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Minor Bump
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Bayonetta Low 1-C Summons/Other Characters Standard + More Justification for the High 6-A minimum + Resistances Additions
- Thread starter Jinx666
- Start date
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Buh-duh-Bump!
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BEHOLD THE POWER OF MY NECROMANCY!
Come on people! We need this!
Come on people! We need this!
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That part about surviving in space is now considered Space Survival. That part at the end needs to be changed.
Other than that, does anything else need to be done?
Other than that, does anything else need to be done?
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- Thread starter
- #47
Just needs one more staff approval iirc? Looking back theres two counting you, and thus far there have been no disagreements.
There are other Bayo revisions coming apparently but we need to desperately get rid of the notion that Demons, the very thing Bayo uses to get so strong and fight with, are only Continental compared to her Low 1-C
There are other Bayo revisions coming apparently but we need to desperately get rid of the notion that Demons, the very thing Bayo uses to get so strong and fight with, are only Continental compared to her Low 1-C
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I'm a content moderator, which means voting in the forum isn't something I can do.
I can ping some thread mods though, if need be.
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@Vietthai96 @Theglassman12 @Planck69 @Catzlaflame @ActuallySpaceMan42
Thread has been ongoing for over a year. What do you think of this?
Thread has been ongoing for over a year. What do you think of this?
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What does this even mean, really?
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- Thread starter
- #52
That there are many similar verses with 'summons', like Bayonetta Verse, that simply get downscaled for the sake of being able to fight amidst the same level even though they're ultimately not on the same level as the top tiers really.
Meanwhile the summons in Bayo have actually shown to be able to harm characters like Bayo, Balder, Singularity, Rodin etc in some capacity, and yet we're calling them Tier 6?
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I meant the SMT example. Can you give an actual example of this happening in the verse?
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So, then it’s a faulty example against the point you’re trying to prove. Then there should be no reason why summons in Bayonetta wouldn’t be relevant to their summoners.
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- Thread starter
- #56
Its not faulty just because i dont know the verse personally? Its just an example of a verse that similarly scales summons and characters to high levels based on this
Can we not try and deflect this into SMT talk? This is zooming into like, an offhand example. This is about Bayonetta
Can we not try and deflect this into SMT talk? This is zooming into like, an offhand example. This is about Bayonetta
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The basis of your analogy requires it to be similar or identical to the original claim. I asked you can you give an example of this, and you couldn’t. If you can’t, I don’t see why it should be accepted.
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- Thread starter
- #58
This is a literal tidbit statement to an entire post that has 0 bearing on SMT.
This is about Bayonetta. I didn't make this post for you to try and derail in discussing SMT, im just aware its a verse that also widescales its cast to Tier 1 despite separate 'vast levels' of power inbetween them. Thats the 'similarity' to show that other verses also scale like what im proposing. Theres nothing 'identical' about it.
If you want to talk about SMT, go to another thread.
My thread about scaling for the Bayonetta verse doesnt hinge on me having to know anything about SMT? Thats a literal separate verse, so im not sure what you mean why this 'should be accepted' because of a completely separate series
This is about Bayonetta. I didn't make this post for you to try and derail in discussing SMT, im just aware its a verse that also widescales its cast to Tier 1 despite separate 'vast levels' of power inbetween them. Thats the 'similarity' to show that other verses also scale like what im proposing. Theres nothing 'identical' about it.
If you want to talk about SMT, go to another thread.
My thread about scaling for the Bayonetta verse doesnt hinge on me having to know anything about SMT? Thats a literal separate verse, so im not sure what you mean why this 'should be accepted' because of a completely separate series
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No, I don’t think I will.
I am asking you can you show me an example of what is bolded, as you bake in the assumption because x verse does this, y verse should be able to. I’m making the argument you’re under a false pretense to begin with, hence me asking can you actively show me evidence of this being done, as you’re using it to bolster your point.
Don’t care much else about your whining and whatnot and what you find relevant to the thread. Answer it or don’t.
I am asking you can you show me an example of what is bolded, as you bake in the assumption because x verse does this, y verse should be able to. I’m making the argument you’re under a false pretense to begin with, hence me asking can you actively show me evidence of this being done, as you’re using it to bolster your point.
Don’t care much else about your whining and whatnot and what you find relevant to the thread. Answer it or don’t.
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Feel free to write a report.
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Guys, knock it off.
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Mind you, this literally isn’t the definition of derailing. He’s making the claim x verse does, I asked him can I get an example of this, and he can’t answer. He’s using the logic that one verse has an established precedent so this other verse should be allowed to. The basis of his thread is literally dependent on what he’s claiming as an example.
It really isn’t that hard.
It really isn’t that hard.
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You really shouldn't have posted that in the OP tbh, but you can both stop talking about SMT stuff and I recommend removing it from the OP.
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- Thread starter
- #67
The basis of the thread is not 'dependent' on it in the slightest.
You obviously just searched 'SMT' in the searchbar, saw it mentioned in this, and now you're desperately trying to talk about the verse in a Bayonetta CRT. It very much is derailing. I gave you why I mentioned it, im not falling for your plugging in tryna make me look into the verse anymore than what i know abt it.
SMT is simply just another verse that scales its summons/personas/whatever you wanna call it that to their Tier 1 heights. Thats perfectly fine to use as an example in that regard instead of people pretending it has to be an identical case otherwise an entire CRT falls apart. Narcissism atp
You obviously just searched 'SMT' in the searchbar, saw it mentioned in this, and now you're desperately trying to talk about the verse in a Bayonetta CRT. It very much is derailing. I gave you why I mentioned it, im not falling for your plugging in tryna make me look into the verse anymore than what i know abt it.
SMT is simply just another verse that scales its summons/personas/whatever you wanna call it that to their Tier 1 heights. Thats perfectly fine to use as an example in that regard instead of people pretending it has to be an identical case otherwise an entire CRT falls apart. Narcissism atp
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- Thread starter
- #68
Whats literally wrong with it other than someone feeling the need to hop on about it (since its quite literally the only reason theyre here and now speaking condescendingly?)
Ive explained why i compared it to SMT and they're directly admitting to just goading on the point, and as such are derailing.
Either way yh, id love to stop talking about SMT. How many more votes does this need from staff now?
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Good luck proving that.
My issue isn’t the summoning, if you spent less time trying to ad hom and throw every psychological buzzword you learned, you would get that. You made the claim that summons are scaled to the top tiers even though they actually aren’t. I am simply asking you, can you provide me evidence that this is the case? Because you are banking on one claim being true in order to substantiate yours being true.
It legitimately is not that hard. If your premise is faulty, then your argument is.
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Let's drop this and move on, please.
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Okay, awesome, now that we’ve established you can’t, I actually am going to disagree with this thread.
So, he was amped. Thus, doesn’t scale to Gomorrah’s actual consistent strength.
Once again, amped Gomorrah, so not his actual consistent strength.
What does this prove?
So you admit he was weakened, and weakened even further by getting hit by Omne (a fusion of Bayonetta and Balder’s summoning power by the way) and yet this is somehow evidence for him being on his level.
I have no issue with MB scaling, she’s by far the most consistent.
Never mind the fact that he fought 3 Bayonettas, Viola, and Luka, doesn’t really seem like him anywhere near full power.
Debunks itself. How in the world did anyone agree with this thread?
The only valid statement is this:
As opposed to numerous feats with context that aptly proves they don’t scale. Count me as disagree.
So, he was amped. Thus, doesn’t scale to Gomorrah’s actual consistent strength.
Once again, amped Gomorrah, so not his actual consistent strength.
What does this prove?
So you admit he was weakened, and weakened even further by getting hit by Omne (a fusion of Bayonetta and Balder’s summoning power by the way) and yet this is somehow evidence for him being on his level.
I have no issue with MB scaling, she’s by far the most consistent.
Never mind the fact that he fought 3 Bayonettas, Viola, and Luka, doesn’t really seem like him anywhere near full power.
Debunks itself. How in the world did anyone agree with this thread?
The only valid statement is this:
As opposed to numerous feats with context that aptly proves they don’t scale. Count me as disagree.
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Madama Butterfly seems to scale, and given she's literally Bayonetta's partner it'd be weird for her not to scale.
I'm not sure about the others.
I'm not sure about the others.
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OP doesn’t need to reply to my points, but Random-Helper and DDM, I hope you see how I illustrated they clearly don’t scale.
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- Thread starter
- #76
The other summons are just as relative to Madama Butterfly. Madama is Bayos most trusted demon not cause shes the overwhelmingly strongest but that they're actually on the same page compared to the others. Bayo still chooses to literally use the other summons and maintain contracts with them, which wouldnt be the case if theyre Tier 6 fodder to the Low 1-Cs
Theyre still all used just as much as she is to fight off the same Tier 1 threats. Keeping them all at Tier 6 is just weird. None of the point the other person was making hold up either but im not replying to them directly since theyre just ragebaiting and being condescending. I can explain why if you want me to though
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Just to be clear, he explicitly is not replying to my points yet also claims they have no merit. So, mods, do with that as you will and verify who sounds more convincing.
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This does seem relevant. Still, I recall something about how she also needs to feed them or something, and I know from Pokemon games that having more Pokemon is better than having empty spaces in your team, even if it's relatively weak.
We should probably look at examples of the summons scaling. Killing an enemy, even a wounded one, should still mean something. A Low 1-C dropping to Tier 6 from being wounded does seem strange, given it'd leave them weakened enough for Bayonetta to kill them by rolling over on them in her sleep. A disempowered one is a different matter though.
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Jinx is responding to me about the lesser summons scaling instead of you because they don't want to let a clash stir up again, so please don't stir things up unnecessarily. I read your comments, I'm asking Jinx for answers to them.
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- #80
Bayo's summoning isnt the same as needing Pokemon. They're the direct sources of her power, and Umbra Witches in general. They make contracts with them in general for strength and utilisation.
They still somewhat have a free will (which Bayo can nullify with Demon Slave) and will turn on her mostly any chance they get, but shes not brining Tier 6-tier beings in fights against the top tiers of her verse.
They obv arent stronger or 'comparable', but they certainly downscale since they're also Bayo's method of attacking.
Yeah, theyre all used to kill the enemies and then used to fight against characters on her tier such as Balder and Singularity.
If we're talking about Aesirs body, then the eyes of the world being erased what was depowered him. The kick from Omne into Gomorrahs mouth (who chewed him up) didnt do anything to warrant such a huge debuff. Its also proven that if you fail to land Aesir/Loptr into Gomorrah's mouth in the gameplay, its a game over screen, so hes not entirely powerless.
