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Anakin and Obi-Wan vs Darth Vader.

Battle of the Heroes intensifies

But seriously, I'll take a shot at this, but since Idk much about Legends, I'll be happy to be corrected.

This fight would be much closer if this was ANH Vader or ESB Vader, but ROTJ Vader? From what I understand, ROTJ Vader is when he was at his peak in power and had long surpassed his ROTS self and Obi-Wan was just below Anakin in power by then. Vader is already stronger here imo regardless of it being 2v1.

Also, Vader has prior knowledge and experience on his side. His former self and his former master? He knows them both like the back of his hand. I wouldn't be surprised if he tried coaxing Anakin to the dark side and or throwing him off balance by revealing Anakin's failure to save Padme or something. Vader would just toy with his former self's emotions, counter all of his tricks and skill thanks to prior knowledge and experience and simply outclass him with greater power. Obi-Wan being the master of Soresu would definitely help him last longer, but in the end, he falls as well. After his failure on Mustafar, Vader has undoubtedly replayed the battle time and time again to the point where he won't be making the same mistakes and would know how to take Obi down this time. Also, the second Vader busts out the force, it's GG. Obi was screwed by Dooku once he pulled out his own force moves so who's to say that Vader, being much stronger than both Dooku and Anakin, won't do the same?

This is all on top of the fact that Vader's suit serves as armor to the duo's attacks and makes him much more durable and physically stronger than them despite the fact he's slower.

Anakin and Obi-Wan are faster here, they have numbers on their side and their teamwork is remarkable, but Vader has more edges in prior knowledge and experience, greater power, greater physical stats and his sheer willpower after years of what he's been through make me believe he takes this. I can see Anakin and Obi-Wan putting up a good fight against him and getting hits there and there, but eventually Vader will win.

Therefore, I vote Vader. Again, I could be missing info or downplaying Anakin and Obi-Wan since I'm not very familiar with Legends so I am open to criticism, but this is what I think.
 
XSOULOFCINDERX said:
No, they definitely lose individually against Vader.
Click to expand...
I just took a look at the profile and it seems that the wiki uses a completely different scaling for Vader than what I had in mind.

They would lose if this was Knightfall Vader, but ROTJ Vader (fighting seriously and at full power) lost against ROTJ Luke, who has multiple WoG statements (Lucas, Hidalgo, Gillard) as being below TPM Kenobi and Qui-Gon Jinn, and so does Vader. Vader's statements should be treated as no different than Maul's statements over Vitiate and Bane's statements over Valkorion. He had a shot at fighting TPM Maul, and lost. He had a shot at asserting superiority to Muur (who is sub-TPM Maul), and conceded that Muur's power far surpassed his own.

A major misconception is that Vader was emotionally conflicted, but the root of those sources that say that Vader was conflicted comes from Luke Skywalker's POV. Luke has a super-hyperinflated vision of Vader. He compares Vader to Gethzerion (powerful enough to scare Palpatine ten years before reaching her prime), he compares Vader to himself after Dark Empire (despite the fact that Luke is too strong for DE Sidious to defeat in sabers at this point), he compares Vader to C'baoth despite the fact that Obi-Wan believed C'baoth could be more powerful than Yoda.
 
If you have a problem with the scaling, then make a CRT for it. Until then, Vader is stronger than both of them.
 
XSOULOFCINDERX said:
If you have a problem with the scaling, then make a CRT for it. Until then, Vader is stronger than both of them.
Click to expand...
CRTs are brushed off as there's always someone saying that a revision is already on the way, I believe someone mentioned Asura and Spino discussing this upcoming revision. There is an active CRT that started October 2020 and is still not finished to this day. I have stick to what's canon because revisions are going nowhere, and I will not submit to the wiki's satanic scaling, and I don't have time to write verse-wide revisions, best I can do is this.
 
Yeah, I never agreed with Dooku, Anakin and Obi-Wan being Several Tiers beneath Yoda and Sidious. That being said though, Vader should still be superior to them regardless.
 
XSOULOFCINDERX said:
That being said though, Vader should still be superior to them regardless.
Click to expand...
He would be if you treat him as superior to Knightfall Vader, which is what I assume the wiki does. Vader's standing is pretty low post-ROTS. He goes from being far above Tenebrae, Yoda and Sidious to being inferior to one of the Exiles, who are all sub-Malak.
 
Just gonna give some more support to Vader winning here. In Shadows of the Empire, it is stated that RotJ Luke is at least comparable, if not superior to RotS Anakin.

Meanwhile, Vader has multiple statements saying that he could’ve bodied Luke if he wanted to. Luke himself stated (in The Courtship of Princess Leia) that if Vader had wanted to kill him, he would’ve gotten stomped.

So Vader >> Luke >= Anakin, and Obi-Wan is significantly beneath Anakin. He was pretty consistently overpowered by Dooku, who is stated multiple times to be beneath Anakin, and before someone mentions the Mustafar duel, it is stated in Dark Lord: The Rise of Darth Vader that Anakin was weakened during that duel.

Also it has been stated more than once that Vader, even at his weakest, is still superior to Dooku (as stated in Dark Lord: The Rise of Darth Vader and an interview with George Lucas) who is stronger than Obi-Wan.

TL;DR Vader is FAR superior to Luke and even FARTHER superior to Dooku, who are superior to Anakin and Obi-Wan, respectively.
 
I think I'm going to vote for Darth Vader due to the different powerscaling in Legends and additional statements which further indicate Darth Vader is significantly stronger than he was as Anakin due to tapping into the dark side. Also, he already knows everything about both his past self and his former master, in terms of fighting style and personalities, which he could easily use to his advantage to manipulate both of them or catch them both off-guard.
 
CiscoTheSoto said:
I think I'm going to vote for Darth Vader due to the different powerscaling in Legends and additional statements which further indicate Darth Vader is significantly stronger than he was as Anakin due to tapping into the dark side. Also, he already knows everything about both his past self and his former master, in terms of fighting style and personalities, which he could easily use to his advantage to manipulate both of them or catch them both off-guard.
Click to expand...
What quotes put Vader over Anakin in legends? There are a wealth of quotes putting Anakin over Vader there as well.
 
hellothere said:
Anakin solo's. Obi Wan solo's
Click to expand...
🤡

this entire fight summarized:
0d0f0707330ed506e22acf39a53512881e81abc9r1-258-194_hq.gif
 
FarerPurple said:
read the arguments.
Click to expand...
Gillard's already confirmed Vader is an inferior fighter to the TPM crew. Placing him below TPM Kenobi who would be eviserated by either prime Obi Wan or Anakin:

What was the most difficult fight sequence in any Star Wars movie?` `The first one, because it had been so long since the last movie. I may have been a bit flippant. I liked the fight with Obi-Wan and Darth Maul, but some seven years on, it's evolved so much. I've taken it so much more seriously. I understand it much better, so once I got to Obi-Wan versus Anakin, I really let it rip. But also keep it so true. On The Phantom Menace, it's the first time we've seen them fight that well. But by this last one, I think we had it in the bag, everybody knew how they should be. Everybody knew how it should look. There's so much pressure as well, because millions of fans also know how it should look, and you've got to try to stay true for them too.
Source: http://www.theforce.net/videogames/story/Nick_Gillard_Talks_ROTS_Game_92147.asp
 
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