that copying the soul also include stuff like knowledge and power like ancient magic.

Elemental spirits of nature(AE) creating independent soul clone with the same abilities as them.

『Shi, Shia! Please think of this as me and bring it with you.』

Choare suddenly thrust her hand into her own chest. And then she shrieked 『NNAAAAAH』 that was unclear whether it was a scream or a voice of anguish while taking out something――she pulled out a red slime.

『Hii hii, zee zee』

「So, Soare-san? Are you alright? Somehow you’re making a face that a god, or rather a woman must not show just now!」

『I, I’m fine! I was only making a soul fragment by shaving off my soul a little after all!』

From the expression of the star tree Lutria and the other divine spirits, it was clear that the ominous words of shaving off the soul were an act that was as bad as it sounded.

『Wi, with this we’ll always be together-. Fuhih, even if we are worlds apart, my other self will always be together with you after all……hehehe』Ch 343

「I don’t know about that. Or rather I don’t understand what kind of law this person called Lutria used to create this child. I can understand why her aptitude is so high if the way she created her was by sharing her own existence, but that should be a difficult method that might destroy herself if she took just a single wrong step. I too can possibly do something like that, but I never considered doing it. I think the possibility of that child having high aptitude coincidentally is higher.」Ch 388

Info bodies:

Putting that aside, spheres of light with seven colors flew out from the “Treasure Warehouse”.

Those seemed to be the information body extracted from the divided souls beforehand. Those spheres then returned to their respective main body.

They smoothly entered into the chests of the main bodies as though melting in. Then a second passed.

The main bodies who learned everything showed their respective reaction. Ch 491

The divided soul’s information sharing wasn’t just a sharing of mere record. It was experience sharing. What the divided soul felt, their current feeling, their thinking too, they were all naturally shared. It felt like their own experience. Ch 491

Race factor:
Souless entities developing a soul
They existed as mind

「……In other words, the existences of you two are like a hodgepodge of such positive conception?」

「Master, wording.」

「Say it in a cooler way! Mister Aby, please show an example.」

「Eh!? ……You two are an aggregation (cluster) of positive subconscious, something like that?」

「「As expected from the one who has peeked into the abyss of chuuni!」」

「Shaddup! Continue with the explanation already!」

Kouki smiled wryly while calming down Kousuke. Fairy Etemp puffed out her chest while he was doing that and she showed a smug face.

「We who ended up becoming an aggregation of positive subconscious wandered in Tortus for a while after that. And then after Kaori-sama returned to her original body, we dwelled inside the body of Neunte who had returned to being a soulless doll again.」

「The reason we did that is unclear but, most likely that was the result of us seeking master subconsciously, and master yourself had fought that body personally and perceived that physical body as a comrade, so that might be the cause we entered that body.」

「Why did you two go to me?」

「Master, this positive conception also included a lot of feeling of deep gratitude for ending the insane game of the god you know?」

「It’s only natural that we wish to stay beside master. The conception that form our fundamentals is also fully made up of that.」 Ch 387

and somehow gained a soul after visiting another world.

before

When Hajime turned around because of Kousuke’s words, Etemp-san was on her back with her legs twitching. Netemp Mother had fallen down with her trembling hands reaching out toward Hajime as though to say 『Sa, save mee~, masterr~』.

It seemed the “Juso” that came attacking was something very powerful. Most likely its effect was working at the level of soul.

「Well, this is also a proof that you two have souls though……」

「「I, ii~~~」」

「Or rather you two, what happened with your usual high tension? You two were too quiet that you became just like Endou.」Ch 384

「Could it be, you two were strangely quiet since coming to this world because……」

「Yes master. It feels like, our soul got the jitters. Then when we focused a bit and put some effort, there was a feeling like perhaps we can do it and then when we tried we really could talk.」Ch 387

and became fairy

「This feeling……don’t tell me, they interfered with the thought element on their own?」

Netemp Mother and Etemp-san bent backward in unison. They also didn’t forget to make their fingers and legs snapped up to point above. An overwhelming smugness radiated from them.

「Using Ehito’s formula to convert piety into magic power as reference, we tried our best with apostle’s knowledge, technique, and also “fighting spirit” that we learned from Shia-sama.」Ch 387

「This thought element’s density, the massiveness of the conception……has she really been reborn as apparition――」

「You there! I’m a fairy!」

「N-no, you are composed of thought element of another world, so by definition you are apparition――」

「I – am – a – fai – ry!」

「……Yes, you are a fairy. I can’t believe that you are really reborn as a fairy by your own effort. Especially when the world is at its current state.」

If they were here inside the Heaven Tree, there was a foundation for “fairy” to be born here. However, as expected an apparition that was born from the flow of conception of another world couldn’t do that here.

And yet, Aularodde saw it with her own eyes how Etemp formed herself with conception of another world, and furthermore with a vast amount of it.

「The possibility that I can think of is……that you already have a vast amount of conception dwelling within yourself from the start?」Ch 387

Element of thought is an energy that manifest ideas, myth, concepts... It's also the energy their manifestation(soul) is made of.

「Apparitions are existences that is born from legends of other worlds. The heaven tree absorbed the thoughts of the people that are filled with those legends and grant them shape. The heaven tree is the lynchpin of this world with such role.」

According to her, the residences of this world were existences that were materialized from the legends of other worlds.

Legends were the wishes and prayers of the people, or perhaps objects of reverence, or even symbols of fear.

Those things were called as “conception” in general. It was a form of energy that was similar to magic power and the like.

And then, this conception existed in any world. The heaven world absorbed those conceptions through the great trees of other worlds, converted them into the unique energy of this world that was called “thought element”, and gave it form.

Conception is just the collective mind, but it's the most fundamental energy in the verse(element) and it's produced by the soul.

Dragon race:
Dragon authority

During the incident where the shocking fact that Japan itself was a “dragon” came to light, Tio was in a state of being unable to move in the “Miniature Garden”.

It was because the “Dragon” possessed the authority that could interfere with all kinds of dragon. Even when it was only in a state of waking up from sleep, even mythological existences got quasi-revived under its control. That threat was still fresh in their memory.

In addition, Tio who was from a dragon race also wasn’t an exception from that influence. Ch 481

Tio and other members of dragon race could transform into dragon was because they as a race had “dragonification factor” mixed into their soul.

That story was something that Hajime and Tio had confirmed between them during the time before the final battle in Tortus, when Tio was learning how to transform other races into black dragon as her new magic.

After all, that magic worked by Tio duplicating her “dragon factor” and inserting it into the target.

「Not to mention, as the result of you continuously enduring the interference of the “Dragon”, you became able to sense your “dragon’s factor” even stronger than before──no, you became able to sense “dragon’s factor” even in other people. Anyone else would also easily reach the same idea if they know that.」Ch 481

Dragon Queen's Call: A spell combination of spirit and metamorphosis magic in which Tio use as medium flesh and blood to turn corpses in part of her dragon army, this is possible do to Tio analyzing her own genetics enough to replicate pseudo-dragon souls with spirit magic, then she combine this with her transformation metamorphosis magic to give the corpses artificial life and turn them into dragons.

Both soul and body influence eachother

「Cough. About the holy sword, I can transform into a wooden heavenly sword because I’m originally a tree fairy. Thinking naturally, Ua Alto-san is a possession type. And when talking about possession, it contain a constant risk in the aspect of the balance between the soul and the container.」

According to her, possession ability was like a default ability for apparition, even so they could choose their vessel. There would be no problem if they possessed something disposable, but if the vessel was too powerful, or if they carelessly stayed in there for too long, occasionally it would be the soul that got influenced by the vessel.

And, if Ua Alto’s soul had been residing in the holy sword ever since the time that wasn’t too long since the creation of Tortus, and on top of that if there was a long period of time she didn’t get used……

「It’s understandable that she got affected by the nature of inorganic object and her will became thinner. In that state, the only way left she can react will be instinctually or emotionally. Such end is common knowledge even among the apparitions.」

「But, she isn’t dead by any means. Isn’t that right, Aula?」

Aularodde nodded strongly.

「However, it seems the frequency and speed of her reaction is increasing since visiting the fairy world. And seeing how we can also see her goddess figure sometimes, I conclude that she’s in the path of recovery. Her soul must not have been damaged irrevocably.」Ch 459

She was in a half dead state before possessing the sword.


Earth apparition possessing a human

This man in black was none other than the true owner of Sokujo. He put Sokujo inside his body to make himself in a possessed state and constantly lurked underground. That was why he was far away from where Kousuke and co originally got held back and Sokujo got proportionally more effective the closer the distance to the mansion was.

But, Hinata’s “power of purification” must be unexpected.

He was driven to the death’s door along with Sokujou, and because of that his presence also became weaker. And because he was also underground, Kousuke and Hinata’s detection didn’t catch him.

There was no doubt that the second “whole mountain purification” would lethally wound him. A clear sign of death was formed on his face.

But, that was exactly why Kousuke felt a chill on his spine seeing the man’s eyes.

「Facing a suicide soldier who is going to accomplish his mission at all cost isn’t funny at all-!!」

To wipe away the rising up bad premonition inside him, Kousuke tried to seal the man using ice tonjutsu――but, as expected a suicide soldier was troublesome.

Something like “possession” wasn’t simple at all. Since the man resolved himself to die, he had already pushed himself into a state that should be called as “assimilation”.

The man’s body crumbled like Taisei’s substitute object at the highway. Ch 412

Oni possessing a woman(human)

At the same time, different cursed item jutted out from the man’s earth body.

That item with charms sticking on it that also burst up looked like a horn. The horn was also emitting terrific miasma too that gnawed on the consciousness of the people of Fujiwara clan.

In addition, there was a violent roar from above.

Sokujou was rampaging on the surface even now following the man in black’s order to drag the other Fujiwara clan members into here. Kousuke grasped the situation through the eyes of his clones that were dealing against it.

The woman.

The woman blew away Kiyotake with an inhuman strength and snapped even Hinata’s binding.

Her face was changing rapidly.

Her hair fell off, her body bloated up, her claws and fangs grew longer, and horns grew out through the skin of her head.

『You stupid fools who didn’t even realize that the apparitions of your own country got stolen!』

The man laughed mockingly with foreign language.

At the same time, the woman who transformed into an oni with huge body rushed toward the hole with terrifying momentum. Ch 412

Apparition: AE from legends myth...

The horn was used to summon this apparition using that woman as a vessel which ended up transforming her.

Possibly soul define race?

「Nice to meet you. Are you someone from that castle? This is quite a novel way to invite someone! Furthermore, that’s one splendid castle! By the way, perhaps there is some kind of misunderstanding, so I’ll say this first but, we are just a virtuous tourist――」

――Mixed person who isn’t human or demon, I’ll receive your soul as the compensation of your sin invading my territory

「Hajime-san!」

A vision of death attacked once more! Ch 345

This was by demons who can see souls

――Nice struggle. That’s a wonderful radiance of soul. Especially the woman’s soul is wonderful

「……Hm?」

Hajime’s eyes narrowed hearing the voice.

――What a really good woman. Her quality surpassed that of the saint. She will make a good womb

――Indeed. It’s a bit wasteful to merely eat her Ch 345

And people becoming gods after gaining divinity.

Soul modification:

――Soul – sublimation combination magic Soul Transformation

In the past, when Hajime and others were summoned to Tortus, they were granted with the skill “Language Comprehension” without their agreement. That skill that allowed them to understand all kind of language wasn’t something that was influenced by their individual ability, but something that was attached to everyone without exception. The reason was because the summoner Ehito meddled with the souls of Hajime and others when they were summoned and granted them that skill……Ch 343

In the first place the premise was strange. Spirit element existed within nature and also within people. It was impossible to separate them. Ch 343

「Well, we also have the cooperation of the star tree and the divine spirits. From my investigation, it seems that spirit element is like an energy that is produced from the soul of living thing, so if it’s Yue then she should manage somehow……perhaps, surely.」Ch 343

――Soul magic activated

――Effect increase using sublimation magic

『I’ll connect it to the world.』

The star tree Lutria was spreading her ripple of will to the world. Just like how she was able to send her oracle, divine spirit, and spirit to anywhere in this world, there was no place or person that the star tree Lutria couldn’t grasp as long as they were in this world.

That power was making Yue’s power to permeate to the whoel world.

「……Nnh, kuu~」

As expected, even with the assistance of Tio in her black divine dragon mode, it was really difficult to grasp the whole world, whether in the aspect of magic power amount and also the thought capability. A vast amount of information was weighing Yue’s brain and soul. Ch 343

With the interference to the soul and the power of sublimation magic to meddle with information, the power to produce spirit element was erased from inside the people and nature. The power was climbing to the sky and gathering while coloring the sky like a “river of heaven” that was flowing toward the island of star tree that was the center of the world. Ch 343

Sublimition/Info magic is used to manipulate the fundamental information of reality. To change the soul you need to manipulate its fundamental information.

Soul fragments:

「……Four, great spirits?」

The winged woman of the sacred peak who possessed the ability to rule over the weather, the spirit of four seasons who were in charge of the world’s climate, Leidia.

The great snake of the mountains and hills who possessed authority over the planet’s force itself, the spirit of creation who managed the land and magic particles, Grandia.

The centaur who possessed the authority of omnipresent space and time, the spirit of protection who managed the time and space, Fordia.

The maiden of the lake who possessed the authority of the transmigration of life, the spirit of life who managed the water and soul, Urdia.

The new spherical display projected the great tree Ua Alto and the great spirits who peacefully served it with respect from the four directions. The great tree stood far taller than even its current self with height that pierced the sky. Its branches and leaves were luscious and gentle light enveloped the whole thing. It was radiating sacredness that made it worthy to be described as god tree.

Yes, the four great spirits were existences that the great tree gave birth to in order to keep the world in balance.
Remnant of Myth Ch4

They've used Urdia authority to do this

But, what “he” created was something that far outstripped the hero and the warrior group.

「Tsu, so it’s like that」

Giant golems that were modeled after the great spirits――Replica Pseudo Spirit.

The Replicas could use the authority of their originals, at the same time they also had extraordinary ability that made the great spirits unable to display their actual power.

For some reason there were only three of them from the start, and before they realized it the figure of Urdia Spirit of Life had stopped appearing in the projection…… Ch 4

「……Combat ability succession system……”God’s Eye”?」

According to the information, it was originally an artifact for prolonging life span through soul copying. This artifact was adjusted so the emotion and will were suppressed as preventative measure against rebellion, while only autonomy in regard to battle was maintained.

The demerit was doing the copying from human to human would cause turbidity to the soul and turned the human into an invalid, so the soul transcription could only be done to golem. The merit was that because it was golem, the soul wouldn’t be separated even if it received damage that should be fatal for living thing, and the golem was easy to repair and could be sent back to the frontline quickly. Ch 4

Ancient magic= knowledge

「The magic circle for pillaging soul that is used in “God’s Eye” and the magic circle for recovering soul that woman used looked really similar to each other. I think that they are the inverse of each other.」

「Certainly, that might be the case.」

「The memo recorded the magic circle for passing down age of god magic that we ran into at the great dungeons. I think the knowledge transfer and memory browsing should be similar with this magic circle.」

「In other words……you’re telling me to reproduce the soul recovery magic?」Ch 4

That magic circle give people ancient magic (Law and CM) by imprinting knowledge into their soul.

Some members of their group lost their memory and ancient magic after getting fragments of their soul stolen by Urdia.

After Yue replicated the soul recovery spell

「……It’s alright now. I’ll take care of things.」

「Ou, I leave it to you.」

Yue turned her back on him. She glared at the battlefield.

The pseudo spirits that had the memory wrenched back from them and lost their autonomy because of that had stopped moving. It seemed that an instruction immediately came from the ruins through Urdia, but their movements were fatally slow.

『……Shia, Tio. Send them flying.』

『There’s no need to even ask!!』

『How unsightly we hath been acting. It shouldst be allowed for me to vent for a liiitle bit just for this time!!』

Yue’s regeneration magic enveloped her two comrades. Right after that, DONN a flash of light blue color pierced the sky. Ch 5

This wasn't possible using normal ancient magic which include soul and time manipulation.

At the very least, they didn’t find anything that could be the cause in their current place. Naturally Hajime had tried using artifact that was enchanted with age of god magic to heal them, but there wasn’t any effect at all.

It was unthinkable that this incident was the work of some human. And the scale was too big for it to be the work of monster. If there was a specimen that powerful, it was strange that Hajime and Yue didn’t notice its approach at all.

In that case, it was the ruin that came up in their mind as expected. After all it was close to the only place other than the town where the memory lost also occurred. Ch 2

Soul could also be data cause they entered a digital world and they can possess machines.

Reincarnation:

「The great tree is an existence to assist or prevent any stagnation in that cycle. It convert the energy in this world to element and expel it to outside the world, and also taking in element from other world in return, then forming the element to form that suit each world before circulating it. It is also a kind of purification facility.」

「……Nn? Wait. The spirit factor has been taken from human territory in its entirety. There should be none in the nature too. Then the new life……」

Yue frowned a bit worriedly. Lutria chuckled and shook her head.

「There is no need to worry. A drastic move like altering every single living thing in the soul level and taking away spirit factor from them, and done in a short time and all at once is impossible for me. However, I can at least subtly adjust the amount of spirit factor circulating in the world once more you know?」Ch 493

「I see. The soul will disperse in death even though it has been altered. Then it’ll get purified and the soul that is containing new life will be created from new energy that is adapted to this world. In other words, the next generation human will regain the spirit factor?」

It seemed that his conclusion was half right and half incorrect. Lutria let out a wry smile.

「The flow of the world is not rushed like the society of human, Nagumo Hajime. There is no way the great tree will replace all the spirit factors in just several years. The world is turning in the span of several centuries or even millenniums.」

「In other words, this world’s humans will be regaining their spirit factor bit by bit throughout several or dozens of generations?」

「Not only human, but every living thing here will be so.」Ch 493

Spirit factor is a part of the soul that produce spirit element.


Conclusion:
The Soul Elements represent the fundamental information of a being, be it their consciousness, knowledge/memory, will, power, skill, stats, growth potential, energy factor, race factor, concepts&divinity(for gods)...

---

AE
Agree: @Lloydblitzed ,@LuffyRuffy46307 ,@Dereck03 ,@Elizhaa ,@ActuallySpaceMan42 ,
Disagree:
Neutral:

Info(1 or 2)
Agree: @Lloydblitzed(1) ,@LuffyRuffy46307(1&2) ,@deonment(1) ,@Digital_Franz ,@Voidnether(1&2) ,@Dereck03(1&2) , @Elizhaa(1&2)
Disagree:
Neutral: @ActuallySpaceMan42 ,

CM
Agree: @Lloydblitzed ,@LuffyRuffy46307 ,@Dereck03 ,@Elizhaa ,@ActuallySpaceMan42 ,
Disagree:
Neutral:

 

[Lloydblitzed]

I agree with AE and Info Type 1, as well as CM tho Im not too sure what type it would grant

 

[LuffyRuffy46307]

Everything looks good to me

 

[Deonment]

There is a difference between creating a pseudo soul and a soul clone, because the latter require copying information. And from artifact like Eto Shin and Spirit Whale, we know that copying the soul also include stuff like knowledge and power like ancient magic.

Yeah, I get that, though the first once seems to specifically be in reference to Info type 1, considering how the context speaks to having an Autonomous body that shares information (knowledge) with the caster, and to my knowledge, if they have the complete knowledge of how to use ancient magic, why would they then not be able to use ancient magic completely, so its less a case of sharing powers and more a case of the knowledge giving access to the powers

Elemental spirits of nature(AE) creating independent soul clone with the same abilities as them.

I do wonder why this is here because it doesn't seem like the same situation as the soul clone mentioned above considering how the person in question literally shaved off a portion of their soul to do this, which seems different than the other case which has them copy information and infuse magic with it

Info bodies:

Yeah, this is info type 1 to me

Souless entities developing a soul

I don't exactly see them developing a soul here though?
I see that they are made out of conception and how they resided within a soulless doll, but nothing about them lacking a soul, hell everything here points towards them having one

Conception is just the collective mind, but it's the most fundamental energy in the verse(element) and it's produced by the soul.

No on the element point, because its specifically called "thought element" (which is a bit nitpicky but that isn't my entire argument), states how its made via conception being converted into it, but also is contradicted by your earlier scan which speaks to how the world tree of each world takes in element from other worlds and converts it into their world's respective energy, which thought element is much more likely to be rather than being element

Unless you are saying that conception=element, which is also scuffed considering how the mind and soul are made of element, but I would be more willing to belive that than if you are trying to say "thought element" is element

Dragon race:
Dragon authority

Genuinely curious as to why this is being brought up

Both soul and body influence eachother

She was in a half dead state before possessing the sword.

Yeah sure

Possibly soul define race?

I mean yeah but this point seems a bit redundant considering the whole thing above about Dragons and the soul and body affecting each other

Sublimition/Info magic is used to manipulate the fundamental information of reality. To change the soul you need to manipulate its fundamental information.

That is not what that scan is saying, in fact it specifically separates the ability to interfere with the soul and sublimation magic

They've used Urdia authority to do this

I don't see where them using Urdia's authority for this comes from

Ancient magic= knowledge
That magic circle give people ancient magic (Law and CM) by imprinting knowledge into their soul.

Some members of their group lost their memory and ancient magic after getting fragments of their soul stolen by Urdia.

I mean yeah, they gained knowledge of how to use it via the knowledge transfer, and then lost it when they lost the knowledge, but I wouldn't call the knowledge the same as the magic though, in the same way as how the knowledge of how to swing a sword isn't the same as swinging a sword

Soul could also be data cause they entered a digital world and they can possess machines.

No. not really, considering how for the former it would only be the "tangible" form that is made out of data, and for the latter, an inanimate object being possessed by a soul is obscenely common in fiction without the souls necessarily being digital construct

Anyways I disagree with AE, being more fundamental than something abstract does not make you innately abstract (especially considering how the soul and the energy of the world are distinguished as two separate creations of element)

Agree that the soul has info type 1 components but not that its entirely composed of it, I have no idea where info type 2 is coming from

Disagree with CM, which is coming from where exactly?

Honestly I think you would be better off trying to argue that the soul is ***** off being made up of element, but I wouldn't recommend that considering how even the physical world exists as element at its core (see the mentions of it making up and being able to be converted into heat and electrical energy)

 

[Lloydblitzed]

I disagree with AE, being more fundamental than something abstract does not make you innately abstract (especially considering how the soul and the energy of the world are distinguished as two separate creations of element)

How?

 

[Deonment]

How?

Because that assumption is faulty, the verse clearly distinguishes the energy of the world (which would be thought element in this case), with the soul as construct of element. With thought element being the result of the conversion of thoughts and beliefs into "energy", which currently makes it abstract, however, that does not necessitate that the Soul itself is (any more) abstract than thought energy, especially considering how the abstract thing in question here is something mental, which is typically considered to exist on the same or lower "level" as the soul. The soul is not considered abstract in those cases either. So just because the soul is more fundamental than something abstract, especially something mental in nature, does not make it innately abstract.

 

[EL_xWatcher1234x]

if they have the complete knowledge of how to use ancient magic, why would they then not be able to use ancient magic completely, so its less a case of sharing powers and more a case of the knowledge giving access to the powers

Who are you refering to with "they"?

To use ancient magic you need knowledge, experience and the talent for it. Hajime has all of them, but he can only one due to him lacking affinity.

About experience, the more they understand that concept the better and more versatile their hax become eventually reaching the its true potential.

I do wonder why this is here because it doesn't seem like the same situation as the soul clone mentioned above considering how the person in question literally shaved off a portion of their soul to do this, which seems different than the other case which has them copy information and infuse magic with it

This was done by the elemental, and the result was another perfect independent clone with all their ability including their authority and conception.

I don't exactly see them developing a soul here though?
I see that they are made out of conception and how they resided within a soulless doll, but nothing about them lacking a soul, hell everything here points towards them having one

My bad, check soul immunity in their profile(I'll look for the scan later)

Even machines could gain soul if they run on the planet energy.

「……Nn~. Considering how this world reached the domain of age of god magic scientifically……Stole Harden was it? Perhaps that guy had also taken a step into the domain of soul magic?」

「Come to think of it, according to Lutria-san, even soul is originally created from element isn’t it? If it’s that person who created the element converter on his own, it wouldn’t be strange that him giving AI emotion was his approach toward soul.」

In other words, perhaps it wasn’t that strange for G10 to be chosen because she properly had soul. That conjecture from Yue and Aiko made G10 said 「I too have soul like human……?」 with her mono eye flickering. Ch 506

No on the element point, because its specifically called "thought element" (which is a bit nitpicky but that isn't my entire argument), states how its made via conception being converted into it, but also is contradicted by your earlier scan which speaks to how the world tree of each world takes in element from other worlds and converts it into their world's respective energy, which thought element is much more likely to be rather than being element

Element ≠ element of thought

This Element is what makes up all those energy and soul. Element=conception/collective mind

I didn't focus much on it but here:
Conception is an energy that come from a higher world(save it for later), the great trees are connected to this world and convert this energy to whatever fit the planet to create it's inhabitant, who in return produce conception through their.

Conception=myth, worship, legends, fears...

This conception get converted by a great into "element of thought", which is what apparition bodies are made of.

Unless you are saying that conception=element, which is also scuffed considering how the mind and soul are made of element, but I would be more willing to belive that than if you are trying to say "thought element" is element

Yes, the soul produce conception and it's not contradiction cause we know characters could create concepts(Concept magic) through will(soul).

Concept Magic: An Age of God Magic that allows one to interfere with the laws of the world and impress concepts upon it. By raising a powerful wish or desire with Spirit Magic and Evolution Magic, it can be raised to a level of a concept before being forcefully materialized with magical power.

Depending on Evolution magic (Sublimation/info) is just a way to skip the process if their will wasn't strong enough.

1)Knowledge could be imprited on the soul
2) concepts could be imprinted on magic power(mana).

That is not what that scan is saying, in fact it specifically separates the ability to interfere with the soul and sublimation magic

This because it's difficult to manipulate the soul infomation using soul magic alone, but not impossible.

This character who talented in soul magic and Urdia don't have info manipulation

By copying the information of one’s own soul and imprinting it into a body of magic power, it became possible to have another body that could move autonomically and share information. It was a magic with the highest level of difficulty.

「I thought that it would be possible somehow if it’s just creating one clone but……after all I can insert pseudo soul into plant to make it fight for me.」

「I guess there is a world of difference in difficulty level between simple combat action and a perfect copy of the user. In addition there was also the matter of time limit.」

「Yeah. To think that it’s that difficult to grant the clone the same level of autonomy like the original self……furthermore maintaining the magic also become more difficult the more advanced it is. Just what in the world is Endou-kun who is able to maintain several such clones all the time?」Ch 483

Creating souls is easy, but a copying her soul information to create a perfect copy is difficult.

Spirit Magic (魂こん魄はく魔法まほう, Konpaku Mahō?) allows the user to manipulate the soul of a living being directly. It's possible to revive a living being back from the dead (time restriction applicable), or transfer the soul of a living being from one body to another, or even into a non-physical body as well, practically granting any living being immortality. The true power of this magic is the ability to manipulate the incorporeal elements of sentient beings. This included heat, electricity and other matterless energy that circulated within a person's body. That also included memories, thoughts and consciousness. With enough skill, a spirit magic user can take those incorporeal elements, duplicate them, and create a new soul out of them.

From the previous scans, this include "dragon factor", and the soul information seems like info type 1 and 2.

I don't see where them using Urdia's authority for this comes from

Context: this group could use soul magic, but it wasn't enough so they kidnapped Urdia trapped her and created an artifact that use her authority over soul.

I mean yeah, they gained knowledge of how to use it via the knowledge transfer, and then lost it when they lost the knowledge, but I wouldn't call the knowledge the same as the magic though,

They've lost fragments of their soul, not just knowledge. After reversing the spell they gain those fragment back and the golems stopped functioning. Hajime had both soul and time magic, but it wasn't enough to heal.(Hajime has just recently gained soul magic)

Soul fragment is what contain information about their soul like knowledge.

in the same way as how the knowledge of how to swing a sword isn't the same as swinging a sword

In this verse it seem that the soul already has capability to manipulate reality, Even normal characters without any supernatural energy could resist some hax thanks to having a strong soul.

No. not really, considering how for the former it would only be the "tangible" form that is made out of data, and for the latter, an inanimate object being possessed by a soul is obscenely common in fiction without the souls necessarily being digital construct

Yeah, except souls could hack advanced technology, and it was stated that their soul replaced the CPU of the robots.

Anyways I disagree with AE, being more fundamental than something abstract does not make you innately abstract (especially considering how the soul and the energy of the world are distinguished as two separate creations of element)

Really ?

The planet energy is just whatever supernatural energy the soul produce.

The mana inside the body≠the mana in nature(planet energy)

The soul take the mana from nature and convert it into individual mana unique to the person.

Agree that the soul has info type 1 components but not that its entirely composed of it, I have no idea where info type 2 is coming from

Soul information is type 2

By copying the information of one’s own soul and imprinting it into a body of magic power, it became possible to have another body that could move autonomically and share information. It was a magic with the highest level of difficulty.

「I thought that it would be possible somehow if it’s just creating one clone but……after all I can insert pseudo soul into plant to make it fight for me.」

「I guess there is a world of difference in difficulty level between simple combat action and a perfect copy of the user. In addition there was also the matter of time limit.」

「Yeah. To think that it’s that difficult to grant the clone the same level of autonomy like the original self……furthermore maintaining the magic also become more difficult the more advanced it is. Just what in the world is Endou-kun who is able to maintain several such clones all the time?」Ch 483

"Dragon factor" is info type 2 that is a fragment of the soul

Tio and other members of dragon race could transform into dragon was because they as a race had “dragonification factor” mixed into their soul.

That story was something that Hajime and Tio had confirmed between them during the time before the final battle in Tortus, when Tio was learning how to transform other races into black dragon as her new magic.

After all, that magic worked by Tio duplicating her “dragon factor” and inserting it into the target.

「Not to mention, as the result of you continuously enduring the interference of the “Dragon”, you became able to sense your “dragon’s factor” even stronger than before──no, you became able to sense “dragon’s factor” even in other people. Anyone else would also easily reach the same idea if they know that.」Ch 481

――Soul – sublimation combination magic Soul Transformation

In the past, when Hajime and others were summoned to Tortus, they were granted with the skill “Language Comprehension” without their agreement. That skill that allowed them to understand all kind of language wasn’t something that was influenced by their individual ability, but something that was attached to everyone without exception. The reason was because the summoner Ehito meddled with the souls of Hajime and others when they were summoned and granted them that skill……Ch 343

In the first place the premise was strange. Spirit element existed within nature and also within people. It was impossible to separate them. Ch 343

「Well, we also have the cooperation of the star tree and the divine spirits. From my investigation, it seems that spirit element is like an energy that is produced from the soul of living thing, so if it’s Yue then she should manage somehow……perhaps, surely.」Ch 343

Modifying the soul or changing its nature seems like info type 2 instead of type 1.

Soul fragments is more than just knowledge

『Shi, Shia! Please think of this as me and bring it with you.』

Choare suddenly thrust her hand into her own chest. And then she shrieked 『NNAAAAAH』 that was unclear whether it was a scream or a voice of anguish while taking out something――she pulled out a red slime.

『Hii hii, zee zee』

「So, Soare-san? Are you alright? Somehow you’re making a face that a god, or rather a woman must not show just now!」

『I, I’m fine! I was only making a soul fragment by shaving off my soul a little after all!』

From the expression of the star tree Lutria and the other divine spirits, it was clear that the ominous words of shaving off the soul were an act that was as bad as it sounded.

『Wi, with this we’ll always be together-. Fuhih, even if we are worlds apart, my other self will always be together with you after all……hehehe Ch 343

It seems like they can regenerate from that.

Disagree with CM, which is coming from where exactly?

That was for conception, I'll save it for another CRT.

Honestly I think you would be better off trying to argue that the soul is ***** off being made up of element, but I wouldn't recommend that considering how even the physical world exists as element at its core (see the mentions of it making up and being able to be converted into heat and electrical energy)

Element is the smallest particle that make up soul, mana, element of thought...

Hajime created this after understanding how mana become lightning spell

Elemagia: An artifact as big as a baseball that converts electricity into magic power.

A person from an advanced civilisation that reached the edge of the universe and multiversal travel range. understood the planet energy as fundamentals particle, created a device that convert particles into other energy.

Element Arrangement Equal Conversion System: An artifact which allows him to convert element, the smallest material that became the base of any kind of energy, into energy.

This is fiction particles could be abstract, spiritual, imaginary...

 

[EL_xWatcher1234x]

My bad, check soul immunity in their profile(I'll look for the scan later)

Here(Laus)

Laus once again shook his head, and the nun bowed and took her leave. He watched her go, then turned and continued the trek to his room. A few seconds later, he realized something, and a shiver ran down his spine. He whirled around, but the nun was no longer there. He was certain, without a shadow of a doubt, that the nun had no soul. He hadn’t sensed one within her. Zero Vol 2 p351

Again soul information require info magic to manipulate it

Shizuku slipped her katana a few inches out of its scabbard and said, “Did you know, spirit magic lets you directly affect the intangible energy every person possesses? This katana of mine can cut through that energy.”

After Shizuku had acquired evolution magic, Hajime had upgraded her katana and givenit the power to cut through souls. Shizuku had then further improved that ability with her own evolution magic, which had led to the birth of the skill True Strike. True Strike could cut through not just a person’s soul, but also their mana, their stamina, their mental state, and even the various positive and negative spells that were affecting them without harming their body at all.

“It took some time to figure out where exactly I needed to cut to sever your link to your mana supply and slice through the Spirit Binding, but...”

All great martial art techniques required impeccable precision. And in order to achieve that precision, Shizuku had needed perfectly accurate information. Fortunately, the true nature of evolution magic was the ability to interfere with information on an abstract level, so she’d had the tools necessary to gather that information. With the help of her artifacts, Shizuku had been carefully studying Kouki...and it had taken until just a second ago to gather the information needed to even use her True Strike.

“A true swordsman’s strokes cut through only that which they desire. I cheated a little to get to that point, but ultimately, I made it there." Vol 12 p136

I found some stuff about mana influencing the body and mana crystals containing the genetic informations and abilities of someone

Like Shea had said, it wasn’t mana crystals that turned regular animals into monsters. In fact, it was the other way around. Once a creature had absorbed enough mana to turn into a monster, the mana solidified into a mana crystal.

Basically, when mana gathered together outside of a living body it turned into a Divinity Stone, but when it gathered within a living creature it became a mana crystal. However, mana crystallized easier inside a living creature, so mana crystals had a far smaller capacity than Divinity Stones. Of course, various factors like the creature’s temperament, the environment it lived in, and so on all influenced the capacity of its mana crystal once it turned into a monster.

The reason mana crystals didn’t form inside humans and demons was that the two races had crafted a formal system for using magic. They usually expended mana regularly, and if they accidentally stored too much within their bodies, there were ways to cure that so mana crystals wouldn’t form. In other words, technology and civilization kept sentient races from producing mana crystals inside them. That being said, it was possible that people who didn’t use magic for decades could still form mana crystals inside themselves.

Transformation was a simple enough spell in theory. The caster ingested a mana crystal taken from a monster, which granted their body the properties of that monster. Until now, Ryutarou had focused on his close combat capabilities and neglected his magic training, so even thoughhe had an affinity with metamorphosis magic, he’d had a hard time getting familiars to follow him. However, after a lot of thinking, he’d come to the conclusion that if he couldn’t subjugate monsters to serve him, he’d just transform into those monsters instead. Vol 12 p77

Those crystals are the reason for Hajime mutation

A monster’s meat was poison to humans. Because of the mana crystals distilled into their blood, a monster’s specialized organs allowed them to directly interface with magic, and give them superior physical strength. The mana that circulated through monsters affected even their bones and muscles.

transformed mana allowed monsters to use magic without incantations or magic circles, though no one knew exactly how. Regardless of the particulars, a monster’s mana was poison to humans, and killed any who tried to ingest it. It would eat a person away from the inside, destroying their very cells. Vol 1 p149

 

[EL_xWatcher1234x]

Because that assumption is faulty, the verse clearly distinguishes the energy of the world (which would be thought element in this case), with the soul as construct of element. With thought element being the result of the conversion of thoughts and beliefs into "energy",

Element here is refering to conception


Conception is that smallest particle of which elementary particles like soul, mana, element of thought, spirit element are made from.

which currently makes it abstract, however, that does not necessitate that the Soul itself is (any more) abstract than thought energy, especially considering how the abstract thing in question here is something mental, which is typically considered to exist on the same or lower "level" as the soul.
The soul is not considered abstract in those cases either. So just because the soul is more fundamental than something abstract, especially something mental in nature, does not make it innately abstract.

Stuff like dragon factor could be understood as the concept of dragon, cause everything related to dragon has it. That why the Dragon authority works on them. That thing could control dragons in multiple universes at once in a weakned state.

The same could be said for "fairy factor" and possibly "demon factor", there is an artifact that destroy demons, and it work on humans after their soul gain demoninc properties.

 

[EL_xWatcher1234x]

Atavist are the descendant of ancient magic user, they can use ancient related hax or in some cases its full potential. We know the soul and body are connected which prove that ancient magic could be the same as genetic information to the soul.

Hecould use magic from the age of the gods. The magic that, according to legend, the gods had used when they still walked the earth. The only people whocould use it now were Atavists, who had inherited the gods’ blood. Vol1 p45

Dragon factor is soul info

"Anyway, that’s basically how metamorphosis magic works. However, you guys are subtly off. The more precise definition of metamorphosis magic is... magic that lets youmanipulate organic substances.” Vol10 p214

"I think dragomen’s transformations use the same principle as well... I have no idea how it gets inherited, though.”

“Oho. So metamorphosis magic is the foundation that our race’s abilities are built on... I see.”

Tio lapsed into thought, and Hajime continued his explanation. Vol10 p215

So dragon factor is not Something related to biology, because it's a soul info.

Tio and other members of dragon race could transform into dragon was because they as a race had “dragonification factor” mixed into their soul.

That story was something that Hajime and Tio had confirmed between them during the time before the final battle in Tortus, when Tio was learning how to transform other races into black dragon as her new magic.

After all, that magic worked by Tio duplicating her “dragon factor” and inserting it into the target.

「Not to mention, as the result of you continuously enduring the interference of the “Dragon”, you became able to sense your “dragon’s factor” even stronger than before──no, you became able to sense “dragon’s factor” even in other people. Anyone else would also easily reach the same idea if they know that.」Ch 481

Mana null through info manipulation

"What just happened?” Ryutarou muttered, voicing everyone’s thoughts. The answer was simple. Hajime’s new weapon, the magic cannon Grentzen, was an Artifact that fired shots of pure mana, with no physical component. Back in the Sunken Ruins of Melusine, he’d run into illusions of the past that could only be hurt by magic, so he’d created this weapon just in case a similar situation popped up again. He just hadn’t had any need to use it until now. Grentzen’s magic bullets were made of a combination of spirit and evolution magic, and they forcibly stripped the mana out of anything they came into contact with. Meaning that Hajime had just blown Kouki’s fake right out of him, as well as all of his mana. Vol10 p176

 

[Digital_Franz]

Agree with Info (2 but can just be 1 idk), neutral for AE and CM (I will reread the arguments to understand later).

 

[EL_xWatcher1234x]

neutral for AE and CM (I will reread the arguments to understand later).

Maybe you'll find something if you reread the scans

Souls produce conception which should be a form of CM. And this "dragon factor" seems like the concept of dragon that the Dragon authority rely on, which make sense that only Tio could sense and manipulate it due to her being a dragon.

 

[EL_xWatcher1234x]

Found another instance of inheriting ancient magic

Most importantly, at the age of twelve, she’d discovered something else about herself. She could cast magic without using incantations, meaning she could directly manipulate mana. So long as she visualized the magic circle in her mind, she could cast any spell instantly. On top of that, her special magic, automatic regeneration, meant that she was immortal so long as she had mana. That particular ability was so rare, people only knew of it from records. The vampire heroes of old had possessed that ability, but no one else had been born with it since. Vol 10 p12

And from other examples like Naiz

“Yogun and I begged my dad to let us go with him. We were already 15 by then. In one year we would have been eligible to join the army. My dad thought it would make good training for us, so he agreed.” The two of them had happily followed Solda to the village gates... and that was where everything went wrong.

“There were actually more monsters than the villagers had mentioned in their report. We’d just finished dealing with the ones the villagers had told us about, so we’d let our guard down, which was why neither me nor Yogun noticed them burrowing behind us.” By the time they’d heard Solda’s warning, they were nearly in the monster’s jaws.

There wasn’t even enough time to cast a barrier. Even if there had been, both Yogun and Naiz were too terrified to move. However, the crisis had awoken a slumbering power inside Naiz, and he moved entirely on instinct.

“That was the first time you used spatial magic, right?” Naiz nodded silently.

“Yogun, my dad, and even I couldn’t believe what had just happened. I’d shredded the monster in front of everyone’s eyes. I’d unconsciouslyopened a rift in space where the monster was. No incantations, no magic circle.”

“When your dad and Yogun found out you could use magic from the age of the gods, what did...”

It was obvious the awakening of his powers had been directly linked to the destruction of Naiz’s village. Zero Vol 1 p271

Some atavist

"Yes, I suspect he’s awoken to some form of special magic. If I had to give it a name, I guess I’d call it Ultra Instinct? If it’s happened this many times, then it’s clearly not a coincidence.”

Laus absentmindedly patted Sharm’s head as he mused his thoughts. Until now, there hadn’t been a single member of the Barn family who hadn’t possessed some kind of special magic.

“I have a special magic?”

“It’s just a guess, but considering the trials you’ve faced during our flight, it wouldn’t be surprising if your latent powers awoke.”

“So this is my special power...” Zero Vol 5 p141

"Hah, fool! Say whatever you want, but it’s mypower that’s tracking Laus Barn. It’s the special magic I awoke to once I began my ascension to an apostle. And the reason it worked through Laus Barn’s spirit magic is because of his failure to—” Vol 5 p179

Selm’s special magic was called Forbidden Command. He’d awoken to it when he’d become half-apostle, and it allowed him to prevent the activation of the person he specified’s special magic. Vol 5 p187

Maybe they have a high chance of inhereting ancient magic because their family is connected to soul magic.


More info about God's eye(Urdia artifact)

「……Combat ability succession system……”God’s Eye”?」

According to the information, it was originally an artifact for prolonging life span through soul copying. This artifact was adjusted so the emotion and will were suppressed as preventative measure against rebellion, while only autonomy in regard to battle was maintained.

The demerit was doing the copying from human to human would cause turbidity to the soul and turned the human into an invalid, so the soul transcription could only be done to golem. The merit was that because it was golem, the soul wouldn’t be separated even if it received damage that should be fatal for living thing, and the golem was easy to repair and could be sent back to the frontline quickly. Remnant of Myth Ch 4

“O-kun! This is what transformed Dylan-kun and the others into mindless fighters. It’s an artifact that holds the memories of ancient masters. Not only that, it can transfer those fighting skills into other people. But this stupid bishop doesn’t actually know how to use it right!” According to Miledi, the sheer amount of information transferred into the people who inherited these skills was too much for the hosts to handle. Because of that, it suppressed their original personalities. At first, the subjects he’d tested on had gone berserk, but after a while the bishop had figured out how to at least control his super soldiers. However, he still didn’t know how to turn them back.

Moreover, in order to execute the kind of moves master fighters had been able to, the hosts had to push their bodies far past their limits. Of course they couldn’t last long in that state, and quickly destroyed themselves. But because their healing abilities had been forcibly increased as well, their bodies regenerated over and over. Still, there was a physical limit to how long they could keep doing that. Even with such powerful healing magic, a few battles would leave them dead and broken. Zero Vol 1 p160

“Most importantly, though...” Oscar grabbed Dylan’s hand. Surprisingly, Dylan squeezed it back. Likewise, when Ruth, Corrin, or Moorin held their hands they heldthem back as well. It was like Dylan and Katy were trying to tell everyone they were still here.

“I think—No, I’m certain those two are fighting.”

“Fighting what?”

“The souls of the soldiers stuck inside them. In fact, they might have been fighting long before Meiru used her restoration magic on them.” Zero Vol 3 p286

The tense moment stretched on for what seemed like an eternity. But finally, Laus closed his eyes and muttered, “I see.”

He’d finished examining their souls.

“How does it look, Laus?”

“I’ll start with the good news. It’s possible to restore their souls to their normal state.”

Everyone started cheering, embracing each other, and crying tears of happiness. Seeing that the celebrations wouldn’t be dying down anytime soon, Laus raised his voice and shouted, “But there’s a problem!”

The cheers stopped instantly. Oscar’s expression grew grim and he asked, “What kind of problem?”

“It’ll take a lot of time.”

According to Laus, Dylan and the others’ souls had been fused with the souls of ancient warriors. It was possible to split them apart again, and doing so would return the kids to normal. But thiswould be the most difficult application of spirit magic Laus would have ever attempted. Zero Vol 5 p360

In this world, there was nothing more complex and delicate than a person’s soul.

“There’s one other problem. I’d have to keep treating them indefinitely.”

“Lau-chan, by indefinitely...do you mean even after you heal them?”

“Yes, even after I manage to separate the souls, it’ll be dangerous to try extracting the implanted one. The fusion is too complete. If I don’t regularly come back to treat them, their souls will start to mix again.” Zero Vol 5 p361

Ever since Meiru had first started using restoration magic on them, Dylan and Katy had been training within the confines of their minds, absorbing the memories and experiences of the warriors whose souls resided in their bodies. Zero Vol 6 p386

"The two of them awakened in order to help Ruth and Corrin escape. They’ve inherited the skills of the ancient warriors whose souls were implanted in their bodies,” Oscar said in a proud voice, patting Dylan and Katy’s heads. Though, hestill couldn’t hide the flicker of sorrow that passed through his eyes. Zero Vol 6 p 398

Tio ancestor's scale

"This is one of the scales of our progenitor. It was the one thing my grandfather could not destroy, despite his best efforts. It grants immense power to any dragonman who touches it, but it also forces them to transform and destroys their mind, reducing them to a mere beast.”

Before the dragonmen elders had found a way to seal it away, there had been those who were lured in by the promise of power and ended up touching the scale. Naturally, they had all gone insane and needed to be slain.

However, exceptionally strong dragons, as well as those who carried the blood of the Klarus line, had been able to retain their sanity for a few minutes before being overwhelmed. Apparently, there were even a few who were able to regain their senses after being consumed, and took their own lives to prevent the scale from destroying them completely and birthing a second calamity. Vol 11 p350

"It seems our ancestor was a rather fierce man. I’m sorry, Grandfather, but could you ask the others to delay our departure? It will take some time to ease this poor soul’s sorrow—Limiter Removal!”

“Ngh, s-such power!”

Tio’s obsidian mana raged around her, beating back the blood-colored mana of the scale. The shockwaves created by the collision were so strong Adul couldn’t even approach Tio.

Meanwhile, Tio closed her eyes and began conversing with the soul of her ancestor, which was trapped within the scale. Vol 11 p352

seems like the soul possesse them and grant them powers like Tio new form

Curses! Even after enduring all that, I still haven’t reached the point needed to activate the spell! Why did my ancestor have to make such a convoluted activation condition?! Couldn’t you have been nicer to your descendants?!

Only by enduring enough pain could Tio activate her final trump card. The unexpected power-up she’d received when she’d returned home—the legacy of the first Klarus. She couldn’t help but complain a little though, since it seemed she still wasn’t close to hitting the activation condition. Still, she wanted to avoid using that trump card if possible. That way, she could use itto help Hajime in his fight against Ehit. But in order to win without it, she needed more time. Vol 12 p253

The black dragon—though it was so far above and beyond other dragons, even Uranos, that it was probably more fitting to call it a black dragon god—was, of course, Tio Klarus herself.

This was Tio’s ultimate spell—Dragon God’s Advent. It was the true nature of the power Tio had gained upon conquering the grudge remaining within the scale left behind by the very first Klarus. In exchange for amplifying the user’s destructive impulses and robbing them of all reason, it granted them enough power to transform into a dragon god. Vol 12 p268

"Hm? My apologies, I must have been misleading with my explanation. This power is quite similar to concept magic, but I do not think it is related.”

If it was, that would have meant that Tio’s ancestor had acquired all seven ancient magics and learned the truth about Ehit. And if that were true, there was no way that story wouldn’t have been passed down through Tio’s family line. And yet, it had been Tio’s grandfather who’d been the first to discover Ehit’s evil plot.

“My ancestor apparently possessed a very powerful special magic that was a cross between metamorphosis and spirit magic.”

Tio suspected he’d used that special magic to encode his grudge, the knowledge of how to perform the ultimate transformation, and a piece of his soul into his scales. Every dragonman’s soul was imbued with the dragonification factor that allowed them to transform, so putting that plus a hidden, deep-seated grudge into an inanimate object made it seem like it was concept magic despite beinf fundamentally different. Vol 12 p352

"Be reborn as one of my familiars—Dragon Queen’s Edict!”

Tio’s voice was filled with the majesty and power only a true ruler could muster.

“Graaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaah!”

The bound wolf let out a pained howl. It didn’t sound like any howl a realwolf would make, and it made Freid’s hairs stand on end.

“Wh-What did you just do?!” Freid asked, shaken. With several grotesque popping and cracking sounds, the three-headed wolf started to transform.

And in the span of just three seconds, its three heads shrank into one, its entire body was covered with black scales, its tail and claws elongated, and wings sprouted from its back. It had been transformed into a black dragon.

This was another one of Tio’s new spells, Dragon Evolution. She had used spirit magic to isolate the part of her genome that made her a dragonman and now could use a combination of metamorphosis and spirit magic to implant those same genes into other creatures, turning them into dragons and her familiars at the same time. Vol 12 p218

Dragon soul genome=dragon factor

 

[ActuallySpaceMan42]

AE & CM Type 3 makes sense to me. Neutral on Info.

 

[EL_xWatcher1234x]

I found this:

Foltina is a goddess of nature and Aula is a tree spirit that transform into the hero sword.

Foltina default form

What remained behind after that was a spherical light of pure white color floating lightly in the air.

Its size was as big as a volley ball. It seemed that this simple light sphere was Foltina’s current default appearance. Ch 468

Looking carefully, it seemed the sphere of light was a congregation of miniscule shining particles. There was a core at the center that was radiating a considerably stronger radiance, and around it were shining grains whirling like countless stars. It was truly a galaxy. Then, perhaps the sphere of light that was containing all of those ought to be called as the universe.

Even though they were feeling a pressure that made them naturally wanted to kneel in submission, they also felt a refreshing air that made them wanted to stay there forever.

Evidently, this shrine that was formed from tree roots was a holy sanctuary that was created solely from Goddess Foltina’s presence. Ch 468

split body

『Now then, hero-sama. Originally I planned to become a divine sword and lend you my strength to show my gratitude for you but──』

「There are already enough swords! Kouki-san doesn’t hold a sword in his mouth to do something like three-sword style──no, is it alright if I’m the one getting held in the mouth?」

「It’s not alright.」

It seemed that holy sword-chan also agreed. It was flashing brightly as though to say 「There ain’t any need for sword other than me!」. It was protesting fiercely.

『Fufu, I thought that would be the case.』

Foltina-sama was mature. She didn’t show any sign of feeling offended and easily withdrew as though she had predicted this beforehand.

『Please bring my split body together with you.』

「Split, body?」

『Yes. From what I’m seeing, hero-sama is unable to display your original power sufficiently.』

「Eh? Original power?」Ch 468

『Anyway, I shall give my assistance to allow hero-sama to display your true ability until my holy sword brethren is awakened. With the quintessence of my power “Blessing”, it’ll be possible to substantially increase the limit of hero-sama.』

「That’s……I’m thankful. Truly.」

An increase to his base strength, and obtaining a new trump card that he never even imagined. Kouki’s expression naturally split into a smile.

『Then, with haste』

Foltina joined her hands in front of her chest. She closed her eyes and at the same time her radiance increased, forming a sphere of light.

That sphere of light──

『Please receive it──my brethren』

「Ee?」

To draw out the hero’s power sufficiently, either a god should reside inside the hero or a god should personally transform into a divine weapon.

And, the offer of Foltina herself transforming into divine weapon had been rejected. The holy sword was being dormant.

Then, there was only one option.

「Hiih, what are you doi──AH!? DON’TT! Don’t come insideee! OUCH, it hurtsss! HIGIIH!? I-I’m breakinggggggggg!!」

Aularodde arched her body backward like a shrimp. The pose she was doing looked artistic in its own way. She was holding her head while twitching uncontrollably. She was desperately trying to chase out Foltina’s split body that entered her body. Ch 468

That split body or soul fragment is possibly her godhood and it seem similar to the elemental spirits split body

『It seems that you are formerly an incarnation of tree so I conjectured that it would go well but……I’m glad. You managed to fuse properly with it.』

「Don’t you have any human heart?」

Aularodde-san’s eyes had lost their highlight and she was hugging her knees while lying on the floor. Even her tone had changed. Kouki and others couldn’t look directly at her and quietly averted their gaze away.

『? We aren’t human you know?』

That was so. They were god. Ch 468

『By holding the divine sword that my brethren transformed into, hero-sama should be able to use your original power.』

「Ah, yes. Thank you so much.」

Kouki kept sending glances to the side. Aularodde-san was staring at empty air with a dead gaze. This looked awful. In various senses.

「Umm, you mentioned fusion……will Aula’s personality be alright?」

『It’s fine. There’s no problem.』

I’m only feeling anxiety……Kouki thought, but from the corner of his sight, he could see Aularodde heartily drinking energy drink that she was still hiding in her attempt to recover mentally, so he judged that there was no problem. Ch 469

Not sure if she turned her into a goddess but it seems this is what she did so the hero could use his true power. Maybe there was no side effect cause both if them were related to nature.

 

[Deonment]

Because of how much stuff you have posted I have decided against quoting every single thing (in part because it is too overwhelming), and just address what I guess are your general arguments

-Dragon Factor arguments
Just because the soul has a quality that dictates how something develops does not make that quality some abstraction or what have you, genes are as physical as the body they cause to develop, for example, it and the manipulation of such would still be the soul, nothing more abstract
-Soul Clone arguments
Don't exactly get the arguments here, or well, what is being argued here, what I see is stuff about how can make copies of their souls, either through the use of imprinting (mental) information or splitting off a part of their soul, neither of which actually argues for the soul somehow being info type 2, also

Yes, the soul produce conception and it's not contradiction cause we know characters could create concepts(Concept magic) through will(soul).

That is an extremely wack argument considering how it isn't saying they create it through it, but that said strong desire is actualized through the magic, and that wasn't even what I was going to say is the issue either way

This because it's difficult to manipulate the soul infomation using soul magic alone, but not impossible.

This character who talented in soul magic and Urdia don't have info manipulation
Creating souls is easy, but a copying her soul information to create a perfect copy is difficult.
From the previous scans, this include "dragon factor", and the soul information seems like info type 1 and 2.

Yeah I have no idea how you can read information in this context as being anything but being mental/knowledge information considering how, it in the same breath, speaks to sharing knowledge between the clones and main body, and I already stated my issues with dragon factor above
-The soul and body effecting each other
That doesn't make it information or conceptual or what have you, that's just a common thing in fiction
-Inheriting of powers
Doesn't really mean anything, genuinely, people having the ability to manipulate reality due to their "bloodline"/soul genuinely has nothing to do with what you are arguing the soul to be

Anything else I missed or didn't touch on is mainly because you have posted so much that I did not remember it as I was typing this up and have no urge to scroll through the thread for the nth time to try and decipher the arguments from the scans being posted, or I just didn't think it was needed for me to respond to it.

Either way, as it is now, I don't agree with the proposals in the OP

 

[EL_xWatcher1234x]

Just because the soul has a quality that dictates how something develops does not make that quality some abstraction or what have you, genes are as physical as the body they cause to develop, for example, it and the manipulation of such would still be the soul, nothing more abstract

Except that the characters need to use Info magic that could manipulate abstract information to manipulate them. The same can be done with Soul Magic it's just that require a lot of skill.

-Soul Clone arguments
Don't exactly get the arguments here, or well, what is being argued here, what I see is stuff about how can make copies of their souls, either through the use of imprinting (mental) information or splitting off a part of their soul, neither of which actually argues for the soul somehow being info type 2, also

Who told you it's mental information ?

Soul clone= are not a normal copy, they are indepent individuals (on other universes) with their own personality, it's just that at the begining they act like the original until they develop.
Ex:
The MC had affection(conception) by a wind god clone that live in his house, when he tried to summon the source of this conception he ended up with the clone. This doesn't just prove they're their own self, but also that they could produce conception.


They copy information that include knowledge, concepts(for conceptual spirits), race (like the dragon factor), energy core(the energy their soul produce or use), and powers imprinted on the soul(like what Urdia did to the guardian spirits souls). Seems like type 2.

That is an extremely wack argument considering how it isn't saying they create it through it, but that said strong desire is actualized through the magic, and that wasn't even what I was going to say is the issue either way

I guess you didn't read this part

Depending on Evolution magic (Sublimation/info) is just a way to skip the process if their will wasn't strong enough.

Normaly a person strong will could reach a conceptual level by itself, but here they used that method to cheat their way into it.

Yeah I have no idea how you can read information in this context as being anything but being mental/knowledge information considering how, it in the same breath, speaks to sharing knowledge between the clones and main body, and I already stated my issues with dragon factor above

Seriously have you read anything ?

Which part of this you don't get ?
(God's eye is artifact based on Urdia authority)

「……Combat ability succession system……”God’s Eye”?」

According to the information, it was originally an artifact for prolonging life span through soul copying. This artifact was adjusted so the emotion and will were suppressed as preventative measure against rebellion, while only autonomy in regard to battle was maintained.

The demerit was doing the copying from human to human would cause turbidity to the soul and turned the human into an invalid, so the soul transcription could only be done to golem. The merit was that because it was golem, the soul wouldn’t be separated even if it received damage that should be fatal for living thing, and the golem was easy to repair and could be sent back to the frontline quickly. Remnant of Myth Ch 4

"O-kun! This is what transformed Dylan-kun and the others into mindless fighters. It’s an artifact that holds the memories of ancient masters. Not only that, it can transfer those fighting skills into other people. But this stupid bishop doesn’t actually know how to use it right!” According to Miledi, the sheer amount of information transferred into the people who inherited these skills was too much for the hosts to handle. Because of that, it suppressed their original personalities. At first, the subjects he’d tested on had gone berserk, but after a while the bishop had figured out how to at least control his super soldiers. However, he still didn’t know how to turn them back.

Moreover, in order to execute the kind of moves master fighters had been able to, the hosts had to push their bodies far past their limits. Of course they couldn’t last long in that state, and quickly destroyed themselves. But because their healing abilities had been forcibly increased as well, their bodies regenerated over and over. Still, there was a physical limit to how long they could keep doing that. Even with such powerful healing magic, a few battles would leave them dead and broken. Zero Vol 1 p160

“Most importantly, though...” Oscar grabbed Dylan’s hand. Surprisingly, Dylan squeezed it back. Likewise, when Ruth, Corrin, or Moorin held their hands they heldthem back as well. It was like Dylan and Katy were trying to tell everyone they were still here.

“I think—No, I’m certain those two are fighting.”

“Fighting what?”

“The souls of the soldiers stuck inside them. In fact, they might have been fighting long before Meiru used her restoration magic on them.” Zero Vol 3 p286

“How does it look, Laus?”

“I’ll start with the good news. It’s possible to restore their souls to their normal state.”

Everyone started cheering, embracing each other, and crying tears of happiness. Seeing that the celebrations wouldn’t be dying down anytime soon, Laus raised his voice and shouted, “But there’s a problem!”

The cheers stopped instantly. Oscar’s expression grew grim and he asked, “What kind of problem?”

“It’ll take a lot of time.”

According to Laus, Dylan and the others’ souls had been fused with the souls of ancient warriors. It was possible to split them apart again, and doing so would return the kids to normal. But this would be the most difficult application of spirit magic Laus would have ever attempted. Zero Vol 5 p360

Ever since Meiru had first started using restoration magic on them, Dylan and Katy had been training within the confines of their minds, absorbing the memories and experiences of the warriors whose souls resided in their bodies. Zero Vol 6 p386

"The two of them awakened in order to help Ruth and Corrin escape. They’ve inherited the skills of the ancient warriors whose souls were implanted in their bodies,” Oscar said in a proud voice, patting Dylan and Katy’s heads. Though, hestill couldn’t hide the flicker of sorrow that passed through his eyes. Zero Vol 6 p 398

Copying soul information=copying soul


Damaging the soul

Shizuku slipped her katana a few inches out of its scabbard and said, “Did you know, spirit magic lets you directly affect the intangible energy every person possesses? This katana of mine can cut through that energy.”

After Shizuku had acquired evolution magic, Hajime had upgraded her katana and given it the power to cut through souls. Shizuku had then further improved that ability with her own evolution magic, which had led to the birth of the skill True Strike. True Strike could cut through not just a person’s soul, but also their mana, their stamina, their mental state, and even the various positive and negative spells that were affecting them without harming their body at all.

“It took some time to figure out where exactly I needed to cut to sever your link to your mana supply and slice through the Spirit Binding, but...”

All great martial art techniques required impeccable precision. And in order to achieve that precision, Shizuku had needed perfectly accurate information. Fortunately, the true nature of evolution magic was the ability to interfere with information on an abstract level, so she’d had the tools necessary to gather that information. With the help of her artifacts, Shizuku had been carefully studying Kouki...and it had taken until just a second ago to gather the information needed to even use her True Strike.

“A true swordsman’s strokes cut through only that which they desire. I cheated a little to get to that point, but ultimately, I made it there." Vol 12 p136

"What just happened?” Ryutarou muttered, voicing everyone’s thoughts. The answer was simple. Hajime’s new weapon, the magic cannon Grentzen, was an Artifact that fired shots of pure mana, with no physical component. Back in the Sunken Ruins of Melusine, he’d run into illusions of the past that could only be hurt by magic, so he’d created this weapon just in case a similar situation popped up again. He just hadn’t had any need to use it until now. Grentzen’s magic bullets were made of a combination of spirit and evolution magic, and they forcibly stripped the mana out of anything they came into contact with. Meaning that Hajime had just blown Kouki’s fake right out of him, as well as all of his mana. Vol10 p176

Again "dragon factor"

Tio and other members of dragon race could transform into dragon was because they as a race had “dragonification factor” mixed into their soul.

That story was something that Hajime and Tio had confirmed between them during the time before the final battle in Tortus, when Tio was learning how to transform other races into black dragon as her new magic.

After all, that magic worked by Tio duplicating her “dragon factor” and inserting it into the target.

「Not to mention, as the result of you continuously enduring the interference of the “Dragon”, you became able to sense your “dragon’s factor” even stronger than before──no, you became able to sense “dragon’s factor” even in other people. Anyone else would also easily reach the same idea if they know that.」Ch 481

"Be reborn as one of my familiars—Dragon Queen’s Edict!”

Tio’s voice was filled with the majesty and power only a true ruler could muster.

“Graaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaah!”

The bound wolf let out a pained howl. It didn’t sound like any howl a realwolf would make, and it made Freid’s hairs stand on end.

“Wh-What did you just do?!” Freid asked, shaken. With several grotesque popping and cracking sounds, the three-headed wolf started to transform.

And in the span of just three seconds, its three heads shrank into one, its entire body was covered with black scales, its tail and claws elongated, and wings sprouted from its back. It had been transformed into a black dragon.

This was another one of Tio’s new spells, Dragon Evolution. She had used spirit magic to isolate the part of her genome that made her a dragonman and now could use a combination of metamorphosis and spirit magic to implant those same genes into other creatures, turning them into dragons and her familiars at the same time. Vol 12 p218

She got better at it

And then, now, just when the main cannons were in the verge of firing, she bent greatly backward while taking a deep breath……

GURYAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA-

She let out a dragon howl with the human body. Still with an extremely disgusting smile as though she was going to throw out all the pleasure in one go.

The howl radiated, however, it wasn’t a mere yell. The howl turned into black colored ripples with Tio as the center, and it rushed through the airspace. The black ripples that repeatedly undulated, over and over again, they ignored the barrier and passed through the fleet.

Was it an unknown attack……. But look there, that woman’s smile. It wasn’t normal!

The fleet’s main cannons cautiously stopped in the stage of firing preparation completed.

Right after that, pulsation resounded in the world.

Thump-

Thump-

Thump-

It wasn’t just one or two. There were innumerable pulses that couldn’t be counted. It was as though the world itself was going to wake up, and then there was a bizarre yet overwhelming presence, presence, presence-!!

――Now, awaken. O mine brethren. O proud, powerful existences. Ch 239

Once in the Holy Precincts Tio used【Dragon King’s Authority】. It was an age of god magic that transformed other creature into a black dragon. Before, she could only change the target one by one by using the black slavery whip in conjunction.

But right now, although there were the requirements that she needed to be in a state that had stocked up power from using Pain Conversion, and also the targets needed to be a creature that was close to dragon, but she was able to transform all the dragons within range into black dragons that possessed tough black scale with one roar. Furthermore, by using an arrangement of【Divine Statement】――【God Dragon’s Word Soul】, it could also awaken the dragon instinct.

Yes, by Tio’s power, all the dragons who were confined by the fleet in great amount as fuel――were transformed into gallant black dragons! Ch 239

 

[EL_xWatcher1234x]

-The soul and body effecting each other
That doesn't make it information or conceptual or what have you, that's just a common thing in fiction

Unless we have reality warper who use info magic(1 and 2) refering to the soul as information, or people becoming conceptual enteties through possession.

-Inheriting of powers
Doesn't really mean anything, genuinely, people having the ability to manipulate reality due to their "bloodline"/soul genuinely has nothing to do with what you are arguing the soul to be

Unless those powers are conceptual in nature like like ancient magic which is a form of Law and CM.

Anything else I missed or didn't touch on is mainly because you have posted so much that I did not remember it as I was typing this up and have no urge to scroll through the thread for the nth time to try and decipher the arguments from the scans being posted, or I just didn't think it was needed for me to respond to it.

Either way, as it is now, I don't agree with the proposals in the OP

That why you missed more than half of the evidences. please reread

 

[LephyrTheRevanchist]

@Elizhaa @Planck69 @Theglassman12

Can you take a look at this? I trust your judgement regarding this topic

 

[Voidnether]

On info bodies and soul modification, yeah it's Information Type 2 (it's blatant, actually).
I think you forgot to add this and this, though I don't know how relevant would it be (the second scan is already accepted as both Type 1 & 2 Information on Nagumo's profile).

 

[EL_xWatcher1234x]

I can't find the scan, but for soke reason everyone has an affinity for info magic. They could all use some basic application like stats and hax amp even Hajime who doesn't have affinity for anything except creation magic(matter manipulation).

Each person's ability to wield one or more Ancient Magics depends on their affinity. Some may work better than others for certain jobs because of their nature. For example, a Synergist can make best use of creation magic because their skills revolve around craftsmanship.

Those with high magical affinities are especially skilled with most forms of ancient magic and can make higher use of them. On the other hand, those with low magical affinitieswill only be able to use them in a limited capacity. For example, Yue, who's skilled in almost all forms of magic, can make high use of almost every type of ancient magic except creation magic, as she cannot use Transmute. The second example is Shea, whose magic skill is extremely low, can only apply it to herself. The only exemption appears to be evolution magic, as it focuses on enhancing and power ups, therefore anyone can use it to varying degrees, regardless of their affinity to it.

Time manipulation can't reverse info magic

“But what if I could evolve it further? They say it’s the power of love that forges bonds, so isn’t that a power that can be enhanced with evolution magic?”

“Wow. You’re just going to continue the conversation like nothing happened, huh, Yue-san?”

“Kaori’s listening like nothing happened too. Even though she moved so fast I could see afterimages... You’ve really grown strong Kaori...”

The two girls had fought so often they’d polished their skills against each other. Shea and Shizuku gazed at their respective best friends with awe. In a way, Shea and Shizuku were in sync as well.

“I-I must say, that does sound like an intriguing experiment. If evolution magic can be used on emotions as well, there’s an endless amount of possibilities.”

“Yue, you sure you want to try it? I feel like you should get some more practice with evolution magic in first.”

“Mmm, I’ll be fine... If it goes wrong, Kaori can always heal me with restoration magic Vol 8 p381

It didn't work

“Someone stop Yue! Kaori, use your restoration magic, please!”

“Uwaaaaaah, Yue, come back to your senses!” Kaori cast restoration magic faster than she ever had in her life. Silver light rained down on Yue.

“Are you... trying to get in my way?”

However, it had no effect.

“Why isn’t it working!?” Kaori screamed. Vol 8 p383

We saw similar thing with time magic not being able to reverse the process of imprinting info on someone souls, because the changes were done to their soul on a fundamental level something that is possible to fix with soul magic but it's highly difficult.

There is also the process of them taking mana from the world and converting it into their own mana, which is unique for each person and it is influenced by changes done to the body or the soul like when Ehit possessed Yue's body. And we know that hardened mana contain genetic information. This may suggest that they all have the ability to manipulate information on a limited scale.

 

[Voidnether]

This may suggest that they all have the ability to manipulate information on a limited scale.

If it's not universal then it's probably only Type 1 iirc. But it depends on how this limited scale is interpreted, once again.

 

[EL_xWatcher1234x]

If it's not universal then it's probably only Type 1 iirc. But it depends on how this limited scale is interpreted, once again.

It doesn't need to be on a universal scale, just manipulating fundamental information of something is enough.

 

[Voidnether]

It doesn't need to be on a universal scale, just manipulating fundamental information of something is enough.

When I said it depends on how this limited scale is interpreted, it means that the universal scale refers to the information themselves besides them being fundamental. I mean, if you can manipulate information but your range isn't universal. It wouldn't disqualify them getting Information Manipulation Type 2, isn't it?

If it's as simple as manipulating information that's fundamental, a lot of verse would get them but the reality is that if the fundamental information in question doesn't correlate with reality as in information being a part that makes up reality.. You wouldn't get Type 2 Information.

 

[Dereck03]

The AE and the CM seems fine. The Info seems type 1.

 

[EL_xWatcher1234x]

The AE and the CM seems fine. The Info seems type 1.

You can ignore AE and CM for now.

I'm terrible at ecplaining this but here:

The type 2 information is for the person soul being made up from the planet energy(fundamental particles). These particles represent their knowledge, power, race, energy(for example mana, ki, chakra...), life force and a peron's will. Manipulating or copying the soul information is done through manipulating these particles.

 

[Dereck03]

Yep, I have read the discussion about the info part and I have agreed on it being type 1 not type 2.

 

[EL_xWatcher1234x]

Yep, I have read the discussion about the info part and I have agreed on it being type 1 not type 2.

Why ?

It's clearly type 2 and knowledge itself is just a part of these information.

 

[Dereck03]

It's clearly type 2 and knowledge itself is just a part of these information.

Was type 2 info already accepted in verse? Because for what I could read here it just seems like type 1, unless I'm missing some important context.

 

[EL_xWatcher1234x]

Was type 2 info already accepted in verse?

Yeah, we have them.

Multiple characters like Lyutillis can manipulate the fundamental information of the world including its concepts using info magic. And she along with this guy who use soul magic find it difficult to manipulate the soul on a that level.

 

[Dereck03]

Well, with the added context ig it could work.

 

[Elizhaa]

AE and CM look fine; Information manipulation types 1 and 2 look fine.