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Zacian, Zamazenta and Eternatus have legitimate scaling and deserve profiles

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I noticed that for some asinine reason Dracovish, a Pokémon without any feats or scaling to speak of has a profile while Galar's boxart legendaries lack a profile. I'm going to show why the trio deserve profiles and have actual scaling.

Base:

As shown in The Scuffle of Legends, Lance's Shiny Gyarados's Hyper Beam was able to statemate Kyogre's Hyper Beam, meaning the Red Gyarados(at least in the anime) scales to High 6-A.
This also is not an outlier as Gyarados lacks any anti-feats in the anime to suggest this. It's just unusually strong compared to the rest of it's species, which isn't that uncommon with champion's Pokemon like Red's Mega Charizard X or Ash's Pikachu.
The scaling to Gyarados is important because in Flash of the Titans, Lance's Dynamaxed Red Gyarados takes on Leon's Gigantamax Charizard and ends up being defeated. This does confirm High 6-A Leon, possibly higher as Gyarados logically has gotten stronger since The Scuffle of Legends and was amped by Dynamax and boosted it's Attack and Speed with Dragon Dance.
In Sword and Shield... The Legends Awaken, Leon's Charizard manages to hold it's own against Eternatus, but not weakening it enough to secure a capture. This means base Eternatus scales to High 6-A, along with relativistic+ speeds.
There's also potential 5-B scaling but I don't know the general opinion on Alain's Mega Charizard X fighting Primal Groudon. Let me know if it's seen as an outlier. If it isn't, i'll go more in-depth on the scaling. If it is, I suggest adding a note to Alain's and Steven's profiles, similar to the note on Zinnia's profile.
This could also scale to base Zacian and Zamazenta, but if that's not accepted they would default to Zapdos tier.

Crowned/Eternamax:

Crowned Zacian is stated in it's Pokémon Sword Pokédex entry that it only needs a single strike to take out Gigantamax Pokémon.
Likewise, Crowned Zamazenta's Pokédex entry states that it can shrug off attacks from Dynamax Pokémon
There are 32 species of Pokémon capable of Gigantamaxing that Crowned Zacian and Zamazenta can scale to. One of which is Melmetal
Meaning Crowned Zacian scales to Melmetal for being able to take it out in one hit, and Eternamax Eternatus would also scale, being able to survive attacks from Crowned Zacian and Zamazenta.

TL;DR
Base tiering: High 6-A
Base speed: Relativistic+

Crowned/Eternamax tiering: At least 3-C, likely High 3-A
Crowned/Eternamax speed: At least Massively FTL+, likely Infinite

There is also a statement from Leon that could imply Eternatus scales above the Creation Trio, but I left that out for obvious reasons.

So yeah. Galar legendaries have feats. They deserve a profile.

Edit: read the replies
 
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I noticed that for some asinine reason Dracovish, a Pokémon without any feats or scaling to speak of has a profile while Galar's boxart legendaries lack a profile. I'm going to show why the trio deserve profiles and have actual scaling.

Base:

As shown in The Scuffle of Legends, Lance's Shiny Gyarados's Hyper Beam was able to statemate Kyogre's Hyper Beam, meaning the Red Gyarados(at least in the anime) scales to High 6-A.
This also is not an outlier as Gyarados lacks any anti-feats in the anime to suggest this. It's just unusually strong compared to the rest of it's species, which isn't that uncommon with champion's Pokemon like Red's Mega Charizard X or Ash's Pikachu.
The scaling to Gyarados is important because in Flash of the Titans, Lance's Dynamaxed Red Gyarados takes on Leon's Gigantamax Charizard and ends up being defeated. This does confirm High 6-A Leon, possibly higher as Gyarados logically has gotten stronger since The Scuffle of Legends and was amped by Dynamax and boosted it's Attack and Speed with Dragon Dance.
In Sword and Shield... The Legends Awaken, Leon's Charizard manages to hold it's own against Eternatus, but not weakening it enough to secure a capture. This means base Eternatus scales to High 6-A, along with relativistic+ speeds.
There's also potential 5-B scaling but I don't know the general opinion on Alain's Mega Charizard X fighting Primal Groudon. Let me know if it's seen as an outlier. If it isn't, i'll go more in-depth on the scaling. If it is, I suggest adding a note to Alain's and Steven's profiles, similar to the note on Zinnia's profile.
This could also scale to base Zacian and Zamazenta, but if that's not accepted they would default to Zapdos tier.

Crowned/Eternamax:

Crowned Zacian is stated in it's Pokémon Sword Pokédex entry that it only needs a single strike to take out Gigantamax Pokémon.
Likewise, Crowned Zamazenta's Pokédex entry states that it can shrug off attacks from Dynamax Pokémon
There are 32 species of Pokémon capable of Gigantamaxing that Crowned Zacian and Zamazenta can scale to. One of which is Melmetal
Meaning Crowned Zacian scales to Melmetal for being able to take it out in one hit, and Eternamax Eternatus would also scale, being able to survive attacks from Crowned Zacian and Zamazenta.

TL;DR
Base tiering: High 6-A
Base speed: Relativistic+

Crowned/Eternamax tiering: At least 3-C, likely High 3-A
Crowned/Eternamax speed: At least Massively FTL+, likely Infinite

There is also a statement from Leon that could imply Eternatus scales above the Creation Trio, but I left that out for obvious reasons.

So yeah. Galar legendaries have feats. They deserve a profile.
Also update meltan's profile gmax melmetal is official
 
Aight let's get over this shiz.

1. If Leon's charizard was high 6-A then Ash's pikachu is high 6-A then all of the above average trainers and all pokemon who are somewhat above fully evolved ones scale to high 6-A. That means that, like all anime legendary vs normal pokemon fights, this is an outlier. Otherwise nearly all pokemon would be high 3-A as Ash and his friends fought UBs and legendaries very often.
TL;DR: most of pokemon anime scaling is full of outliers so we only use those that make sense (ex. Silvally vs Melmetal)

2. The statement about one-shotting gigantamax and dynamax pokemon is just hyperbole as literally in the other entry it says it can slash anything down in one hit and clearly we ain't getting 2-A zacian. Also to prove my point is the fact that the move is described as a move that deals double damage against gigantamax/dynamax pokemon and that is it's whole mechanic.

So unless there is some statement that proves em scaling above any legendary, we cannot use it at all.
 
1. According to this very wiki, "An Outlier is an event or incident that is considered to be completely and irreconcilably inconsistent with a character, entity, group, or series' normal displayed level of power" Show me the inconsistency of Lance's Red Gyarados scaling to Kyogre in the anime. Does the Red Gyarados get clowned on by a Bellsprout in a later episode that I missed out on?
Also, Pikachu loses to Charizard and is clearly portrayed as inferior in the episode (ignoring that Leon is the world champion and Pikachu has no prior experience with Gigantamax) and thus does not scale.

2. I'm not using the shield dex entry, why are you brining it up. Also, the fact that Behemoth Blade does more damage to Gigantamax foes only supports my argument that Zacian scales above Gigantamax(ignore that this wiki mentions Sp. Def whenever Shadow Ball is in a Pokemon's profile)

Edit: base Urshifu faces off against Regice in the preview for Journeys, and Urshifu is comparable to Leon's Charizard with both being used by Galar Champions.

While how exactly Mustard compares to Leon in the anime is unknown, this does further confirm Zacian scales above Groudon and Kyogre as Zacian scales above Urshifu's Gigantamax form.
 
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if pikachu was that much inferior to charizard he would have gotten one-shotted, meanwhile he held up against him, damaged him and almost did as much as Lance did. He also survived hits from him.

2. You didn't counter my argument. Behemoth blade does not one-shot and only deals double damage against gigantamax, there is no proof that he is stronger.
Where is that quote then? What do you take it from?

And about the stuff you mentioned at the bottom...You do realize we can scale almost all pokemon like that right? Pikachu, Bulbasaur and Squirtle all fought and later defeated members of the regi-trio. Charizard beat Articuno. Ash's Talonflame fought Moltres. Ash's flying pokemon fought Zapdos. It goes on man, we ain't scaling run of the mill Talonflame to high 6-A and neither will we scale this.

I do not even understand why you use this as the scaling. You could have at least argued that the energy provided for pokemon that gigantamax and dynamax comes from Eternatus and so you could have scaled him to 3-C likely high 3-A using that argument, but instead you delve into outliers.
 
Pikachu, Bulbasaur and Squirtle all fought and later defeated members of the regi-trio. Charizard beat Articuno. Ash's Talonflame fought Moltres. Ash's flying pokemon fought Zapdos. It goes on man, we ain't scaling run of the mill Talonflame to high 6-A and neither will we scale this.
Why would Talonflame be High 6-A for fighting Moltres, a Low 6-B...
 
doesn't matter i just used an example and messed up the tiering. What is important is that the scaling proposed is dumb
 
Pokémon can become superior to others of their species via training. That's why Mega Charizard X isn't listed as planetary on Charizard's profile but it is on Red's profile. Or why 10,000,000 Volt Thunderbolt isn't listed as universal on original Pikachu's profile but it is on anime Pikachu's profile. Or, quoting this very wiki:
"All of our Pokémon species profiles are composite versions of that species of Pokémon across all canon mediums, including the games, the anime, the manga, the Trading Card Game and spin-off games. Their power and abilities should reflect this. The only exceptions to this are Pokémon that are individual enough to warrant a profile separate from their species, such as Ash's Pikachu."
Isn't a Charizard that is used by the world champion individual enough to warrant it's own scaling?

Also, you don't explain how the scaling to Gigantamax Melmetal is an outlier. You just say "No OnEsHoT=nO sCaLe", and leave it at that. Also, considering on the Legendary Beasts profile
it states that they're superior to non-legendaries, why can't that same logic be applied to Gigantamax when Zacian is stated to scale above them while Raikou just gets a "should be"?
Is one shotting and exaggeration? Maybe. Does that mean Zacian doesn't scale? No.
 
Pokémon can become superior to others of their species via training. That's why Mega Charizard X isn't listed as planetary on Charizard's profile but it is on Red's profile. Or why 10,000,000 Volt Thunderbolt isn't listed as universal on original Pikachu's profile but it is on anime Pikachu's profile. Or, quoting this very wiki:
"All of our Pokémon species profiles are composite versions of that species of Pokémon across all canon mediums, including the games, the anime, the manga, the Trading Card Game and spin-off games. Their power and abilities should reflect this. The only exceptions to this are Pokémon that are individual enough to warrant a profile separate from their species, such as Ash's Pikachu."
Isn't a Charizard that is used by the world champion individual enough to warrant it's own scaling?

Also, you don't explain how the scaling to Gigantamax Melmetal is an outlier. You just say "No OnEsHoT=nO sCaLe", and leave it at that. Also, considering on the Legendary Beasts profile
it states that they're superior to non-legendaries, why can't that same logic be applied to Gigantamax when Zacian is stated to scale above them while Raikou just gets a "should be"?
Is one shotting and exaggeration? Maybe. Does that mean Zacian doesn't scale? No.
you are taking stuff out of context.

1st, raikou scales above non-legendary pokemon only in speed. We can scale zacian, zamazenta and eternatus to at least high 7-A but that was already done once and it looked dumb so they deleted it.
2, charizard is enough to warrant some scaling but only in a different context. Tbh we have questionable stuff like 5-B charizard and a high 6-A lucario but these ones just weren't debated enough and i will probably deal with the charizard later. What i am trying to say is that Leon's charizard is not even in the same context as red's charizard. If we make ghyrados high 6-A then the problem is that it opens up the possibility of scaling other mons to higher tiers. Tbh i would not be specifically against that but at the same time Pikachu held his own against buzzwole who is high 3-A. Basically if Lance did this in origins or somewhere else we'd consider it but otherwise it is just one of the many outliers. Throughout what i have seen Leon's charizard is definitely superior to many mons but comparable to gigantamax ones and if we start scaling those to high 6-A it is just gonna be broken.

You make fun of my no one shot no scale logic but think about it.
If a dedenne hits a kyogre with spark it will deal 2x damage, yet it does not mean that the dedenne is high 6-A. Same logic goes here. Show me one instance of em directly hurting a gigantamax melmetal, do it. ill believe you then.

You also ignored the part about eternatus giving energy to all gigantamax pokemon which would be a far better argument. Also the argument Aden made seems legit.
 
1. No i'm not. It's AP is listed as vastly superior to non-legendaries such as Tyranitar, not just it's speed.
"Tier: At least Low 6-B
Attack Potency:
At least Small Country level+ (Equal to Entei and Suicune. Should be somewhat comparable to Moltres and vastly superior to Pokémon like Tyranitar)"
And if you want to argue that the comparability to Moltres is the main argument, why bring up Tyranitar?
Also tfw doesn't every legend scale to small country level why was it listed as high mountain

2. My argument is specific to the Red Gyarados specifically, not to all Gyarados. Shinies have had their own profiles too, like on Genesect's profile.
And the multi-continent Gigantamax Charizard would be specific to Leon's profile and nowhere else like Red's planet level Mega Charizard. Pikachu would only be multi-continent with Gigantamax, and only on anime Pikachu's profile, not literally every wild Gigantamax Pokémon.

3. Dedenne isn't stated to surpass Kyogre, Zacian is stated to surpass Gigantamax. Behemoth Blade's effect is only supporting evidence. Also VS Wiki brings up game mechanics on profiles all the time, like:
"Metal Sound: X Pokémon releases a metallic screeching sound that lowers the opponent's special defense.
Scary Face: X Pokémon makes a scary face at the opponent, lowering their speed.
Noble Roar: X Pokémon lets out a noble roar to intimidate the opponent which in turn lowers their offensive stats."

4. We don't see Zacian beating Gmax Melmetals, but we also don't see Charizard melting mountains, or Pupitar knock over a mountain, or Groudon raising continents. Scaling in Pokémon is already heavily reliant on statements, so I don't see the issue now.

5. You're right, I didn't use that argument. Mostly because it can be use to scale Eternatus above the Creation with the Crown Tundra being a thing, which i'm still iffy about. There's also a statement from a Game Informer interview with Junichi Masuda that if Zamazenta had the Rusted Sword it would be the strongest Pokémon, so the legendaries could be scaled far higher.


6. Yeah, Adem is correct. And Zacian scaling above Gigantamax would mean the crowned forms and Eternamax would also scale that high unless Gmax Urshifu gets some bonkers feat when the episodes are actually released. I feel like waiting until the episodes actually come out is the safest thing because there's the potential for really juicy scaling.
 
So look here is the deal.
I still disagree with the high 6-A charizard and stuff but you do yours, i'll let the experts talk about it because i don't care bout it that much, we are here to argue about a different theme.

But here is the deal.
ill start with n5 - it was likely a game mechanics statement but whatever, either way if this kinds of statements were true mewtwo woulld be 2-A for being dubbed the strongest pokemon for the 100th time this half-century.

4 - here is the deal. Give me a clear statment about that. Thing is, pokedex entries were made by scientists and explorers and Melmetal was only recently discovered, heck its g-max form wasn't even revealed in the anime yet. Basically i guess i can see high 6-A galar legendaries but definitley not 3-C, high 3-A, at least for now.

3 - like i said, where is the statment? just give me the statement.
 
3. Here's the official Pokémon website:
Zacian scales above Gmax.

4. Nope. Not even close.
Melmetal and it's Gigantamax form have been known about for thousands of years. At least 3,000 to be exact.

5. I disagree with Eternatus scaling above the creation trio, i was just using that as an explanation for why I didn't use that argument.

Multi-continent Gmax Charizard might not even matter anymore because of Urshifu tbh.
 
huh, didn't know about the thousands of years. I follow the anime mostly so i didn't know that. However g-max melmetal is also stated to come from a distant land meaning that galarians could not have seen it or seen it interact with zacian or zamazenta.
Anyways about Zacian felling even gigantamax pokemon in one slash is hyperbole in my opinion for the reason that literally in the next entry it states that he can slash "anything". I don't see him slashing up Eternatus in one hit that's for sure so i don't really think it is viable in this case.
 
I would say Eternatus should scale above Base Necrozma hear me out

In they came from ultra beyond a canon quest the only way to finish it is to fight Necrozma amped by Eternatus's energy making it Dynamaxed. This is different from other legendaries since to complete the they came from ultra beyond quest you need to beat necrozma.

Eternamax Eternatus also has a infinite energy statement which is very fitting for scaling above a 3-C likely High 3-A.
 
idk man seems iffy. Just dynamaxing someone is not specifically enough. It's not even gigantamax. I'd understand if it was g-max but everyone can dynamax, even the CT and Arceus. Basically i do not think it is applicable here.

Also the infinite energy statement is not fully considered in because we do not know it is overtime or not. But yeah the tier fits the description so hopefully we will get the right scaling.
 
It probably does take more than one slash but I do think it still scales as Eternatus can prevent the use of Gigantamax. To quote Leon:
"It seems like some power of Eternatus's was keeping my team from Dynamaxing, but...we've had a champion time all the same!"
I do agree that the ultra beyond argument is iffy, Necrozma is moreso using Eternatus's power to amp itself rather than Eternatus surpassing Necrozma, but since Arceus isn't in Sword and Shield it's unclear whether or not it can Dynamax, has a Gigantamax form, an "Arceumax" form or anything like that.

Also, the infinite statement in question is from Pokémon Shield, said statement being:
"Infinite amounts of energy pour from this Pokémon's enlarged core, warping the surrounding space-time." And we see it do this in-game
"I'm your Galarian tour guide, and if you look to the left you'll see a hole in space and time." This would also be consistent with the scaling to Gmax Melmetal, with base Melmetal able to fight on par with Silvally who could potentially surpass the Tapus(Silvally being created to kill UB's instead of Aether Foundation just using the Tapus could imply Silvally > Tapus), with just one Tapu being able to go toe-to-toe with base Necrozma in Sun and Moon Episode 88
Base Necrozma having performed an infinite 3D feat of absorbing infinite amounts of light from the infinite in size Ultra Space, and would learn closer to high universal than galaxy level.

It should have at least enough energy to power Galar for a millennium, given that's why Chairman Rose awakened it. I saw a calculation on the Death Battle Fanon Wiki that put it at 265.87 gigatons of TNT equivalent which is casual large island level if that means anything.
 
still the infinite energy could just be released overtime. You don't need infinite energy to distort space-time i believe.

Also i did the calc and it was 298.5 gigatons.

Also arceus may not be in game but giratina is.
 
Even releasing infinite energy over the course of quintillions of years is still releasing an infinite amount of energy every second. I brought up the distortions because that supports the entry being true.
Also, Giratina is fodder to Arceus.
 
Giratina is still 2-A and about what i said you must have misunderstood.

What i mean is it could be capable of releasing energy endlessly rather than releasing it it constantly. So endless motor type of thing, not instant infinite energy.
 
Giratina is still 2-A and about what i said you must have misunderstood.

What i mean is it could be capable of releasing energy endlessly rather than releasing it it constantly. So endless motor type of thing, not instant infinite energy.
I dunno, "Infinite amounts of energy pour from this Pokémon's enlarged core" sounds like a "right now" statement rather than an "over time" statement. Also Eternatus's TCG expansion is called "ムゲンゾーン" (or "Infinity Zone" if you can't read Japanese"), and Eternatus being infinite is consistent with the scaling to Gmax.
 
I know I'm extremely extremely extremely late on this, but almost every single Galarian trainer profile on this wiki was buffed to Creation Trio Avatar level due to scaling to the likes of the Gen 4 playable character who could clap and subsequently capture said Creation Trio

Leon scales above every other trainer yet lost against Eternatus
 
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