• This forum is strictly intended to be used by members of the VS Battles wiki. Please only register if you have an autoconfirmed account there, as otherwise your registration will be rejected. If you have already registered once, do not do so again, and contact Antvasima if you encounter any problems.

    For instructions regarding the exact procedure to sign up to this forum, please click here.
  • We need Patreon donations for this forum to have all of its running costs financially secured.

    Community members who help us out will receive badges that give them several different benefits, including the removal of all advertisements in this forum, but donations from non-members are also extremely appreciated.

    Please click here for further information, or here to directly visit our Patreon donations page.
  • Please click here for information about a large petition to help children in need.

Giorno's Low 2-C ranking

Monarch_Laciel

Monarch_Laciel

VS Battles
Retired
21,783
4,826
Can someone explain why him breaking Time Skip is Low 2-C to me a little better? The current justification for his rating just seems like power null, rather than having the power to destroy an entire space-time continuum.

Plus, universal in range doesn't mean universal+ in AP, Diavolo is not rated low 2-C with time skip, and he only erases 10 seconds of time, not even an entire universal space time continuum. Why would nulling it be low 2-C?
 
As far as I know, there are statements of the temporal abilities in the JoJoverse, Diavalo's Time-Erase as well as Dio and Jotaro's Time-Stops extending out into space and affecting the whole universe.

I believe that Matt also brought this up on the BB revision thread, but the fact that a character can manipulate time in a universal range or higher doesn't translate into AP at all. You also make good points that the timeline itself isn't ever erased, that's just a range basis.
 
...well...this is probably pretty important considering it's a tier 2 rating and a popular series (although the latter shouldn't have anything to do with this), highlighting for more attention
 
Diavolo erases everything alongside time. I thought it was a visual key at first, but then GER actually restores everything as it was deleted, so Diavolo erases really a 99% since some just stay around time and everything else.

Erase 1
Erase 2
To me it's more why Diavolo's time erase isn't ranked as a separate Low 2-C, I guess. Maybe it's because of the timeframe he uses it in.
 
He's erasing an time itself for seconds at a time from the entire universe, the fact remains that time itself is momentarily erased for everyone and everything.

Of course this doesn't give Diavolo 2-C stats, he can't use it offensively and GER can't punch out a universe or tank a universal attack but he can negate abilities on a scale that can effect entire universes and things that are 2-C in nature including abilitues and powers that effect the space time continuum of said universe.

He himself isn't 2-C but he can nullify things on that scale hence the 2-C via hax only note. Edit: I guess think of the time erase as a low 2-c feat albeit only momentarily and GER scales to it but all the time, I think that makes sense?
 
Affecting the entire universe would refer to the ability's range though, not it's AP. It's also not affecting the entire timeline, but a small window of time.

If it's affecting the Space-Time continuum, it sounds that it would be Power Negation of Space-Time Manipulation on a Universal range, not Low 2-C hax itself as an entire timeline isn't getting affected.
 
The universe is several billions years old. Meaning that there are several hundreds of quintillions seconds. So 10 seconds of a universe are something like the 0.000000000000001% of the baseline requirement for Low 2-C. Pretty sure that this is High 3-A
 
@J-Man That would still mean that it's just Causality Manipulation with that universal range, it doesn't imply a Low 2-C status at all.

  • Universe level+: ("Low 2-C") This is for characters who can destroy and/or create the entire 4-dimensional space-time of one universe, not just the physical matter within one. For example, an entire timeline.
The site's description of a Low 2-C character is above. GER does not meet the description of what it's judged by. It does not affect the entire spacetime contiuum with its abilities, as it does not affect the entire timeline. Thus, it shouldn't be ranked there.
 
It's more like GER has some Low 2-C hax, rather than destroy the universe itself.

Diavalo: Erases time from 10 seconds. During these 10 seconds, the present literally doesn't exist.

GER: Nullifies Diavolo's attack and regenerates time back into existence.

I get the argument of "Oh, but he didn't destroy 10,000,000,000 years worth of time", but would that really be more impressive? I ask because time is made out of infinitely small instants.
 
It's made out of infinitely small instants, but those instants are only 3-A in their own right (they are the universe the way we perceive it). The amount of instants is what changes the feat.

The 4D hypervolume of a timeline is 3D volume x age= Low 2-C.

If one of the two factors become smaller, be it volume or time, the result would be lower than baseline Low 2-C, but still 4D, so it would be High 3-A.

In our case we have: 3D volume x 10 seconds, so it would be lower than Low 2-C, because the amount of time is lower
 
On a side note, GER's range is multi-dimensional/universal considering he sent Diavolo through countless parralel worlds with at least a few shown if we're gonna bring range into this.
 
Did it send him to parallel ones or did it makes the ones where he infinitely dies in? They never really specify that, he just kind of dies forever.
 
Who knows, we know at least a few of them are parallel worlds and not different places on earth, but then again dimension travel wasn't touched upon untill part 7 so we dont got anything concrete on if he was sent it they were created, so him making the world's or him sending them there is anyone's guess.
 
I think that one needs to destroy all of the continuum to be Low 2-C. That's what the tiering system page says.

Affecting universal time-space it's usually enough because it can be assumed to be the continuum, but here we know that it's just a minimal portion of it.

why all the interesting debates start when I need to sleep
 
@Matt I'm a bit confused then because the description says it applies to a whole timeline to qualify. How is GER's not just hax with that level of range?
 
what would be the difference between GER infinitely reset-ing Diavolo in parallel worlds and infinitely reset-ing Diavolo in multiple universes?Aren't parallel worlds the same thing as Multiple universes? Because if there is a difference then the only stand we know that works with parallel worlds in JJBA is Funny Valentine and those parallel worlds are almost identical to the real universe with minor differences so if GER sends people to parallel worlds as well then that would mean only slight differences would occur but we know thats not the case seeing as he gets send to completely different places(from the originalverse/world) with different times(day or night) and "dies" in 3(iirc) different ways showing that GER's "parallel worlds" doesn't follow the same laws as D4C's parallel worlds or that GER doesn't send people to a parallel world but rather to another universe.

And if there isnt a difference between the two then shouldn't Giorno's range be Multiversal+ for affecting time by reset-ing Diavolo's death at specific periods of time in each reset (for instance looping Diavolo's stabbing death at specific points in time in each universe)? someone help me out here
 
time is being erased it's just that everything that happens in between the time erase doesn't happen, shoot a gun>erase next 10 seconds>bullet is in target.You're thinking of something different like, erase next 10 seconds>shoot bullet>bullet in target maybe?
 
KoichiSamakibara said:
Time itself isn't really being erased as everything that's supposed to happen, still happens. But the victims remember none of it.
Click to expand...
No, it is explicitely erased.

The 10 seconds between now and the 10 seconds from now are erased, simply gone. Giorno regenerated time.
 
I also thought that an entire space-time continuum or timeline had to be affected to qualify for Low 2-C.
 
@Ant

I guess? But I don't think that destroying a universe automatically equates to destroying the universe across all points in time.
 
I am uncertain about where to place deleting just part of a timeline. I will ask DarkLK.
 
Dienomite22 said:
time is being erased it's just that everything that happens in between the time erase doesn't happen, shoot a gun>erase next 10 seconds>bullet is in target.You're thinking of something different like, erase next 10 seconds>shoot bullet>bullet in target maybe?
Click to expand...
Sometimes I feel like that's what happens. But it might have been because Araki didn't really specify KC's power in the beggining and only elaborated upon them in the later arcs of the manga perhaps?
 
If characters that are one with the universe throughout spacetime are ranked as 2C, then I suppose erasing a small fragment of spacetime doesn't exactly qualify as a 2C, but at the same time 3A doesn't really make much more sense either to me... if all else fails we can just use the argument of "It just works"
 
Well of course, how does At least High 3-A sound? Considering it was no effort to null what is now agreed as High 3-A feat for KC's erase but low 2-c being above what was shown, so a middle ground I guess?
 
I'm fine with High 3-A if that's what it comes down to.

does that mean i dont have to ask people to unlock his page when i need to fix something

@Matt

The only thing that people will scale from in GER is the Acausality benefit.
 
"At least High 3-A" might be an idea, yes.
 
If High 3-A is what DarkLK and others here are fine with, i have no objections to it.

Of course, we probably have to reword it the reasoning for them probably.
 
On a side note since this is basically a GER revision. And I don't remember if I brought it up before but, in the manga when GE got stabbed with the arrow it caused a giant hole in Giorno's chest and King Crimson followed up by punching the soon to be GER in the head causing Giorno's head to split, spray blood and his eyes to turn white/roll back and lose consciousness yet a page later when GER appears all wounds, both inflicted by the arrow and King Crimson are gone and Giorno is fine hovering in the air. What do we make of this and would it add anything to his profile or is it already covered.
 
Actually, I want to talk about this since this is a GER revision.

Ger shot
GER shot energy at Diavolo. He never had anything in his hand. What would this add?
 
You must log in or register to reply here.

Similar threads

Goshtama
Low 2-C | Finite or Infinite Timelines?
Replies
1
Views
950
Richard5128pm
Richard5128pm
Sakimori889
Can AP L2-C negation LGR & MGR?
Replies
5
Views
1K
TWILIGHT-OP
TWILIGHT-OP
TheOrangeGuy09
How do time axises work?
Replies
3
Views
1K
TheOrangeGuy09
TheOrangeGuy09
DRW001
GER - Non-existent interaction and Pseudo NEP (Nature Type 1, Aspect Types 1, 3 and 5) (staff votes pls)
2
Replies
58
Views
4K
WyattR612
WyattR612
ProfessorKukui4Life
Big Bang Questions & Clarifications
Replies
36
Views
4K
William_Joee
William_Joee
Back
Top