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But what if.......i cross scale the Emeralds from both and make Movie Sonic tier 2?Thinking on it, I guess White Space also including the Movie Continuity also gives credence to "All space and time" being affected.
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But what if.......i cross scale the Emeralds from both and make Movie Sonic tier 2?Thinking on it, I guess White Space also including the Movie Continuity also gives credence to "All space and time" being affected.
A cosmology could work, but Archie and Mainline would need to be in different multiverses due to Worlds Collide's ending I think.Now we just need confirmation it affected the Boom continuity. That would inadvertantly make the games share a cosmology with Archie (and Sonic X, I guess)
Although I agree to the idea of the cast not growing in time, your frustration is understandable for sure. What you are expressing is frustration with how SEGA is handling aspects of Sonic characters and continuity, if I'm understanding it properly, and I would feel I can empathize with you.I know we've discussed this topic to death and back, but Sega wanting the cast to never grow in power fails to make sense when there's 15+ instances that infer a member of the cast growing in strength. Battle alone has like half a dozen, we've had half a dozen more within the past three mainline games, etc., Shadow Gens included now cuz of Metal Overlord.
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Yeah, cast not growing in power, at least not to major degrees makes far more sense to me, as there are just as many instances of that being the case as those fairly often vague statements of them getting much stronger and stronger, infinitely into higher dimensions, leaving no room for callbacks and fun stories like Scrapnik Island or even Generations, which I think is more importantAlthough I agree to the idea of the cast not growing in time, your frustration is understandable for sure. What you are expressing is frustration with how SEGA is handling aspects of Sonic characters and continuity, if I'm understanding it properly, and I would feel I can empathize with you.
I am sorry if I'm misunderstanding though.
Eggman claimed that he could take over the multiverse with Master Emerald, so, that's already a possibilityBut what if.......i cross scale the Emeralds from both and make Movie Sonic tier 2?
Oh yeah, there is also Silver, if he is from the far future, I wonder why he doesn't one-shot anyone due to scaling infinitely higher than everyone elseYeah, cast not growing in power, at least not to major degrees makes far more sense to me, as there are just as many instances of that being the case as those fairly often vague statements of them getting much stronger and stronger, infinitely into higher dimensions, leaving no room for callbacks and fun stories like Scrapnik Island or even Generations, which I think is more important
Sonic grows stronger by doing literally nothing, with his allies And his enemies always being able to by varying degrees keep up with him due to story needing that, by that logic, Silver, a fighter, should be hundreds of thousands if not infinite amount of times stronger than anyone from the current cast, by the logic powerscaling followsSilver being from the future wouldn't make him one-shot everyone. Sonic cast grows stronger because of training, not age.
No since he wouldn't be alive for hundreds of years.......following your logic, he would only grow for 14 yearsSonic grows stronger by doing literally nothing, with his allies And his enemies always being able to by varying degrees keep up with him due to story needing that, by that logic, Silver, a fighter, should be hundreds of thousands if not infinite amount of times stronger than anyone from the current cast, by the logic powerscaling follows
Even if he starts to wear down at his 40-50's, that's still massive amount of potential considering things he did as just a teenNo since he wouldn't be alive for hundreds of years.......following your logic, he would only grow for 14 years
I don't think it's a problem, it's moreso the issues that sprout from both sides of the coin.Why the Characters growing in power is a problem?it seems to make more sense to me rather than not
Nah man, you didn't misunderstand, that's perfectly on-point. And I can see why you and SJG believe they DON'T grow in power, since there are occasions where no power growth makes more sense at times (Scrapnik Island). Either way, as long as good stories are being told, I couldn't care less.Although I agree to the idea of the cast not growing in time, your frustration is understandable for sure. What you are expressing is frustration with how SEGA is handling aspects of Sonic characters and continuity, if I'm understanding it properly, and I would feel I can empathize with you.
I am sorry if I'm misunderstanding though.
........what is your point? Silver isn't 40, he never reached that age in the gamesEven if he starts to wear down at his 40-50's, that's still massive amount of potential considering things he did as just a teen
And will never reach it........what is your point? Silver isn't 40, he never reached that age in the games
They were Super thereI'd be able to somewhat understand SEGA's desire to not have Sonic characters grow in strength if, you know, they weren't constantly making new villains that are stronger than the last or having the modern characters do crazy shit compared to their past versions. I mean even in the upcoming Sonic x Shadow Generations, Shadow is capable of fighting very competitively against Metal Overlord, the same boss that fought against Super Sonic and a Chaos Emerald empowered Tails and Knuckles.
Why with Scrapnik is a problem?Nah man, you didn't misunderstand, that's perfectly on-point. And I can see why you and SJG believe they DON'T grow in power, since there are occasions where no power growth makes more sense at times (Scrapnik Island). Either way, as long as good stories are being told, I couldn't care less.
I'm talking about Sonic, as long as he is capable of fighting and growing in power, everyone around him essentially will be of that level of power, leading to Silver, an Extraordinary Genius combatant in his own right logically be pretty much infinitely stronger than anyone from the present due to power creep leading into the future........what is your point? Silver isn't 40, he never reached that age in the games
Mecha Sonic was defeated in the classic era and got stranded on a island with other old and outdated Badniks, having no ways of growing stronger, yet still be considered a threat to modern cast who are by Wiki's stats are infinitely stronger than their classic counterpartsWhy with Scrapnik is a problem?
They were Super there
All the characters in Sonic’s era are either long dead or sealed away by the time Silver is born, so he’d have no future versions of those characters to scale to.I'm talking about Sonic, as long as he is capable of fighting and growing in power, everyone around him essentially will be of that level of power, leading to Silver, an Extraordinary Genius combatant in his own right logically be pretty much infinitely stronger than anyone from the present due to power creep leading into the future
Tbf Mecha being equal to Modern makes little sense regardless of whether or not the characters grow in power, as due to his damaged state he would probably be weaker and would absolutely be slower than he was before. Not to mention Modern is still way more skilled than before even if he wasn’t any stronger. I don’t think that’s really a power creep issue so much as it is Mecha just being written to be more dangerous for the sake of plot.Mecha Sonic was defeated in the classic era and got stranded on a island with other old and outdated Badniks, having no ways of growing stronger, yet still be considered a threat to modern cast who are by Wiki's stats infinitely stronger than their classic counterparts
I mean he potencially would considering that there could be more unseen characters that are either born with Sonic's cast being middle aged, gaining scaling from them and then would fight younger character etc etc until Silver's time, keeping up the scaling chain, your fairly regular civilians are already capable of keeping up with the likes of Infinite, like Tangle or AvatarAll the characters in Sonic’s era are either long dead or sealed away by the time Silver is born, so he’d have no future versions of those characters to scale to.
Aleka and Miss:i will ignore thatMecha Sonic was defeated in the classic era and got stranded on a island with other old and outdated Badniks, having no ways of growing stronger, yet still be considered a threat to modern cast who are by Wiki's stats are infinitely stronger than their classic counterparts
huh.....no? what kind of logic is that? like......i can't see any connection between any of the points here for me to even talk about at allI'm talking about Sonic, as long as he is capable of fighting and growing in power, everyone around him essentially will be of that level of power, leading to Silver, an Extraordinary Genius combatant in his own right logically be pretty much infinitely stronger than anyone from the present due to power creep leading into the future
that is you assuming their offspring would still scale to them for some reason, or that they would even have offspring to begin with, or that any of the younger generation would scale to them at all for no reasonI mean he potencially would considering that there could be more unseen characters that are either born with Sonic's cast being middle aged, gaining scaling from them and then would fight younger character etc etc until Silver's time, keeping up the scaling chain, your fairly regular civilians are already capable of keeping up with the likes of Infinite, like Tangle or Avatar
Everyone still scales to him to Low 2-C/2-C, infinitely higher than Emerl at his peak, so yes, yes they dohuh.....no? what kind of logic is that? like......i can't see any connection between any of the points here for me to even talk about at all
Also, no, everyone doesn't need to have the same growth rate as Sonic, Battle pretty much confirmed this as he is the only one capable of stopping Awakened Emerl, so yeah
I am talking about any characters in general, Tangle is a civilian and can fight Rough and Tumble that gave some problems to Sonic and Knucklesthat is you assuming their offspring would still scale to them for some reason, or that they would even have offspring to begin with, or that any of the younger generation would scale to them at all for no reason
yeah.......which they gained by off screen growth in power in between the time these games are apart, yes.............again, your point just doesn't have any connection with itself to make sense, specially with chars like Infinite talking about how surprised he is that Sonic got much stronger so quickly in ForcesEveryone still scales to him to Low 2-C/2-C, infinitely higher than Emerl at his peak, so yes, yes they do
a "civilian" with a mutation to have her tail grow several dozens of meters, aka not a normal civilian, who need wispons and such to actually fightI am talking about any characters in general, Tangle is a civilian and can fight Rough and Tumble that gave some problems to Sonic and Knuckles
Literally proving my point that the stronger Sonic gets, everyone around him especially become just as strong.yeah.......which they gained by off screen growth in power in between the time these games are apart, yes.............again, your point just doesn't have any connection with itself to make sense, specially with chars like Infinite talking about how surprised he is that Sonic got much stronger so quickly in Forces
Whisper is comparable to her, being able to take hits from Surge and as far as I know she doesn't have any mutations. Regular civilians partake in a battle against clones of Shadow, Chaos, Metal and Zavok, suffering no losses.a "civilian" with a mutation to have her tail grow several dozens of meters, aka not a normal civilian, who need wispons and such to actually fight
Nah, Forces are a part of that tooStarting to think most of the problems with power growth exist because IDW is considered canon
some do by training off screen......not inherently a he gets strongerLiterally proving my point that the stronger Sonic gets, everyone around him especially become just as strong.
......she has training with the Wisps, so she has good enough justificationsWhisper is comparable to her, being able to take hits from Surge and as far as I know she doesn't have any mutations.
proof of that?Regular civilians partake in a battle against clones of Shadow, Chaos, Metal and Zavok, suffering no losses.
......? when have i said it did? again, you presented no connected argument for why that would be the caseMe believing Silver should be infinitely stronger than everyone else has nothing to do with my belief of them not growing in power
explain Sonic's first fight with Infinite vs their second fight thenNah, Forces are a part of that too
This is the best argument against power growth, and it comes from IDW, a source which is specifically stated by Ian to have inconsistancies that should be dismissed if they contradict the gamesMecha Sonic was defeated in the classic era and got stranded on a island with other old and outdated Badniks, having no ways of growing stronger, yet still be considered a threat to modern cast who are by Wiki's stats are infinitely stronger than their classic counterparts
I mean there is also Gens and Forces that have Classic Sonic on par with Modern so, consistent, i guessThis is the best argument against power growth, and it comes from IDW, a source which is specifically stated by Ian to have inconsistancies that should be dismissed if they contradict the games
Oh yeah, forgot Ian also said that.This is the best argument against power growth, and it comes from IDW, a source which is specifically stated by Ian to have inconsistancies that should be dismissed if they contradict the games
Those are the same two games with the most blatant instances of Sonic growing stronger.I mean there is also Gens and Forces that have Classic Sonic on par with Modern so, consistent, i guess
The canon timeline split solved that problem, until it was retconned, but it's not like they retconned the power growth along with it since they only continued to emphasize it during and after all those instances. Not to mention the lack of a timeline split results in so many story-breaking pararoxes that are just dismissed that there's no reason not to also dismiss the power-scalling paradoxes.I mean there is also Gens and Forces that have Classic Sonic on par with Modern so, consistent, i guess
Yeah, which in turn make it have even less sense, Classic Sonic growing from 5-A to Low 2-C to one-shot Chaos 0 and fight Egg Dragoon is... blehThose are the same two games with the most blatant instances of Sonic growing stronger.
Your disbelief is not an argumentYeah, which in turn make it have even less sense, Classic Sonic growing from 5-A to Low 2-C to one-shot Chaos 0 and fight Egg Dragoon is... bleh
Ian said in Bumblekast that the timeline "self corrects" enough for events to play out nearly the same wayThe canon timeline split solved that problem, until it was retconned, but it's not like they retconned the power growth along with it since they only continued to emphasize it during and after all those instances. Not to mention the lack of a timeline split results in so many story-breaking pararoxes that are just dismissed that there's no reason not to also dismiss the power-scalling paradoxes.
considering other instances of Sonic's AD.......it isn't that unbelievable tbhYeah, which in turn make it have even less sense, Classic Sonic growing from 5-A to Low 2-C to one-shot Chaos 0 and fight Egg Dragoon is... bleh