Doomguy 2-A removal

[Profound_Euphoria]

Hello. So here https://vsbattles.fandom.com/wiki/Doomguy it is stated that doomguy is 2-A pretty much because he defeated Davoth. The problem is, Davoth was stripped of all of his power by the time he fought slayer. In fact, it was claimed that when Davoth started abusing his primeval power by subjugating Jekkad and turned into the dark lord, The Father tore his entire life sphere from him, removing his power as a primeval and only leaving the bare minimum. Here's the entire instance detailed by the book of seraphs.

"Book of Seraphs - Part VIII"

"Believing Jekkad rejected by their creator, hate grew within Davoth. Jekkad fell further into inequity as Davoth consumed all the realm in pursuit of his goals, and the Father sorrowfully sealed Jekkad away from the other realms. The Primeval, created to protect and shepherd the people of his realm, stoked an eternal fury toward the Father as more of his people fell to mortality. He became the Dark Lord and raged against the walls of Jekkad."

"The Father sensed this and knew they both needed to leave the physical realms before their warring lieutenants tore creation apart. It was then that the Father returned to Jekkad, now called Hell by many. Atop the Pyramid of the Lost where Hell once worshipped the Father, as the skies split and Hell trembled, the Father ripped the Dark Lord's life sphere from his chest. He placed it in the Tomb of Souls, unwilling to obliterate the Dark Lord's essence entirely as he had favored Davoth once."

"Samur then took the Father's life sphere to the Luminarium, and for a time, there was a stillness in creation. But now the Dark Lord whispers lies and deceptions about the Father to his praying minions in Hell, while he rages, trapped in the Tomb of Souls. For even without a physical form, gods may yet influence the realms."

Book of Seraphs - Part XI

"The Seraphs remember that when the Dark Lord's lifeless body tumbled down the Pyramid of the Lost, Samur begged the Father to crush the Dark Lord's life sphere. Samur saw that they could destroy the Dark Lord's very essence so that he would brood no more against the Father."

"The Father refused. The Dark Lord was his creation. It was better to leave Hell contained, with the Dark Lord reduced to whispers."

"If it came to pass that the Dark Lord were ever reincarnated in physical form only another Primeval, or something more powerful, could slay him. Once vanquished in this manner, the Dark Lord could no longer rule Hell. Stripped of a Primeval's bindings to the realm it was forged in, it would be scattered across the stars. Any denizens of Hell not inside the realm's borders would die as they lost their connection to the very reality the Father designed them for."

So given the circumstances, Doomguy's victory over Davoth should not be regarded as a multiversal feat because Davoth was no longer at the height of his power, like a shell of his former self. In addition, entities crossing over to dimensions, not the power of doomguy and davoth, was what was causing the multiverse to crumble. The multiverse going into that state is a natural occurrence of entities crossing over to dimensions, not the result of anyone's innate power

"Within the hub of the Doom Slayer's chamber. VEGA monitors quantum abberations with great interest. As the forces of Hell and Urdak collide with the mortal realm, the tenuous order of reality begins to fragment, signaling the dawn of a new age of chaos."

"A dedicated portion of VEGA's simulation matrix observes, records and analyzes these dimensional abnormablities as VEGA attempts to comprehend their meaning. Processing a veritable kaleidoscope of hyperfluxual phenomena, VEGA observes what may very well be the result of the multiverse imploding on itself, where countless battles are fought between the Doom Slayer and demonkind."

"To further explore this anomaly, VEGA has designed an onboard omni-contextual interface, an interdimenional man-machine gateway that allow the Slayer to engage in these skmirshes directly. As the Slayer enters the gateway, his surroundings take the form of an arena, in tandem with the arrival of adversaries ready for battle Seemingly extracted from the data of his experiences, the opponents the Slayer faces are familiar but now transformed by some unseen force."

"With further analysis Vega observed ephemeral distortions within the fabric of reality; scrambled reflections of the physical world. As the slayer interacts with this anomoly, a peculiar ripple in the anomaly's composition emerges, seemingly reacting to the Slayer's presence reflexively. The anomoly reshapes itself, calibrating itself to the Slayer, responding to his memory, ancestral, and memetic data, before ultimately projecting itself onto the Slayer himself"

Also, here: https://vsbattles.fandom.com/wiki/Samur_Maykr it is stated that samur is 2-A for absorbing the father. This is not true. Samur Maykr did NOT absorb the father's life sphere, doomguy destroys it which is the reason Samur started screaming in pain and agony because he was undergoing transfiguration. The only way for samur to prevent this was WITH the restoration of The Father, which is why doomguy was TASKED to destroy it.

To conclude, I do not believe that doomguy or samur's profiles qualifies for a 2-A rating and nothing even remotely close to it when taking further context into consideration. I have to go to work shortly so I'll be able to elaborate more if needed

 

[Confluctor]

...........Even as someone who is quite unfamiliar with the verse, this is just blatantly wrong.

 

[DarkDragonMedeus]

This was already attempted and rejected, and while Davoth has lost some power, he hasn't lost enough to make him infinitely weaker. Furthermore, he still upscales from Samur Makyr, who literally violently shook the multiverse in his conflict with the Father.

 

[Profound_Euphoria]

This was already attempted and rejected, and while Davoth has lost some power, he hasn't lost enough to make him infinitely weaker. Furthermore, he still upscales from Samur Makyr, who literally violently shook the multiverse in his conflict with the Father.

First off, not all objections to a profile should be discounted just because one individual was turned down in the past. Secondly, He did lose enough to weaken him to the point that it is unnecessary to scale him to 2-A. The father, a maykr, stole his energy and as a result, davoth lost nearly everything.. To be able to handle the maykrs, Davoth needed slayer's help. That's a significant change from the god killer that he used to be

Can you give further details on this "violently shaking the multiverse" feat? Because according to what I've read, the multiverse entering this state was caused by entities traveling between dimensions rather than by their sheer power

 

[Transcending]

Ok this is wrong on so many levels.

The problem is, Davoth was stripped of all of his power by the time he fought slayer. In fact, it was claimed that when Davoth started abusing his primeval power by subjugating Jekkad and turned into the dark lord, The Father tore his entire life sphere from him, removing his power as a primeval and only leaving the bare minimum. Here's the entire instance detailed by the book of seraphs.

This is wrong, Davoth wasn't weakened, credits to @Gewsbumpz_dude for this. Davoth's power is connected to him having a physical body:

Book of the Seraphs - Part VIII:

“

The Father sensed this and knew they both needed to leave the physical realms before their warring lieutenants tore creation apart. It was then that the Father returned to Jekkad, now called Hell by many. Atop the Pyramid of the Lost where Hell once worshipped the Father, as the skies split and Hell trembled, the Father ripped the Dark Lord's life sphere from his chest. He placed it in the Tomb of Souls, unwilling to obliterate the Dark Lord's essence entirely as he had favored Davoth once. Samur then took the Father's life sphere to the Luminarium, and for a time, there was a stillness in creation. But now the Dark Lord whispers lies and deceptions about the Father to his praying minions in Hell, while he rages, trapped in the Tomb of Souls. For even without a physical form, gods may yet influence the realms.

„

Davoth's power was greatly diminished after losing his physical body to the Father. This is further shown in The Tainted Prophecy.

The Tainted Prophecy:

“

It was believed by cultist members of the UAC that the creation of the Slayer was guided in secret by the Dark Lord himself. He did it to destroy the Maykrs and their world as punishment, his hope to exact revenge on the servant race who had betrayed him. Even without a physical form the Dark Lord can still have a powerful influence, especially against ones susceptible to corruption. He touched the mind of the Khan Maykr, leader of the Maykr race, convincing her that there was a "chosen one" who would threaten her rule. The Khan set out to find him - paranoid, afraid of this potential hidden threat the Dark Lord convinced her was close. She would do anything to find and destroy the hidden Beast.

„

It is further hammered in that Primevals are at the peak of their power when they have a physical form by this quote from The Father in The Ancient Gods Part I;

“

It is clear that I am what was known as The Father. While I have indefinite access and understanding of this world's systems. I lack the control over them necessary to remove the demons and re-seal the Void. Without a physical form I am merely a presence. I have no recollection of myself - I beliueve my essence from the sphere could return me to my full faculties

„

Lastly, a full-powered Primeval or something more powerful is needed to slay Davoth if he ever gains physical form ever again. Implying that physical body = full power.

Book of the Seraphs - Part XI:

“

If it came to pass that the Dark Lord were ever reincarnated in physical form only another Primeval, or something more powerful, could slay him. Once vanquished in this manner, the Dark Lord could no longer rule Hell. Stripped of a Primeval's bindings to the realm it was forged in, it would be scattered across the stars. Any denizens of Hell not inside the realm's borders would die as they lost their connection to the very reality the Father designed them for.

„

So given all of this, we can deduce that the power of a Primeval is reliant on them having a physical form and if the body is cut out of the equation, the Primeval will be significantly weakened, "reduced to whispers" as the scan above puts it. Of course, we fight Davoth in his physical form, meaning Doomguy would scale and to say otherwise would be ignoring how he lost his power to begin with.

In addition, entities crossing over to dimensions, NOT the power of doomguy and davoth, was what was causing the multiverse to crumble. The multiverse going into that state is a natural occurrence of entities crossing over to dimensions, not the result of anyone's innate power

Your scan doesn't say that, all it say is that Hell and Urdak colliding with the mortal realm was breaking the tenuous order of reality and then that the clash between Doomguy and the demons was destroying a Multiverse.

 

[Gewsbumpz_dude]

Disagree FRA.

Also;

Also, here: https://vsbattles.fandom.com/wiki/Samur_Maykr it is stated that samur is 2-A for absorbing the father. This is not true. Samur Maykr did NOT absorb the father's life sphere, doomguy destroys it which is the reason Samur started screaming in pain and agony because he was undergoing transfiguration. The only way for samur to prevent this was WITH the restoration of The Father, which is why doomguy was TASKED to destroy it.

Kinda weird you say that, even though you can clearly see the yellow stuff from the sphere emit from his body, as if he absorbed it.

 

[Axxtentacle]

At literally no point in this does it state the Father actually absorbed Davoth's former power, just an fyi. It being stolen from him doesn't mean the father absorbed it. He beat him and ripped his life sphere out, which took his ability to use his power. The Father was never stated to have taken anything from the sphere, never stated to have absorbed the power Davoth had at the time, or anything. It's just some random headcanon that keeps being brought up for downgrades.

And, yes, your thread really can just get closed for using arguments that were used for a downgrade and rejected already. You did bring more random unrelated info to try to prove your point, though, so I guess I have to respond.

I'll respond to each individual point anyway, even though this feels incredibly not worth it lmao

Hello. So here https://vsbattles.fandom.com/wiki/Doomguy it is stated that doomguy is 2-A pretty much because he defeated Davoth. The problem is, Davoth was stripped of all of his power by the time he fought slayer. In fact, it was claimed that when Davoth started abusing his primeval power by subjugating Jekkad and turned into the dark lord, The Father tore his entire life sphere from him, removing his power as a primeval and only leaving the bare minimum. Here's the entire instance detailed by the book of seraphs.

"Book of Seraphs - Part VIII"

"Believing Jekkad rejected by their creator, hate grew within Davoth. Jekkad fell further into inequity as Davoth consumed all the realm in pursuit of his goals, and the Father sorrowfully sealed Jekkad away from the other realms. The Primeval, created to protect and shepherd the people of his realm, stoked an eternal fury toward the Father as more of his people fell to mortality. He became the Dark Lord and raged against the walls of Jekkad."

"The Father sensed this and knew they both needed to leave the physical realms before their warring lieutenants tore creation apart. It was then that the Father returned to Jekkad, now called Hell by many. Atop the Pyramid of the Lost where Hell once worshipped the Father, as the skies split and Hell trembled, the Father ripped the Dark Lord's life sphere from his chest. He placed it in the Tomb of Souls, unwilling to obliterate the Dark Lord's essence entirely as he had favored Davoth once."

So he got his life sphere ripped out, taking him out of his physical form, which is how he lost his power. He regained said physical form when we resurrect him, allowing him to have his power as a Primeval again.

"Samur then took the Father's life sphere to the Luminarium, and for a time, there was a stillness in creation. But now the Dark Lord whispers lies and deceptions about the Father to his praying minions in Hell, while he rages, trapped in the Tomb of Souls. For even without a physical form, gods may yet influence the realms."

Book of Seraphs - Part XI

"The Seraphs remember that when the Dark Lord's lifeless body tumbled down the Pyramid of the Lost, Samur begged the Father to crush the Dark Lord's life sphere. Samur saw that they could destroy the Dark Lord's very essence so that he would brood no more against the Father."

"The Father refused. The Dark Lord was his creation. It was better to leave Hell contained, with the Dark Lord reduced to whispers."

"If it came to pass that the Dark Lord were ever reincarnated in physical form only another Primeval, or something more powerful, could slay him. Once vanquished in this manner, the Dark Lord could no longer rule Hell. Stripped of a Primeval's bindings to the realm it was forged in, it would be scattered across the stars. Any denizens of Hell not inside the realm's borders would die as they lost their connection to the very reality the Father designed them for."

So given the circumstances, Doomguy's victory over Davoth should not be regarded as a multiversal feat because Davoth was no longer at the height of his power, like a shell of his former self. In addition, entities crossing over to dimensions, not the power of doomguy and davoth, was what was causing the multiverse to crumble. The multiverse going into that state is a natural occurrence of entities crossing over to dimensions, not the result of anyone's innate power

"Within the hub of the Doom Slayer's chamber. VEGA monitors quantum abberations with great interest. As the forces of Hell and Urdak collide with the mortal realm, the tenuous order of reality begins to fragment, signaling the dawn of a new age of chaos."

"A dedicated portion of VEGA's simulation matrix observes, records and analyzes these dimensional abnormablities as VEGA attempts to comprehend their meaning. Processing a veritable kaleidoscope of hyperfluxual phenomena, VEGA observes what may very well be the result of the multiverse imploding on itself, where countless battles are fought between the Doom Slayer and demonkind."

"To further explore this anomaly, VEGA has designed an onboard omni-contextual interface, an interdimenional man-machine gateway that allow the Slayer to engage in these skmirshes directly. As the Slayer enters the gateway, his surroundings take the form of an arena, in tandem with the arrival of adversaries ready for battle Seemingly extracted from the data of his experiences, the opponents the Slayer faces are familiar but now transformed by some unseen force."

"With further analysis Vega observed ephemeral distortions within the fabric of reality; scrambled reflections of the physical world. As the slayer interacts with this anomoly, a peculiar ripple in the anomaly's composition emerges, seemingly reacting to the Slayer's presence reflexively. The anomoly reshapes itself, calibrating itself to the Slayer, responding to his memory, ancestral, and memetic data, before ultimately projecting itself onto the Slayer himself"

Genuinely, none of these other pieces of information mean anything. I don't know why you bothered putting them here. It's just bloating and agitating to read.

Also, here: https://vsbattles.fandom.com/wiki/Samur_Maykr it is stated that samur is 2-A for absorbing the father. This is not true. Samur Maykr did NOT absorb the father's life sphere, doomguy destroys it which is the reason Samur started screaming in pain and agony because he was undergoing transfiguration. The only way for samur to prevent this was WITH the restoration of The Father, which is why doomguy was TASKED to destroy it.

We talked about this in the thread. Our reasoning was because the life sphere got destroyed, and yellow energy seemingly went into Samur Maykr. There wouldn't have been any other source for it besides the essence in the sphere, & the Kahn Maykr didn't have that kind of a reaction despite transfiguring mid fight, or the yellow energy. Also, every Life Sphere destroyed (Davoth & the Kahn Maykr) has released energy. For Davoth, it flew up and the energy blasted out around it. For Kahn Maykr, it blew up and caused the storm in Urdak. And we see the energy of the life sphere seemingly start emitting from Samur, right after the sphere was destroyed, and it's supposed to be a sign of transfiguration even though the Kahn Maykr's transfiguration didn't have those effects? Occam's Razor, man.

To conclude, I do not believe that doomguy or samur's profiles qualifies for a 2-A rating and nothing even remotely close to it when taking further context into consideration. I have to go to work shortly so I'll be able to elaborate more if needed

Ok.

I would genuinely love for people to stop assuming the father absorbed the power, or assuming the power just went poof when it's stated he lost it because he lost his physical form, because his life sphere was ripped out. Which was the whole point that him getting his physical form back was so bad. Because he would get his power back.

 

[Transcending]

Also just putting it out there that "power", doesn't necessarily refer to strength

It can also refer to authority, which would match the canon much more since we know that after defeating Davoth, the Father basically took control of everything. The Father stole Davoth's power and name as in, he stole Davoth's authority over the Multiverse.

 

[Profound_Euphoria]

This is wrong, Davoth wasn't weakened, credits to @Gewsbumpz_dude for this. Davoth's power is connected to him having a physical body:

That stands in stark contrast to what Davoth established as eternal was drawing to a close. When the maykrs learned about how to achieve immortality, they feared that this information was too dangerous for davoth to know so they sealed off Jekkad. This pissed davoth off and eventually turned jekkad into this Hell.

Book of Seraphs - Part 1​

" Foreseeing that Davoth's rule would ultimately grow to threaten all creation, and that Davoth would someday rise to challenge the Father himself, the creator of all things sealed Jekkad off from the myriad dimensions enfolded in his arms"

"Davoth bent all Jekkad utterly to his will, consumed with fury at their abandonment, until outside the gleaming walls of Immora the plundered festered. The clear-watered Pleasure Lakes spoiled into the Blood Swamps. The Palace of Groans grew over the Ardenite Gardens."

"The Father watched as Jekkad fell into darkness, and knew it could never happen again. Determined to avoid a similar result for the Earthly realm, the Father blessed his newest experiment with mortal pains and misfortunes, so that his new creations would treasure life, empathy, and peace."

What I'm trying to argue is that the theft of Davoth's power and the loss of his life sphere are two distinct incidents. According to Book of Seraph Part 5, Davoth's power increased as he and his minions vanquished and absorbed lesser gods. The Father went back to Jekkad to steal Davoth's life sphere while sparing him from utter destruction.

Davoth created The Father and the rest of the makyrs to achieve immortality -> The Father and Makyrs deemed this information too dangerous, stole davoth's power and sealed off Jekkad with Davoth in it -> Davoth gets pissed by their betrayal which causes Jekkad to turn into Hell -> Father sees what Jekkad has become, returns there and rips out Davoth's life force.

There was no other primeval who got their powers stolen and then sealed away, so even though they're at full power within their physical forms, Davoth being in his physical form nearing the end is a exception to that rule.

And it clearly states here:

"With further analysis Vega observed ephemeral distorations within the fabric of reality; scrambled reflections of the physical world. As the slayer interacts with this anomoly, a peculiar ripple in the anomaly's composition emerges, seemingly reacting to the Slayer's presence reflexively. The anomoly reshapes itself, calibrating itself to the Slayer, responding to his memory, ancestral, and memetic data, before ultimately projecting itself onto the Slayer himself"

That these distortions were caused by constant dimensional traveling, so I'm not sure why that would be a multiversal feat for all of demonkind and slayer.

 

[Axxtentacle]

That stands in stark contrast to what Davoth established as eternal was drawing to a close. When the maykrs learned about how to achieve immortality, they feared that this information was too dangerous for davoth to know so they sealed off Jekkad. This pissed davoth off and eventually turned jekkad into this Hell.

Book of Seraphs - Part 1​

" Foreseeing that Davoth's rule would ultimately grow to threaten all creation, and that Davoth would someday rise to challenge the Father himself, the creator of all things sealed Jekkad off from the myriad dimensions enfolded in his arms"

"Davoth bent all Jekkad utterly to his will, consumed with fury at their abandonment, until outside the gleaming walls of Immora the plundered festered. The clear-watered Pleasure Lakes spoiled into the Blood Swamps. The Palace of Groans grew over the Ardenite Gardens."

"The Father watched as Jekkad fell into darkness, and knew it could never happen again. Determined to avoid a similar result for the Earthly realm, the Father blessed his newest experiment with mortal pains and misfortunes, so that his new creations would treasure life, empathy, and peace."

What I'm trying to argue is that the theft of Davoth's power and the loss of his life sphere are two distinct incidents. According to Book of Seraph Part 5, Davoth's power increased as he and his minions vanquished and absorbed lesser gods. The Father went back to Jekkad to steal Davoth's life sphere while sparing him from utter destruction.

Davoth created The Father and the rest of the makyrs to achieve immortality -> The Father and Makyrs deemed this information too dangerous, stole davoth's power and sealed off Jekkad with Davoth in it -> Davoth gets pissed by their betrayal which causes Jekkad to turn into Hell -> Father sees what Jekkad has become, returns there and rips out Davoth's life force.

There was no other primeval who got their powers stolen and then sealed away, so even though they're at full power within their physical forms, Davoth being in his physical form nearing the end is a exception to that rule.

None of this proves those were 2 separate incidents, that's completely baseless so far. They're not portrayed as 2 separate incidents. The Maykrs started sealing Jekkad away which enraged Davoth, this doesn't prove jackshit about any power getting stolen. So Davoth went on a rampage.

Where, in any of this, does it say Davoth lost his power before getting his life sphere removed? Nowhere.

And it clearly states here:

"With further analysis Vega observed ephemeral distorations within the fabric of reality; scrambled reflections of the physical world. As the slayer interacts with this anomoly, a peculiar ripple in the anomaly's composition emerges, seemingly reacting to the Slayer's presence reflexively. The anomoly reshapes itself, calibrating itself to the Slayer, responding to his memory, ancestral, and memetic data, before ultimately projecting itself onto the Slayer himself"

That these distortions were caused by constant dimensional traveling, so I'm not sure why that would be a multiversal feat for all of demonkind and slayer.

Uh... this is the statement for Doom Slayer having canonical skin changing lmao. This isn't the same quote you're trying to talk about; so moot point.

 

[Gewsbumpz_dude]

"With further analysis Vega observed ephemeral distorations within the fabric of reality; scrambled reflections of the physical world. As the slayer interacts with this anomoly, a peculiar ripple in the anomaly's composition emerges, seemingly reacting to the Slayer's presence reflexively. The anomoly reshapes itself, calibrating itself to the Slayer, responding to his memory, ancestral, and memetic data, before ultimately projecting itself onto the Slayer himself"

Uh...that comes from a completely separate scan different from the multiverse imploding scan. Said scan also says nothing about dimensional travel.

One is an in-verse explanation on player customization, and the other is going over the lore of Battlemode.

 

[Profound_Euphoria]

Disagree FRA.

Also;

Kinda weird you say that, even though you can clearly see the yellow stuff from the sphere emit from his body, as if he absorbed it.

He didn't absord it at all. Samur is experiencing transfiguration in "The Ancient Gods Part-1," which is why he assigned Slayer to recover the father's life sphere. Samur thinks that by restoring the father, his transfiguration will be reversed. Slayer rejects the maykr's plea and destroys the father's life sphere instead and takes the dark lord's life sphere to Urdak to allow the dark lord to retake physical form so that doomguy can finally put an end to the strife in hell. Samur changes into that demonic looking beast for this reason.

The Ancient Gods Part -1

"Weakened due to his approaching Transfiguration and being unable to set foot in the Dark Realm, Samur tasks the Slayer with braving the trials of the Blood Swamps in Hell in order to retrieve the Father's Life Sphere and returning him into physical form, allowing him to save Urdak from the demons and as well curing Samur's Transfiguration. However, the Slayer proceeded to destroy the sphere right in front of Samur to prevent the Father's interference and further weakening Samur in the process. Without any opposition, the Slayer took the Dark Lord's Life Sphere with the intent of using the Luminarium in the Holt of Urdak to give the Dark Lord physical form in order to destroy him with his subjects. He leaves Samur behind.

Upon the Slayer reaching the Luminarium, Samur confronted him, trying to prevent him from resurrecting the Dark Lord. Soon after, Samur is consumed by his Transfiguration and engages in a fierce battle with the Slayer.[4] Ultimately, the Slayer emerges victorious and prepares to kill Samur, only for the Father to rescue Samur and grant the Slayer access to the Luminarium. His whereabouts and condition following this encounter are unknown, but he is presumed to still be alive."

 

[Axxtentacle]

I'd love to hear why the Life Sphere being destroyed would cause the Transfiguration to happen on the spot. Your argument doesn't work without that, so please, tell me where that comes from.

 

[Profound_Euphoria]

Uh...that comes from a completely separate scan different from the multiverse imploding scan. Said scan also says nothing about dimensional travel.

One is an in-verse explanation on player customization, and the other is going over the lore of Battlemode.

.....

You do realize the text of the scan you provided is literally word for word as to what I described right? Of course its going over the lord of Battlemode. Its literally all covered here https://doom.fandom.com/wiki/Multiverse

And its talking about the consequences of constant travel across hell, urdak and the mortal realm. not that these battles are tearing apart the fabric of reality by doomguy's or whatever demon's raw power, unless you are unironically arguing that every demon in doom is multiversal.

 

[Axxtentacle]

Those are both from artbooks for DOOM Eternal. 2 separate scans, and you quoted the one explaining why Doom Slayer has canonical skin changing, not the one that talks about the Multiverse imploding. You should understand and read what you're saying before you spout out the wrong info.

I'll let Gews respond to the other part.

 

[Profound_Euphoria]

I'd love to hear why the Life Sphere being destroyed would cause the Transfiguration to happen on the spot. Your argument doesn't work without that, so please, tell me where that comes from.

Its not an argument, its literally the context of the entire mission. And the transfiguration literally happened the moment you encounter again right before samur tries to STOP DOOMGUY from reviving the dark lord. I don't know why you are contesting this when the description of the mission is literally detailed. But here

Sarum: "Repay the Father for all he has granted us both by returning him to his throne and then, he will save us all"

Sarum: "The father's life sphere sits at the top of the sanctum located in the blood swamps of hell"

Sarum: "My body is undergoing rapid transfiguration its why I need the father"

Sarum: "Bring The Father back to physical form."

Sarum: "Maykrs cannot set foot in the dark realm. I'll be waiting for you in the sanctum"

Sarum: "Your reckless mission ends now"

And what is doomguy's "reckless" mission in this context? Delivering the dark lord's sphere to urdak so he can take physical form. Sarum did not absorb anything, doomguy did what he did to prevent any one from interfering with his mission

 

[Gewsbumpz_dude]

Not my point, I'm pointing out that you are trying to connect two scans together that don't really have a connection.

And its talking about the consequences of constant travel across hell, urdak and the mortal realm. not that these battles are tearing apart the fabric of reality by doomguy's or whatever demon's raw power, unless you are unironically arguing that every demon in doom is multiversal.

Not sure where you are getting this notion from anyway. The portals made by VEGA are nowhere said to have harmful effects. Not even the demon portals, tears in the fabric of time and space, really have a harmful affect on the environment from what we've seen of them, plus they're tiny in comparison to the universe, let alone the multiverse. The scan says that their fights were causing the multiverse to blow up.

As for the all multiversal demons bit. No. He is fighting the combined forces of Hell, as in, it is a massive group effort on their behalf. So no, me disagreeing with what you are saying isn't in someway also arguing every demon to be 2-A as a result

 

[Profound_Euphoria]

Those are both from artbooks for DOOM Eternal. 2 separate scans, and you quoted the one explaining why Doom Slayer has canonical skin changing, not the one that talks about the Multiverse imploding. You should understand and read what you're saying before you spout out the wrong info.

I'll let Gews respond to the other part.

Then, let me know where else the multiverse is said to be collapsing other the quotes in the Doom Eternal artwork and the wiki that I have previously referenced.

 

[Axxtentacle]

Its not an argument, its literally the context of the entire mission. And the transfiguration literally happened the moment you encounter again right before samur tries to STOP DOOMGUY from reviving the dark lord.

So what's the yellow energy and seizing about? Yellow energy came from the life sphere, Samur started having those effects. You're arguing this isn't because of Transfiguration, even though that was the only argument for it not being The Father's energy. You checkmated yourself.

I don't know why you are contesting this when the description of the mission is literally detailed. But here

Sarum: "Repay the Father for all he has granted us both by returning him to his throne and then, he will save us all"

Sarum: "The father's life sphere sits at the top of the sanctum located in the blood swamps of hell"

Sarum: "My body is undergoing rapid transfiguration its why I need the father"

Sarum: "Bring The Father back to physical form."

Sarum: "Maykrs cannot set foot in the dark realm. I'll be waiting for you in the sanctum"

Sarum: "Your reckless mission ends now"

And what is doomguy's "reckless" mission in this context? Delivering the dark lord's sphere to urdak so he can take physical form. Sarum did not absorb anything, doomguy did what he did to prevent any one from interfering with his mission

Doomguy's mission has absolutely ******* nothing to do with this. His mission happens whether that happens or not, it's unrelated, but it does happen. This disproves nothing and makes you look like you're grasping for straws.

 

[Axxtentacle]

Then, let me know where else the multiverse is said to be collapsing other the quotes in the Doom Eternal artwork and the wiki that I have previously referenced.

You're missing what i'm saying. Let me say it more clearly.

YOU USED THE WRONG SCAN.

 

[Profound_Euphoria]

So what's the yellow energy and seizing about? Yellow energy came from the life sphere, Samur started having those effects. You're arguing this isn't because of Transfiguration, even though that was the only argument for it not being The Father's energy. You checkmated yourself.

Doomguy's mission has absolutely ******* nothing to do with this. His mission happens whether that happens or not, it's unrelated, but it does happen. This disproves nothing and makes you look like you're grasping for straws.

He was undergoing his transfiguration. Yellow=/=father's life sphere. Are you kidding me right now. You literally see samur scared as soon as doomguy starts handling the life sphere because doomguy clearly is NOT bringing the father back which is what Samur wanted. You can watch the entire damn video yourself.

Doomguy's mission has absolutely everything to do with what he did because doomguy is TASKED TO DESTROY IT while samur tasks him to retrieve it and bring the father back. You clearly did not watch the video or play this instance of the game and yet you are trying to get aggressive with your beliefs.

But here you go:

Intern: Ah, I see that your mission objective states that you are going to DESTROY THE SPHERE AND NOT RETRIEVE IT.

This happened right after the cutscene of samur asking you to retrieve the father's life sphere to bring the father back

Samur "absorbing" the father is complete fanfiction and literally contradicts everything that happened in part 1 of ancient gods

 

[Gewsbumpz_dude]

He was undergoing his transfiguration. Yellow=/=father's life sphere.

Ah yes. It was some other elusive form of yellow energy that only appeared after the Father's life sphere was destroyed and the essence from it engulfed him. Obviously.

 

[Axxtentacle]

He was undergoing his transfiguration. Yellow=/=father's life sphere. Are you kidding me right now. You literally see samur scared as soon as doomguy starts handling the life sphere because doomguy clearly is NOT bringing the father back which is what Samur wanted. You can watch the entire damn video yourself.

Doomguy's mission has absolutely everything to do with that he did because doomguy was TASKED TO DESTROY IT while samur was tasked to retrieve it and bring the father back. You clearly did not watch the video or play this instance of the game and yet you are trying to get aggressive with your beliefs.

But here you go:

Intern: Ah, I see that your mission objective states that you are going to DESTROY THE SPHERE AND NOT RETRIEVE IT.

This happened right after the cutscene of samur asking you to retrieve the father's life sphere to bring the father back

Samur "absorbing" the father is complete fanfiction. The father after samur is defeated RESCUES samur

He was already going through transfiguration beforehand, and this straight up ignores the arguments me & Gews brought up in prior posts. Good to know you aren't reading our replies. That wasn't connected to the Life Sphere besides using it to revive The Father so The Father could help him. Doomguy's assigned task canonically was to help revive The Father, but he didn't. It was his personal mission to destroy The Father's life sphere and bring back Davoth to kill him.

None of this gives your argument any weight as it's unrelated. What we're talking about is the accepted interpretation that the Yellow energy that bursted out of the Father's YELLOW life sphere when it was crushed started coming out of Samur Maykr as he absorbed the Father's essence and therefore his power.

Let's also not forget to ******* say that VEGA is a copy of the Father's Mind implanted into an AI, NOT THE FATHER HIMSELF. The Father saved Samur by USING THE VEGA TECH. Because it's his mind INSIDE AN AI.

You know absolutely nothing about the lore, and i'd be genuinely surprised if you had actually played this game. Genuinely, i'd be shock. I don't want to believe someone's comprehension is so dangerously terrible.

 

[Profound_Euphoria]

Ah yes. It was some other elusive form of yellow energy that only appeared after the Father's life sphere was destroyed and the essence from it engulfed him. Obviously.

The life sphere is actually destroyed by Doomguy. Even his allies know what doomguy's aims are despite what samur tasked him; it was essentially his role in this mission to DESTROY IT. I literally just showed you with the video of the mission, image of the intern's quote and the context of samur's tasks. Despite the fact that practically every detail of the task itself disproves Samur's absorption of the Father,, you seem to be particularly fixated on this yellow energy thing for some reason. Hell, before Doomguy destroyed the sphere, Samur was ALREADY emitting yellow energy. That is indeed depicted in the video I provided. Following his transformation, Samur began to emit purple energy. Does that imply that he now has the energy of dark lord because the dark lord's orb is purple? Hell Samur is physically SAVED by the father after being defeated by Doomguy. Like, the only thing supporting the entire "samur absorbed the father" theory is "samur glow yellow" while literally ignoring every bit of context from that entire scenario

 

[Profound_Euphoria]

He was already going through transfiguration beforehand, and this straight up ignores the arguments me & Gews brought up in prior posts. Good to know you aren't reading our replies. That wasn't connected to the Life Sphere besides using it to revive The Father so The Father could help him. Doomguy's assigned task canonically was to help revive The Father, but he didn't. It was his personal mission to destroy The Father's life sphere and bring back Davoth to kill him.

None of this gives your argument any weight as it's unrelated. What we're talking about is the accepted interpretation that the Yellow energy that bursted out of the Father's YELLOW life sphere when it was crushed started coming out of Samur Maykr as he absorbed the Father's essence and therefore his power.

Let's also not forget to ******* say that VEGA is a copy of the Father's Mind implanted into an AI, NOT THE FATHER HIMSELF. The Father saved Samur by USING THE VEGA TECH. Because it's his mind INSIDE AN AI.

You know absolutely nothing about the lore, and i'd be genuinely surprised if you had actually played this game. Genuinely, i'd be shock. I don't want to believe someone's comprehension is so dangerously terrible.

HE DIDN'T ABSORB you have no proof of that outside of samur glowing yellow which he literally ALWAYS DID. Your arguments is that samur started glowing yellow, father orb is yellow therefore samur is now the father, which is complete and utter bullshit when you actually pay attention to the context of the mission which gives furthur context to that cutscene. The game tells you doomguy is going to destroy it, you hear the orb cracking in doomguy's fists, you see samur trembling while it happens and then you see samur scream and then undergo his transfiguration. Never in the story did samur, doomguy or ANYBODY asked or were tasked to have samur absorb the father sphere. Its complete nonsense fan interpretation all because samur momentarily had a yellow aura around him, the same yellow aura that samur always had

 

[Axxtentacle]

The life sphere is actually destroyed by Doomguy.

Ok?

Even his allies know what doomguy's aims are despite what samur tasked him; it was essentially his role in this mission to DESTROY IT.

The task he was given by Samur was to retrieve it. It was his personal mission to destroy it. The mission things that show up in the game aren't always showing what his actual assigned mission by Samur or whatever is. It's his personal mission.

I literally just showed you with the video of the mission, image of the intern's quote and the context of samur's tasks.

Mhm, to retrieve it and use it to bring The Father back to life.

Despite the fact that practically every detail of the task itself disproves Samur's absorption of the Father,, you seem to be particularly fixated on this yellow energy thing for some reason.

Yeah. Because the yellow energy that came from the life sphere went straight to Samur, engulfed him, and entered his body.

Hell, before Doomguy destroyed the sphere, Samur was ALREADY emitting yellow energy.

No he wasn't. I just looked at the clip. Don't lie to get your point across.

That is indeed depicted in the video I provided.

No it isn't. Stop lying.

Following his transformation, Samur began to emit purple energy. Does that imply that he now has the energy of dark lord because the dark lord's orb is purple?

It's red. And no, it doesn't. It's because he got corrupted by the transfiguration. Learn your shit.

Hell Samur is physically SAVED by the father after being defeated by Doomguy.

The Father's mind was copied and put into an AI, VEGA. Which is why he's still around. This proves nothing.

Like, the only thing supporting the entire "samur absorbed the father" theory is "samur glow yellow" while literally ignoring every bit of context from that entire scenario

No, it's not. At all. The context supports it, if anything.

HE DIDN'T ABSORB you have no proof of that outside of samur glowing yellow which he literally ALWAYS DID.

No he didn't. I watched your video and i've seen gameplay, he didn't. That's a lie.

Your arguments is that samur started glowing yellow, father orb is yellow therefore samur is now the father, which is complete and utter bullshit when you actually pay attention to the context of the mission which gives furthur context to that cutscene.

No, it isn't. Samur doesn't have to become the Father to absorb his power for one, the rest of the context is easy enough.

The game tells you doomguy is going to destroy it, you hear the orb cracking in doomguy's fists, you see samur trembling while it happens and then you see samur scream and then undergo his transfiguration.

He was already undergoing transfiguration, and he didn't fully transfigure till later on in Urdak. The Yellow Energy has nothing to do with it.

Never in the story did samur, doomguy or ANYBODY asked or were tasked to have samur absorb the father sphere.

Ok? That doesn't matter. We visually see the energy from the life sphere engulf him and go into his body.

Its complete nonsense fan interpretation all because samur momentarily had a yellow aura around him, the same yellow aura that samur always had

No he didn't. You evidently haven't played the game or even reviewed your own scans, because he doesn't in the clip you posted earlier till the Life Sphere is destroyed.

Pointless clip.

 

[Axxtentacle]

Also i'd like to point out this has become solely about Samur Maykr and he hasn't responded to any debunks about the Davoth thing. If you actually want this downgrade to go through, you need to argue your points, or this thread will get closed.

 

[Maverick_Zero_X]

This CRT seems pretty rejected. Closing