Type 4 Acausality: Causality VS Time

[ZephyrosOmega]

Pretty much that.

Why does having a different flow of time grant Type-4 Acausality. From what I'm aware, we treat cause and effect as a separate thing from the progression of time. Equating them for the purposes of causality seems arbitrary.

And before you ask, No this isn't because of Devil May Cry. Multiple verses do this and The verse I'm in charge of revisions for might do it to, so this question is actually somewhat relevant to me.

 

[deonment]

Why does having a different flow of time grant Type-4 Acausality. From what I'm aware, we treat cause and effect as a separate thing from the progression of time. Equating them for the purposes of causality seems arbitrary.

because for most verses casuality is included in the set of time, as it is by time that causality works, so if time works differently it could be assumed that causality does as well

 

[ZephyrosOmega]

But why should that be something that we assume bydefault

 

[Tago238]

Shouldn't. Just a consequence of the VBW system making people force vague ass statements in a box the statements almost imply (but only in concept rather than combat application). Especially in the case of time the writer can mean a lot of things when they come up with a statement like that (hell I know multiple series where the manipulation or absence of time only correlates to visible aging being different).

 

[Tony_di_bugalu]

Implying DMC runs on time only

 

[DarkDragonMedeus]

Time pretty much needs to exist for Causality to exist to begin with.

 

[Tago238]

If you want to argue for that side then respond to my comment instead of the OP because I 1)don’t think the statement alone implies acausality type 4’s specific combat application and 2)think it can fall under multiple interpretations given how variable people’s idea of the nature of time is (I mean hell look at DMC where different flows of time literally involve things ageing differently and nothing else).

Hell even if you wanted to set down a reasonable base assumption of these statements it wouldn’t have anything to do with acausality, it would be related to time dilation; since a different “flow” would more likely be referring to experiencing time differently rather than existing on a different type of time altogether.

 

[Tony_di_bugalu]

(I mean hell look at DMC where different flows of time literally involve things ageing differently and nothing else

I just want to correct this, the flow of time in the demon world is stoped, faster, slower, backwards and one very specific place is outside of time entirely/time doesn't exist.

 

[Cloozuma]

Probs what deonment said, but with context that it's related to Causality.

 

[Tago238]

I just want to correct this, the flow of time in the demon world is stoped, faster, slower, backwards and one very specific place is outside of time entirely/time doesn't exist.

As far as I know some of the places where time is screwed up just causes flowers to age differently, things don't move faster or slower in those places. Hell may I ask what the effect of this one place being timeless actually is? It's a nitpicky point anyway since the unevenness of that wouldn't really mean acausality as it would less be an irregular pattern of cause and effect and more just the interval between events being dilated.

 

[Tony_di_bugalu]

That's just the DMC1 scans, check the demon page. And it isn't because its causing them to age faster directly but time moving differently in each place, something shown in 2.

Its the source of all power, basically what Void Mundus became.

 

[Tago238]

"Its the source of all power, basically what Void Mundus became."
So not much elaboration on the timeless part then.

 

[Tony_di_bugalu]

You asked what the effect was, that's it, it is the source of power and made mundus exist outside of the flow of time

 

[ZephyrosOmega]

tfw i say this isn't about DMC and it pretty much instantly devolves into DMC

 

[Cloozuma]

tfw i say this isn't about DMC and it pretty much instantly devolves into DMC

You caused this

 

[TheGatememer]

So to get this straight, its just the wiki standard that different time flow = Type 4 Acausality?

(had this question too)

 

[TheUnshakableOne]

Wait... if Vsbw accepts Time = Casuality.. does that mean transcending time is Type 5? Am i reading some of the comments here right?

 

[GilverTheProtoAngelo]

Wait... if Vsbw accepts Time = Casuality.. does that mean transcending time is Type 5? Am i reading some of the comments here right?

More like time is congruent in direction and """speed or rate""" then both being equal.

 

[DarkDragonMedeus]

Time =/= Causality; that's like saying Water and Oceans are the same thing. One's technically different as it's an example of the other; Ocean is water, but not all water is the same thing as the Ocean.

It's more like Causality is the study of cause and effect; a cause in the past triggers an event in the future. Which past and future are both temporal directions. So they're not quite the same concept, I merely meant Causality cannot exist without time since there's no cause in the past nor is there a future for an event to take place.