- 22,335
- 18,520
Note: Devilman in general is very heavy on nudity and violence. Also, this might make it confusing but I'm going to refer to Satan as "they/them/their/they're" since they're a hermaphrodite. Satan is technically intersex male, but it's easier to differentiate from everyone else with male pronouns. In Gekiman! Satan is also called a "creature of two genders."
Satan Isn't Comparable to God
Devilman (Original)/Devilman Lady
In the original Devilman manga, Satan never fights God without assistance and is never portrayed as comparable. In their war before the existence of humanity, Satan leads an ark-like structure composed of various demons (you can see them here) against God. Satan also confirms they fought alongside the Demons.
In Devilman Lady, Satan and Michael (who has the same abilities as Sata) are explicitly called the left and right hands of God, rather than being treated like equals. Akira also calls Lucifer "the closest to God", not a direct rival in power with equal status, although he admits in the previous scan that he knows practically nothing about the latter and it could refer to status.
According to Akira and Dante, it was Sata (fused with Zenno) who fought directly against God and has equal power. If anything, this would scale to Zennon himself, since it's explicitly stated he possessed Lucifer.
Anime Incarnations
In the opening of Devilman: The Birth, Lucifer—much like his manga counterpart—never fights God directly, only warring against his forces with the the Demons. Here, it's actually even more explicit than the manga.
Devilman The Birth - Opening
In Devilman Crybaby, Satan is soundly defeated and banished from Earth.
They didn't even win the war like other incarnations. They're simply obliterated (but not killed) along with all the other Demons, which happens again at the end of the series.
Devilman Crybaby final scene (sub ENG)
History
In the original manga, God is never refered to as having created the entire universe, just the Earth. In Devilman Lady, Akira is also unsure if God even created the universe. To be clear, Akira not knowing isn't evidence that God didn't create the universe, just that we never know if he did.
In Devilman Lady, God did not create an alternate timeline, he changed the original. There's also no evidence that one God even produced ever alternate timeline. On the contrary, they've all been portrayed diffferently, God in Devilman Crybaby and the OVA, for example, is portrayed as host of angels, while the one from the manga is a singular entity or the fusion of multiple angels. Different gods also exist in Devilman, such as the Greek gods, who were there before the universe was solidified, and Indian as well as Sumarian.
Cosmology
In the Devilman Lady continuity (which takes place before Devilman Saga), Hell is an alternate reality that overlaps the material universe and is structured in a similar manner to the Inferno from The Divine Comedy. Earth is directly described as a higher level than Hell, and it's implied Heaven is above both. The lowest level is said to be separated by a transdimensional barrier, but the terms transdimensional and interdimensional are often used interchangeably in fiction.
The 5-D statements come from Devilman Saga, but there's still a problem with this. The armour isn't called 5-D, it's stated to be made from 5-D matter. Hell itself is 5-D, but it's not portrayed as qualitatively superior. The wiki already takes this statement with a massive grain of salt, anyway.
In Devilman G, Hell is a place where time doesn't flow. It was created by the universe here, not God.
Miscellaneous Revisions
Akira (OG Manga)
Even nameless Demons, who appear in every city on Earth as part of their first wave of attacks, ca one-shot tanks—even throwing them hard enough to destroy portions of buildings—blow up houses, divert fighter planes in flight, blow up radar towers and burst right through streets. According to Ryo, these are fodder Demons minions conducting a suicide tactic to possess people at random just so they can create terror and deal as much damage as possible.
For reference, the Sabbath parties at the start of the series only attract high-level demons, and they'd need to be capable of killing whole groups of them to be a serious threat. Akira also grossly outclassed Agwell and Ghelmer in his human, both of whom were powerful demons summoned to defeat Devilman.
According to Kiyoshi Nagai, Devilman grew stronger during his battle with the Demons. Also, both Devilman and Satan have a High Hypersonic feat, as they both reached space. For reference, Agira and Caliorruar were both on the ground when Satan and Devilman left, and later moved into space on their own. So Satan and Devilman did move into space under their own power and speed.
In Shin Devilman, which is unfortunately canon to original, Devilman increases in size and summons a massive storm that clearly has lightning, this requires a minimum of 9.63982388237265 Megatons. Sirene herself could also make a similar storm, so this is fairly consistent. So everyone except Zennon, Psycho Jenny and Satan should be downgraded from At least City level to just City level.
Violence Jack
The same earthquake that destroyed El Dorado was strong enough to shatter cliffs and buildings. It was also described as "unprecedented" and the second apocalypse of Kanto. For reference, Japan accounts for around 20 percent of earthquakes around the world with an average of magnitude 6.0 or more, so this should be at least Town level.
Ryo/Satan (Original)
His base form should not be City level. Firstly, Ryo only damaged Sirene with a shotgu, so this is likely sharpness=/=blunt force durability. Secondly, she completely fodderized Ryo with her iron claws. Third, he considers even extremely weak demons to be a massive threat that requires fusing with demons to defeat. Fourth, Ryo was hosplitalized by a demon merely falling on him. And lastly, he's explicitly much weaker than Devilman's human form.
This form should be Unknow or not exist at all, probably the latter. It's possible he is City level after realizing he's Satan, but this is never shown and the current justifications are highly innaccurate.
On Satan's page it says "Light Manipulation and Transmutation (Covered Russia in a light that turned everything to salt)," "Plant Manipulation (His light made plants flourish)," and "Death Manipulation (Can induce death by merging to those who have reason, though this requires him to die as well, and as leader of demons he should be able to do so despite being an Angel)". The first one was God, not Satan, and the second event literally never happened in any canon material, and the last one is just overpowering beings by possessing them, not death manipulation.
Conclusion
Devilman (Original):
Attack Potency: Small Building level (Superior to Agwell and Ghelmer, both of whom should be far more powerful than fodder demons capable of effortlessly destroying tanks and houses, and were summoned specifically for the purpose of defeating Devilman) | City level (Casually summoned a thunderstorm, and is superior to Sirene who could do the same by merely flapping her wings. Grew even more powerful during his battle with the demons )
Speed: SuperHuman (Superior to Gosu who can dodge hunting rifles) | High Hypersonic (Escaped the Earth's orbit during his battle with Sata)
Satan (Original):
Attack Potency: At least City level, likely Multi-Continent level (Superior to Zenno, accidentally bisected Devilma with a single blast. Stated that he created ice age on purpose to hibernate), possibly far higher (Part of the Demon Lord, who is comparable in power to God, who in turn created the Earth)
Speed: High Hypersonic (Escaped the Earth's orbit during his battle with Devilma)
These were discussed below
Devilman (Composite):
Attack Potency: At least Town level (Created an earthquake of an "unprecedented scale" to destroy El Dorado, meaning it should be superior to a common magnitude 6.0 which accounts for 20% of earthquakes in Japa) | At least Planet level, likely far higher (Defeated both Satan and Zennon in the Violence Jack timeline)
Satan (Composite):
Attack Potency: At least Planet level (Part of the Demon Lord, who is comparable in power to God, who in turn created the Earth. Destroyed the moo and caused great destruction to the Earth during the course of his battle with Devilman. Recreated the Earth in the Violence Jack timeline, and can warp it with his mood alone), likely far higher (Sent the Sun's corona to an alternate dimension). Most of his attacks ignore conventional durability
Satan Isn't Comparable to God
Devilman (Original)/Devilman Lady
In the original Devilman manga, Satan never fights God without assistance and is never portrayed as comparable. In their war before the existence of humanity, Satan leads an ark-like structure composed of various demons (you can see them here) against God. Satan also confirms they fought alongside the Demons.
In Devilman Lady, Satan and Michael (who has the same abilities as Sata) are explicitly called the left and right hands of God, rather than being treated like equals. Akira also calls Lucifer "the closest to God", not a direct rival in power with equal status, although he admits in the previous scan that he knows practically nothing about the latter and it could refer to status.
According to Akira and Dante, it was Sata (fused with Zenno) who fought directly against God and has equal power. If anything, this would scale to Zennon himself, since it's explicitly stated he possessed Lucifer.
Anime Incarnations
In the opening of Devilman: The Birth, Lucifer—much like his manga counterpart—never fights God directly, only warring against his forces with the the Demons. Here, it's actually even more explicit than the manga.
Devilman The Birth - Opening
In Devilman Crybaby, Satan is soundly defeated and banished from Earth.
.png "Screenshot (1811)")
.png "Screenshot (1813)")
.png "Screenshot (1816)")
They didn't even win the war like other incarnations. They're simply obliterated (but not killed) along with all the other Demons, which happens again at the end of the series.
.png "Screenshot (1817)")
.png "Screenshot (1818)")
.png "Screenshot (1819)")
.png "Screenshot (1820)")
.png "Screenshot (1821)")
.png "Screenshot (1822)")
Devilman Crybaby final scene (sub ENG)
- Tako (Devilman): The Revelation—the god of demons—Satan lost his body in the war with the Lord. After an eternity, he rose from nothing and led a demon army that brought hell from the sky. Yet the army of God defeated them once more.
History
In the original manga, God is never refered to as having created the entire universe, just the Earth. In Devilman Lady, Akira is also unsure if God even created the universe. To be clear, Akira not knowing isn't evidence that God didn't create the universe, just that we never know if he did.
In Devilman Lady, God did not create an alternate timeline, he changed the original. There's also no evidence that one God even produced ever alternate timeline. On the contrary, they've all been portrayed diffferently, God in Devilman Crybaby and the OVA, for example, is portrayed as host of angels, while the one from the manga is a singular entity or the fusion of multiple angels. Different gods also exist in Devilman, such as the Greek gods, who were there before the universe was solidified, and Indian as well as Sumarian.
Cosmology
In the Devilman Lady continuity (which takes place before Devilman Saga), Hell is an alternate reality that overlaps the material universe and is structured in a similar manner to the Inferno from The Divine Comedy. Earth is directly described as a higher level than Hell, and it's implied Heaven is above both. The lowest level is said to be separated by a transdimensional barrier, but the terms transdimensional and interdimensional are often used interchangeably in fiction.
The 5-D statements come from Devilman Saga, but there's still a problem with this. The armour isn't called 5-D, it's stated to be made from 5-D matter. Hell itself is 5-D, but it's not portrayed as qualitatively superior. The wiki already takes this statement with a massive grain of salt, anyway.
In Devilman G, Hell is a place where time doesn't flow. It was created by the universe here, not God.
Miscellaneous Revisions
Akira (OG Manga)
Even nameless Demons, who appear in every city on Earth as part of their first wave of attacks, ca one-shot tanks—even throwing them hard enough to destroy portions of buildings—blow up houses, divert fighter planes in flight, blow up radar towers and burst right through streets. According to Ryo, these are fodder Demons minions conducting a suicide tactic to possess people at random just so they can create terror and deal as much damage as possible.
For reference, the Sabbath parties at the start of the series only attract high-level demons, and they'd need to be capable of killing whole groups of them to be a serious threat. Akira also grossly outclassed Agwell and Ghelmer in his human, both of whom were powerful demons summoned to defeat Devilman.
According to Kiyoshi Nagai, Devilman grew stronger during his battle with the Demons. Also, both Devilman and Satan have a High Hypersonic feat, as they both reached space. For reference, Agira and Caliorruar were both on the ground when Satan and Devilman left, and later moved into space on their own. So Satan and Devilman did move into space under their own power and speed.
In Shin Devilman, which is unfortunately canon to original, Devilman increases in size and summons a massive storm that clearly has lightning, this requires a minimum of 9.63982388237265 Megatons. Sirene herself could also make a similar storm, so this is fairly consistent. So everyone except Zennon, Psycho Jenny and Satan should be downgraded from At least City level to just City level.
Violence Jack
The same earthquake that destroyed El Dorado was strong enough to shatter cliffs and buildings. It was also described as "unprecedented" and the second apocalypse of Kanto. For reference, Japan accounts for around 20 percent of earthquakes around the world with an average of magnitude 6.0 or more, so this should be at least Town level.
Ryo/Satan (Original)
His base form should not be City level. Firstly, Ryo only damaged Sirene with a shotgu, so this is likely sharpness=/=blunt force durability. Secondly, she completely fodderized Ryo with her iron claws. Third, he considers even extremely weak demons to be a massive threat that requires fusing with demons to defeat. Fourth, Ryo was hosplitalized by a demon merely falling on him. And lastly, he's explicitly much weaker than Devilman's human form.
This form should be Unknow or not exist at all, probably the latter. It's possible he is City level after realizing he's Satan, but this is never shown and the current justifications are highly innaccurate.
On Satan's page it says "Light Manipulation and Transmutation (Covered Russia in a light that turned everything to salt)," "Plant Manipulation (His light made plants flourish)," and "Death Manipulation (Can induce death by merging to those who have reason, though this requires him to die as well, and as leader of demons he should be able to do so despite being an Angel)". The first one was God, not Satan, and the second event literally never happened in any canon material, and the last one is just overpowering beings by possessing them, not death manipulation.
Conclusion
Devilman (Original):
Attack Potency: Small Building level (Superior to Agwell and Ghelmer, both of whom should be far more powerful than fodder demons capable of effortlessly destroying tanks and houses, and were summoned specifically for the purpose of defeating Devilman) | City level (Casually summoned a thunderstorm, and is superior to Sirene who could do the same by merely flapping her wings. Grew even more powerful during his battle with the demons )
Speed: SuperHuman (Superior to Gosu who can dodge hunting rifles) | High Hypersonic (Escaped the Earth's orbit during his battle with Sata)
Satan (Original):
Attack Potency: At least City level, likely Multi-Continent level (Superior to Zenno, accidentally bisected Devilma with a single blast. Stated that he created ice age on purpose to hibernate), possibly far higher (Part of the Demon Lord, who is comparable in power to God, who in turn created the Earth)
Speed: High Hypersonic (Escaped the Earth's orbit during his battle with Devilma)
These were discussed below
Devilman (Composite):
Attack Potency: At least Town level (Created an earthquake of an "unprecedented scale" to destroy El Dorado, meaning it should be superior to a common magnitude 6.0 which accounts for 20% of earthquakes in Japa) | At least Planet level, likely far higher (Defeated both Satan and Zennon in the Violence Jack timeline)
Satan (Composite):
Attack Potency: At least Planet level (Part of the Demon Lord, who is comparable in power to God, who in turn created the Earth. Destroyed the moo and caused great destruction to the Earth during the course of his battle with Devilman. Recreated the Earth in the Violence Jack timeline, and can warp it with his mood alone), likely far higher (Sent the Sun's corona to an alternate dimension). Most of his attacks ignore conventional durability
