Saber Alter vs Naruto Uzumaki (Kurama Mode)

[HalilAssassino]

• Who Wins and Why ? (It has been canceled.)

• Saber Alter

• Naruto Uzumaki | Kurama Mode

• Speed Equalized.

• Standard Battle Assumptions

 

[Expectro2000xxx]

I'm gonna sleep so when I wake up I can participate, but first, what's the AP of Naruto?

 

[Popted2]

Vote Naruto he has the Hax and various way to dura neg Saber also he has the analitycal prediction that will make him dodge her attacks

 

[Rez]

Saber Excalibur spams and pretty sure Naruto's dura neg is useless because of servant physiology but I can be wrong

 

[Rez]

So voting the failure of an King

 

[Ricsi-viragosi]

Nah, rasenshuriken should wreck as it does normally if it lands, servants still have organs like a heart and brain. For all they can ignore immense damage as long as those two are fine, cell-sized blades are going to cut into them rather easily. I'm pretty sure if he lands one of those, Saber's done for. And servant haxes are not that good, the intangibility makes her unable to attack and is never used to evade attacks, everything else is just not combat applicable.

So it mostly becomes a contest of whether her Excalibur spam can get through him first, but while he needs Kurama avatars to be on her Excalibur's level, he should be able to get a shadow clone spam off even if she eventually breaks the avatar off. And as great as nigh-infinite mana is, I don't think she couléd kill all of Naruto's clones before they land enough hits to take her out.

Especially when using the full noble phantasm, she is practically limited to a one-directional laser (though she can move it around), which wouldn't help against being attacked by all directions. Though she could of course luck out and hit the OG Naruto, which her instinct can help with.

 

[KingAllen30]

Nah, rasenshuriken should wreck as it does normally if it lands, servants still have organs like a heart and brain. For all they can ignore immense damage as long as those two are fine, cell-sized blades are going to cut into them rather easily. I'm pretty sure if he lands one of those, Saber's done for. And servant haxes are not that good, the intangibility makes her unable to attack and is never used to evade attacks, everything else is just not combat applicable.

So it mostly becomes a contest of whether her Excalibur spam can get through him first, but while he needs Kurama avatars to be on her Excalibur's level, he should be able to get a shadow clone spam off even if she eventually breaks the avatar off. And as great as nigh-infinite mana is, I don't think she couléd kill all of Naruto's clones before they land enough hits to take her out.

Especially when using the full noble phantasm, she is practically limited to a one-directional laser (though she can move it around), which wouldn't help against being attacked by all directions. Though she could of course luck out and hit the OG Naruto, which her instinct can help with.

Her instinct is pretty bad even if it’s rank B because of her corruption.

From Fate/Complete material:

Instinct: B
Constant self-control is required to maintain Saber's reason while blackened. To focus on suppressing her madness, her surroundings are neglected and Instinct is dulled.

 

[Ricsi-viragosi]

It's B class exactly because of that though, isn't it? Normally it's A class and on the level of dodging Gae Bolg, but due to the corruption its only B.

 

[Regidian]

It's B class exactly because of that though, isn't it? Normally it's A class and on the level of dodging Gae Bolg, but due to the corruption its only B.

Yep

 

[KingAllen30]

It's B class exactly because of that though, isn't it? Normally it's A class and on the level of dodging Gae Bolg, but due to the corruption its only B.

Yeah

 

[KingAllen30]

What are the wincon of each opponent?

 

[Ricsi-viragosi]

If Naruto lands a rasenshuriken that should do the trick, whuch can be facilitated by shadow clone spam - but this forces him to fight as a 6-C instead of a Low 6-B.

She can either kill him while he doesn't have clones and is Low 6-B, or manage to aoe and kill his real self before the clones kill her, both with Excalibur spam.

 

[KingAllen30]

Can Naruto amp himself with Sage mode?

 

[KingAllen30]

This is like coin flip

 

[Popted2]

If Naruto lands a rasenshuriken that should do the trick, whuch can be facilitated by shadow clone spam - but this forces him to fight as a 6-C instead of a Low 6-B.

She can either kill him while he doesn't have clones and is Low 6-B, or manage to aoe and kill his real self before the clones kill her, both with Excalibur spam.

Don't forget that Naruto has still analytical prediction so Saber won't hit him, and Kurama can still bijuudama spam

 

[Popted2]

Can Naruto amp himself with Sage mode?

No but his clones can use the rasenshuriken too

 

[Loyd]

naruto spams hundreds on clones and asks saber alter do you want these clones to use kurama mode?

 

[KobsterHope07]

Don't forget that Naruto has still analytical prediction so Saber won't hit him, and Kurama can still bijuudama spam

Don’t Heracles also have Precognition and Saber Alter was able to still him with her attack

 

[Ricsi-viragosi]

Naruto obviously stomps with a reverse harem jutsu.

Jokes aside, I'll probably go for Naruto for now, since the odds of him dying before he can make clones, or him just happening to be picked out among the clones and killed, seems way less likely to him landing an RS.

 

[KingAllen30]

I’m still undecided

 

[Loyd]

voting naruto for now aswell

 

[John985]

Analitycal prediction is like, very common in fate, its not really a problem for combat ready servants.

 

[Regidian]

And actually she shouldn't have problem to know who is the real one since servant sense soul directly

 

[Regidian]

I vote for saber alter even if naruto can use clone, salter will directly see who is the real one with her sensing and since we are in new york bcz SBA she have like all the shadow she want to be able to tp herself outside of naruto atk

 

[Loyd]

i don't know if Naruto's shadow clones have souls or not but when he does it thr identical to each other.
has Salter done the shadow teleport in combat? and consistently against opponents spams?

 

[Ricsi-viragosi]

Chakra is kind of equated to souls (see the guy whose power is astral projection, with his soul fading away when he gave all his chakra to Tsunade; or Naruto's chakra grabbing his own soul and absorbing it back into his own body) a lot, so I'm not sure being able to sense those would really help against Shadow Clones.

Edit: A much more blatant example is the third hokage using shadow clones to use a soul sacrificing power (the shinigami sealing).

The shinigami seals the users and targets soul into itself, forcing them to forever battle. We see it do this with the shadow clones' souls, meaning that somehow someway, the shadow clones have souls.

 

[Loyd]

yep chakra is equated with soul so soul sense won't help

 

[Regidian]

Chakra is kind of equated to souls (see the guy whose power is astral projection, with his soul fading away when he gave all his chakra to Tsunade; or Naruto's chakra grabbing his own soul and absorbing it back into his own body) a lot, so I'm not sure being able to sense those would really help against Shadow Clones.

I mean if the chakra is able to grab naruto soul it's still mean that they have a little distinction.

i don't know if Naruto's shadow clones have souls or not but when he does it thr identical to each other.
has Salter done the shadow teleport in combat? and consistently against opponents spams?

Clone are mean to look identical to other most of time.

She have done it like one time? But she don't have do much battle and the most important one was in night or in place whitout shadow (like cave)

 

[Ricsi-viragosi]

I mean if the chakra is able to grab naruto soul it's still mean that they have a little distinction.

As I pointed out in an edit, we outright see the soul of a shadow clone being ripped out and sealed.

 

[Regidian]

As I pointed out in an edit, we outright see the soul of a shadow clone being ripped out and sealed.

Shadow having soul doesn't mean he have exactly the same than the real one.


In fate tamamo clone have soul they can distinct the real one

 

[Ricsi-viragosi]

Shadow having soul doesn't mean he have exactly the same than the real one.

Yeah, but... they are the same in every way, and they have souls. You assuming their soul would for some reason be the exception is rather baseless.

In fate tamamo clone have soul they can distinct the real one

I don't particularly care about that, since he doesn't use shadow clones. Especially if you mean the Tamamo nine, who are even physically distinct being alters, and are manifestations of specific characteristics instead of being perfect clones. They and shadow clones are not even remotly similar.

 

[Loyd]

Shadow having soul doesn't mean he have exactly the same than the real one.

i'm not sure if shadow clones split evenly anymore
and i don't mean identical like physical traits.

but beings who can see chakra still couldnt discern the real naruto/original naruto who should "hypothetically" have more chakra.

i think Salter tele dodges one RS, maybe some but gets bodied by the rest thats spammed.

Especially if you mean the Tamamo nine, who are even physically distinct and are alters, and are manifestations of specific characteristics instead of being perfect clones. They and shadow clones are not even remotly similar.

mmm more nasu lore, noted.

 

[Regidian]

Yeah, but... they are the same in every way, and they have souls. You assuming their soul would for some reason be the exception is rather baseless.

I don't particularly care about that, since he doesn't use shadow clones. Especially if you mean the Tamamo nine, who are even physically distinct being alters, and are manifestations of specific characteristics instead of being perfect clones. They and shadow clones are not even remotly similar.

Does they have the same exact amount of chakra etc?

And i don't talk about tamamo nine, tamamo can create clone of herself

 

[Loyd]

Does they have the same exact amount of chakra etc?

yes thr divided evenly

 

[Popted2]

Naruto FRA

 

[Regidian]

And does naruto will do spam of shadow clone + rasenshuriken in first move? For most of the combat i see he rarely do that as first move.


And since excalibur morgan is salter first move + naruto is like in the fange of her atk and she can activate Excalibur in less than one second i don't see how he will have time to create clone+ rasenshuriken + come to her before she lend it to him

 

[Loyd]

its been awhile since ive read naruto, whats the starting range?

And does naruto will do spam of shadow clone + rasenshuriken in first move? For most of the combat i see he rarely do that as first move.

no its not first move, i think he starts with bijuu bomb
doesnt spam with tons of clones early in the fight iirc buts its not ooc if the opponent is evading well for awhile.

And since excalibur morgan is salter first move + naruto is like in the fange of her atk and she can activate Excalibur in less than one second i don't see how he will have time to create clone+ rasenshuriken + come to her before she lend it to him

via emotion detection/analytic prediction he can sense her negative intent/use it to predict her first move
and shunshin its kinda like a short mana burst for quick speed/evasion
and her ex morgan looks like a giant narrow beam not hard for somone like naruto to evade.

can Salter teleport in darkness if naruto flattens new york with a bijuu bomb?

 

[Regidian]

its been awhile since ive read naruto, whats the starting range?

no its not first move, i think he starts with bijuu bomb
doesnt spam with tons of clones early in the fight iirc buts its not ooc if the opponent is evading well for awhile.

via emotion detection/analytic prediction he can sense her negative intent/use it to predict her first move
and shunshin its kinda like a short mana burst for quick speed/evasion
and her ex morgan looks like a giant narrow beam not hard for somone like naruto to evade.

can Salter teleport in darkness if naruto flattens new york with a bijuu bomb?

Depend if it's rest shadow, she need shadow to tp, and we never see her tp in shadow of other people so we can't assume she can tp to naruto directly.

For the emotion detection/analysis prediction a ton of servant have them and excalibur is still one of the most in inevitable np and salter have still instinct which let her "feel" the best outcome of her action.


The starting range of SBA is 4km

 

[Loyd]

Mind you this naruto is also fighting with people who have pretty crazy reaction/analytical prediction,

4KM is enough he should have his avatar and start with a bijuu bomb

if he survives long enough naruto spam isnt out of the picture either,

Naruto's also pretty crafty with shadow clones using them as a distraction or to test the opponent. clone that get destroy return thr memories/experience back to him itd help at that range and the early fight stage.

 

[Regidian]

Mind you this naruto is also fighting with people who have pretty crazy reaction/analytical prediction,

4KM is enough he should have his avatar and start with a bijuu bomb

if he survives long enough naruto spam isnt out of the picture either,

Naruto's also pretty crafty with shadow clones using them as a distraction or to test the opponent. clone that get destroy return thr memories/experience back to him itd help at that range and the early fight stage.

Except Excalibur morgan is salter first move and since sba mean she know where naruto is she likely to just use it the moment she appear or to tp Near him and use it