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Damage boost and homing attack X-Axis xd
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Removal of Infinite Attack Speed in Bleach
- Thread starter Azertyhuuh
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Depends on the perception speed of said character, honestly in a battle of characters with Infinite speed and infinite speed attack it doesn't make sense....
Either way this is one of the most blatant Infinite speed attacks...
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This speed of the x-axis isn't about how long it takes for him to fire the attack but how fast the attack itself "travels" after he fires it, unless I am misunderstanding what you're saying.
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He doesn't fire it in Zero time the projectile travels the distance in zero time.
Attack speed as counter intuitive as it might seem (I learnt this recently) isn't how fast you attack it's how fast your attack moves
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In case it isn't obvious, easy disagree with this CRT
Saqphire
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I am talking about the attack’s speed.
Yeah, the attack’s speed still travels within a timeframe in the anime as per the video above. It doesn’t ignore distance and ignoring finite distance is not a factor in infinite speed because again, Lille never implies it goes at an instant or in zero time or anything
Hellscream
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Can we keep this civil?
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I feel like that is being too harsh... So I would suggest deleting that.
Saqphire
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Anywho I’m not arguing further if the thread gets nuked anyway
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You have been very and unnecessarily provocative to Saqphire in the past. So i will tell you straight up: this is an official warning to cease this. Do not engage again if this is all you will be doing.
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Just to be clear. You mean this fight scene or is there a different one?
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Can you quote the exact time stamp ?
Brosky....
Let's take a look at what we know,
- It penetrates anything and everything in between two coordinates
- You can't dodge it
Also can we like not say "Let's not take everything a character has to say about their own ability(explanation of it) at face value" like I get that we need to have some Skepticism but given that's all the explanation we have, he never lied and it shows what he said it does I see no reason to really dismiss it under that pretense or if you do then uphold that same standards across every single verse because afaik the wiki doesn't maintain that standard. you can put me in disagreement with the thread and in agreement with most Grasses being Green.
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I don't see what you're referring to. Every time Shunsui dodges the X-Axis, he always moves out of the way before Lille fires a shot, and when he doesn't, he gets a hole punctured through him.
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yep this one,
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If you don't mind me asking, what are your thoughts on the CRT so far ?
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I don't think there is a good reason to dismiss Lille's explanation of his ability. And in their fight nothing was shown to contradict his explanation. It can be aim dodged sure but the reason would be tracking Lille's movement (which isn't infinite speed), not the projectile itself.
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Homing also makes 0 sense considering it does not home and it uniformly works in a straight line between muzzle and target which is how oetsu was able to keep aim dodging it. Homing would actually work against aim dodging.
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The anime is seemingly inconsistent in how it portrays X-Axis. Against the Royal Guard in Cour 2 it clearly did not shoot a projectile and was just an instant puncture, but against Shunsui in Cour 3 it does kind of look like a projectile is fired, despite that directly contradicting Lille's statement. There's also the possibility that Lille wasn't using X-Axis for every attack against Shunsui, he's still capable of firing the normal projectiles just like other Quincy.
However, while there are somewhat contradictory portrayals for how X-Axis is shown in the anime, there are zero contradictions in the statements we are given, statements such as:
Also, Oetsu can easily blitz Lille, but is helpless against X-Axis and doesn't even understand why there are now holes in his body. This doesn't seem to suggest "fast" to me, it suggests instant.
Having said all of that, the thread might have some credence for the ability not classifying as infinite speed, as it could be strongly argued that there is no distance traveled, but that'd depend on how strict the definition for infinite speed is. Though, I'd argue that for all intents and purposes, it'd still be the same as infinite speed in effect.
However, while there are somewhat contradictory portrayals for how X-Axis is shown in the anime, there are zero contradictions in the statements we are given, statements such as:
- There is no projectile
- Uniform penetration of everything between the muzzle and target
- The concept of dodging is meaningless
Also, Oetsu can easily blitz Lille, but is helpless against X-Axis and doesn't even understand why there are now holes in his body. This doesn't seem to suggest "fast" to me, it suggests instant.
Having said all of that, the thread might have some credence for the ability not classifying as infinite speed, as it could be strongly argued that there is no distance traveled, but that'd depend on how strict the definition for infinite speed is. Though, I'd argue that for all intents and purposes, it'd still be the same as infinite speed in effect.
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in cases we see a projectile he's probably not using the X-Axis because in the scene where he explained it we saw no projectiles at all in comparison to vs shunsui where there is some. Either that or the animators forgot he had the ability
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- Thread starter
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Yes, that is correct.
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At 0:35, same blue attack that is used (no indication the guy suddenly uses something else for no reason) shown to take time to travel (from bullets perspective) and is dodged by the opponent even tho the bullet is traveling while the opponent hasn't moved. If the shot moves in 0 time then the opponent shouldn't have any time to move out the way.
At 0:40, before the guy gets punctured by the bullet he flops as he's hit.
At 2:41, left ambiguous whether he predicted that shot or not before he jumped. He shouldn't be able to pre-aim it because he was blinded by the wall.
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For infinite speed there would need to be movement of some projectile involved, which I don't think is what X-Axis does. It seems to rather just be manifesting the effect (erasure/penetration of something) on the thing, in my understanding.
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Not X axis.
Not X-axis
Shunsui moves before he fires because Shunsui already predicted that.
I mean it's pretty clear he says it himself, if there's a projectile then that means he isn't using X-axis like just see the attack....
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Does this help ? If you have any queries feel free to ask I will try my best to answer.
So it crosses finite distance in no time....
That's Infinite speed
As explained it ignores distance, it's never explained as "teleportation"
I feel like people should ask the verse supporters before making these CRT's
I mean really, it's written in the Teleportation Page.
It's even bolded to show the seperation between Infinite speed and Teleportation. Anyways for those that haven't watched/read Bleach.
X-axis penetrates (physically) anything between the muzzle and the target in no time, take the muzzle starting at coordinate (1,2,3) and the target is at (500,2,3) it physically travels that distance
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Lille doesn't always use the X-Axis; sometimes, he just uses regular Reishi bullets. If you go back to a previous fight Lille had, you'll see him use Reishi bullets, and they look exactly like that.
As Shunsui explains, that's his shadow, which he uses to dupe Lille quite a few times.
He predicted it. Shunsui is pretty good at that.
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I don't understand, does he give any indication that he's not using x-axis that's different from him using x-axis or is this your deduction he's not using x-axis because it's shown as a projectile. If the story doesn't differentiate them then I'll consider your deduction an arbitrary headcanon.Not X axis.
Not X-axis
Shunsui moves before he fires because Shunsui already predicted that.
I mean it's pretty clear he says it himself, if there's a projectile then that means he isn't using X-axis like just see the attack....
Tho your deduction itself raises questions, if projectile-like puncture is not X-axis while instantaneous puncture is X-axis then where does the non-existent bullets in his gun come from and why do they glow the same blueish color before they're shot.
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both of those instances were X - Axis actually
After the first shot Shunsui says that he thought he dodged it, and Lille gives an explanation, and the second shot is right after the explanation showcasing it
Saqphire
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2:25. We see a flash of light, and then holes where Kyoraku was hit. Honestly the scene is very vague but we see the timeframe isn’t zero as Kyoraku is still moving as he’s getting hit (plus we see the splinters from his Shihakusho move as the attack lands on him too so unless the splinters move in infinite speed as well, I truly doubt it went at zero time as people imply)
Which doesn’t need to happen in zero time, there are many interpretations that can grant this such as dura neg, spatial hax, damage boost, homing attack etc etc, I believe there has to be more backing than this for the speed to be granted
Hax-based interpretations can grant that too. And this is assuming Lille is, again, speaking literally as if the concept of distance or dodging is ignored and that the timeframe is nil because of that
I didn’t say he lied tho. I said a way of granting the statement but not the infinite speed conclusion is that given his history with X-Axis, the concept of dodging is not a thing from his POV and as such he is an arrogant person with his ability given his confidence for it. But Lille doesn’t mention zero time anyway
Well… it’s a conclusion with little backing when we see multiple users, including me, giving interpretations that don’t need to support infinite speed either so
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No it's stated,
It's just,
"I can shoot Reishi bullets with my guns that are visible Projectiles and when I use my schrift X-axis I don't use projectiles"
Watch Bleach otherwise you won't understand ngl
And my scans are for when he is using X-axis
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Then the animators simply showed them as projectiles travelling (which we can see) which goes against what he said
I mean you have to specify the hax, what hax exactly allows you this ?
That's fine, I don't fault you I apologise if it came off as such that aside I explained this already. The distance travelled is there just that there's no projectile travelling said distance just the effects of what would happen if a projectile travelled physically through said distance (it's weird yes) but that's the explanation. Again Infinite speed suits this best imo.
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I told ya I don't watch Bleach. Anyways if his X-axis is never shown to be a projectile (and anything projectile like is not x-axis) then he can't have infinite attack speed because there's 0 distance traveled, which you are seemingly contending for.No it's stated, are you trying to like Gaslit or just failing to understand like I don't get it ?
What part of
"I can shoot Reishi bullets with my guns that are visible Projectiles and when I use my schrift X-axis I don't use projectiles" is vague.
Watch Bleach
Here's him normally
And my scans are for when he is using X-axis
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- Thread starter
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Yes, that is exactly what happens.
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Can we get CM-3 or maybe CM-2 for Ignoring the concept of Distance also isn't that just better ?
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??
Yeah, Shunsui's moving because he's already been hit and reacting to that. Shunsui (and his Shihakusho and hat) is not moving in time with the X-Axis because he's already been pierced through.
Homing attack makes no sense (if it was homing, aim dodging it wouldn't work), and he already has the other stuff on his profile.
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The flash of light doesn't necessarily mean he's still in the process of getting hit. I think he was clearly already hit there.
FriendOfTheTeaParty's reasoning on why it's most probably not homing attack is solid imo.
I think there is no good reason to dismiss Lille's explanation as non literal. I agree with 2 intepretations, it's either an infinite speed attack or a spatial hax that happens at zero time.
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