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MrDrProfessorPatricio said:
Well we can ignore for the AE and Concept thing for now. Only US users like Rimuru and non US users like Hinata can interact with concepts. Just a question what type of concepts and abstract can they interact?
If we consider it as Embodiment of user desire concepts type 4 maybe? And AE Type 1?
 
So far these are the progress we made:

First Key Rimuru: Concluded

Second Key Rimuru: Should be akin to Power Modification otherwise Concluded

First Key Hinata: Concluded

Second Key Hinata: Concluded

First Key Diablo: Just changing it to Energy Manipulation otherwise Concluded

Second Key Diablo: Concluded

Radiation Manipulation: Concluded

Missing Resistances: Concluded

Resistance to Mind, Empathic and Madness Manipulation: Still not finished

Spiritual Body: Concluded

Conceptual and Abstract Existence: We can ignore the True Dragons for now. So only US users can interact with concepts/abstracts but needs clarification on what type of abstracts/concepts they can affect with. Also discussing regarding Rimuru and High-Spiritual Lifeform can survive conceptual destruction.

Universes and Spatial Motion Range: Still kinda confused here. So Spatial Motion will get 2-C range? because he can escape Ramiris' Labyrinth while Ramiris threatens to trap Rimuru also quoting what NeoSuperior said: "Rimuru entered the labyrinth, where it's explained that Shadow Motion would be of no help to escape it, to contrast it with him being able to escape once again thanks to upgrading it to "Spatial Motion"."
 
If we consider it as Embodiment of user desire concepts type 4 maybe? And AE Type 1?

Which means Rimuru could get Resistance to Conceptual Manipulation(type 4) due to being able to tank Melt Slash, since he was able to tank it while his skill wasn't. This would depend on the quote of when Rimuru tanks melt slash. [The previous statements don't actually make much sense, and just having Hinata have Non-Physical Interaction and destroying the skill that way makes more sense and is more in line with what actually occurred than saying she has Conceptual Manip type 4 or Rimuru is resistant to said manipulation. ] (Rimuru would still get Concept Manip type 4, though due to Raphael being able to recreate an Ultimate Skill, which is a type 4 concept/abstraction, in place of getting Power Modification)

And wouldn't everyone who can destroy autonomous Ultimate Skills qualify for Non-Physical Interaction due to their(Ultimate Skills') nature as Abstract Concepts / Existences that exist autonomously outside of the users body?(I don't think we have seen Rimuru go up against his own autonomous skill so this would only really apply to Hinata, unless it scales to Rimuru)
 
I think we are saying that because Ultimate Skills are concepts and are also able to be given autonomy, similar to what Rimuru did against Hinata, they should be classified as a Type 1 Abstract Existence (only when a skill is autonomous and separate from its user) which is vulnerable to Type 4 Conceptual Manipulation and Non-Physical Interaction.
 
@Jaw201

Not tank it but survive Conceptual Destruction, as Veldora implied high level spiritual Lifeforms can survive Conceptual Destruction (not arguing for Veldora just giv example) rather than give him resistance to concepts manip its more like he can survive an attack that can destroy concepts. If he Resist concepts manip Beelzebub Will not be destroyed
 
I think for 2C range we need to wait tho, for now we can classified alternate Dimension as pocket Dimension, and thats mean Rimuru Resist pocket reality manip? Or just can escape someone pocket Reality?
 
It's just dimensional travel.

As for concept manipulation what Rimuru did with magic aura seems like type 3, it's the default option, this just basically lets him add concepts to things not destroy them.

The stuff with Ultimate Skills though, Idk, sort of leaning towards what WHYNAUT said about needing more info before doing anything.
 
if Ultimate skill is Concepts (Embodiment of User Desire) Rimuru will get Immunity to conceptual destruction as Melt slash cannot kill him even tough he doesnt have resistance to conceptual manip (if he have Hinata will not be able to destroy Beelzebub)
 
Ok we can conclude that it's Dimension Travel. Does that mean he can escape from pocket reality manip?

Hmm does it let him interact to characters who are abstract/concept? like what abilities Rimuru can interact to those types?Can he damage those who has AE?

Also we need an input for the resistance coming regarding the Unique skill Starved, also quoting what Neo said: "What I was refering to with "Geld resisting Starved" was Geld II, not Geld I. In both manga and anime, if you look at the eyes of Geld I (both Orc Lord and Orc Disaster forms) and the other Orcs, they are blank, with the sole exception of Geld II who managed to still have clear and sharp eyes instead, meaning he was able to resist the effects of Starved - and ONLY him, among the Orcs."
 
I don't think it's just "pocket reality". Reason being places such as Dwelling of the Spirits are a FUNDAMENTAL part of the setting. They aren't just "little pocket spaces". Or to put it another way, the Dwelling of the Spirits, i.e. including the Labyrinth, is the equivalent of the "Spirit World" which is the World where Daemons reside - and that's again part of the most important "infrastructure" that clearly operates under other principles within the Veldanava Multiverse, which is considered to be at least equal in size as the Material World - there is no indication whatsover that it's just a "subspace" of the Material World.

Or to put it differently, Otherworld Summon spells are proof that teleportation over 2-C distances are "a thing" - the only issue is that going from there to Earth doesn't easily work out due to Earth being a "purely Material World", causing anyone attempting to go back to Earth to either instantly die or just disappear into nothingness due to being made at least to some extent of "spiritual stuff" that wouldn't be able to exist in a purely material environment.
 
@GLHF22
Personally I think both Unique Skill and Ultimate Skills are "conceptual", though Unique Skills are limited to its own effects, i.e. they can only affect things within the user's and the Skill's own effective range, while Ultimate Skills have an impact on the world itself due to accessing the "ultimate principles of the world" and can therefore affect parts of the concept even beyond its own effective range. What that means effectively for the wiki? Honestly, no idea.

@MrDrProfessorPatricio
I'd say it'd at least grant baseline resistance against whatever p&a assigned to Spiritual Attacks we decide upon.
 
@MrDrProfessorPatricio
Not sure if I am seeing this wrong, but aren't you using the WN scan for the effects of Gluttony for the "Power Bestowal" scan? I am certain it was not "Food Chain", but rather "Receive" there, unless the LN vol. 2 version I read was an older print edition or something.


EDIT: This is what I was familiar with:


Report. Following the merger of the unique skill Ravenous with the unique skill Predator, the unique skill Predator has evolved into the unique skill Glutton.

The Sage had the habit of combining skills that resembled one another a fair bit, although everything was still downward-compatible. I analyzed this new skill, then closed my eyes.

This skill, Glutton, consisted of four old abilities—Predation, Stomach, Mimic, and Isolate—combined with three new ones—Corrode, Receive, and Provide. The new ones worked like this:

Rot: Performs Rot on the target, decomposing it if it is organic. Monster corpses partially absorbed in this manner will reward the user with part of the monster's skills.

Receive: Gain the ability to obtain skills from monsters under your influence.

Provide: Grants part of your abilities to monsters under your influence or linked to your soul.

Giving each the once-over, I had to say, this was some pretty damn sweet stuff. My Stomach got a huge upgrade—it felt maybe twice as big. And Rot sounded downright scary, although handy for things like destroying armor.

Receive and Provide were the real plums, though. This meant, basically, whatever new skills people like Benimaru and Ranga earned when they evolved, I could get 'em for myself, right? And redistribute them to anyone on my team I wanted?
~ LN vol. 2​
 
@Neo yeah since Raphael is blatantly stated as Conceptual intelligence, that enough evidence for ultimate skill as a Concepts
 
Nothing like that exists. The part where Predator is introduced is LN vol. 1 where Great Sage explains both Predator and Great Sage itself - and the description is different from what you wrote as well.

The second part about Gluttony is different too. as you see from the part I quoted above.

Could it be you accidently used the WN version from Guro in that part? Well it doesn't really matter much, since they are mostly the same anyway as you can see.
 
Ahh i used the wiki for that. I thought it was ok to use the wiki because it's common sense for Slime readers for Rimuru to give powers to his subordinates. My bad. But the rest are from the LN, you can search them if you want for proof.
 
No, the wiki is pretty much still mostly WN stuff or mixed WN/LN stuff.

And yes, I know, the other parts should be fine. It was just that one part that stood out a bit and didn't quite match my memory of the LN.
 
Can we get conclusion for Ultimate skill as a Concepts? I think OP explanation is enough for it.
 
I edit the CRT and add more justifications on the Concepts and Separate universes. I also added your thought on the separate universe too @Neo.
 
Celestial Pegasus said:
As for concept manipulation what Rimuru did with magic aura seems like type 3, it's the default option, this just basically lets him add concepts to things not destroy them.
So In manga it said he add idea of Destruction and Cut to his Blade , does that mean it actually concepts of Destruction and cut? (Exclusively for himself as Veldora said)
 
Since Magic Aura was not affected by Magic Resistance and is using the reality warping aspects of Magic for Aura-based attacks, wouldn't that make it Reality Warping too?


This would end so much quicker if I could just eat this guy. What should I do? Icicle Lance seemed like it'd damage the demon but not decisively so, I didn't think. Demons have a lot of magical resistance, too…

Oh, hang on. Magic was simply the embodiment of whatever you pictured in your mind. If the Icicle Lance was the embodiment of taking heat from the body, fireballs had to be all about burning something. Meanwhile, Modelwill—one of the arts I'd learned—took your aura (your fighting force) and converted it directly into offensive power.

That ought to work against a spiritual life-form—and since I knew how to lodge magical projectiles by now, it was just as easy for me to control my aura. But ooh, if I start busting out my aura, everyone would know I was a monster. Which means…

…Well, let's test something out. Carefully summoning a bit of my aura, I converted it back into magical force, combining it with the magicule energy one normally uses to launch magic. For a human being with few magicules flowing through their veins, they would need to gather the required energy from the atmosphere at this point. As a monster, though, I could skip that. I had a supply I could tap at any time.

So I took this fresh quantity of pure magical force and applied it directly to my sword, as if wrapping it in paper. In my mind, I pictured strengthening, slicing, destroying. It began to emit a faint light, telling my instincts that it was set to go.

Report. Extra skill Magic Aura obtained.

That turned out to provide even more than I had pictured. Basically, Magic Aura was a skill that let me easily add magical effects to attacks with my own aura. A sort of combination of magic and arts. Now all I have to do is get slashin'.

The moment my sword touched the Lesser Demon, it split completely in half, dissipating into dust and disappearing.
~ LN vol. 4​
 
Yes, but isn't it Reality Warping AS WELL? Since the (concept) creation in this case creates a reality warping effect like "severance", which causes a Daemon who is strongly resistant to magical attacks and remains unharmed by physical attacks, get cut through as easily as butter as a result of combining magic effects with aura.
 
Since Magic is an embodiment of anything you want even an Abstract thing like Destruction, strength, Slicing, i think that would make him able to interacts with AE type 1 as shown it necessary to interacts with non-physical Lifeforms
 
The person who can interact with abstract will only apply to Rimuru and Hinata as of Volume 8 just to be safe. Well Ultimate skill is basically an abstract and Hinata can hit it while Rimuru can absorb/interact it meaning they can really interact with AE type 1.
 
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